Hi Rob, Gee, say the word 'recipe' agin and you might that YOU are the proud admin of the Scotch Irish list <grin>. That's mean you find in your inbox: 200 "Cannot deliver email" messages 50 "GET ME OFF THIS LIST!" messages 50 "Finally, a NICE topic!" messages 15 successful unsub messages 5 "Why is xxx sending me deaththreats?" messages 4 emails I can't understand. (Get the internet out of the Alzhiemer units!) 25 recipes for 'tomato sandwich' and 4 for possum 75 mass unsubs from British cousins offended by our bad spelling and hideous cuisine (it's the American schools, guys!) 40 emails blaming me for everything. 1 sub message 1 email trying to find a ancestor .... in Scotland. 1 mass-emailed funeral announcement for the IRA spy on the list who died from boredom like the last one. 1 email from rootsweb 'help desk' claiming someone claims I insulted him/her. So I say we all join the Unionist list and post our favorite Scotch Irish recipes!! Linda Merle (SI Admin, who hopes her time here reduces her time in purgatory) ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Rob Hilliard" <rhilliard@mackinengineering.com> Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2006 08:10:54 -0500 >Edward, >I, for one, will look forward to subscribing to your new list. I go >back nearly to the inception of this S-I list, but after a few years I >took a rather long hiatus until recently. When I resubscribed I found, >as you alluded, that the tenor of the list had changed to something >resembling more traditional genweb research lists - unquestionably an >important and useful tool, but not nearly as much fun as the old days. > >For Pete's sake, I've been back almost two months and there hasn't been >even one fight yet! Or one recipe discussion. > >Ah, the good old days . . . > >Rob > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Edward Andrews [mailto:edward.andrews@btinternet.com] >Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 1:35 PM >To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [Sc-Ir] New list > >Sorry folks to subscribe to the list which I recently advertised > >* Subscribing. Clicking on one of the shortcut links below should work, >but if your browser doesn't understand them, try these manual >instructions: to join Unionist-Culture-L, send mail to >Unionist-Culture-L-request@rootsweb.com with the single word subscribe >in the message subject and body. To join Unionist-Culture-D, do the same >thing with Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com. ><mailto:Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com> > >* Subscribe ><mailto:Unionist-Culture-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=subscribe&body=s >ubsc >ribe> to Unionist-Culture-L >* Subscribe ><mailto:Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=subscribe&body=s >ubsc >ribe> to Unionist-Culture-D (digest) > >Edward Andrews > > > >Only by recovering prophetic and objective modes of preaching, in >faithfulness to the gospel of Christ crucified and in contradiction to >society's profane habits and priorities, can we truly challenge our >dying culture and reveal to it its own possibilities for resurrection. > Alan E Lewis. "Between Cross and Resurrection. A Theology of Holy >Saturday" >Eerdmans 2001 p 377 > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

I am interested in information on John McKenzie/McKinney/McKinsey/McKengie who has been listed as being born between 1770 to 1790 and he has been listed as marrying either Ellen Boggs or Martha Patsy Cocke/Cox in Lee or Scott or Russell co. Va. around 1800. This man in one source was also listed as Johnson McKenzie. I would like to hear from anyone on this man and McKenzie family. Thank you. Duane McKenzie. dmckenze@hutchtel.net

I would like information also on Vatchel or Vachel Clark who was born in 1730 and died in Montgomery co. NC. around 1815. His wife was named Olive and they came to Montgomery co. NC. from Orange or Chatham co. NC. in 1790. I would like to hear from any of you on this Clark family. Thank you. Duane McKenzie. dmckenze@hutchtel.net

Hi, I would like information on Joseph McKenzie who came to Philadelphia, Pa. around 1750 and settled near Newburg, Pa. Joseph McKenzie was born in 1730 possibly in North Ireland. I would like to hear from anyone on this man and McKenzie family. Duane McKenzie. dmckenze@hutchtel.net

