Hi Diane, the book is "The Forefathers and Families of Certain Settlers in Western Pennsylvania" by Wm. Boyd Duff. His Boyds came from County Down: David, wife Mary, daughter and six sons in the early 1800s. They lived 15 miles from Belfast. Their intentions were to move west but the children were ailing. They were met by a nephew of David Boyd, whose sister had married James Laughlin of Dunover and whose son Alexander had left Ireland in 1819. Alexander Laughlin later brought over his father, brother James and sisters after his mother's death in Ireland. They bought land on the north side of the Allegheny across from Verona, Depreciation Land. Verona was then called McCanicksburg. Sorry for misleading you into thinking these were colonial immigrants! Linda Merle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 6:42:22 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA On Mar 30, 2010, at 2:52 PM, [email protected] wrote: > There were definitely Boyds in the Casco Bay area. I got a book on > Boyds in western PA. If y ou provide more information I can see if > the family is in this book. Thank you Linda ================================================================= 1 Thomas Boyd -------------------------------------------------- Birth: abt 1715 Death: bef 19 Jun 1782, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania ? Father: ? Boyd Mother: UNNAMED It is said that In 1732, he left his home in County Armaugh, Ulster, Ireland, with his brother William and 2 unmarried sisters. In his will, he said that he was of (Alin?) Allen Township, Northampton County, Pennsylvania. Will 2-4-1782. Executed 6-19-1782. Alexander Boyd, and James Boyd were executors. Witness to will, Thomas Wilson, and Robert Hays. In 1743, this was still part of Bucks, county, untill 1752. Spouse: Elizabeth Birth: abt 1720 Death: (after 1765?)bef Jun 1782 The name Elizabeth possibly came from the church records (which church)? as tithe/pew rental. Marriage: abt 1738 Children: Alexander (~1740-) m. Sarah Miller (6 children) James (Major) Sr. (1743-1813) b. Bethlehem ? m. Nancy Brown Mary (~1746-) m. John Dunlap Elizabeth (Betsy) (~1749-) m John Brisbane Andrew (~1752-) m. Sarah Baird Thomas (~1755-) m. Ann Martin 1.2a James (Major) Boyd Sr.* -------------------------------------------------- Birth: 1743, Bethlehem, Norhampton County, Pennsylvania Death: 9 Oct 1813, Centre Co., Pennsylvania He served with the Northampton Co., Militia in the Revolutionary War. At the time of his will, he mentioned $ to church formerly called Grand Island Congregation. The history of Beech Creek says that Nancy Brown and James Boyd, and Lt. Jmes Hays and Sarah Brown Hays came to Beech Creek together on a flatboat. Spouse: Nancy Brown Birth: 1752 Death: 19 Sep 1800, Centre Co., Pennsylvania Marriage: 22 Feb 1774 Children: Thomas (1775-1847) m. Elizabeth Hughs Mary (Molly) (1776-1856) m. John Donnel Elizabeth (Betsy) (1778-1864) m. William Watson and Hugh McClelland James Jr. (1781-1863) m. Isabella McClelland Alexander Brown (1784-1813) Jennie (1786-1786) Nancy (1787-1827) m. James Steele John (1790-1792) Jane (1792-1865) m Joseph Holmes McClelland Sr. Other spouses: Phoebe McKelvey I have tried for years to definitely find the origins of Thomas Boyd (of Alin township) and surname of his wife Elizabeth.. I am grateful for any help. Diane > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Sarah, nope, don't recall any, but I was looking only in Catholic records in two specific areas for people name Constantine and Thomas. I may have seen other marriages but as I was being paid to see marriages of Constantine and Thomas, they didn't register at all. These particular Johnstons migrated in such a way as to preserve their religion, first to Baltimore and then to the area close to the St. Vincent mission in Westmoreland County. The area came to have a sizable Catholic population -- some Irish and some German -- and they intermarried. St. Martins was built in New Derry and then my client's ancestors attended church there. Burials for St. Martins are on line: http://noel.mcn.org/StMartin%27sCemetery.htm . I don't recall finding St. Vincent's records on line but they are published. Another early misson, serviced out of St. Vincents was the Buffalo settlement (on Buffalo Creek). Many of them were from Donegal, leaving in 1795 on the Eliza. More info on my website. Viewing the St. Vincent's records I could see many marriages amongst the people living to the south near St. Vincents. They were a close knit group. The Buffalo or Sugar Creek congregation are the founders of the first diocese west of the Allegheny Mountains. The petition requesting a priest was signed by both Presbyterians and Catholics for this was a mixed religious settlement in both Ireland and America and quite United Irish in their sentiments: http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~merle/Butler/index.htm . I think some of my ancestors married women from the Sugar Creek group as my ancestor Frances Anderson lived close by. All the Catholic families that I have encountered from these groups have remained staunch Catholics because of efforts made by the ancestors to live in areas where they could take the sacraments and live as Catholics. So unless your family tradition is Catholic I doubt you are associated with them. They are a very interesting group to research. But unless your family was Catholic this is of no help to you. You can learn a lot about early Catholic migration here: http://noel.mcn.org/MigrationC.htm You can see that they cluster. Former Catholics who didn't live in the indicated areas know are known as "Scotch-Irish". Seriously! In the early 1800s a priest from Ireland toured through the highlands of VIrginia and the Carolinas. He noted many with Irish surnames. When queried the bearers said yes that they were of Irish ancestry -- but they'd all been Baptist or Methodist for generations. They'd assimilated. Those who made sure that their children would be raised as Catholics lived in the areas indicated and didn't assimilate. Linda Merle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 8:01:45 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [S-I] Johnstons in PA Hi Linda, You have me interested in the line of Johnstons and wondered if you have seen any records that had marriages to Flemings. I have relatives John and James Fleming who married sisters Mary and Margaret Johnston I believe.........when I was in NI and my cousin took us to the hometown of my Flemings he said a relative from the US came over looking for connections.......he didnt know where they lived or anything else.. Surely the lines have mention of double cousins and relatives. Anyone know these Johnstons??? Appreciate any help. Sarah ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Linda, Oh I would love to go the DNA route!!!! And maybe someday I will be able to ... It is on my wish list ... Why does it have to be a male relative with the surname??? Why can't it just be a male with the McCleary genes in him??? Keeping in mind that my husband is Scotch-Irish, maybe it doesn't always fit, but talking my husband into the desire to pay for DNA testing will be a real adventure..... LOL, Thanks Ellie -------------------------------------------------- From: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:14 AM To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration from NH toPA in 1719 > Hi Ellen, > > The burnt courthouse scenario is an all too familiar one. It is the > subject of endless lectures, articles, and even books. You need