Hi David, Can't help you with connections with the Abernathys. However if you check past posts and the website you may find tips on how to proceed with y our genealogy. If you are the pioneer researcher in your family then you will have to learn how to do the research as no one else has the info to post it here. That seems to be MY case in most of my lines, groan.... I ha "The Scots-Urish in the Carolinas the Kennedy here before me. He is not a scholar and does not footnote his work, so you must locate his sources. He does have info on HAMILTON in SC. It's possible that the Abernathys knew the Hamiltons in Ulster. ONe of the commonly used strategies is if you can't move forward on one line, research the other line (the spouses). The HAMILTONs he writes about are in Abbeville. The town was owned by Major Andrew Hamilton, s. of Archibald and Frances Calhoun Hamilton of Augusta Co, VA. The grandparents were Audley Harrison and Eleanor Adams Hamilton, whose estate was in Tyrone, Ireland. Audley descended from Lord Claude Hamilton, a son of Sir James Hamilton, 2nd Earl of Arran and regent of Scotland and guardian of Mary, Queen of Scots. (This makes sense as the HAMILTONs of Tyrone were Catholic). Major Andrew Hamilton married Jane McGarra. In 1765 they left VA for Abbeville to join his wife's kin, the Calhouns. Major H is associated with General Andrew Pickens, who moved from SHenandoah at the time. They were both elders of the Long Cane PResbyter Church and commanding officers in the Revolution. (P 164-165). He has two pages of sources at the rear of the book, no idea where he got this info, but given the prominance of the Hamiltons, a history of Abbeville would be one place to look. You got a few clues here of places to look for your Abernathys. Also its' important to recall that 95% of the folk in the south hoofed it down from the Middle Atlantic states. So esp. for South Carolina, you trace them from the NORTH, just like the Hamiltons, who came down from VA. Many in VA came down from PA or MD. SOme from the New ENgland colonies. only 5% floated into a Virginia or Carolina harbor in a boat. So I'd do a fast check of Augusta County (this is about half of VA at your time....) to see if you can place Abernathys there. The court records are published and are easy to search. Best of luck! Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "David C Abernathy" <DaveA@schmeckabernathy.com> Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 08:21:56 -0800 > I am new to this mailing. Is any one connected to my line. I have hit a >brick wall on Hugh's connection prior coming to the "Colonies". > >HUGH ABERNATHY was born Bet. 1738 - 1743 in Ireland, and died February 21, >1826 in Franklin County, Indiana. He married MARY ANN HAMILTON 1773 in >South Carolina. She was born 1770 in South Carolina, and died September 16, >1838 in Fountain County, Indiana. > > >Thanks, >David C Abernathy >Email disclaimers >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >This message represents the official view of the voices in my head. >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >http://www.SchmeckAbernathy.com >== All outgoing and incoming mail is scanned by Norton AntiVirus 2005 == > >-----Original Message----- >From: CBGILBERT@aol.com [mailto:CBGILBERT@aol.com] >Sent: Friday, November 25, 2005 7:27 AM >To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [Sc-Ir] I LOVE THE POSTINGS > >Happy Day after Thanksgiving to one and all! >I've lurked around this wonderful site for a few months now waiting to see >if anything pertained to my families. I've discovered that while most of >the info has nothing to do with my family names it does open up avenues for >thought. >My local Genie Club at the library just had a study on Scots-Irish and now >there's a discussion on this site! How great is that! >While I can't relate to the "newbies",people who came over in the >1800's,(GRIN!!!!) because my families, the Atwell's and the Abernethy's, >came to America in the late 1600's I still learn something from everyone. >Thanks to all who take the time to post questions, provide answers and >steer us to other places to explore. >Also, concerning the delete key, I've use mine many times when things >aren't interesting to me and guess what, it works! (a little joke) Bless >you all. >Cynthia Bolick Gilbert > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net
Happy Day after Thanksgiving to one and all! I've lurked around this wonderful site for a few months now waiting to see if anything pertained to my families. I've discovered that while most of the info has nothing to do with my family names it does open up avenues for thought. My local Genie Club at the library just had a study on Scots-Irish and now there's a discussion on this site! How great is that! While I can't relate to the "newbies",people who came over in the 1800's,(GRIN!!!!) because my families, the Atwell's and the Abernethy's, came to America in the late 1600's I still learn something from everyone. Thanks to all who take the time to post questions, provide answers and steer us to other places to explore. Also, concerning the delete key, I've use mine many times when things aren't interesting to me and guess what, it works! (a little joke) Bless you all. Cynthia Bolick Gilbert