Let's just concentrate on the Army. If he was in Scotland then he was in a Scottish Regiment. So you are looking for a Scottish Regiment which was in Dublin in 1775 and was involved in the American Rebellion having been in Charleston. Could you share the source of what you have read? Edward Andrews _____ From: Tannich, Mary Lou [mailto:tannicma@itronix.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 7:06 PM To: 'Edward Andrews' Subject: RE: [Sc-Ir] Foote family 1750 Dublin Anything I have read, he was pressganged. Went to Scotland for two years training and then apparently got sick at Charleston and was hospitalized. I think then was when he left and stayed in the States. This is what I have read anyway...He apparently hated Cornwallis. Wow! Great points...thanks so much! :) Mary Lou -----Original Message----- From: Edward Andrews [mailto:edward.andrews@btinternet.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 10:58 AM To: 'Tannich, Mary Lou' Subject: RE: [Sc-Ir] Foote family 1750 Dublin Are you sure that he was kidnapped and pressganged into the Army? It was the Navy which had a pressgang. The Army recruited the thinking was that once you got them on a ship they were going to find it difficult to desert, it was not so with the Army. If he was enlisted in Dublin in 1775 it would be possible to discover what regiment/s were in Dublin, and it might even be possible to follow your man. I don't know what you mean "To fight for the British" in 1775 Ireland still had its own parliament, and also I think its own Army Establishment. I suggest that you try milgenire which is a Yahoo group which advertises itself as "Provide a forum for discussion of all aspects of pre-1922 Irish military history and military genealogy. This includes all forces in Ireland during the British period whether of the regular British Army, the Militia, Yeomanry, Auxiliary or the Irish Volunteer Army, the Citizen Army and similar. It also includes those forces such as the Irish Brigades and similar bodies. The emphasis is on Military Genealogy and the post Treaty period will not be included. Topics can include the history of any of the above, their uniforms, badges, equipment, medals etc. as well as the actions they participated in. Some of the discussion will require an enormous amount of discipline. Since we will be discussing legitimate Military History, the words 'murder(ers)' and 'terrorist(s)' are not allowed. It is hoped to encourage the study of this area and especially the documentation of those who served in these forces". With a name like "John Wesley" given the date of his birth his parents were almost certainly Methodists so you are looking for a Methodist Foote, from Dublin who joined the British Army in 1775 at aged about 17, so he was either not an Apprentice, or else was running away. Hope that this helps Edward Andrews -----Original Message----- From: Tannich, Mary Lou [mailto:tannicma@itronix.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 6:12 PM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] Foote family 1750 Dublin I do not know the parent's names but John Wesley Foote was born about 1758 and was kidnapped around 1775 or so by Cornwallis's press gang to make him fight for the British. John apparently was visiting his Mom in nearby Dublin. I've heard possibly he is connected to the well documented Foote's from England but have found no real connection. I've found a few Foote's in Dublin about that time but do not know of the connection to John. Thanks, Mary Lou Tannich

Are you sure that he was kidnapped and pressganged into the Army? It was the Navy which had a pressgang. The Army recruited the thinking was that once you got them on a ship they were going to find it difficult to desert, it was not so with the Army. If he was enlisted in Dublin in 1775 it would be possible to discover what regiment/s were in Dublin, and it might even be possible to follow your man. I don't know what you mean "To fight for the British" in 1775 Ireland still had its own parliament, and also I think its own Army Establishment. I suggest that you try milgenire which is a Yahoo group which advertises itself as "Provide a forum for discussion of all aspects of pre-1922 Irish military history and military genealogy. This includes all forces in Ireland during the British period whether of the regular British Army, the Militia, Yeomanry, Auxiliary or the Irish Volunteer Army, the Citizen Army and similar. It also includes those forces such as the Irish Brigades and similar bodies. The emphasis is on Military Genealogy and the post Treaty period will not be included. Topics can include the history of any of the above, their uniforms, badges, equipment, medals etc. as well as the actions they participated in. Some of the discussion will require an enormous amount of discipline. Since we will be discussing legitimate Military History, the words 'murder(ers)' and 'terrorist(s)' are not allowed. It is hoped to encourage the study of this area and especially the documentation of those who served in these forces". With a name like "John Wesley" given the date of his birth his parents were almost certainly Methodists so you are looking for a Methodist Foote, from Dublin who joined the British Army in 1775 at aged about 17, so he was either not an Apprentice, or else was running away. Hope that this helps Edward Andrews -----Original Message----- From: Tannich, Mary Lou [mailto:tannicma@itronix.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 6:12 PM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] Foote family 1750 Dublin I do not know the parent's names but John Wesley Foote was born about 1758 and was kidnapped around 1775 or so by Cornwallis's press gang to make him fight for the British. John apparently was visiting his Mom in nearby Dublin. I've heard possibly he is connected to the well documented Foote's from England but have found no real connection. I've found a few Foote's in Dublin about that time but do not know of the connection to John. Thanks, Mary Lou Tannich