to stop > using it as an excuse (like the rest of us <grin>) and get past it using > good genealogical methodologies. Such an event can be overcome. You just > need to know how. > > The first thing to do is google. In this case for things like burnt > courthouse genealogy. I did that and came up with several things including > http://inman.surnameweb.org/documents/looking.htm . > > The bottom line with burnt courthouses is that sooner or later some > government comes along and wants to collect taxes. Unless they can figure > out who is responsible for paying the taxes, many are likely to avoid it. > So reconstruction of land records occurs rather fast. Assisting are > families who want to inherit or continue with their high place in the > social order as well as those whose enemies see the chaos as a chance to > dispossess those families of their property. > > There was NOT a law in place (that I am aware of) requiring that property > sales (deeds) be registered at the courthouse. I am not a North Carolina > expert; I may be wrong, but I doubt it seriously. You COULD register the > deed but you didn't have to. Eventually due to the difficulties of > collecting taxes, etc, the states applied much pressure to get the court > house used. But that's later on. The way you proved you owned property is > you produced the deed. The real deed. The deed was copied into the > courthouse records -- maybe. The real deed is the one your ancestor had. > To prove he owned it after the fire, he showed up at the courthouse and > had it recorded again. > > If he didn't have the deed (house burnt too, goat ate it, Uncle Bob used > it for TP (toilet paper)), then you got some witnesses who swore an oath > and testified. There are a zillion of these kinda cases all over the USA > in court records. If the courthouse burnt up, it started again. > > There are also grants -- made by the colony. NC grants are a huge huge > topic. I once encountered them in a project in Tennessee....They're not > kept at the courthouse. Maybe it had some copies but those are state > records and I do know they survive. Ditto for Virginia, PA, Maryland and > all the places to the north where you should be looking. There are all > kinds of records that are not kept at the county courthouse you can use > and lots of articles and books that explain what they are and how to find > them. > > However this is a heck of a lot of work. If you want fast results, then > it's simple. Catch a male relative with the surname and test his Y > chromosome. He has to have the Y chromosome of the early family, so make > sure he descends on the male line. Don't have one, you say? Hogwash. Do > some genealogy and FIND one! That's what we do <grin>. Genealogy! It costs > $300 unless you hit on a sale. Test at www.familytreedna.com (largest > database). You can join free as many projects as you want. Maybe the > Ireland one. When the results arrive, the admins can usually figure out > what quad of Ireland they're from. If Ulster, you are shuffled off to the > Ulster Heritage project. Then you look for matches in that project, in NC > projects, in family projects, etc. > > When you find matches, you can then look for the paper trail from A to B. > Eliminates a lot of vacuuming up of records in places your ancestors never > were. > > You can spend 20 years vacuuming records and copying them at 25 cents or > more per page and not get anywhere, so you hire someone for the minimum > amount -- which now is about $300 and they may or may not find something > (toss the dice). Or you can do DNA testing NOW. You spend $300. You save > money photocopying every piece of paper in the original colonies, and > eventually, maybe in six weeks, maybe in a year, you will have a match and > can start figuring out how they got from A to B. Even if you never get a > match in the USA, you know your ancestor didn't match those guys. He's not > a McCleary. But you'll know what he was and can work with those people to > figure out who the Indian in the wood pile was. THAT you'll never learn > any other way. > > Because the truth is even if all the courthouses hadn't burnt down, there > could have never been a record made of where your ancestors came from, so > sifting through records, will not solve this problem. Most colonial > immigrations are NOT documented. They were not documented in 1719 when > they hopped off the boat nor any other time unless by chance in oral or > county histories, obits of pioneers, etc. > > So forget the courthouse and go track down a cousin. In six weeks, when > your DNA results come in, you could know which family groups you match and > which you don't, assuming others with the surname have tested. Check for a > family project at www.familytreedna.com and find out. > > DNA is the only way to get results for certain, and it's fast and cheap > too. If you have colonial migrants, then you need to do this. You can read > through several courses on migration genealogy at > www.genealogical.com/university.html and eventually you'll figure out > there is no sure way to find their origins doing genealogy. There is using > DNA -- so bag a cousin and then read the courses while the DNA is being > tested. It'll give you something to do <grin>. > > Linda Merle > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hope you are finding them now. Isn't it exciting to be the one to find the real name and people! Sure does get confusing. Ellie -------------------------------------------------- From: "John Erwin" <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 10:06 AM To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration fromNHtoPA in 1719 > We had a McCrary which turned out to be a McCurry. This spelling thing has > been a real problem and caused us to go down the wrong road for about 40 > years! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ellie Dowling" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 10:08 PM > Subject: Re: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration > fromNH > toPA in 1719 > > >> Hi Linda, thanks for taking so much time to answer my, I don't know what >> to >> do comment. I should have let you know why I have a snag in the McCleary >> family search. I have traced them back to North Carolina during the >> civil >> war and even one tax list after, and then other census from then till >> now, >> but my snag is I can't figure out how to go further back to tie the >> McCleary >> family elsewhere to the one in North Carolina. The North Carolina county >> courthouse where the McCleary family lived was bombed during the civil >> war >> and burnt down. all records lost, and then it burnt 3 more times... I >> can >> not seem to find who the father of Jefferson McCleary, also spelled >> McClorry, and MCClary on different census papers. Not doing such a hot >> job >> of figuring out who his wife is either. she must have been dead by the >> time >> the records that have survived were taken. I did read a bit of a history >> book online that said a lot of Scotts that came to North Carolina >> actually >> came inland through Tennessee, but Jefferson lists he was born in North >> Carolina. I have found records in other counties of McCleary or some >> derivative thereof, but no one claims Jefferson on their family . I'm >> stumped. I figured I would just suearch out every MCCleary etc I can >> find >> from Pennsylvania to North Carolina and I might get lucky and find >> something. Right now it is guesswork. The Dowling name means nothing >> as >> far as ancestry goes... My husbands father and his twin