I am interested in finding people researching Gillzeans or Gilleans who migrated from Scotland to Canada and then to US, state of Georgia. My ancestor is John Gillean born 5 May 1813 in Georgia, died 2 Feb 1852 in Arkansas. A book in Cooper, Delta County, Texas said that these Gilleans were Scotch-Irish who came from Scotland to Canada, then to Georgia and to Arkansas. Can anybody recommend a web site or a bookseller where I might verify this? I have recently been told that they were called Gilzeans when they came to Canada. Recently someone in the family came across an old parchment sheet that said a John Gillean born in 1774 married a Fannie. Have not been able to find a record of this anywhere. Thank you.

If anyone wants it, I have a synopsized version of the Blanket Hill battle (the attack on Kittanning that Linda mentions below) in a Word document. I'll warn you, though, that I wrote it so it has some of my editorial comments in it as well. Rob -----Original Message----- From: Linda Merle [mailto:merle@mail.fea.net] Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 5:49 PM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] Armstrong Co, PA history (SHARP, ARMSTRONG, POTTER, Etc) Hi folks, a History of Armstrong County, PA is on line with immense details. It includes a blow-by-blow of the Kittanning raid by Cumberland men in the French and Indian War including the names of many dead, wounded, captive, rescued, etc: http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/toc.html Horrible story of the SHARP family who lived near Crooked Creek and were attacked by Indians in 1794 as they attempted to relocate to Kentucky: http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/history/chap1b.html "Among the pioneers in the Plum Creek region was Capt. Andrew Sharp, who had been an officer in the revolutionary service under Washington. He, with his wife and infant child, emigrated to this region in 1784, and purchased, settled upon and improved the tract of land, consisting of several hundred acres, on which are Shelocta and the United Presbyterian church, near the county line, on a part of which John Anthony and the Wiggins now live, being then in Westmoreland county. The writer mentions his case in the general sketch of this county because he has reliable information concerning it, because many of his descendants now live in the county, and because it is illustrative of dangers and hardships, varying in kind, encountered and endured by the inhabitants of this region in those times. Capt. Sharp, after residing about ten years on his farm, revisited his kindred in Cumberland county, procured a supply of school-books and Bibles for his children, and returned to his home in the wilderness. Determined that his children should have facilities for education which did not exist there, he traded his farm there for one in Kentucky. In the spring of 1794 he removed with his family to Black Lick Creek, where he either built or purchased a flatboat, in which he, his wife and six children, a Mr. Connor, wife and five children, a Mr. Taylor, wife and one child, and Messrs. McCoy and Connor, single men, twenty in all, with their baggage and household effects, embarked on the proposed passage down the Kiskiminetas and Allegheny rivers to Pittsburgh, and thence on to Kentucky. Low water in the Black Lick rendered their descent down it difficult. They glided down the Conemaugh and Kiskiminetas to a point two miles below the falls of the latter, at the mouth of Two Mile r! un, below the present site of Apollo. Capt. Sharp tied the boat there, and went back for the canoe which had been detached while crossing the falls. When he returned the children were gathering berries and playing on the bank; the women were preparing supper, and the men who led the horses had arrived. It was about an hour and a half before sunset. A man then came along and reported that the Indians were near. The women and children were called into the boat, and the men having charge of the horses tied them on shore. It was then thought best that the party should go to the house of David Hall, who was the father of David Hall, of North Buffalo township, this county, and the grandfather of Rev. David Hall, D. D., the present pastor of the Presbyterian church at Indiana, Pennsylvania, to spend the night. While the men were tying the horses, seven Indians, concealed behind a large fallen tree, on the other side of which the children had been playing half-an-hour before, fired! on the party in the boat. Capt. Sharp's right eyebrow was shot off by the first firing. Taylor is said to have mounted one of his horses and fled to the woods, leaving his wife and child to the care and protection of others. While Capt. Sharp was cutting one end of the boat loose, he received a bullet-wound in his left side, and, while cutting the other end loose, received another wound in his right side. Nevertheless, he succeeded in removing the boat from its fastenings before the Indians could enter it, and, discovering an Indian in the woods, and calling for his gun, which his wife handed him, shot and killed the Indian. While the boat was in the whirlpool, it whirled around for two and a half hours, when the open side of the boat, that is the side on which the baggage was not piled up for a breastwork, was toward the land, the Indians fired into it. They followed it twelve miles down the river, and bade those in it to disembark, else they would fire into them again. Mrs. Connor and her eldest son ? a young man ? wished to land. The latte! r requested the Indians to come to the boat, informing them that all the men had been shot. Capt. Sharp ordered him to desist, saying that he would shoot him if he did not. Just then young Connor was shot by one of the Indians, and fell dead across Mrs. Sharp's feet. McCoy was killed. All the women and children escaped injury. Mr. Connor was severely wounded. After the Indians ceased following, Capt. Sharp became so much exhausted by his exertions and loss of blood, that his wife was obliged to manage the boat all night. At daylight the next morning they were within nine miles of Pittsburgh. Some men on shore, having been signaled, came to their assistance. One of them preceded the party in a canoe, so that when they reached Pittsburgh, a physician was ready to attend upon them. Other preparations had been made for their