Forrest, There is a census for all of the Ulster Plantation in 1659 including County Armaugh. I have seen Armaugh but only have copies of Counties Antrim and Down since that's where almost all my ancestors were located. However, these censuses are only broken down by Parrish, Town, Title Holder's Name, # People and then Count of English/ Scots vice Count of Irish. You may be lucky if the family held title to a grant of land such as the case in Antrim, or held a caretaker position for an Earl in Down, or even head of a militia company for a district since they are often mentioned by name. Copies of these censuses along with selected family information has been published by the Irish Genealogical Foundation and can be found at www.irishroots.com. This 1659 Census is the earliest existing census of which I'm aware but it doesn't contain many specifics so you generally resort to numerous secondary sources as a substitute for the census prior to the 1830s. The National Library and PRONI have many of these including the Freeholder's (Land Owners) Rolls for various years, Poll Book or Electors Rolls for various years, Church/ Parrish censuses, etc.. The church is often the best source. This seems to be the rule for Colonial Virginia as well as the Ulster Plantation generally. Good Luck. V/R Chuck Shaw Charles H. Shaw, III, CPL 15934 Spyglass Hill Loop Lake Manassas Gainesville, VA 20155 USA Home: 703-753-0549 Cell: 609-405-2511 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Forrest Plumstead" <fplum1@gmail.com> To: <Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 9:20 PM Subject: [Sc-Ir] Census > Does anybody know if there were any census in County Armagh before 1835? > > Forrest Plumstead fplum1@gmail.com > Researching the following Surnames: > Bushouse, Plumstead, Risser, Schroeder, Senne, Thayer, > Quaker Families: Coppock, Heald, Hobson, Hollingsworth, Potts, Ross, Watt > Plumstead and Associated Families: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fplum/ > Military Kool Lynx: http://geocities.com/fplum/ > Ham Radio WB5HQO http://forrest.3h.com/main.html > >

Sorry folks to subscribe to the list which I recently advertised * Subscribing. Clicking on one of the shortcut links below should work, but if your browser doesn't understand them, try these manual instructions: to join Unionist-Culture-L, send mail to Unionist-Culture-L-request@rootsweb.com with the single word subscribe in the message subject and body. To join Unionist-Culture-D, do the same thing with Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com. <mailto:Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com> * Subscribe <mailto:Unionist-Culture-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=subscribe&body=subsc ribe> to Unionist-Culture-L * Subscribe <mailto:Unionist-Culture-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=subscribe&body=subsc ribe> to Unionist-Culture-D (digest) Edward Andrews Only by recovering prophetic and objective modes of preaching, in faithfulness to the gospel of Christ crucified and in contradiction to society's profane habits and priorities, can we truly challenge our dying culture and reveal to it its own possibilities for resurrection. Alan E Lewis. "Between Cross and Resurrection. A Theology of Holy Saturday" Eerdmans 2001 p 377

Hi list, Don't think any of my ancestors were in Pa. before or during revolutionary war that I know of (came over much later); but being a history buff, I found your recent E-Mails very interesting Keep them coming!!! Janet