sister, were >> adopted >> by the Dowlings. His dads adoptive mother made him promise to never look >> for his genetic parents. Thankfully his wife finally talked him into >> letting her look when he was 70 years old. We have been able to trace >> his >> blood family, The Raffields, and the Morris family we are still working >> on. >> The Morris side was possibly Irish but I have more work to trace in >> America >> before I try that. The Raffields are probably English, but again I >> haven't >> tried to do to much hunting that way yet. I use Ancestry.com, but have >> only been working about 4 months. And that is on lots of different family >> names. I have used family search on line, and genealogy.net for my side. >> My tree is looking like a spider web. I have my tree to the point where >> many ancestors have to be hunted for overseas. But I still have to try >> to >> get to one of those ancestry help places that family search has. There >> is >> one in our town, but their schedule and mine haven't fit together yet. >> >> I have noticed on ancestry.com that the family lists from other >> peoples >> trees don't have a lot of facts connected sometimes. Many have names and >> dates all mixed up. But they have helped give me directional hints >> though. >> And most of the names panned out as being family, if not in the exact >> order >> I found them in. I am searching family in Lithuania, Germany/ Prussia >> and >> Sweden, on my side. Have even tried writing some people living who have >> my >> family name and living in the same towns my family hailed from. Hoping >> they >> answer me. I have my Swedish side to where they came over to America, >> but >> I >> haven't invested the time or money yet to sign up to SVAR. That whole >> directions entices but baffles me. I am signed up to a Swedish list, and >> have Swedish word lists etc. But haven't worked up the courage to dive >> in. >> My tree is on Ancestry.com. It is the Auge,Vitz, Plinsky Thomander, >> Nyberg >> etc tree. LOL. I have gotten some family to pitch in and share what they >> know. Sometimes I think I'm nuts to have tried to go so many directions >> so >> fast, but , I don't know how long I will have a subscription, so I am >> hunting everybody for everybody. Tell ya what, the more I learn the >> more >> I realize I don't know enough.. I still have 2 McCleary ladies left in >> their 80's, but they have actually tried to find out things years ago by >> traveling to the towns where the McCleary's lived in North Carolina. >> but >> they ran into the fire in the courthouse problem, and could go no >> farther. >> Their father was dead and there was no one to ask. I have been able to >> find >> out that their dad Jordan Winfield McCleary was illegitimate . so I have >> no >> idea who his dad was. I figure it was somebody in the farming area where >> his mother lived and worked in other peoples homes. Her name was Amanda >> McCleary, and through the census records that list her, I was able to >> find >> her siblings and her dads name. they lived in a place called MCCleary >> swamp, but I can't find it on any map, in North Carolina, but I have the >> counties they lived in. Before the last courthouse fire, when my >> husbands >> mother and her sister went hunting, they found a certificate of bastardy >> for >> a McCleary boy child, they thought might have been for their father. >> They >> have long since lost it. I am enjoying the hunt too, but I can't imagine >> doing this for a living. the time involved is enormous. Anyway, thanks >> for writing, sorry I didn't make a clearer comment on what you wrote... I >> really do appreciate your taking the time to write me that long letter. >> and you have mentioned paths to take that I have yet to follow but plan >> to. >> If I could only find that connection in the McCleary family from >> Jefferson >> on back. I found a Thomas Jefferson McCleary age 26 on an 1830 Maryland >> census... but my Jefferson was born in 1814, as per the 1860 census that >> lists him as age 46. It calls him McClorry on that one, but it's him. >> The >> batches of first names in the family tie together the various census >> misspellings of the last name. I even found people that may have been >> his >> brothers or cousins, but haven't found them back further either, yet. I >> was hoping if I couldn't follow his trail, I could hit on it with >> extended >> family from the same area and census. The area I found them in was Cool >> Springs, Washington County, NorthCarolina, Post office Mackeys Ferry, and >> also Harrington County Div.2. dist. 1 N.C., and the northern district >> 1850 >> Census Rockeartto, County, N.C. or something like that, can't read it >> very >> good. If you have any idea how to look back farther I'm all ears....or >> in >> this case eyes since we are writing, not talking. LOL. >> >> There are some colonial ancestors on my husbands side as well, but none >> on >> mine.. the hardest part of waiting so long to start hunting is I forget >> what >> I've found and where I found it so quickly... I am trying to document it >> all >> as I go along... but I have gone so many directions in such a short time >> I >> have well nigh driven myself crazy!!!! In your business do you only hunt >> Scotch Irish, or do you hunt other countries too??? Well thanks >> again... >> Ellie >> From: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 10:00 AM >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration >> from >> NH toPA in 1719 >> >>> Hi Ellen, It's hard to give you specific advice because we don't know >>> what >>> info you got! >>> >>> At this point you want to post : "Okay, I know my great grandpa Scott >>> was >>> living in Pohokan, Nebraska in 1884 and his daughter said they came from >>> ....." >>> >>> That's important stuff to document. Right now, before anyone else passes >>> on to the great beyond. My great uncle Ralph is now gone and we don't >>> know >>> the source of his story that one ancestress of ours had a twin brother >>> who >>> set off for the gold rush in 1849 and was never hard from. Family >>> believed >>> he was murdered at a tavern. Digging up the area for a street car line, >>> the town found skeletons. Good story? BAD story so far. Ie ancestress >>> was >>> supposedly born in Scotland but there is no baptism for her -- and none >>> for a twin brother. No twin brother named in any wills or deeds. Could >>> be >>> another ancester and the story got attached to the wrong person. Or >>> Uncle >>> Ralph is right. Donno.....we'll have to channel him if we want to know. >>> I >>> wonder if that works? >>> >>> I'm jumping ahead. It's like a murder investigation. You got to collect >>> all the clues and info, but then you need to realize these are not >>> facts. >>> These are clues. Some clues are misleading. Some clues, even if >>> misleading, can lead you to the murderer anyway. Or a different crime >>> scene altogether. >>> >>> So then you ask 'How do I know great grandpa Scott was living in >>> Pohokan? >>> You check the censuses. >>> You migh think this is a two minute no-brainer, what with the indexes at >>> Ancestry.com. No. often you can't find them either due to bad indexing, >>> bad census taking, inaccurate information, inexperienced searching (on >>> your part). So when this happens (and it will) don't get depressed and >>> don't give up. >>> >>> As you gather evidence, you must learn all about records: what exists, >>> where to find them, how to interpret them. Knowing how to find this >>> information is not genetic. We are not bees who are born, eh, hatched, >>> knowing