comfort and hospitable reception by the good people of that place. Capt. Sharp, having suffered severely from his wounds, died July 8, 1794, forty days after he was wounded, with the roar of cannon, so to speak, reverberating in his ears, which he had heard celebrating the eighteenth anniversary of our national independence, which he, under Washington, had helped achieve. Two of his daughters were the only members of his family that could follow his remains to the grave. He was buried with the honors of war, in the presence of a large concourse of people. His youngest child was then only eleven days old. As soon as his widow had sufficiently recovered, she was conducted by her eldest daughter, Hannah, to his grave. Major Eben Denny makes this mention in his military journal, June 1, 1794: Two days ago, the Indians, disappointed in that attack" ? on men in a canoe on the Allegheny river, elsewhere mentioned ? "crossed to the Kiskiminetas and unfortunately fell in with a Kentucky boat full of women and children, with but four men, lying to, feeding their cattle. The men, who were ashore, received a fire without much damage, got into a boat, all but one, who fled to a house not far distant. The Indians fired into the boat, killed two men and wounded the third. The boat had been set afloat, and drifted down in that helpless condition, twenty-four women and children on board." Bios including General John Armstrong: "Col., afterward Gen., John Armstrong was born in the north of Ireland in the year 1720. About 1746 he came to Pennsylvania, and settled in what was then called the Kittatinny, now Cumberland valley, on the southeast side of the Kittatinny or Blue mountains...." and "Captain, afterward General, James Potter,21 .... was born "on the bank of the river Foyle, Tyrone, Ireland, in" 1729, and was about twelve years of age when his father, John Potter, landed at New Castle, Delaware." http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/history/chap1f.html Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

As a side note to Linda's information below, I will add that George Woods, at the commission of somebody (I forget who right this minute - maybe the Penn heirs?), laid out the original survey of the city of Pittsburgh, circa 1781. So we have him to blame for our current traffic problems. His son John (who helped his dad lay out the city and therefore also deserves some of the blame) built a house around 1792 that they called "Leisure Retreat" in what was then the countryside just east of Pittsburgh's city limits. It still stands today within the Pittsburgh neighborhood of Hazelwood, making it the oldest continuously standing structure within the entire city (the Ft. Pitt blockhouse at the Point is older, but was demolished in the 1800s and reconstructed in the 1960s). The sandstone house is now simply referred to as the "Woods House." It's on the National Register of Historic Places (since 1993), but it's in a sad state of repair now. Interestingly, the latter generations of the Woods family were friends with composer Stephen Foster, another Pittsburgh S-I. They suspect that some of his famous compositions may have been written there at the Woods House, where he used to stay sometimes on weekends. His songs "Sadly to Mine Heart Appealing," "Farewell Old Cottage," and "There's a Good Time Coming" were dedicated to Rachel and Mary Keller after Rachel married George Woods' grandson, Henry. Foster also wrote "Where is Thy Spirit, Mary?" after Mary passed away in 1846 (Source: Deane Root, University of Pittsburgh's Stephen Foster Memorial). Just thought someone might like to know, Rob -----Original Message----- From: Linda Merle [mailto:merle@mail.fea.net] Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 2:13 PM To: Scotch-Irish-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Sc-Ir] Early History Pittsburgh (Western PA) (Dungannon > Pgh) Hi Folks, The following website has a history of a ward of Pittsburgh that gives a detailed picture of the area in the French and Indian War and afterwards. It details the WOODS family, including Indian captives, etc. Many of these people lived in Bedford till Pittsburgh was 'settleable'. Here's a bit: "The founder of the Woods family in America was George Woods, member of a family of Scotch origin, resident in Ireland. He married Rosanna Hall in Ireland, and emigrated with his family from Dungannon County, Ireland, to America, prior to 1733. He was probably accompanied by his brother, John Woods. In 1740, George Woods took the oath of allegiance in Philadelphia, and he settled in Tuscarora, prior to 1754. In religion he was a Presbyterian, and by occupation an Indian trader and packer, owning large trains of horses used in transporting merchandise of all kinds from Harris' Ferry (Harrisburg) to Fort Pitt (Pittsburgh) and the intervening settlements, and bringing on the return trip packs of furs and skins. By 1762, George Woods was living at Fort Bedford (Bedford) where his children and their families had preceded him. George Woods, founder of the Woods family in Pennsylvania, had four children, all born in Ireland. (1)." Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Bill, would you believe WORD crashed on my file? I gotta open it but I'm scared. So I did a check over at LDS. Under PA ALlegheny Probates we got this item: Orphans' court dockets, 1789-1905 Authors Pennsylvania. Orphans' Court (Allegheny County) (Main Author) Notes Microfilm of the original records at the City County Building in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Each volume has an index. Subjects Pennsylvania, Allegheny - Probate records Pennsylvania, Allegheny - Guardianship Format Manuscript (On Film) Language English Publication Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of Utah, 1971 Physical 90 microfilm reels ; 35 mm. References (Indexed In) Estate index 1788-1971 ; Proceedings index 1788-1971 -------------- 90 film is a lot. Check Record of deaths, 1874-1903, of those who died leaving estates probated in Allegheny County, Pennsylvania Authors Allegheny County (Pennsylvania). Register of Wills (Main Author) Notes Microfilm of original records in the Allegheny County Courthouse, Pittsburgh, Pa. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Indexes appear at the front of each volume. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sworn statements by informants giving the name of deceased, date of death, and residence. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The records are arranged by date of registration with the Register of Wills. The deaths may have occurred a few days to a year before being registered. Even these are filmed: Will packets or files, 1789-1917 Authors Allegheny County (Pennsylvania). Register of Wills (Main Author) Notes Microfilm of original files at the City and County Building, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To use this record, consult the Estate index which gives the vol. number in the Proceedings index. These will packets are listed under the deceased's name as WB (will book). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A transcript of v. 1-59 of will packets may be found in author-title catalog under: Allegheny County (Pennsylvania). Register of Wills. Will books 1789-1917. ----- Wills and administrations are published: Abstracts of wills and administrations of Allegheny County, registered at Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, 1789-1800, 1803-1813 Wood, Mary Ellison ----\ Under indexes, you got this one: Estate index 1788-1971 ; Proceedings index 1788-1971 Authors Allegheny County (Pennsylvania). Register of Wills (Main Author) Pennsylvania. Orphans' Court (Allegheny County) (Added Author) Notes Microfilm of the original records at the City-County Building in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These are indexes to the records of the Register of Wills and Orphans' Court. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Locate the name of the deceased in the Estate index which also gives the death date, residence, personal representative; volume, page and block numbers of the Proceedings index in which to locate the records processed. Some records are: AC, account; AD, CC letters of administration; AU, audit; BD, letters of administration; G1, guardian inventory; IN, inventory and app.; OC, guardian appt., Orphan Court?; R1, receipt, release; RD, record of death; RG, citation; TR, trust account; WB, will book; etc. Subjects Pennsylvania, Allegheny - Probate records - Indexes Pennsylvania, Allegheny - Vital records - Indexes Format Manuscript (On Film) Language English Publication Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of Utah, 1971 Physical 85 microfilm reels ; 35 mm. References (Indexes) Will books, 1789-1917 (Indexes) Orphans' court dockets, 1789-1905 (Indexes) Record of deaths, 1874-1903, of those who died leaving estates probated in Allegheny County, Pennsylvania (Indexes) Will packets or files, 1789-1917 (Indexes) Delayed birth record dockets, filed 1941-1971 ----------------- Anyway, anyone leaving an estate that got probated in the county is in the above index even if theyd didn't leave a will. Linda Merle who must now go deal with WORD.... ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Hi Bill I may be going crazy (just spend a couple hours running spell check on a 400 page document with an extensive bibliography) so check up on me, but I think in the various things I've read on wills (almost wrote bills!!!), probates, etc, that you are always told to think beyond wills. The reason is that you may get more information in the records created to process someone who died intestate than you would get from a will. To see if I'm going crazy is easy. It doesn't even cost a penny. You can find free articles on the Internet or sub to the ancestry daily diatribe to daily learn a little more. You may not have found a will for the wife because he disposed of his property when he died. She may have left a will if she herself owned significat goods when she died like dower property. >Would the prothonotary's office or the recorder of wills office in Allegheny >County be the appropriate place to look, and what would I be looking for? Well if you like to wait a long time to get information and have to deal with untrained clerks it's fine. Explain to me why you won't check the LDS catalog under PA Probates and PA Allegheny to see what's filmed or published ina book?? It's fast, it's easy. The court where you search for these records varies with the colony or state. In colonial times in PA it was the orphans court, but donno for your time. If I wanted to know I'd search the LDS free state guide for PA. Or use www.usgenweb.com. I have learned (the hard way) that my brain can't hold all the info, so I'd better check before I assume I know where to look, even if I think I know, because sometimes I'm WRONG. It doesn't much matter here, but a paying customer isn't going to like to hear I spent $200 searching the wrong court <grin>! So check. Or believe someone who tells you on an internet list -- maybe they are emailing from an Alzheimers Unit. So I hate to steer you wrong -- but I think you need the Orphan's Courts Records. Go to www.familysearch.org, click on catalog, navigate to PA Allegheny County, then to Probates. Find some estate records. Click. What court is the author? I'd do this but I gotta complete some work today and it's probably a good thing for you to try. A lot of the early PA criminal records are published in Cumberland, and so are the VA ones. Augusta County (OLD Augusta co) is published in Chalkley (Chronicles of the Scotch-Irish). They can help a lot. You can write a letter to the court clerk who wasn't trained to read these 18th century records and who was probably laid off last week (and replaced by a 19 year old who gets paid $7.50 an hour) or you can see if they were published with a nice index. If you find something interesting, then go there or write a letter about a specific document. That way when y ou do go to the facility, you can examine the records there that you can't get elsewhere. Well back to going crazy. Word is not my friend, I have learned.... Linda ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Thanks Linda and all, I am carefully going through your list, Linda, to see if I've missed anything, but I'm lucky enough to live close to PA (Maryland) so I spent the past two weeks “vacationing” in the libraries and archives that I've been haunting for some five years. (And I HAVE learned that 18c script regularly made their e's backwards and how to distinguish s's...but I still have to guess more often than I'd like!) I made a newbie mistake, though – I didn't make clear what I had already