If you haven't noticed, one of our favorite traditions is to disagree. STRONGLY. WITH CAPITAL LETTERS. Sometimes, I think that the love of a good fight maybe one of our defining characteristics. Personally, I could argue with a rock. Ron -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.6/179 - Release Date: 11/23/2005
My Gt-aunt, Sarah Muirhead (1854-1926) married Charles Boyle (1841-1908). They lived most of their lives in Racavan parish, County Antrim. However, for a short period (about 1871-1874) they lived in Pennsylvania where two children were born; Frances in 1872 and Charles Andrew in 1874. This information came from a grandson of Charles Andrew, and this was the extent of his knowledge on the subject. I would welcome any advice or suggestions as to how I might track down these two births in unknown locations in PA. Thank you. From John Muirhead
I am new to this mailing. Is any one connected to my line. I have hit a brick wall on Hugh's connection prior coming to the "Colonies". HUGH ABERNATHY was born Bet. 1738 - 1743 in Ireland, and died February 21, 1826 in Franklin County, Indiana. He married MARY ANN HAMILTON 1773 in South Carolina. She was born 1770 in South Carolina, and died September 16, 1838 in Fountain County, Indiana. Thanks, David C Abernathy Email disclaimers ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- This message represents the official view of the voices in my head. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.SchmeckAbernathy.com == All outgoing and incoming mail is scanned by Norton AntiVirus 2005 == -----Original Message----- From: CBGILBERT@aol.com [mailto:CBGILBERT@aol.com] Sent: Friday, November 25, 2005 7:27 AM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] I LOVE THE POSTINGS Happy Day after Thanksgiving to one and all! I've lurked around this wonderful site for a few months now waiting to see if anything pertained to my families. I've discovered that while most of the info has nothing to do with my family names it does open up avenues for thought. My local Genie Club at the library just had a study on Scots-Irish and now there's a discussion on this site! How great is that! While I can't relate to the "newbies",people who came over in the 1800's,(GRIN!!!!) because my families, the Atwell's and the Abernethy's, came to America in the late 1600's I still learn something from everyone. Thanks to all who take the time to post questions, provide answers and steer us to other places to explore. Also, concerning the delete key, I've use mine many times when things aren't interesting to me and guess what, it works! (a little joke) Bless you all. Cynthia Bolick Gilbert
Hey Linda, Always enjoy your posts. Hope you didn't have too much snow to drive in on your way to your sister's... Anyways, what do you know of the STINSONs from Ireland? Is this an SI surname? My great grandmother, Sarah M. STINSON, was purportedly born about June 1830 in Belfast, Antrim. (I don't know anything else about her ancestors or siblings, so obviously I'm not ready to jump the pond. When she emigrated, she went to Hamilton, Canada, married, then eventually settled in Michigan.) Any insight would be appreciated. Donna In Michigan enjoying my tryptophan (So no one calls the DEA, that's the chemical in turkey that makes one sleepy)
Donegal’s part in the birth of Presbyterianism across North America is to be celebrated in a heritage tourism initiative linking the University of Ulster’ s Institute of Ulster Scots Studies and the International Fund for Ireland. The achievements of two of Donegal’s most famous sons, Francis Makemie and William Gregg as towering figures in the growth of the Presbyterian Church in the United States and Canada, will be centre-stage in an educational and interpretive centre to be built in the cradle of Irish Presbyterianism – the Laggan district in the north-east of the county. The old manse at Monreagh near St Johnston is just five miles from the Donegal-Derry border will be converted into the new centre, containing 17th and 18th century artefacts and displays that tell the story of how Presbyterian communities fled Ulster seeking freedom of religion and a new life in the New World. “ This centre will not be a staid mausoleum. It will be a living attraction which will celebrate an Ulster Scots heritage that will attract tourists and generate income in the north-west. It will be a significant addition to the many reasons for visiting this area,” said Professor John Wilson, Director of the Institute of Ulster Scots Studies. “Tourism Ireland has developed a deliberate strategy to woo the Scots-Irish. We think lots of people will be interested to travel to the centre as a way of establishing a link with forebears, many of whom sailed as entire congregations for North America,” he added. The International