Recently after a discussion on the Scotch-Irish list I decided that I would start a cultural list. Over the past few years the Scotch-Irish list has developed in genealogical terms and in no longer the place where there use to be cosy discussions about the more esoteric features of Scotch-Irish Culture and History. I have also discovered the Irish Scots list which while it is not directly connected to the Scotch-Irish saga, does point the Ulster Scots to that part of the common experience of Irishness which is shared by people from all parts of Ireland, that of being a paddy in Britain. I however believe that it is important to affirm the experience of the Scotch Irish tribe before they left for America, acknowledging that there is still a substantial remnant in Ireland, which while it may or may not have a strong political basis depending who you are talking to. Unfortunately when I applied to Rootsweb for a new list I was told that the Unionist-Culture list was on the go, and that dealt with the interests which I listed in my application for Scots-Irish_Culture. However when I had asked about a list the Rootsweb administrators had tried to contact the Unionist Culture list, and discovered that it did not have a list owner. The list was therefore put up for adoption. I adopted it, and not withstanding the name, and reflecting the very low volume of posting that there has been we are going to go in a new direction. I invite all who are interested in the journey of the Scots Irish and the Irish Scots to come here for discussion about the roots which we have and our heritage. Personally I was born in Downpatrick, educated in Larne, Belfast, /Derry, Dublin, Manchester and Edinburgh (I was a slow learner) and have lived in Ulster, Cumbria, Highland, Lothian, and Argyll. My academic interests are History, especially Ecclesiastical History, and Sociology. Not withstanding the name of the list I do not expect that we will be getting involved in the nitty gritty of politics in either part of Ireland. Sectarianism of any kind will be severely stamped on. One warning and you are out. I have been waiting for a few weeks from taking over the list to give the present members a chance to post - which generally they haven't taken, and because I was over in Ireland for a week and I didn't want a complete break in service. On some week ends when I'm away working I'll have the list on Moderation so that a row can't start in my absence. For those who question my tag line, it is by a Welsh Ulsterman who taught theology in Scotland and America. His early death robbed reformed Theology of potentially a great teacher. Edward Andrews Only by recovering prophetic and objective modes of preaching, in faithfulness to the gospel of Christ crucified and in contradiction to society's profane habits and priorities, can we truly challenge our dying culture and reveal to it its own possibilities for resurrection. Alan E Lewis. "Between Cross and Resurrection. A Theology of Holy Saturday" Eerdmans 2001 p 377

Hi folks, before I forget, here's what I have learned. I've been checking on this for a long project. The people in Cumberland formed local militias to ward off the Indians. Some details are in "Mother Cumberland: Tracing your Ancestors in South-Central Pennsylvania" by Raymond M. Bell. It details ten counties: Bedford, Blair, Centre, Cumberland, Franklin, Fulton, Huntingdon, Mifflin, and Perry. I think these are west of the Susquahanna, so for Lancaster and York (etc) you need another book. It has detailed maps showing the evolution of townships. This will drive you crazy....I still remember the day when I found a person of interest in "Pitt Township" in Bedford County. That's Pittsburgh! It was in Bedford County for less than a year... Anyhow he also gives the names of the local militia leaders during the Revolution. These are KEY for locating where your ancsestor lived. You can usually find them in the militia lists under this man's name. (Militia lists are in the PA archives -- see our webpages for free internet copies and also the PA Archives website for different ones). So his name is key to the exact location. This can be useful for F&I times too as the same families were there. Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Rob, have you read about scouts? It's hard to believe that GW could find decent scouts of Western PA in Williamsburg! Surely he had to recruit a few 'locals' (to use the term very broadly <grin>). If only I was closer to those daily orders -- they might show him hiring local scouts. I am relieved to hear that my family is not the only weird family in Western PA. When I was attending college, the linguistic professor could tell which side of PGH you was raised in by your accent. This kinda localization I guess only happens if you do stay put! > Amen. And by the way, anyone joining the army during the retreat is >definitely my kind of guy. <GRIN> You mean like people joining on 9-12?? I suspect GW's defeat was the 9-11 of the day. If the Froggies (I can use that term: I married one!!) and the redskins won, people in western Cumberland Co and probably eventually even the fat Quakers of Philly were going to have to take French lessons -- or Iroquis lessons. So apparently some did 'join' on the retreat. At least this one guy did. Then he went AWOL.... Wow, you live ON THE OTHER SIDE of the Airport? I didn't know we'd settled that area yet. Or is it Steubenville??? >Another observation on W PA geography is that our rivers always have - >and continue to - screw up travel patterns. Not to pick on Linda, but I >will since she, like many in this area, apparently believes that the >airport is located south of Pittsburgh. This is partially because you >cross over the Mon or the Ohio River to get there, which in most >people's minds puts you south of the city. However any map will show >that the airport is WEST of Pittsburgh and actually NORTHWEST of the >downtown area. Geez! That's amazing!! I had no idea!!! I bet my parents won't believe me. Where I live now is very very geographically difficult. The Allegheny which is flowing....I donno....from the NE?? makes a big hairpin turn so that Westmoreland Co becomes a pimple sticking out into it on three sides. That's Arnold! So the river is on 3 sides and I'm on top of the hill. There is a big ridge on the other side of the river -- on all the sides of the river. I think my work room here is facing west and so to look at PGH I must look south. Maybe.... But the west feels like south because of this logic that says that Allegheny Co is west of Westmoreland. Except here where I think it's north as well as west. "Up 28", that's what it is <grin>. It's right up there with moving from Mass to CA and feeling you are u pside down because the ocean is on the wrong side!! >followed the north-flowing Monongahela (we call it the Mon) That's cause we can't spell it! It's easier than Kiskiminekis.. I think, well, the Kiski river! My ancestors moved to Westmoreland Co (southern) in 1785, then the next generation crossed the Allegheny at Freeport, and somehow hauled their tired butts up the huge bluff to the plateau. This Frances Anderson did a number of years before it was purchased from the Indians. So he settled illegally, around 1804, taking over from an earlier settler named Murphy. It wasn't long before some from the good ship Eliza also arrived. They had left Donegal, a mixed lot of Prods and Catholics, infected with liberty and freedom. That group became the start of the first Catholic diocese west of the Alleghenies. Alas, everyone signed the petition so you can't use it to sort the Prods from the Catholics....It became Butler and Indiana Counties, that area. The north western parts of PA are still .... vacant! get too far north you find New Yorkers and people who crossed the Erie or migrated down when they built the canal. But the rest is still farmland peppered with an occasional Presbyterian church. Also a Llama farm and game preserves. For anyone looking for a nice cheap civilized place to retire to, let me recommend Pittsburgh. I almost went into a fatal shock a couple weeks ago when I went in to PGH for an event and it took 20 minutes. Yet you can rent a nice apartment over a garage here for $250 and a house for $500. We got a nearby Walmart and anything else you would want. The Walmart opened a month ago but no one has found it yet. They apparently do advertizing at corporate because they screwed up the address. And if you clicked on "Directions" from their webpage, Mapquest deliveres you to a nonexistent place. I couldn't find it. My parents could not. Everyone they know is complaining. I phoned and found out where it is. I wonder if anyone has been there? What a screwup! My mother said every time they advertized it (3 times) in the paper they had a different address. Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Are you folks familiar with The Scotch-Risih of Colonial Pennsylvania, by Wayland F. Dunaway? 0806308508 (Genealogical Publishing's reprinting). I have found it of interest and it deals with various counties and their settlement as well as both social and political history of Scots Irish groups in that area. Is the work well-regarded? Carol -- Carol Cole Renfro 5931 West Avenue Lavonia, Georgia (706) 356-1254