searched. (I do that on tech help lists too. Really annoys the geeks – welovegeeks - and rightly so!) To be clear, Dr. Henry Cathey and I are trying to plot our colonial ancestors – with the Shippensburg map of Blunston licenses, an unfinished Boiling Springs/Allen Twp. warrant map I found in Carlisle, Dr. John V. Miller's Carlisle Quadrant map from the same Cumberland County Historical Society, the Walnut Bottom warrants map, a Trindle Springs connected draughts map, the Hanover and Paxtang township warrant maps from now-Dauphin County and various others the staffers laughed at my calling my “ancestors in a bag,” as I left each day. All “our” locations. This batch, the Catheys,- all the men had moved on to Augusta Co, VA and Rowan Co, NC or were dead before the Revolution, leaving Cathey girls behind as matriarchs of Brandons, Trindles and McCormicks (Buchanans' and McMullens' and Carothers' Irish grandmas were Cathey girls, too). No Cathey men on surviving French and Indian War lists that I have found (got my Brandons, though) - they headed south c.1748 and earlier. Trying to figure out which kids belonged to this so far unconnected Edward Cathey, who we can't place geographically. All that survives is that estate bond – no Orphans Court, no inventory or vendue – he just pops up, dead! That pesky UFO. And the name Edward is unknown in the next generation of Cathey relatives that we know. I will continue to look for evidence of Ed – this was an out-of-the-box way of going at it: what percentage of 1745 papers signed by Cookson and Smith (if any) are known to have been connected with estates on the west side of the Susquehanna? It was all Lancaster County for four more years, of course. (It's that wagon train of widows from Shippensburg to Lancaster that haunts me....) The wording is “sealed and delivered in the presence of” Cookson and Smith - the widow Catherine Cathey was standing before them, along with her witnesses, it seems. Because it was closest, we're leaning toward Paxtang, where one of the John Catheys d.1742. But it could be Trindle Springs.... I will go back up there (or google here) and look at all the earliest estate index entries and see if I can't pick out some from whatever part of the alphabet that are dated closest to 1745, I think. I persevere. With the help of the Big Brains and long memories of the Scotch-Irish list! Thanks so very much, Sally Brandon http://www.genealogy.com/users/b/r/a/Sally-A-Brandon/

Hi Jane, There was no request for wills. There was a request for adminstrative bonds. For others, the will indexes and abstracts of the Lancaster wills are on line free from 1727 to 1819 here: http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/pa/lancaster/wills.htm The abstracts include the names of witnesses, heirs, etc. You can search them from the parent page here: http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/pa/lancaster/ I also own the book of Lancaster Wills and I haven't opened it in maybe two years because the stuff on usgenweb is just so much more convenient and has more information (abstracts). Enjoy! Linda Merle ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Jane Stewart Atwell <jalu@bayou.com> Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2006 21:32:57 -0600 >I must have been reading the posts too rapidly. I missed the query >on Lancaster Co. Wills. I have the book, Abstracts of Lancaster Co. >Pa. Wills 1732-1785. It just lists names, dates, and townships. If >you need me to check someone for you I will be happy to do so. >Jane > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Nelda's websites - Please visit http://freepages.folklore.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ Gilpin DNA Project member

Hello! All the settlements west of the Susquehanna River were part of Lancaster County in 1745. York County was created in 1749 and Cumberland in 1752. The inconvenience of traveling long distances to record deeds, administer estates, and so on was one reason why people always wanted large counties reduced in size and court houses closer to home. It was also the reason why many deeds were not recorded (only quoted in later deeds) and some smaller estates not legally administered. There is a printed index of Lancaster County wills and administrations. I can't remember the compiler's name. If your man is in it, you can find some documentation. If he isn't, there is no record of any will having been probated or administration of an estate and there never was. Lancaster County Historical Society has inventories/appraisals and/or accounts for many, not all, estates settled in Lancaster County within whatever its boundaries were at that time. They can produce them with the name and date. A great many are readily available in the surname folders in the LCHS because someone ordered a photocopy and they always make two, one for the surname file. The Court House should have administration bonds. My memory is that they are recorded in the records of the Orphan's Court which are well indexed and readily accessible in the CH. All the best, Richard MacMaster

I must have been reading the posts too rapidly. I missed the query on Lancaster Co. Wills. I have the book, Abstracts of Lancaster Co. Pa. Wills 1732-1785. It just lists names, dates, and townships. If you need me to check someone for you I will be happy to do so. Jane

I apologize, Linda, if this isn't the right list for this query, but so many of you have colonial Pennsylvania ancestors. Am trying to figure out where one Edward Cathey died. Intestate, his estate bond was filed in Lancaster before Thomas Cookson and James Smith in 1745. Anyone else got admin bonds c.1745? I'm curious if that makes it more likely he lived near Lancaster City as opposed to Cumberland County like I'd thought. I just can't see witnesses and widows/widowers making a mournful trail behind their attorneys from way out Cumberland way every spring/summer to the other side of the river. Did Cookson make the rounds regularly or stay in Lancaster? (1745 was the year James Smith finished his studies in Lancaster and began practicing in Shippensburg.) The Lancaster County Historical Society says admin bonds were loose papers so they're not chronologically accessible. Who's got 1745 Pennsylvania estate papers, anyone? Are the only ones that made it to the courthouse from Lancaster-area people? Thoughts? Thanks, Sally Brandon http://www.genealogy.com/users/b/r/a/Sally-A-Brandon/