what they need to know to accomplish bee-tasks. So if you >>> haven't >>> received training in this stuff, you don't know how to do it, even if >>> your >>> Cousin Alma knew and she told you. That's because things are changing >>> fast. If you try to do genealogy like Cousin Alma, you won't get very >>> far. >>> That's why she didn't and left you all those dead ends. You live in the >>> electronic age and you can literally accomplish more in one afternoon >>> than >>> she could in her whole life of writing letters to courthouses and >>> distant >>> cousins. >>> >>> So you need to get educated. This isn't a grim as it sounds. There is >>> lots >>> of free information at www.rootsweb.com and www.familysearch.org, >>> www.ancestry.com, and lots of information you should get, even if you >>> have >>> to pay for it. You should take some classes, visit your local family >>> history center, and absorb new information -- every day. You can >>> subscribe >>> to free enews letters over the INternet and every day get a couple with >>> short, digestible articles. You can learn to use your local library to >>> check expensive standard works. On and on! Learnng can be fun. The >>> genealogy industry also holds conferences -- local ones, regional, >>> national, >>> etc, which are great places to learn fast. Get invovled in the local >>> genealogy societies too. >>> >>> There are people who try to do this for a living, though few actually >>> make >>> a decent living at it. The rest expect these guys to produce results >>> FAST >>> so they tend to be better educated. The number of people who can afford >>> to >>> hire someone else to do their family history is quite small. Other than >>> poverty, the one thing professionals have in common and that separates >>> them from the 'family historian' is that pros keep learning. On the pros >>> lists, they are constantly looking for conferences, cheap copies of >>> lectures, magazines, books, etc, because every day they learn even >>> though >>> they may be recognized leaders in their field. On the other hand, family >>> historians often think they already know it all and get quite huffy if >>> you >>> suggest they don't. NO one knows it all. >>> >>> So what's important now for you is to start collecting what info you do >>> have in the family. Oral history dies with the person unless you collect >>> it. Collect it and source it (Aunt Mary Hart....) and if you can ask the >>> person how they know it, it might lead to more discovery. Then you model >>> it in genealogy software. You can get several free. I like Legacy >>> (www.legacyfamilytree.com). Then you can print out a zillion updated, >>> correct family group sheets for the family reunion, send people PDF >>> reports, gedcom your data to people -- it's easy. A lot easier than in >>> Cousin Alma's day. I do genealogy professionally...what sucks (among >>> other >>> things) is to get a pile of papers in the mail (sources! I think). >>> Wrong. >>> Family group sheets -- and they are all different. What's the most up to >>> date version? WHo knows! The client doesn't know either. My inherited >>> family group sheets are a mess too. MINE I print out and they have a >>> date >>> on them <grin>!!! Voila. I or a grand neice can arrange them >>> chronologically. Hopefully the later ones are righter than the earlier. >>> >>> Every genealogy 'problem' has standard ways to resolve it. These are >>> taught at conferences, in books, in free webpages and courses, etc. >>> Usually you have to check standard sources. Most of the time clients who >>> employ me either haven't checked those sources or if they did, didn't >>> document that they did. So they basically haven't done the job and, >>> having >>> done it, failed to document the findings. Even a negative result is >>> important. It says something. If you try to find an ancestor in the book >>> that documents British aliens living in the USA in 1812 it means >>> something: he wasn't here or he wasn't an alien. (The book could be >>> wrong >>> or he could have been hiding out as well). This is important info to >>> know. >>> Can you prove he wasn't here? Was he in the army? Can you find him back >>> home? Was he old enough to be documented or could his father be this man >>> who lived in your area and who is documented?? So you found him or >>> rather >>> his father, but didn't realize it? >>> >>> You need to understand the standard sources to check for things. The >>> Family history library's free guides can help or you can pay $$$ to buy >>> some books to learn these. Legacy (paid verson) also will tell you what >>> to >>> check and where they are. I cheat a lot and use it<grin>!! >>> >>> If you have colonial (or near colonial) ancestors, you will most likely >>> never find a document that says where precisely they came from >>> ("Ireland" >>> on an early naturalization don't count: you can get that from the >>> census). >>> That's because no one ever made those documents. You can search for 100 >>> years for a document that never existed -- and oddly, never find it. >>> Only >>> the naive are impressed when you sound off at a family reunion" "I have >>> searched for immigration information for sixty years now". Smarter to >>> search for 5 minutes at Ancestry and then moving on to really locating >>> the >>> family origins in a productive manner. >>> >>> The way we locate the place of origin is to use clues. If you don't have >>> any because you didn't collect any or you don't know which are correct >>> and >>> which appear fabricated -- you don't get too far. It's episode2 of the >>> season. The rest of the episodes you spend interviewing and >>> re-interviewing and staring at charts and driving around following up on >>> 'aha's. We know that. We watch TV. >>> >>> A good book is Rising's "A Family Tree Problem Solver" -- it shows how >>> you >>> use indirect evidence to figure out where they came from. She uses I >>> think >>> it is Missouri records to trace people back to Tennessee and Virginia. >>> The >>> technique is much the same for hopping over the pond. >>> >>> You can't explain this all in an email. And you can't learn it all in a >>> day either! It takes years and years of practice and learning, so the >>> answers are not here. One good place to start and then revisit often are >>> the free courses at www.genealogical.com/university.html . I still visit >>> these...when? When I'm stuck! Being stuck means you need to go learn >>> some >>> more. Sometimes something you overlooked the first 10 times will be your >>> savior. So it's circular, like an English mystery where the detective is >>> always driving past the same fields as he returns to interview the >>> witnesses, again and again. >>> >>> The long version will be put into a book someday. If you don't buy books >>> you won't know how to do it. I have (meanly) said at times that my plan >>> is >>> to the part of my family history that I discovered in a journal -- and >>> thereby hide it from all the family as they don't read genealogy >>> journals >>> or know about the index to them (PERSI). Hehehe..... And send all my >>> notes >>> to the Family History Library who will microfilm it and put it in their >>> catalog but my family never visits the first place you should always go >>> for family history -- the family history library (largest collection of >>> genealogy on the planet -- why wouldn't you go, esp. since 'going' means >>> visiting >>> www.familysearch.org ?). Hehehehehe....oh, I'm a mean one, I am <grin>! >>> >>> Tell me about the Dowlings. There are English Dowlings