Amen. And by the way, anyone joining the army during the retreat is definitely my kind of guy. >We only go south of PGH to go to the airport. Amen, part deux. My dad, who still lives on our family farm in the Allegheny Valley, is convinced that I've moved to the back side of the moon because I moved all the way to Beaver County - ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE AIRPORT!! I think he believes I was closer when I lived in Florida. Another observation on W PA geography is that our rivers always have - and continue to - screw up travel patterns. Not to pick on Linda, but I will since she, like many in this area, apparently believes that the airport is located south of Pittsburgh. This is partially because you cross over the Mon or the Ohio River to get there, which in most people's minds puts you south of the city. However any map will show that the airport is WEST of Pittsburgh and actually NORTHWEST of the downtown area. What the hell does this have to do with genealogy, you ask? Good question. What you end up with in western PA is a migration pattern that started in the south (hence the oft-referenced VA connection) and followed the north-flowing Monongahela (we call it the Mon) to the 'Forks of the Ohio' at Ft. Pitt (Pittsburgh). From there people went north along the Ohio for a ways before it loops back to the south and into what is now WV and OH. There were also a large number of early settlers who cut across the Mon and settled in what is now Washington County and the southern part of Beaver County, PA, south of the Ohio River. They rarely crossed the Ohio, though, because that was Indian territory until Fallen Timbers in 1794. An interesting anomaly of all this is that I live near one of the oldest non-family cemeteries in western PA (Mill Creek Presbyterian Church cemetery which dates to at least 1787), but the area where my (and Linda's) ancestors settled wasn't really populated until five or ten years later - even though it is a good 40 miles further EAST and therefore closer to the migration routes. Why? Because the Mon and the Ohio could easily carry settlers downstream to where I live, but the Allegheny flows the wrong way (for them). Anyone wanting to settle along the Allegheny north and east of Pittsburgh had to either fight the current or struggle across the hilly and largely roadless landscape to get there. Even parts of WV and OH - e.g., Wheeling and Zanesville - were settled (almost exclusively by S-I and Germans) decades before the upper Allegheny Valley. FWIW, Rob -----Original Message----- From: Linda Merle [mailto:merle@mail.fea.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 11:09 AM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com; Rob Hilliard Subject: RE: [Sc-Ir] Subject: History Alert Hi Rob, well my best knowledge agrees with yours - that GW recruited locally (to him). However given that we didn't know the boundaries of PA, MD, and VA in those days, and given that I have found a few guys in PA who served in VA troups, and given that nothing is rock solid, I thought I had better not say our PA SI ancestors "Didn't even serve" with GW. No one can make that statement as we don't have all the records. Plus as soon as I'd make such a statement, someone on the list would pipe up with their exception! I am sure they exist as no one thinks "oops, I donno if I am living in PA or MD or VA but because I am clairvoyant and I know that in 20 years they will decide this is PA, I can't go on the only interesting thing to happen here in my lifetime". Only a clairvoyant ancestor, living in the wrong place by 5 miles or so, could decide correctly. I did find one man who I believe lived in Berkeley Co, a McCormick (fer those who know "Dr. John", the early Scotch Irish settler in Fredericksburg area) who apparently joined up on the retreat (I think it was near Willis Ft). I think this man is Dr. John's son. He wasn't from the Williamsburg area. In reading the records, you do find men joining and then desserting on the way -- both ways. Some of the daily reports survive and it's there I found this man of interst. Though PA men were not fond of the Virginians, the border was not known and family alliances existed up the wahhhzooo between PA and MD and VA. I've found a number of PAers who married PA women in MD. We make too much of borders. He coulda been by the name the son of a man living near Chambersburg, but ..... I think Dr. John's family is more likely the source as they are Virginieees. However my theory on why my family rarely ever move south from the Allegheny Valley or even visit is them southernish parts in the Mon Valley are full of Virginians <grin>!!! We only go south of PGH to go to the airport. Linda Merle