Hi Sally, I have to say that dealing with 18th century PA records is a chore we share with the Germans and Quakers (etc)! It seems hard till you try a few other colonies.... Anyhow, you won't find out where he died unless you channel him. You can find out where he owned land and probably lived. That's where they processed his estate. Though I have seen people file in various counties who didn't own any land in two of the three (apparently lived in Cumberland Co because all land is there, but filed in Lancaster and Chester too. Don't know why.) >Am trying to figure out where one Edward Cathey died. >Intestate, his estate bond was filed in Lancaster before >Thomas Cookson and James Smith in 1745. Maybe he died on a UFO <grin> but he had enough of an estate in Lancaster that the local court took an interest. >Anyone else got admin bonds c.1745? I got many things but not personally these. The thought makes me sneeze and my eyes cross. However when I am researching if these things exist and where they are here is what I do. 1. Check the FHL catalog. Why not? It's free and y ou can get most of what is in it cheaply. 2. Check a book on PA records. Sometimes its confusing because you can find (for example) film/transcriptions/abstracts of probate records from the courthouse but also sometimes the PA Society of Genealogists (I hope I got the name right) in PHilly may have a collection that is also filmed/transcribed/abstracted. Check them all. Sometimes there are courthouse fires and these secondary collections got more. I keep hoping to find a copy of a will that was not recorded as it was disallowed due to debt (in three counties though the person owned land in only 2, He had a debtor in the third, I suspect) about 1742 or so. The estate went to a man with a different name who claimed he was the 'heir at law'. Twenty years later another man manifested and convinced a court he was the rightful heir and the property was sold in a sherrif's sell and the original 'heir' was given a cash amount representing a debt. None of the depositions survive that id this younger man. ANd where was he for 20 years? If he was an orphan than why wasn't there an orphan's court case in one of three counties?? I donno... 3. Check www.usgenweb.com . This last idea is particularly good because it has a lot of aids to understanding the evolution of counties and townships in early PA. Anyway I digress... The FHL has under Probate Records Abstracts of Lancaster County, Pa, Orphans Court records, 1742-1791 Wevodau, Edward N Abstracts of Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, wills Wright, F. Edward (Frederick Edward) , 1934- Abstracts of wills of the Hess families of Lancaster County, Pennsylvania Young, Henry James, 1908-1995 Index and abstracts of Orphans' Court records, 1742-1760 Pennsylvania. Orphans' Court (Lancaster County) Index to letters of administration, 1730-1830 Pennsylvania. Orphans' Court (Lancaster County) Lancaster County wills, 1729-1825 Lancaster County, Pa. will abstracts, 1721-1820 Miscellaneous books, 1742-1867 ; Index to miscellaneous books, 1742-1891 Pennsylvania. Orphans' Court (Lancaster County) Pennsylvania wills, 1682-1834 Wills, 1730-1908 ; Index to Wills, 1729-1947 Lancaster County (Pennsylvania). Register of Wills >I'm curious if that makes it more likely he lived near >Lancaster City as opposed to Cumberland County like I'd >thought. One of the nice things about the FHL catalog is it gives the dates the counties were forms. Regarding Cumberland it says: Created Jan. 27, 1750 from part of Lancaster County. From it came Bedford Co., in 1771, part of Northumberland Co. in 1772, Franklin Co. in 1784, part of Mifflin Co. in 1789, Perry Co. in 1820. So anyone wanting to probate a will, etc, in 1745 had ONE CHOICE. That's Lancaster Co because it included what would become Cumberland. The legal descripton of the land might name streams or other individuals that might well. I think most all of Cumberland was "Hopewell Township" then. You do end up wanting to narrow it down. You could hire a lawyer in Carlisle. I have found court records of men I knew lived in what would become Franklin Co, near Chambersburg who were summoned to jury duty in Carlisle. Not as big a trek as Lancaster. People got around back then, esp on the frontier. >>The Lancaster County Historical Society says admin bonds >were loose papers so they're not chronologically accessible. There. Have you check the FHL? I'd order any number of items from the above list esp the orphans court records. Thats's where they processed estates in PA. The adminstrations are filmed (above). Dealing with a brick and mortar historical society is the LAST thing I'd do. You may also want to do more checking to see if these have been published (www.genealogical.com is a good place to start as well as the library of congress -- the catalog is on the web, try www.google.com ). These things are hard to read. You have to read them very carefully. You are not probalby trained to read 18th century hand writing. If you can find published abstracts that index them, WOW what a win. THEN read the one you care about on film. Print out a copy. >Who's got 1745 Pennsylvania estate papers, anyone? Are the >only ones that made it to the courthouse from Lancaster-area >people? Thoughts? Check also the FHL free guide to PA records for more stuff than I recall. There are wills but better than them are administrations and records for intestates because more had to be documented and discovered to process those estates. In PA in the 1740s you have lots to go on. To find out where he lived you go to www.usgenweb.com and navigate to Lancaster CO. You check the on line wills. The abstracts I think are there. He may not have left a will but did he witness a neighbor's? These usually ID the township. If he witnessed a will for a John McBip of Lost Twp, where do you think he lived? Probably near John McBip. You can do a lot of research in this period and tell where he lived. Did sons serve in the French and INdian War? Who was their captain? That gives you a very good idea where they lived. Much info is in the on line PA archives. An index to them is at our website: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~merle . I am fairly sure the admins are not in the PA Archives, but check. Apparently