Fund for Ireland (IFI) is giving a €374,000 grant to the centre and the building project is expected to begin early next year. The Institute for Ulster Studies will recruit a project manager to lead the first year of the project. Denis Rooney, IFI Chairman said: “The development of sustainable tourism based on the history and heritage of the Ulster-Scots/Scots-Irish is now an integral part of the tourism strategy for the border region. Tourism Ireland is launching a direct marketing campaign aimed at the 200,000 Irish Americans of this heritage in the USA. The first tours based on the history and heritage of the Ulster Scots arrive this year.” The Laggan district lies between Loughs Swilly and Lough Foyle, and is centred on the towns of Lifford, Raphoe, Carrigans, St Johnston, Stranorlar and Newtowncunningham. The first Irish Presbytery was founded at Carrickfergus in 1642 among the Scots army. The Presbytery of the Laggan, an area of Scottish and Presbyterian settlement, was the second formed in Ireland. Founded in 1644, Monreagh is the oldest of five congregations founded in the Laggan and the oldest Presbyterian community in the Republic of Ireland. “Donegal has a proud Christian heritage from the time of St Colmcille whose heritage is a meeting point for all denominations today. His great missionary achievements were continued into the New World by Makemie and Gregg and the new centre will reflect this historic evangelism,” Prof Wilson said. “Coming closer to modern times, it will be asking what it was about Presbyterians from an Ulster Scots background that had such an influence in North America, an influence that was even mirrored in the American Constitution and the fact that at least 17 Presidents claim an Ulster Scots heritage.” The establishment of heritage and education centre in Donegal to commemorate Makemie has been under consideration for four years. Initial research by the Institute for Ulster Scots Studies received seed funding of £18,000 from the Ulster Scots Agency and a €10,000 from the Department of Foreign Affairs in the Republic. Francis Makemie is recognised as the founder of the Presbyterian Church in the United States. Born in Fanad near Ramelton of Scottish parents in 1657-8. The Penal Laws disbarred students from studying in Ireland and would not permit the establishment of a Presbyterian College and so Makemie, like his other contemporaries, took his degree at Glasgow University. It is in many senses very appropriate therefore that the Institute of Ulster Scots Studies is based at Magee Campus of the University of Ulster, as this was the first Presbyterian College in Ireland. Ordained at St. Johnston in 1682 with a view to missionary work in the new colonies, Makemie went first to the West Indies and afterwards arrived in Maryland in 1683. He set about organising scattered congregations into a structured church. Makemie became Moderator of the first Presbytery, which met in Philadelphia in 1706. He died aged 50 and is buried in Virginia. William Gregg was born at Killycreen near Ramelton in 1817. After studying theology in Edinburgh, he was licensed by the Free Church Presbytery in 1846 and was immediately sent to Canada on missionary work. Ordained there in 1847, he was Moderator of the Presbyterian Church of Canada, usually called the Free Church, in 1861 when union took place between it and the United Presbyterian Church of Canada. For further information, please contact: Press Office, Department of Public Affairs Tel: 028 9036 6178 Email: _pressoffice@ulster.ac.uk_ (mailto:pressoffice@ulster.ac.uk)
There is a book, "The Ulster Jackson" by D.J. McCartney. It is done by a retired schoolmaster.It's been a while since I read it. I should probably revisit it. It was published by Carrickfergus Borough Council in 1997. Good luck, Sharon Oddie Brown Roberts Creek, BC, Canada THE SILVER BOWL: http://www.user.dccnet.com/s.brown/index.html FAMILY TREE: http://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?db=silverbowl
Hullo Elaine and other friends I heartily agree with you. Because I was born in Cornwall of a Cornish mother and Ulster/Devon father, I am also a member of the Cornish List. We have two Lists - one for genealogy alone and the other which covers history, geography, customs, recipes and other information of general interest which, as you rightly say, gives us an idea as to how our ancestors lived. Listmum steps in when she feels a thread has outlived its usefulness, otherwise the delete key is just a touch away. Cheers Pat Pat Banks Perth Western Australia CFHS 03548 OPC for St.Levan and Mullion, Cornwall Researching: COCK Mullion, Cornwall GEORGE Illogan and Townshend, Cornwall OSBORNE St.Levan, Cornwall POLGLASE Breage and Kerthenwood, Cornwall MAGILL Co.Antrim MAWHINNEY Co. Antrim -----Original Message----- From: E. Suhre [mailto:braisl@madisontelco.com] Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2005 8:47 AM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] Traditions I agree with Elaine Allen. I sometimes don't have enough time during the Holidays and many other times to pick up a book and read it from one end to another about a Holiday, living conditions, meanings of words etc. before another Holiday arrives. Thusly, I appreciate the tidbits given on the list about history. And isn't that what genealogy is, history? Information gleaned from the list helps fill out the bones of my ancestors. Sometimes I can see their faces, where they lived and how they lived through stories (short ones) given on the list. In other words, thanks for the history/genealogy lessons. Keep up the good work. Elaine Suhre