and there are >>> Irish. The Irish are in Ulster and I got one. In Ireland the name is >>> believed to be a variant of "Doran", an Irish name, but without >>> investigation who knows. All I know is the marriage of my ancestress to >>> Robert Norris about 1820 in Derry, that produced "Dowling Norris". He >>> was >>> killed in the American Civil War. Don't know who her people were, yet. >>> >>> Linda Merle >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Ellie Dowling" <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 12:58:55 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >>> Subject: Re: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration >>> from >>> NH toPA in 1719 >>> >>> Hi, I haven't heard of this, but have just begun to hunt relatives, and >>> had >>> no idea where to begin. I had originally thought the family of McCleary >>> had >>> come over much later, but now I think they may have come from >>> Pennsylvania... Thanks for sharing this hint.... Now to try to figure >>> out >>> how to follow up on it... should be interesting. Ellie >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------- >>> From: "Ruth McLaughlin" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:52 PM >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration from >>> NH >>> toPA in 1719 >>> >>>> Below is an excerpt about the 1718 arrival of "the 5 ships" to give >>>> the context. The bit of the excerpt that catches my attention is the >>>> last sentence beginning "The majority of the Scotts-Irish could not >>>> wait any longer...." Here's the paragraph: >>>> >>>> Elmer Roy Collier begins his book, Weir, Wear, and Ware, by saying, >>>> "The... families petitioned in 1718 to the Governor of New England to >>>> come to America...they arrived in Boston Harbor in 4 August 1718 but >>>> were forbidden to land by the intolerant Puritans. ...Sixteen families >>>> sailed to Casco Bay to claim a tract of land there but were frozen in >>>> the Bay by early winter weather…When the ice broke in the Spring they >>>> journeyed to Haverhill, Mass., where they heard of a fine tract of >>>> land about 15 miles northeast called Nutfield…James Gregg and Robert >>>> Weir sent a request to the Governor and Court, assembled at >>>> Portsmouth, New Hampshire, for a township ten miles square. The >>>> majority of the Scotts-Irish could not wait any longer and traveled >>>> overland to the Scotts-Irish settlement at the Forks of the Delaware >>>> (Northampton County, Pennsylvania)." >>>> >>>> Is anyone familiar with this 1719 movement of families from New >>>> Hampshire to PA, after the terrible winter in Casco Bay, ME? Who were >>>> they, why there in particular, how did they get there? I am familiar >>>> with the families who stayed and settled in Nutfield/Londonderry, NH >>>> and environs. The idea makes sense that others, perhaps within the >>>> same families, couldn't wait for the decision of Governor and Court, >>>> not wanting to endure another tough winter as yet unsettled, and moved >>>> on to PA, thus losing contact with siblings, cousins etc. in NH. But I >>>> am out of my depth on PA! So any insights or help would be much >>>> appreciated. >>>> >>>> Ruth >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>>> the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2777 - Release Date: 03/29/10 > 01:32:00 > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Ruth, >You've had a lot of DNA experience, Linda — does a 66 out 67 match >imply, in your mind, that the intersect would be within a certain >number of generations? I am not a DNA genealogist and can never really be one: I never took statistics! Family tree DNA and other firms have this matching software on their websites that will give you a guestimate. However that software doesn't take into account fast and slow moving markers. So a 'real DNA genealogist' would look at the marker that doesn't match and be able to make a better suggestion. Each is known to have a different rate of mutation. You can get some info by googling for that marker or asking in the DNA-genealogy list. Lots of 'principals' are there and they can give you really good feedback. However this ol' liberal arts major thinks one marker off is pretty good. However again I'd want to see the Smiths that do and do not match. My one client who had such success -- he has 6 or 7 markers off with known relatives on the American side of the Pond! Fast moving DNA. He's a closer match to the guy in Australia than to some of his own cousins. The ones that are 'off' are the faster moving, less stable markers. A couple of them, randomly selected by the scientists, are so unstable that people who know on the DNA genealogy list have theorized that they should be 'thrown out' and never considered at all. Or that is what this liberal arts major understood <grin>! To me statistics is right up there with channelling fairies .....though I think I am better at channeling fairies..... There are plenty of Pennsylvanians who went to the Carolinas. Of course you read about this in the lit but I have seen the wills so I believe the books now <grin>. Early will abstracts for Cumberland CO PA are on the Internet. They often mention property in other colonies, most frequently, of course, the southern ones and yes, I have seen estates in NC. One was a McCamey family in Londonderry, PA, who willed land to a daughter in NC. She was then an Alexander but I never did figure out which Alexander. This is also from memory...... I'll look and post the info in the hopes that someone can make a connection. Deeds/grants are good too. The first deed will often identify where the person was living. One latest find was a Johnston family I was working on. They arrived circa 1821 (tax records) in Westmoreland Co, PA. Irish Catholic. Bought a few thousand acres of land, so not poor Irish. These ones lived in Derry but I have also established a connection to the Catholic Johnstons in Unity Twp. The known ancestor was named Constantine, but he died at a time when the county kept records and they ID'd his father as Thomas and his place of birth as Co Down, Ire. So...big party! However in the early censuses living with him was an older man. Thomas? Tax records had Thomas living there all right and indicated his occupation was salt merchant and that he owned a few thou acres. Ten years later he was gone, probably dead. Checked through all the early grants and deeds -- more than one Thomas Johnston. Found a couple for a man involved in salt manufacturing. The earliest indicated that he was a merchant of Baltimore, Maryland. Maryland of course had many Catholics. The one son (Constantine) married a woman who was raised by Mother Seton and her father was a Marylander. So we know this family had Baltimore connections. So the first deed can be very important. The deeds I viewed (there were many, many) didn't show Thomas leaving his land to his son, but he could have done so and not recorded it. No will either. Hard to prove a whole lot. Maryland wills and deeds need checked and even Irish and Canterbury wills because this man was probably from a Catholic merchant family in the Belfast area. DNA? It matches descendents of a Johnston sept of the O'Neills, and they have family history of a branch who moved to Co Down. So another big party!! It kinda shows how if you do methodical work you can win big. Another genealogist cherry picked deeds for my client in the county courthouse and didn't find what I did. She failed to get Constantine's death record and so didn't have the n ame of his father either. I used