the man had children. Check where they served in the Revolution. Again, the militias were recruited locally. IF you get the name of the captain, you know the township where they lived. The Cumberland ones are published in "Mother Cumberland". Lancaster will take a little research. Best of luck!! Linda Merle >Thanks, >Sally Brandon > >http://www.genealogy.com/users/b/r/a/Sally-A-Brandon/ > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Thanks to Forrest for that URL! I know what I'll be doing later on (downloading and reading!) Yesterday while working I found a great website that publishes some old, rare works on early American history. http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~wcarr1/ It's dense stuff! I also found this website with some free Irish stuff: http://www.irishgenealogy.ie/frame_800.cfm Most significantly it has an Irish tombstone collection with a free search: http://www.irishgenealogy.ie/frame_800.cfm If you see something interesting check LDS catalog to see if it's filmed and in LDS. I also was browsing through the local (western PA) newspaper's collecton of historical stuff. It is where I picked up the LOSSING link (above). Here is part 3 of their series on the Kiski trail, probably taken by the lads in Cumberland when they came west during the French and Indian (Seven Years) War to do in the Indians at Kittanning. <SPLAT!> http://www.alle-kiskitoday.com/articles/2135 Cruise to the bottom for some URLS. Some don't work but I will have to locate updated ones as they link to the local Indian traders (Croghan, etc) in whose memoirs one might find the names of any ancestors living here. We have forgotten that much of western Cumberland and of course anything west of that (which was infested with Indians and French in the mid 1700s anyway) were not open to settlement till I think it was 1758. Before that the Quaker Gov. in Philly actually forcably removed people from Indian lands. So ancestors living there illegally were not going to declare themselves, now would they? Many even after that date just settled (after all, Willie Penn did invite them!) and left the details like surveys and warrants to their descendents or the guy they sold out to. Hey, in Ireland we didn't own the land and esp. in Ulster we sold our holdings (leases) and improvements to the next tenant. So often these folk don't appear in tax lists (hard to tax people who are living illegally on land the gov says it has no right to tax, anyway since it's Indian land --assuming you can find them and they don't shoot you first when you show up to try to collect taxes from them), etc, so if you can find traders' records, it can be a big win. Many of these people didn't believe in probate courts either. Speaking from personal experience with my ancestors who settled illegally in what would be Butler Co in the very early 1800s. (Not legal to settle there till 1807 I think it was....mine were the second guys to farm that place). So if I can find new URLs to the Croghan journals, whatta win! Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

I found this while looking for a Grand Aunt, for anybody searching Quakers of County Armagh: http://www.bob-sinton.com/ballyhagan/p1-p4.htm If you go to http://www.bob-sinton.com/ballyhagan/ you will get a file list. You can right click on the file names then left click on Save Target As and save the book to your hard drive to look at when ever you want to. Enjoy! Forrest Plumstead fplum1@gmail.com Researching the following Surnames: Bushouse, Plumstead, Risser, Schroeder, Senne, Thayer, Quaker Families: Coppock, Heald, Hobson, Hollingsworth, Potts, Ross, Watt Plumstead and Associated Families: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fplum/ Military Kool Lynx: http://geocities.com/fplum/ Ham Radio WB5HQO http://forrest.3h.com/main.html

Hi folks, the New River website has moved to http://www.newrivernotes.com/nrv.htm It includes detailed history of this area and its hardy band of first settlers, clickable county maps, and endless amounts of info. For example this article. http://www.newrivernotes.com/nrv/Paula_Anderson-Green.htm THis article quotes another, describing key characteristics of frontier settlement to people like ourselves who are trying to trace their origins: "The method of migration and settlement in the South was fairly uniform during the pioneer period. Friends and relatives living in the same or neighboring communities formed one or more parties and moved out together, and when they had reached the promised land they constituted a new community, which was called a "settlement" -- and still is so called. Settlements were frequently miles apart, and the inhabitants of a single settlement would be more scattered than they had been in the old community in the East; and other settlers would come in after the first trek in smaller groups or in single families and fill in the interstices. These later comers would often be relatives ' or friends of those who had come first, or friends of their friends.27 " The article tells us that "Many of the earliest settlers were of Quaker background, from such heavily Quaker areas as Loudoun County, Virginia; Chester County, Pennsylvania; and Burlington County, New Jersey. A Quaker meeting was established in the New River border frontier section by Friends from New Jersey about 1785." IN addition "Although a majority of the settlers on the northwest Carolina frontier were Scotch-Irish Presbyterians or German Lutherans, a significant number were of English or Welsh origin and of Quaker or Baptist persuasion. The importance of this group on the frontier was considerable, for most of the sheriffs, clerks of the court, lawyers, and justices of the peace were of Quaker or Baptist origin.51 As we have seen, the majority of the New River settlers came from New Jersey or Pennsylvania, where many of them were closely associated before they moved. Tolles has shown that the Delaware River Valley, including both its New Jersey and Pennsylvania sides, was a "single economic province and…a single cultural area."55 Records of Quaker meetings indicate that the population on both sides of the Delaware were in constant touch with each other. Similarly, the Presbyterian churches provided opportunity such interchange of visits and, in particular, drew together colonists of various backgrounds: New England Puritans, who were part of the "spill over" into New Jersey, newly arrived Scotch-Irish, and a few French Huguenots. In their pre-Appalachian days many New River families were located in the New Jersey counties of Essex and Burlington, and in Philadelphia County, Pennsylvania, and adjoining Delaware Valley counties. As the westward movement developed, these same families mo! ved by stag through the Susquehanna and Cumberland valleys into the Shenandoah. Their close-knit relationships must have been a significant element that sustained them on the frontier." Yet so many people only search in PA and never look in NJ or Maryland for their ancestors!! Not so smart.....I've found a lot of PA families in MD records. Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