Hi Forrest, The Jacksons have been 'done' over and over. Your problem is figuring out what is crap and what is not. The man whose research is least likely to be wrong works at the New England Historic Genealogical Society -- I forget his name. ANyone know? He has spent his life researching presidents. If you google (www.google.com) you'll find a huge amount of stuff like this: http://www.presidentsusa.net/jackson.html Popularizers like Billy Kennedy also have published on him but Billy is not always right and he never footnotes his stuff so it's a 'dead end'. He contradicted himself on some of my ancestors in the same book. Still he's great to read! Billy covers Jackson in "The Scots-Irish in the Carolinas". The Jacksons were from Antrim, ariving 18 months before Andrew was born. His mother was related to the McAMIE family, which is where I did a wee bit of research on them. From one source (Clan McCord) Andrew Jackson was born just a few miles into South Carolina at Waxhaw, just south of Mecklenberg County, North Carolina. His mother was close to relatives such as the McAmis (McCamish, McCamis) family and the Crawford family who lived just inside the North Carolina line a few miles away and attended the same church as McCord family members who lived there. {not tru, not McCamish -- which was the surname I was researching....} In "OUR BRANCH OF THE LESSLIE FAMILY IN THIS COUNTRY SINCE 1750" By John Nathaniel Lesslie The Lesslie family first came to Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. In 1756 war began between France and England for the possession of all the northern part of the country and Canada. ...So on account of the Indian depredations life became unsafe in Pennsylvania. They began the treck down the Wagon Road to the "Garden of the Waxhaws". In 1757 all except John Lesslie and his family came to Lancaster County, South Carolina to what is known as the Waxhaws. In 1765 Mr. Jackson and Elizabeth came from Antrim, Ireland to America in company with a Hutchinson Brother. They landed in Charleston and made their way up the river to their relatives in LancasterCounty, South Carolina. The Jacksons settled on land near the headwaters of Twelve Mile Creek, about eight miles from the other family members. The others settled on either side of Waxhaw Creek. Andrew Jackson II died after being injured lifting! a log. He died within 48 hours. He is buried in Waxhaw graveyard. The grave is marked. At the time of his death, his wife Elizabeth Hutchinson Jackson was pregnant with her 3rd child, Andrew Jackson III, the future president of the United States of America. On the night he was born Elizabeth and her sister sent for another sister, Sarah Hutchinson Lesslie, to serve as mid wife. Along with her came he daughter of 7 years, Sarah. (Later Sarah Latham) The same book says In 1755, Mckemie, Sam Lesslie, John Lesslie, James Crawford, James Crow and their families came to America and settled in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. In 1757 all except John Lesslie and his family,on account of the French and Indian War, came to Lancaster County, South Carolina to what is known as the Waxhaws. In 1765 Mr. Jackson and Elizabeth came from Antrim, Ireland to America in company with a Hutchinson Brother. They landedin Charleston and made their way up the river to their relatives in Lancaster County, South Carolina. To Sarah and Samuel Lesslie were born nine children: John, who migrated to Henderson County, Tennessee, Robert, who went to Kings Mountain, York County, SC; William, who made his home in Abbeville; Samuel, who married Nandy Allison about 1770-1775. In 1800 they left Lancaster County and went first to Oconee or Pickens and later to Alabama then to Arkansas. Sarah married Mr. Latham. Mary became the wife of James Faulkner.Jane was unmarried. There w! ere two other children (no record or name) Anyway, further research convinced me they were McKemies, not McCamishes (who aren't usually from Antrim but from Down and Tyrone....). Some of the Lesslie stuff might be wrong too -- but it gives you a notion of how many families are connected to the Jacksons and if you can tie yours in -- most likely they are also Antrim people. A lot of Lancaster/Cumberland Co Ulster Scots had ties and estates in the Carolinas. This I learned from reading will abstracts <grin>. Too bad you are a Forrest and not a Forrester as I have FORRESTERs but they came straight from Ayr about 1800 and intermarried with the