>Our ancestors might have served in G W's army when he went west. Not if they lived in PA. Washington's troops (specifically, 1754 at Ft. Necessity and 1755 militia in Braddock's march) were raised in VA, mostly in the vicinity of Williamsburg. It's possible that there may have been a few PA militia in Braddock's march in addition to Washington's Virginians, but I don't have that information in front of me right now. As Linda correctly points out, there were virtually no European settlers west of the Allegheny Mountains at the outbreak of the F&I War in 1754. There was a single trader named (John?) Frazier with a cabin at the mouth of Turtle Creek on the Monongahela River and a few straggling traders at the Indian village of Logstown (current Freedom, PA) on the Ohio. The total white population in what is now western PA amounted to less than a couple dozen individuals at that time. By the close of the war in 1763, it was a slightly different story. Fort Pitt was five years old, the town of Pittsburgh was growing up around it, and Redstone Old Fort (current Brownsville, PA) was starting to grow with new settlers further south on the Monongahela. Still, though, you might only be talking about a couple hundred white settlers and traders at that time. It was over the next 20 years that the population in western PA grew abruptly. The relative security provided by the close of the F&I War started the westward migration, along with economic factors such as land speculation by the Ohio Company and the donation of lands to soldiers of the Continental Army. Of course, this security was disrupted again and again by Indian attacks - during the Revolutionary War (the Senecas in this area allied with the British), during the post-Revolution Indian Wars (ending with Anthony Wayne's 1794 defeat of the Indians at Fallen Timbers), and during various and sundry attacks in between. This can be important to genealogists because you may find that your ancestors moved west over the Alleghenies more than once - only to be forced back East again when things got hot on the frontier. Rob -----Original Message----- From: Linda Merle [mailto:merle@mail.fea.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 9:59 AM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Subject: History Alert It was interesting but our ancestors were not in Western PA during it. The edge of civilization was about Chamberburg, though living there was risky. There are places still called "Burnt Cabins". Our ancestors might have served in G W's army when he went west. Apparently many Cumberlanders were on the raid of Kittanning (which is now just up the river from me!). "The Crucible of War" by Fred Anderson (Vintage Books), in cheap paperback, is a good history of the Seven Years/French and Indian War. THe Cousins' Wars" by Kevin Phillips (Basic Books) presents a view of British Civil War (and American involvement), the French and INdian, and the American Revolution as three civil wars in the Anglo-British universe. It's fascinating to see the forces that underlay all three. Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: ACMBJC@aol.com Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:16:27 EST >Does anyone on the list know if or when the following is to be aired? >I sure hope it appears again, since most of my family history evolved >from western PA. > >TIA. > >Marybeth C. >acmbjc@aol.com > >============================================================= >In a message dated 2/19/06 12:26:06 AM, >Scotch-Irish-D-request@rootsweb.com >writes: > ><< Subject: History Alert > >That PBS show on cemeteries of Allegheny County was great as was the >one on the French and Indian War THE WAR THAT MADE AMERICA also WHEN >THE FOREST RAN RED. Let's send an alert to the list when we know >something good is scheduled for broadcast on PBS or the History Channel >Carolyn > >> > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

