Don't know Ron I wasn't around then ! When I worked in the Ministry of Pensions in 1958 in Glasgow I was astounded by the number of my neighbours who were unmarried but living together. I had signed the secrecy act so kept my mouth shut. They were all sort of ordinary if not downright ugly and unwholesome.. I thought 'living in sin" was for the young, wild and gorgeous". There we are. Ella ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Brown" <suenron@southwest.com.au> To: <sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 5:01 PM Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname Hi John. If my great grandmother was still married at the time could she simply walk away from that marriage and enter one of the other forms of marriage in Scotland at the time? Was divorce common then? Ron -----Original Message----- From: sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of J D Dods Sent: Monday, 24 November 2008 2:08 PM To: sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname Hi Ron, a suggestion. Rather than trying to prove the Georgina Gillespie you found in 1901 was yours, have you tried to disprove it? Also remember "marriage by repute" and "marriage by declearation" were legal forms of marriage in Scotland at this time and neither required to be registered. cheers John Proud to be a transcriber for the freeCEN Project and volunteer for Random Acts of Geneological Kindness Ask me how you can contribute to either of these worthy projects or for other ways of helping our hobby. Researching BATTERS in Yorkshire BENNIE in Lanarkshire, Dunbartonshire & West Lothian BENNING in Lanarkshire & Montreal COLLINS in California & PA COOPER in Yorkshire DODS in East Lothian, Berwickshire, British Columbia, Montreal, Manchester, South Africa, Hong Kong, India DOUGLAS in Lanarkshire FENTON in Edinbugh FISHER in Yorkshire FORREST in South Africa HAYTON in Yorkshire HEWAT in East Lothian LAMONT in Lanarkshire LEGGAT in Monreal MCLEAN in Argyllshire RANKINE in Dunbartonshire, Perthshire SEYMOUR in British Columbia & Montreal SHIRREFF in East Lothian SNELL in California, Oregeon SUFFILL/SUFFIELD in Yorkshire TROTTER, Lanarkshire, Stirlingshire, West Lothian WATSON in Brantford & Barrie, Ontario. WEIR in Argyllshire,Lanarkshie WILLIAMSON in Edinburgh & North Berwick ----- Original Message ---- From: Ron Brown <suenron@southwest.com.au> To: sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, 24 November, 2008 5:34:48 PM Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname Hi Ella, I wish Ella! I have not been able to find a marriage for Gillespie & Burgess. On her death Registration from ScotlandsPeople it lists her given name as Georgina Ballantyne Gillespie, underneath in brackets it says "otherwise Burgess" widow of John Francis Burgess. I'm not sure if I'm being too pedantic but id hate to be going down the wrong path. Thanks Ron -----Original Message----- From: sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Ella Ross Sent: Monday, 24 November 2008 1:14 PM To: sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname Hi Ron I wouldn't be too bothered about the age on the 1901 census being out by 3 years. It could be a transcription error or deliberate on the part of the person involved. If it was someone else who filled in the census they may have been mistaken about her exact age. Anything on a death certificate has been given by the informant. They may ar may not have deliberately omitted some details. Have you found a marriage certificate for her with Burgess and with Gillespie? Cheers Ella Ross ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Brown" <suenron@southwest.com.au> To: <sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 2:31 PM Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname > Hi Jacquie, I do have that death registration for my great grandmother > thanks. The problem I have is trying to prove that it is she who is on the > 1901 census living with a Joseph Gillespie in North Leith. All the info on > the census looks good except Georgina's age is out by 3 years > > If she had left her first husband John Francis Burgess and lived with > Joseph > Gillespie around 1900 would it have been normal to list on her death > registration in 1951 as 'widow of John Francis Burgess'. > > Thanks > Ron > > -----Original Message----- > From: sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jacquie > Sent: Monday, 24 November 2008 11:24 AM > To: sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname > > At ScotlandsPeople there is a death registration for a Georgina Gillespie, > other surnames Burges and > Spence dated 1951 in Leith. She was 81. You can view the image at the > site. > > Jacquie > Winnipeg, MB > Canada > > -----Original Message----- > From: sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:sct-edinburgh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of > Ron Brown > Sent: November 23, 2008 7:51 PM > To: Edinburgh email list > Subject: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname > > Hello, > > I believe my great grandmother Georgina Ballantyne Spence/Burgess may have > lived with a man named Joseph Gillespie in North Leith around 1900. I have > located a similar family on the 1901 census but need to prove correct or > otherwise. > > Thanks > > Ron > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Easy recipes for Christmas entertaining on Yahoo!Xtra Lifestyle- http://nz.lifestyle.yahoo.com/food-recipes ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SCT-EDINBURGH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Ella and Ron I think the reason that so many couples were forced to live together 'in sin' in Scotland was that a man or woman would leave a marriage, and the 'wronged' party could refuse to divorce them. I don't believe there was a time limit on this refusal. This was the situation in the 1950s and could be very cruel. It no longer applies, of course. I tried to find the facts on this by googling scottish divorce law, but failed. However I did come across one interesting point. Apparently in late 19th century England, a man could divorce his wife on grounds of her adultery only. A wife, on the other hand. had to prove other grounds, such as unreasonable behaviour; adultery on its own was not sufficient. Scottish law treated both parties equally. Enough said! Rhoda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ella Ross" <ebbtide@ihug.com.au> To: <sct-edinburgh@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 6:07 AM Subject: Re: [SCT-EDINBURGH] Gillespie surname > Don't know Ron I wasn't around then ! > > When I worked in the Ministry of Pensions in 1958 in Glasgow I was > astounded > by the number of my neighbours who were unmarried but living together. I > had signed the secrecy act so kept my mouth shut. > > They were all sort of ordinary if not downright ugly and unwholesome.. I > thought 'living in sin" was for the young, wild and gorgeous". > > There we are. > Ella >