Ulster Scots of Western PA. On my website I have a photie of a possible pre 1800 Forrester tartan. It was brought over by my MARTIN/FORRESTER ancestors. It is very very alergi-fying due to the natural dyes. I call it the "toxic tartan" : http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~merle/Family/Tartan.htm Highly sacred, no one was allowed to touch it when my mother was a child. However that could be because it's radioactive <grin>!!!! There are not a lot of 18th century setts around. Jackson genealogy http://www.presidentsusa.net/jackson.html Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Forrest Plumstead" <fplum1@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 08:35:49 -0600 >I feel like I just fell off the pumpkin wagon. I just found out that Andrew Jackson Sr, father of President Andrew Jackson came from Ulster. Anybody have additional information on this family. (including traditions(sorry couldn't resist<VBG> ;-) ) > >I'm working on a connection between my wife's family and the Andrew Jacksons. > >Forrest Plumstead fplum1@gmail.com >Researching the following Surnames: >Bushouse, Plumstead, Risser, Schroeder, Senne, Thayer, >Quaker Families: Coppock, Heald, Hobson, Hollingsworth, Potts, Ross, Watt >Plumstead and Associated Families: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fplum/ >Military Kool Lynx: http://geocities.com/fplum/ >Ham Radio WB5HQO http://forrest.3h.com/main.html > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net
Does anybody in County Armaugh know if the Gaol of Ardmagh is still standing? If so where could I find some pictures of it? Forrest Plumstead fplum1@gmail.com Researching the following Surnames: Bushouse, Plumstead, Risser, Schroeder, Senne, Thayer, Quaker Families: Coppock, Heald, Hobson, Hollingsworth, Potts, Ross, Watt Plumstead and Associated Families: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fplum/ Military Kool Lynx: http://geocities.com/fplum/ Ham Radio WB5HQO http://forrest.3h.com/main.html
I have been watching the for and against arguments developing on this site and it makes me a bit sad. I can understand that recipes etc should be kept private and off the list but to my mind traditions are another thing altogether. When some of my ancestors left these shores to go to the US and other places around the world, the places they went to and the communities they founded were based on the traditions they knew. I find it inexplicable that someone should try to sort out their Scots-Irish heritage without attempting to understand the history and tradition which their ancestors brought with them. Obviously the intolerance of some of those left behind was also carried to the new world. Be patient folks, if a little discussion is not to your liking read the subject line and use the delete key. This list is great, Linda does a great job and does step in when someone oversteps the mark. Let us all calm down and practice a degree of tolerance and we might all learn a lot more than we know now! Ella, in a very cold, windy Belfast, Northern Ireland Ella Patterson Cataloguing Department Resources Management Division Information Services Main Library The Queen's University of Belfast University Road Belfast BT7 1LS Telephone : + 44 (0) 28 9097 3639 Fax : +44 (0) 28 9097 3340 Email : e.patterson@qub.ac.uk Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C5F0FB.5360FD90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" = xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" = xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" = xmlns:st1=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" = xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1"> <meta name=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> <o:SmartTagType = namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name=3D"PlaceName"/> <o:SmartTagType = namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name=3D"PlaceType"/> <o:SmartTagType = namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name=3D"country-region"/> <o:SmartTagType = namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name=3D"City"/> <o:SmartTagType = namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name=3D"place"/> <!--[if !mso]> <style> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } </style> <![endif]--> <style> <!