indexes when I was in Salt Lake and have a long list of deeds to check. My client can check them by ordering microfilm at a small price and then spend a month perusing them at his leisure. We also didn't check the early deeds of the Unity Twp family but probably their first deeds will show a connection to Thomas. The founder of that family is named Thomas and they had a grandson named Constantine and from the indexes they engaged in land transactions with Thomas/Constantine in Derry. So many of the Johnstons around here descend from an ancient sept that gave Queen Lizzie great heartburn! The geneticists and the genealogists were not sure exactly which O'neill these guys descend from. Usually the Aussies do have better paper trails than us. They usually have immigration records and the death records even in the later 1800s ask for the year of migration, the place of birth, the names of surviving children, all kinds of info. You sure your Aussie cousins can do genealogy? I found a heap of such info on the Internet at the district websites (or whatever you call the parts of Australia... we don't seem to have discussed that in history class!!). Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth McLaughlin" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 6:39:09 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA That concept of 'chain migration' is something that *has to* be thought about but trying to get a handle on some connections in American history, for the moment in terms of theorizing seems infinitely easier than late 17th-early 18th c. County Londonderry!! <groan> The for-sure common ancestor of the so-called Group 26 Smiths within the Northeastern Smith Project who came to America in 1718 is a Thomas Smith, born Derry 1688. You've had a lot of DNA experience, Linda — does a 66 out 67 match imply, in your mind, that the intersect would be within a certain number of generations? All the TN connection seems to be very East TN—Carter and Sullivan and seemingly from NC more than VA. There is a Jarvis Smith family who oral history says may have come to Wilkes Co. NC from York Co. PA and established iron bloomery. Could this family be the family we need to find a connection to —or not? A road we have to go down and hopefully have already found a willing DNA testor which will save time barking up a wrong tree. This Jarvis family also clearly has connections within Carter Co. TN! Jarvis and his siblings and many of his sons including Caleb fought in the Revolutionary War, including all of them fighting in the Battle of Kings Mountain, 1780. Jarvis' will is extant and a team member (we are lucky to have a strong team) is going to try and see the original in the next two weeks where its now resides in Raleigh. But what catches my eye, Linda, is your reference to land records. Will be back in time to wonder about that and the indexes etc... to find a land grant that had been lost—somebody was looking out for you! If it weren't for DNA, we would know nothing of related Smiths in Tennessee. I'm into matches in Australia too, but for my Ulster Croziers. The Aussies just don't have paper trails and I do, and so how to connect?! Arrrgh! Ruth On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 3:10 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Ruth, thanks for this information! I alas have not researched anyone in this Casco Bay to PA > migration, though it is believed many left New England for Pennsylvania in the early 1700s. Not only was > the climate improved, but Pennsylvania offered freedom of religion and, in the early 1700s, welcomed them. > So wonder is any remained. Once in PA, the next generation moved down the wagon road into Virginia. Many VIrginianas moved to Tennessee after the Revolution, esp. eastern TN. Depending on the area of TN, > they might have gotten a grant due to military service in North Carolina. Virginia soldiers received land in > the future Kentucky, not TN. But by the time the soldiers came to TN, eastern TN was largely in private > hands so the military grants are in the middle and west, with some federal land grants as well. I had to do > some research in the area. I'm no expert. A lot of the indexes are microfimed and in LDS, but in the end > we had to use an expert to search the original North Carolina landgrants, which he found. The grant > was missing from the TN state copy. The guy charged us $3 or some such amount to send us the grant. > (not $300 like we were charged for a probate packet once....grrrrrr.....). > > However your experience where a surprising DNA match sets you off on another direction is somewhat > typical. In my one situation, where we were looking for matches to Virginia (To TN) settlers from the 1770s, > our match was to an Australian! He had excellent proof of descent from a man in a town in Tyrone. We > knew about this man but no proof of relationship till the DNA match half the way around the world. > > It's possible that the Londonderry family sent other sons to America independently of Casco Bay. This is called 'chain migration'. So you cannot create a link between Casco Bay and TN because the link is back > to Ireland. > > With a common name like Smith a good DNA match is really appreciated. > > Linda Merle ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you for sharing this, I printed it all out since I can't trust that I will remember it all. This will help me on my wild McCleary hunt!!! Ellie -------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel Wilson" <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 1:17 PM To: "Scotch-Irish Discussion List" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co.,PA > I too have been searching for some hard evidence of the migration from > Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA. I haven't read Collier's book, but > I've seen a quote attributed to William Egle, former PA State Historian > and prolific writer of PA history. I don't have the exact quote on hand > but it was something in his attempt to explain the so-called "irish > Settlement" which began at Mt. Bethel, PA not far from Easton, PA, and > spread west to the Lehigh River around Allentown, PA. In his statement > he mentions the difficult winter at Casco Bay and the migration to > eastern PA. There is also an anecdote that the group got lost on the > way, and thought they were settling in NY, so they named their > settlement the "Hunter Settlement" supposedly in honor of the Governor > of NY at the time. A contingent from the Hunter Settlement moved on to > E. TN and settled around Greenville, Greene Co., TN ca. 1791, where they > founded the Mt. Bethel Presbyterian church, named in remembrance of > their former home in PA. If you want more specific information, let me > know, and I'll dig out what I have. > > Dan Wilson > > > From: "Ruth McLaughlin" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:52 PM >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration from >>> NH >>> toPA in 1719 >>> > >> >>> Below is an excerpt about the 1718 arrival of "the 5 ships" to give >> >>> the context. The bit of the excerpt that catches my attention is the >> >>> last sentence beginning "The majority of the Scotts-Irish could not >> >>> wait any longer...." Here's the paragraph: >> >>> >> >>> Elmer Roy Collier begins his book, Weir, Wear, and Ware, by saying, >> >>> "The... families petitioned in 1718 to the Governor of New England to >> >>> come to America...they arrived in Boston Harbor in 4 August 1718 but >> >>> were forbidden to land by the intolerant Puritans. ...Sixteen >> >>> families >> >>> sailed to Casco Bay to claim a tract of land there but were frozen in >> >>> the Bay by early winter weather?When the ice broke in the Spring they >> >>> journeyed to Haverhill, Mass., where they heard of a fine tract of >> >>> land about 15 miles northeast called Nutfield?James Gregg and Robert >> >>> Weir sent a request to the Governor and Court, assembled at >> >>> Portsmouth, New Hampshire, for a township ten miles square. The >> >>> majority of the Scotts-Irish could not wait any longer and traveled >> >>> overland to the Scotts-Irish settlement at the Forks of the Delaware >> >>> (Northampton County, Pennsylvania)." >> >>> >> >>> Is anyone familiar with this 1719 movement of families from New >> >>> Hampshire to PA, after the terrible winter in Casco Bay, ME? Who were >> >>> they, why there in particular, how did they get there? I am familiar >> >>> with the families who stayed and settled in Nutfield/Londonderry, NH >> >>> and environs. The idea makes sense that others, perhaps within the >> >>> same families, couldn't wait for the decision of Governor and Court, >> >>> not wanting to endure another tough winter as yet unsettled, and >> >>> moved >> >>> on to PA, thus losing contact with siblings, cousins etc. in NH. But >> >>> I >> >>> am out of my depth on PA! So any insights or help would be much >> >>> appreciated. >> >>> >> >>> Ruth > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The Hunter Settlement (now Martins Creek) is a few miles above the Forks of the Delaware. Sherri Bangor, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 6:21 PM Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA > > My Boyds supposedly arrived at the "Forks of the Delaware before > arriving at Craig Settlemen(t became Allen Township.) > > Does this fit with anyone else...........or.............is more > definitive information available? I would love to know if they were > possibly part of the group under discussion. > > Diane

I live a few miles from the Scotch-Irish settlement in Martins Creek and have some relatives buried in the cemeteries there. There is a Sarah Boyd, daughter of Benjamin Boyd and Catherine DePue buried in the Stoch-Irish buring Ground there. She was born 18 DEC 1781 and died 28 JUL 1833. I don't know if she'd be related to your bunch or not. Sherri Bangor, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 3:21 PM Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA > On Mar 30, 2010, at 12:17 PM, Daniel Wilson wrote: > >> Lehigh River around Allentown, PA > ==================== > Can anyone tell me if there were BOYD'S in this > migration.............or how I can look for that information? > > I have Boyd's of Allen , Pa. and the Lehigh Valley............... > 1700's and early 1800's. > > Thanks > Diane

On Mar 30, 2010, at 8:07 PM, [email protected] wrote: > Hi Diane, the book is "The Forefathers and Families of Certain > Settlers in Western Pennsylvania" by Wm. Boyd Duff. ============= Thanks anyway Linda. It's always good to get the names etc . out again. Perhaps someone will see them in the archives. Diane

Some of these last names are familiar and in the Presbyterian church roll in my lines that moved down to York Co SC.....the Armstrong, Walker, Graham Wallaces and Black, Irvins, Kirkpatrick, Flemings and others were in this group. Sarah ----- Original Message ----- From: "tangara" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 8:51 PM Subject: Re: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co.,PA > The Hunter Settlement (now Martins Creek) is a few miles above the Forks > of > the Delaware. > > Sherri > Bangor, PA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 6:21 PM > Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., > PA >> >> My Boyds supposedly arrived at the "Forks of the Delaware before >> arriving at Craig Settlemen(t became Allen Township.) >> >> Does this fit with anyone else...........or.............is more >> definitive information available? I would love to know if they were >> possibly part of the group under discussion. >> >> Diane > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

A large group of scotch-Irish came from Co Tyrone as Presbyterians........the church still stands. We saw many of the names in our family on tomestones in the cemetary there. Many of these families moved into Tenn, NC, SC amd GA after the REV war as you said getting land grants for fighting. mine all went into GA. And spread over the South. Sarah

My Boyds were earlier but the family was still there. Mary Boyd Walker m. Robert Renick then their daughter Mary Walker Renick m. my Elijah Fleming..........all in early (1720-50) PA and then down to SC. All fighting for REV from NC. lot of interesting families in early PA. Sarah ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 7:03 PM Subject: Re: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co.,PA > > On Mar 30, 2010, at 6:49 PM, Sarah wrote: >> I also had "Boyds" in this area at this time. They were related to the >> Walkers, Renicks, >> and Flemings in PA. > ================= >> My Boyd ancestor, Mary Boyd b. 1776 Pa. m. John Donnel whose mother >> was supposedly Mary Fleming. > > Diane > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Diane, you would find out if there were Boyds by checking in the previously mentioned book. I don't have it! Of course you might check the genweb county webpage and see if you can determine if there were early Boyds living there too. http://northampton.pa-roots.com/ There were definitely Boyds in the Casco Bay area. I got a book on Boyds in western PA. If y ou provide more information I can see if the family is in this book. Good luck! Linda Merle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: [email protected], [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 3:21:38 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA On Mar 30, 2010, at 12:17 PM, Daniel Wilson wrote: > Lehigh River around Allentown, PA ==================== Can anyone tell me if there were BOYD'S in this migration.............or how I can look for that information? I have Boyd's of Allen , Pa. and the Lehigh Valley............... 1700's and early 1800's. Thanks Diane ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Ruth, thanks for this information! I alas have not researched anyone in this Casco Bay to PA migration, though it is believed many left New England for Pennsylvania in the early 1700s. Not only was the climate improved, but Pennsylvania offered freedom of religion and, in the early 1700s, welcomed them. So wonder is any remained. Once in PA, the next generation moved down the wagon road into Virginia. Many VIrginianas moved to Tennessee after the Revolution, esp. eastern TN. Depending on the area of TN, they might have gotten a grant due to military service in North Carolina. Virginia soldiers received land in the future Kentucky, not TN. But by the time the soldiers came to TN, eastern TN was largely in private hands so the military grants are in the middle and west, with some federal land grants as well. I had to do some research in the area. I'm no expert. A lot of the indexes are microfimed and in LDS, but in the end we had to use an expert to search the original North Carolina landgrants, which he found. The grant was missing from the TN state copy. The guy charged us $3 or some such amount to send us the grant. (not $300 like we were charged for a probate packet once....grrrrrr.....). However your experience where a surprising DNA match sets you off on another direction is somewhat