I do not know the parent's names but John Wesley Foote was born about 1758 and was kidnapped around 1775 or so by Cornwallis's press gang to make him fight for the British. John apparently was visiting his Mom in nearby Dublin. I've heard possibly he is connected to the well documented Foote's from England but have found no real connection. I've found a few Foote's in Dublin about that time but do not know of the connection to John. Thanks, Mary Lou Tannich

Hi Rob, well my best knowledge agrees with yours - that GW recruited locally (to him). However given that we didn't know the boundaries of PA, MD, and VA in those days, and given that I have found a few guys in PA who served in VA troups, and given that nothing is rock solid, I thought I had better not say our PA SI ancestors "Didn't even serve" with GW. No one can make that statement as we don't have all the records. Plus as soon as I'd make such a statement, someone on the list would pipe up with their exception! I am sure they exist as no one thinks "oops, I donno if I am living in PA or MD or VA but because I am clairvoyant and I know that in 20 years they will decide this is PA, I can't go on the only interesting thing to happen here in my lifetime". Only a clairvoyant ancestor, living in the wrong place by 5 miles or so, could decide correctly. I did find one man who I believe lived in Berkeley Co, a McCormick (fer those who know "Dr. John", the early Scotch Irish settler in Fredericksburg area) who apparently joined up on the retreat (I think it was near Willis Ft). I think this man is Dr. John's son. He wasn't from the Williamsburg area. In reading the records, you do find men joining and then desserting on the way -- both ways. Some of the daily reports survive and it's there I found this man of interst. Though PA men were not fond of the Virginians, the border was not known and family alliances existed up the wahhhzooo between PA and MD and VA. I've found a number of PAers who married PA women in MD. We make too much of borders. He coulda been by the name the son of a man living near Chambersburg, but ..... I think Dr. John's family is more likely the source as they are Virginieees. However my theory on why my family rarely ever move south from the Allegheny Valley or even visit is them southernish parts in the Mon Valley are full of Virginians <grin>!!! We only go south of PGH to go to the airport. Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Rob Hilliard" <rhilliard@mackinengineering.com> Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 10:25:02 -0500 > >Our ancestors might have served in G W's army when he went west. > >Not if they lived in PA. Washington's troops (specifically, 1754 at Ft. >Necessity and 1755 militia in Braddock's march) were raised in VA, >mostly in the vicinity of Williamsburg. It's possible that there may >have been a few PA militia in Braddock's march in addition to >Washington's Virginians, but I don't have that information in front of >me right now. > >As Linda correctly points out, there were virtually no European settlers >west of the Allegheny Mountains at the outbreak of the F&I War in 1754. >There was a single trader named (John?) Frazier with a cabin at the >mouth of Turtle Creek on the Monongahela River and a few straggling >traders at the Indian village of Logstown (current Freedom, PA) on the >Ohio. The total white population in what is now western PA amounted to >less than a couple dozen individuals at that time. > >By the close of the war in 1763, it was a slightly different story. >Fort Pitt was five years old, the town of Pittsburgh was growing up >around it, and Redstone Old Fort (current Brownsville, PA) was starting >to grow with new settlers further south on the Monongahela. Still, >though, you might only be talking about a couple hundred white settlers >and traders at that time. > >It was over the next 20 years that the population in western PA grew >abruptly. The relative security provided by the close of the F&I War >started the westward migration, along with economic factors such as land >speculation by the Ohio Company and the donation of lands to soldiers of >the Continental Army. Of course, this security was disrupted again and >again by Indian attacks - during the Revolutionary War (the Senecas in >this area allied with the British), during the post-Revolution Indian >Wars (ending with Anthony Wayne's 1794 defeat of the Indians at Fallen >Timbers), and during various and sundry attacks in between. > >This can be important to genealogists because you may find that your >ancestors moved west over the Alleghenies more than once - only to be >forced back East again when things got hot on the frontier. > >Rob > >-----Original Message----- >From: Linda Merle [mailto:merle@mail.fea.net] >Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 9:59 AM >To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [Sc-Ir] Subject: History Alert > >It was interesting but our ancestors were not in Western PA during it. >The edge of civilization was about Chamberburg, though living there was >risky. There are places still called "Burnt Cabins". Our ancestors might >have served in G W's army when he went west. Apparently many >Cumberlanders were on the raid of Kittanning (which is now just up the >river from me!). > >"The Crucible of War" by Fred Anderson (Vintage Books), in cheap >paperback, is a good history of the Seven Years/French and Indian War. > >THe Cousins' Wars" by Kevin Phillips (Basic Books) presents a view of >British Civil War (and American involvement), the French and INdian, and >the American Revolution as three civil wars in the Anglo-British >universe. It's fascinating to see the forces that underlay all three. > >Linda Merle > > >---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- >From: ACMBJC@aol.com >Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:16:27 EST > >>Does anyone on the list know if or when the following is to be aired? >>I sure hope it appears again, since most of my family history evolved >>from western PA. >> >>TIA. >> >>Marybeth C. >>acmbjc@aol.com >> >>============================================================= >>In a message dated 2/19/06 12:26:06 AM, >>Scotch-Irish-D-request@rootsweb.com >>writes: >> >><< Subject: History Alert >> >>That PBS show on cemeteries of Allegheny County was great as was the >>one on the French and Indian War THE WAR THAT MADE AMERICA also WHEN >>THE FOREST RAN RED. Let's send an alert to the list when we know >>something good is scheduled for broadcast on PBS or the History Channel > >>Carolyn >> >> >> >> > > > > > >________________________________________________________________ >Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