-- /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {margin:0cm; margin-bottom:.0001pt; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {color:blue; text-decoration:underline;} a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple; text-decoration:underline;} p {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0cm; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0cm; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} span.EmailStyle17 {mso-style-type:personal-compose; font-family:Arial; color:windowtext; font-weight:normal; font-style:normal; text-decoration:none none;} @page Section1 {size:595.3pt 841.9pt; margin:72.0pt 19.85pt 72.0pt 19.85pt;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style> <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" /> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit"> <o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" /> </o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--> </head> <body lang=3DEN-GB link=3Dblue vlink=3Dpurple> <div class=3DSection1> <p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span = style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>I have been watching the for and against arguments = developing on this site and it makes me a bit sad. I can understand that recipes = etc should be kept private and off the list but to my mind traditions are = another thing altogether. When some of my ancestors left these shores to go to = the <st1:country-region w:st=3D"on"><st1:place w:st=3D"on">US</st1:place></st1:country-region> = and other places around the world, the places they went to and the communities = they founded were based on the traditions they knew. I find it inexplicable = that someone should try to sort out their Scots-Irish heritage without = attempting to understand the history and tradition which their ancestors brought with = them. Obviously the intolerance of some of those left behind was also carried to the new = world. Be patient folks, if a little discussion is not to your liking read the = subject line and use the delete key. This list is great, Linda does a great job = and does step in when someone oversteps the mark. Let us all calm down and = practice a degree of tolerance and we might all learn a lot more than we know = now!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span = style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>Ella, in a very cold, windy Belfast, Northern = Ireland<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span = style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <p><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span = style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ella Patterson<br> Cataloguing Department<br> Resources Management Division<br> Information Services<br> Main Library<br> The Queen's <st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:PlaceType = w:st=3D"on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st=3D"on">Belfast</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><br> University Road<br> <st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place = w:st=3D"on">Belfast</st1:place></st1:City><br> BT7 1LS &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; = </span></font><o:p></o:p></p> <p><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span = style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Telephone : + 44 (0) 28 9097 3639<br> Fax : +44 = (0) 28 9097 3340<br> Email : <a href=3D"mailto:e.patterson@qub.ac.uk">e.patterson@qub.ac.uk</a><br> <br> Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the = moments that take our breath away</span></font><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p= > <p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span = style=3D'font-size: 12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> </div> </body> </html> ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C5F0FB.5360FD90--
OK, I give up ! ! ! I'm going to enjoy my Thanksgiving. Grandpa Walt Ulster-Scot McKenzie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Walt McKENZIE, Sr." <WaltIrish1@comcast.net> To: Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2005 11:36 AM Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Apology for asking for traditions > G'day , > Thank you so very much for your service to our country, > USAmerica. Isn't it great we can all express our opinion. May God > bless you. Happy Thanksgiving , Walt > P.S. : I can't understand all the confusion over my rather concise, > courteous, constructive opinion. It is a simple matter of having 29,000+ > Rootsweb genealogy mail list, so that each list can experience on-topic > sharing in a relatively kind & mature manner and not psyche-out or > greatly irritate others. Rootsweb is not 1 site / mail list where all of > genealogy, no matter what, is discussed. Again, we can't even > comment relatively on-topic on this one single matter. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Walt McKENZIE, Sr." <WaltIrish1@comcast.net> > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2005 9:23 AM > Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Apology for asking for traditions >> Bag it, Walt. If your primary interest is Scots-Irish >> History go to the library and read up on it. Cultural >> traditions are as important to genealogy as all the >> names and dates going back to the 1700s. That >> information fell off the table a long time ago. >> I'm 58 and of Scots-Irish Descent, a retired US >> Army Sergeant First Class(wounded twice), father of >> three and grandfather of seven. If you want to study >> the history of the emigration, as well as the root >> causes; go to the library. These lists are for people >> who wish to learn about their own heritage, not what >> happened 300+ years ago!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Forrest Plumstead" <fplum1@gmail.com> To: <Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 7:46 PM Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Apology for asking for traditions > Traditions are a part of history, and history is a part of genealogy. With > out them all you have is a boring list of names, date and place of birth, > date and place of death, and date and place of marriage. For example I have -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.7/180 - Release Date: 11/23/2005