Robert Harrison born 1825, Ireland. First found in the 1850 census in Philadelphia and then in 1860 in Baltimore. Then I loose all but Robert Washington Harrison. Family had always said that this family was English. Thrilled to find that they are Scotch- Irish. There was a Mill owned by a Harrison Family in ?Belfast. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where this family might have moved after 1860? Or help in directing me to sources in Ireland.... Thank you, Kathleen This is the family: Robert the father was born in 1825 Ireland, woeking as a Weaver in the 1850 census, Mariner in the 1860 census. wife Sarah (born) 1825 or 1835 Ireland or Scotland in the 11850 census she was listed as a spinner. John (born) 1845, Scotland, a potter Henry (born) 1849, Penn. Sarah (born) 1851, Penn. Hannah (born) 1854, Penn. Robert Washington (born) 1855, Baltimore, a pattern maker William (born) 1859, Maryland

Hi Kathleen, Everyone who joins this list asks this question: >Or help in directing me to sources in Ireland.... Wow, do we have carpal tunnel. We put together some webpages to assist that need updated. They are at http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~merle . I vowed to never update these again a couple times because it seems like no one ever looks at them. In addition there is a huge number of suggestions in our archives (www.rootsweb.com -- click on Mailing lists and type in our name, then select interactive search or the browse option). The advice for people starting is basicly the same 100% of the time. That's to learn how to do Irish genealogy. There's free resources as well as books and courses you can find. No one on one consulting required to get started. If you do not know where in Ireland your ancestors came from, you probably cannot get too far beyond learning about Griffiths, the Tithe Applotments, estate records, spinning wheel lists and other such esoterica of Irish genealogy. You need to do migration research. To do that you can obtain books and take courses. Or you can take the free courses here: www.genealogy.com/university.html . They are wonderful. I refer to them frequently and I do genealogy professionally. Still, I see new stuff with each re-reading. I would suspect you need to do some US naturalization work. Again the courses above will give you an overview of that process. You may need to do addition study. All the USA censuses are indexed and available at www.ancestry.com . It shouldn't be too hard to do a search in the 1870, etc, for HARRISON b. in Baltimore or PHilly. The US censuses are critical to your search. Best of luck, Linda Merle (SI Admin) ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: HarrisonOttoKath@aol.com Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2006 08:18:11 EST >Robert Harrison born 1825, Ireland. First found in the 1850 census in >Philadelphia and then in 1860 in Baltimore. Then I loose all but Robert >Washington Harrison. Family had always said that this family was English. Thrilled >to find that they are Scotch- Irish. There was a Mill owned by a Harrison >Family in ?Belfast. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where this family >might have moved after 1860? Or help in directing me to sources in Ireland.... >Thank you, > Kathleen > >This is the family: > >Robert the father was born in 1825 Ireland, woeking as a Weaver in the 1850 >census, Mariner in the 1860 census. >wife Sarah (born) 1825 or 1835 Ireland or Scotland in the 11850 census she >was listed as a spinner. >John (born) 1845, Scotland, a potter >Henry (born) 1849, Penn. >Sarah (born) 1851, Penn. >Hannah (born) 1854, Penn. >Robert Washington (born) 1855, Baltimore, a pattern maker >William (born) 1859, Maryland > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net

This may not answer your specific question, but it could point you in the right direction or give some added knowledge. Go to: http://www.qub.ac.uk/ In the search engine, key in parish histories A wide variety of information comes up, part of which is "A Report for the Centre for Cross Border Studies The Local History Project Co-operating North and South Jacinta Prunty Raymond Gillespie Maeve Mulryan-Moloney October 2001 http://www.crossborder.ie/pubs/localhistory.pdf There is a lot of info available including local history society addresses and contact people, that will download to your computer and is readable by Adobe Acrobat. Linda Irish and Scot chat host Genealogyforum.org Manager

I have put the 1911 census for Greencastle on my website, please go to the Mourne index page, click on Greencastle, there are some names of lighthouse keepers and coastguards among the names that might interest someone, and the best of luck in your research. Raymond http://www.raymondscountydownwebsite.com