It was interesting but our ancestors were not in Western PA during it. The edge of civilization was about Chamberburg, though living there was risky. There are places still called "Burnt Cabins". Our ancestors might have served in G W's army when he went west. Apparently many Cumberlanders were on the raid of Kittanning (which is now just up the river from me!). "The Crucible of War" by Fred Anderson (Vintage Books), in cheap paperback, is a good history of the Seven Years/French and Indian War. THe Cousins' Wars" by Kevin Phillips (Basic Books) presents a view of British Civil War (and American involvement), the French and INdian, and the American Revolution as three civil wars in the Anglo-British universe. It's fascinating to see the forces that underlay all three. Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: ACMBJC@aol.com Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:16:27 EST >Does anyone on the list know if or when the following is to be aired? I sure >hope it appears again, since most of my family history evolved from western >PA. > >TIA. > >Marybeth C. >acmbjc@aol.com > >============================================================= >In a message dated 2/19/06 12:26:06 AM, Scotch-Irish-D-request@rootsweb.com >writes: > ><< Subject: History Alert > >That PBS show on cemeteries of Allegheny County was great as was the one on >the French and Indian War THE WAR THAT MADE AMERICA also WHEN THE FOREST >RAN RED. Let's send an alert to the list when we know something good is >scheduled for broadcast on PBS or the History Channel >Carolyn > >> > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Hello Missy, Go to www.seanruad.com and put Craigmore into the townland. You will find 3 hits, 2 for County Londonderry and 1 for County Antrim. Although they sound the same, 'moor' is English for 'moorland' while 'more' means 'big' in the Celtic languages. I'd suggest the monumental mason went by sound of the placename Rob Doragh Liverpool UK Missy Warren <mawarren@sbcglobal.net> Subject: Symington Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 2nd g-grandmother Sarah Elizabeth Symington (maiden) Stephens (married name) b1830, d1890 St. Louis, MO. birthplace on tombstone Craigmoor, Ireland. have looked up Craigmoor under numerous websites of towns, parishes, baronies and counties find nothing similar. Missy Warren

Does anyone on the list know if or when the following is to be aired? I sure hope it appears again, since most of my family history evolved from western PA. TIA. Marybeth C. acmbjc@aol.com ============================================================= In a message dated 2/19/06 12:26:06 AM, Scotch-Irish-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: << Subject: History Alert That PBS show on cemeteries of Allegheny County was great as was the one on the French and Indian War THE WAR THAT MADE AMERICA also WHEN THE FOREST RAN RED. Let's send an alert to the list when we know something good is scheduled for broadcast on PBS or the History Channel Carolyn >>