I am surprised to find out that apparently a large group of computer users don't have a "delete" key. I sneak a peek and if I don't want to read farther click good old "delete". By the way, my GGgrandparents came from Scotland, spent 7 years in Ireland on their way over in 1853 and I didn't realize until my first trip to Scotland in 1985 how much of my family's customs, sayings, and especially food came from the old country (even though the grandparents I loved were 1st generation American-born). I love it SOME OF THE TIME when the theme turns a bit off plain genealogy. Learn a lot from those times and, if not, there's still that delete button. Sometimes I don't understand why Linda gets so uptight with things that some of us enjoy, but I guess that comes with the list manager's job description. Then she has to deal with the "up-tight" members. Bless her heart! Mary Lander ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nancy" <nmcfarl@racc2000.com> To: <Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: November 23, 2005 11:53 PM Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Asking for Traditions > > I actually use my "delete" key if I happen to not like the subject on one of > my e-mail groups I subscribe to, or if the subject doesn't pertain to me. > > Nancy McFarland > > > > > Hi List , > > There is nothing wrong wanting to have traditions, recipes info > etc. as > > long as its not over-the-top off-topic. > > In genealogy, we have a) primary documents e.g. vitals b) > secondary > > data e.g. census c) verbal info passed-down & d) generically applicable info > > e.g. recipes, traditions etc. It is d), the generic info that is so often > the off > > topic offender and these aspects are not going to establish your ancestors > > true identity. Only the higher level data, especially the primary docu., > for the > > 18-19th centuries will begin to differentiate Scotch-Irish (S/I) from > > Ulster-Scot (U/S) etc. > > Again, even more so, we can have 30,000+ mail list (this is good), > if we > do not presently have a "S/I Traditions" and even a "U/S Traditions" list > etc. > Actually, only 16-17th century docu./data will differentiate S/I & U/S and > we > all know that is even less likely / available. > > Walt > > > > >
Obviously, Mr. Law has either not been on this list long or has not paid attention in the past.
Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Apology for asking for traditions/Surnames > Our ancestors were just more than a name and date on a page >> It's interesting to see what traditions and variations there of, have >> survived over the years! > > I find traditions especially interesting because I grew up with no > knowledge of my father's family background -- not even the countries of > origin for the surnames. After I discovered that my maternal grandmother > was SI, and realized that it is from her family that most of our family > traditions, political leanings, moral values, etc. originated, it is > fascinating to me so see how similar they are to those of others from that > same heritage. It may not be "genealogy", but I sure have learned much of > value about my SI background from these occasional off-topic exchanges. I > treasure them -- thanks. > Virginia -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.7/180 - Release Date: 11/23/2005
I am new to this list, but have thoroughly enjoyed the 'chat' about traditions. A few questions for anyone who may have ideas or suggestions: Are Scottish and Irish traditions likely to be the same? Are the Ulster Scots likely to have kept their Scottish traditions, especially since they are often associated with religion? Did they keep to themselves, or would they have adopted the 'ways' of the folks around them? I have one Ulster Scots ancestor, William Howard BURNS, born in Belfast 1766, and other supposedly Scottish families: REED, SANKEY, ALEXANDER, MORRISON (maybe Scottish or maybe Irish?) Would these be lowlander Scots rather than highlander? No 'Mc's' anywhere. Also, my father's grandparents (Chester Burns REED and Annette Tryphene GOODSON) were called "Danny" and "Bonnie" supposedly Scottish nicknames for grandfather and grandfather. Anyone heard of these names used as such? (I am named for that 'Bonnie') Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks, Bonnie Bonnie L Hamilton tibart@alum.wellesley.edu WorldConnect gedcom: http://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?db=tibart&I11.x=45&I11.y=0