Hi folks, a History of Armstrong County, PA is on line with immense details. It includes a blow-by-blow of the Kittanning raid by Cumberland men in the French and Indian War including the names of many dead, wounded, captive, rescued, etc: http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/toc.html Horrible story of the SHARP family who lived near Crooked Creek and were attacked by Indians in 1794 as they attempted to relocate to Kentucky: http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/history/chap1b.html "Among the pioneers in the Plum Creek region was Capt. Andrew Sharp, who had been an officer in the revolutionary service under Washington. He, with his wife and infant child, emigrated to this region in 1784, and purchased, settled upon and improved the tract of land, consisting of several hundred acres, on which are Shelocta and the United Presbyterian church, near the county line, on a part of which John Anthony and the Wiggins now live, being then in Westmoreland county. The writer mentions his case in the general sketch of this county because he has reliable information concerning it, because many of his descendants now live in the county, and because it is illustrative of dangers and hardships, varying in kind, encountered and endured by the inhabitants of this region in those times. Capt. Sharp, after residing about ten years on his farm, revisited his kindred in Cumberland county, procured a supply of school-books and Bibles for his children, and returned to his home in the wilderness. Determined that his children should have facilities for education which did not exist there, he traded his farm there for one in Kentucky. In the spring of 1794 he removed with his family to Black Lick Creek, where he either built or purchased a flatboat, in which he, his wife and six children, a Mr. Connor, wife and five children, a Mr. Taylor, wife and one child, and Messrs. McCoy and Connor, single men, twenty in all, with their baggage and household effects, embarked on the proposed passage down the Kiskiminetas and Allegheny rivers to Pittsburgh, and thence on to Kentucky. Low water in the Black Lick rendered their descent down it difficult. They glided down the Conemaugh and Kiskiminetas to a point two miles below the falls of the latter, at the mouth of Two Mile r! un, below the present site of Apollo. Capt. Sharp tied the boat there, and went back for the canoe which had been detached while crossing the falls. When he returned the children were gathering berries and playing on the bank; the women were preparing supper, and the men who led the horses had arrived. It was about an hour and a half before sunset. A man then came along and reported that the Indians were near. The women and children were called into the boat, and the men having charge of the horses tied them on shore. It was then thought best that the party should go to the house of David Hall, who was the father of David Hall, of North Buffalo township, this county, and the grandfather of Rev. David Hall, D. D., the present pastor of the Presbyterian church at Indiana, Pennsylvania, to spend the night. While the men were tying the horses, seven Indians, concealed behind a large fallen tree, on the other side of which the children had been playing half-an-hour before, fired! on the party in the boat. Capt. Sharp's right eyebrow was shot off by the first firing. Taylor is said to have mounted one of his horses and fled to the woods, leaving his wife and child to the care and protection of others. While Capt. Sharp was cutting one end of the boat loose, he received a bullet-wound in his left side, and, while cutting the other end loose, received another wound in his right side. Nevertheless, he succeeded in removing the boat from its fastenings before the Indians could enter it, and, discovering an Indian in the woods, and calling for his gun, which his wife handed him, shot and killed the Indian. While the boat was in the whirlpool, it whirled around for two and a half hours, when the open side of the boat, that is the side on which the baggage was not piled up for a breastwork, was toward the land, the Indians fired into it. They followed it twelve miles down the river, and bade those in it to disembark, else they would fire into them again. Mrs. Connor and her eldest son ? a young man ? wished to land. The latte! r requested the Indians to come to the boat, informing them that all the men had been shot. Capt. Sharp ordered him to desist, saying that he would shoot him if he did not. Just then young Connor was shot by one of the Indians, and fell dead across Mrs. Sharp's feet. McCoy was killed. All the women and children escaped injury. Mr. Connor was severely wounded. After the Indians ceased following, Capt. Sharp became so much exhausted by his exertions and loss of blood, that his wife was obliged to manage the boat all night. At daylight the next morning they were within nine miles of Pittsburgh. Some men on shore, having been signaled, came to their assistance. One of them preceded the party in a canoe, so that when they reached Pittsburgh, a physician was ready to attend upon them. Other preparations had been made for their comfort and hospitable reception by the good people of that place. Capt. Sharp, having suffered severely from his wounds, died July 8, 1794, forty days after he was wounded, with the roar of cannon, so to speak, reverberating in his ears, which he had heard celebrating the eighteenth anniversary of our national independence, which he, under Washington, had helped achieve. Two of his daughters were the only members of his family that could follow his remains to the grave. He was buried with the honors of war, in the presence of a large concourse of people. His youngest child was then only eleven days old. As soon as his widow had sufficiently recovered, she was conducted by her eldest daughter, Hannah, to his grave. Major Eben Denny makes this mention in his military journal, June 1, 1794: Two days ago, the Indians, disappointed in that attack" ? on men in a canoe on the Allegheny river, elsewhere mentioned ? "crossed to the Kiskiminetas and unfortunately fell in with a Kentucky boat full of women and children, with but four men, lying to, feeding their cattle. The men, who were ashore, received a fire without much damage, got into a boat, all but one, who fled to a house not far distant. The Indians fired into the boat, killed two men and wounded the third. The boat had been set afloat, and drifted down in that helpless condition, twenty-four women and children on board." Bios including General John Armstrong: "Col., afterward Gen., John Armstrong was born in the north of Ireland in the year 1720. About 1746 he came to Pennsylvania, and settled in what was then called the Kittatinny, now Cumberland valley, on the southeast side of the Kittatinny or Blue mountains...." and "Captain, afterward General, James Potter,21 .... was born "on the bank of the river Foyle, Tyrone, Ireland, in" 1729, and was about twelve years of age when his father, John Potter, landed at New Castle, Delaware." http://www.pa-roots.com/~armstrong/smithproject/history/chap1f.html Linda Merle ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at mail.fea.net