Hi Bonnie, welcome to the list. >Are Scottish and Irish traditions likely to be the same? It's hard to generalize. Things are different at the south end of Ireland from the north and ditto for east and west. The music is different, traditions too! Scotland as well. Scotland has undergone a lot of homogenization in the last few hundred years. It was originally formed by 4 different peoples: The gaelic Scots (from Ulster), the Vikings -- still prominant in the north and west, the indiginous Picts, and the "Angles" (tribes of Germans who settled in the Lothians). Oh, and lets not forget the Welsh who moved to Galloway. So things are different in the highlands than the lowlands. At least!! However that said, I was amazed when reading "Passing the time in Ballymenone", a town in the North of Ireland, how much things were like my Scottish grandmas -- right down to how you placed the furniture in the room and what you had on your shelves for display. I think the 'folk culture' is very similar -- perhaps!! (Grandma's family were lowlanders from Polmont in the heart of Scotland). >Are the Ulster Scots likely to have kept their Scottish traditions, >especially since they are often associated with religion? Did they keep to >themselves, or would they have adopted the 'ways' of the folks around them? Another debate here -- The people who left Scotland to move to Ulster in the 1600s were the most enterprising, Ferenghi like Scots. They were willingly leaving a place with few opportunities for the wild west of its day. Those who didn't bring wives had to marry and many married Irish women. This was particularly true of the men in the McDonald army who conquored Antrim in the 1500s. They had no women at all. And who is it that sits at the fire all day telling the children stories? Cooking food and passing on their recipes? Women! Some blending has definitely occured. >I have one Ulster Scots ancestor, William Howard BURNS, born in Belfast >1766, and other supposedly Scottish families: >REED, SANKEY, ALEXANDER, MORRISON (maybe Scottish or maybe Irish?) Would >these be lowlander Scots rather than highlander? No 'Mc's' anywhere. Probably, but Highland families in Scotland often adopted lowland surnames wh en they moved. THere was a lot of dislike of them. They'd be as welcome in Edinburgh in a kilt and with a Mc name as an Indian in a loincloth in Andrew Jackson's Washington DC!! That changed of course. It was very easy to move a little ways and change your name and take up a new identity. There is some evidence too that if you changed religion the clergy might record the baptisms and marriages in the 'right style' so an Irish surname might get the O' circumcized and a Mc attached, etc. I know a pro- fessional genealogist whose family 'switched' identities at least 4 times in Ireland that he's been able to trace by doing this. His were gentry so there were records. Ours were po' people -- no records, so it was a LOT easier to put your past behind you. >Also, my father's grandparents (Chester Burns REED and Annette Tryphene >GOODSON) were called "Danny" and "Bonnie" supposedly Scottish nicknames for >grandfather and grandfather. >Anyone heard of these names used as such? >(I am named for that 'Bonnie') Sure. But since you can see Ireland from Scotland, anything in the one place is likely to be in the other. Not totally true, but is always good to remember. I recall reading a scholarly book about the Irish banshee and how the Scots had none, based on Ulster Scots in Ireland. Yet if you read any book of Scottish folktales there are plenty of banshees. I regret not being able to flunk the author in some course.....any course, for bad scholarship. Linda Mer ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net
I feel like I just fell off the pumpkin wagon. I just found out that Andrew Jackson Sr, father of President Andrew Jackson came from Ulster. Anybody have additional information on this family. (including traditions(sorry couldn't resist<VBG> ;-) ) I'm working on a connection between my wife's family and the Andrew Jacksons. Forrest Plumstead fplum1@gmail.com Researching the following Surnames: Bushouse, Plumstead, Risser, Schroeder, Senne, Thayer, Quaker Families: Coppock, Heald, Hobson, Hollingsworth, Potts, Ross, Watt Plumstead and Associated Families: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fplum/ Military Kool Lynx: http://geocities.com/fplum/ Ham Radio WB5HQO http://forrest.3h.com/main.html
Hello Nancy, Try www.electricscotland.com for Scottish history. There is also GENUKI Scotland at www.genuki.org.uk/big/sct/index.html and GenWeb at www.scotlandgenweb.org/ Rob Doragh Liverpool UK Nancy <nmcfarl@racc2000.com> Subject: Surnames Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2005 a few ancestors on a maternal line are MacAlpin, which I find is a Scottish clan name, and also some with old spellings MacGabhran, MacAiden, MacDomnail or MacDamnall. these may be strictly Scottish in origin but I'm not sure of what the modern spellings would be or the families may have ventured to Ireland.