typical. In my one situation, where we were looking for matches to Virginia (To TN) settlers from the 1770s, our match was to an Australian! He had excellent proof of descent from a man in a town in Tyrone. We knew about this man but no proof of relationship till the DNA match half the way around the world. It's possible that the Londonderry family sent other sons to America independently of Casco Bay. This is called 'chain migration'. So you cannot create a link between Casco Bay and TN because the link is back to Ireland. With a common name like Smith a good DNA match is really appreciated. Linda Merle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth McLaughlin" <[email protected]> To: [email protected], [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 2:45:42 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA This is fascinating, Dan. Maybe a Casco to PA migration is not a chimera! If you ever come upon the source and even the full quote at some point, I'd love to receive them. And I'd appreciate it if you'd remembered me in your future research, as I will you, from now on! What family surname are you tracking in this potential Casco to PA and thence to East TN? Mine is a County Londonderry Smith family. Current exploration in faraway East Tennessee (quite out of the normal comfort zone for me in research) is the result of DNA testing – as Linda reminds us very good value for the money spent! A stunning DNA match (66 markers out of 67) between a Smith with a strong paper trail to the Smith family probably on the 1718 Ulster ship that wintered in Casco Bay, settled in NH in 1719, and whose specific line emigrated to Quebec c1800 and an East Tennessee Smith, without much paper trail, but who *might* be connected to a Smith family in Northhampton, PA in the 1700s and migrated to NC and TN from there. These PA-NC-TN Smiths were Scotch-Irish and theoretically, might have split from the Smith family who remained in NH. That's the theoretical construct for analysis at the moment. Anybody with insight on *any* aspect of this, info much appreciated. Ruth Ottawa, Canada On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:17 PM, Daniel Wilson <[email protected]> wrote: > > I too have been searching for some hard evidence of the migration from > Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA. I haven't read Collier's book, but > I've seen a quote attributed to William Egle, former PA State Historian > and prolific writer of PA history. I don't have the exact quote on hand > but it was something in his attempt to explain the so-called "irish > Settlement" which began at Mt. Bethel, PA not far from Easton, PA, and > spread west to the Lehigh River around Allentown, PA. In his statement > he mentions the difficult winter at Casco Bay and the migration to > eastern PA. There is also an anecdote that the group got lost on the > way, and thought they were settling in NY, so they named their > settlement the "Hunter Settlement" supposedly in honor of the Governor > of NY at the time. A contingent from the Hunter Settlement moved on to > E. TN and settled around Greenville, Greene Co., TN ca. 1791, where they > founded the Mt. Bethel Presbyterian church, named in remembrance of > their former home in PA. If you want more specific information, let me > know, and I'll dig out what I have. > > Dan Wilson >>From: "Ruth McLaughlin" <[email protected]> >>Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:52 PM >>To: <[email protected]> >>Subject: [S-I] a question about a possible Scotch-Irish migration from NH to PA in 1719 >>Is anyone familiar with this 1719 movement of families from New Hampshire to PA, after the terrible winter in Casco Bay? >>Ruth ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On Mar 30, 2010, at 6:49 PM, Sarah wrote: > I also had "Boyds" in this area at this time. They were related to the > Walkers, Renicks, > and Flemings in PA. ================= > My Boyd ancestor, Mary Boyd b. 1776 Pa. m. John Donnel whose mother > was supposedly Mary Fleming. Diane

Hi Linda, You have me interested in the line of Johnstons and wondered if you have seen any records that had marriages to Flemings. I have relatives John and James Fleming who married sisters Mary and Margaret Johnston I believe.........when I was in NI and my cousin took us to the hometown of my Flemings he said a relative from the US came over looking for connections.......he didnt know where they lived or anything else.. Surely the lines have mention of double cousins and relatives. Anyone know these Johnstons??? Appreciate any help. Sarah

Hi Marsha, people can and do change religion and ethnicity all the time, so don't get too attached to a label. "Scotch Irish" is an American ethnicity, just meaning they were from a certain area of the USA. Morrison can be English, Scots, or Irish in origin (Bell "Book of Ulster Surnames"). There was a very learned sept in Donegal named O'Muirgheasain (from 'sea valor') who were erenaghs (hereditary keepers) of Conmany in Inishowen. Not only did some anglicize the name to O'Morison, Morison, Morrison, but also Bryson (esp. in Derry). In Donegal Bryson, Brice, and Bryce were also used for Breslin. A branch of this sept moved to Lewis and Harris in the Scottish Isles at an unknown date, where they became bards to the MacLeods of Dunvegan. Etc, etc..... Of couse the English ones were 'son of Maurice' or Morris. Also two septs of Clan Buchanan were called MacMaurice and eventually Morrison. You should order a DNA test immediately. Since you're looking at Donegal, the odds are the DNA is northwest Irish. If it's Scots then it gets more complicated. But most likely they were among the many Donegalese who left their homeland in the 1700s. See Kirby Miller's book on Irish emigration. Projects like the Cumberland Gap DNA project show immense amounts of north west Irish DNA, supporting his opinion that Donegal lost much of its Irish population in the 1700s. Other than the DNA test, you just slog through the records. There are lot on line now, but keep careful records of what you check, including what you check but don't find nothing in. That's to avoid re-searching that source 20 times! Esp. irritating when you've hired someone to research and y ou don't give them a list of what you searched and what you found. So they, being thorough, execute the standard search and search these things again. Yes, maybe they can find something you haven't but I suspect you'd prefer they search somewhere you hadn't <grin>. So it's important to do. I of course didn't do this the first 10 years or so of my research either but I do it of course with clients and durn.....it really helps. Linda Merle ----- Original Message ----- From: "marsha moses" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:46:38 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [S-I] Morrison from Donegal I have just added a possible 5-gr-grandfather and 6-gr-grandfather to my ancestors. Because this is a VERY new possibility, I am just starting my research on this line. The younger man's name is Patrick Henry Morrison and his father's name is James Morrison. The family history books in my area that have articles submitted by researchers (and I realize are thus suspect) say that James and Rachel Morrison moved to Pittsylvania County, Virginia in the mid to late 1700's from Donegal. Now I realize that Donegal is part of Ulster Province, but NOT part of Northern Ireland---being instead a part of the Republic of Ireland. So the question here is do I suspect SI or do I suspect Irish for the surname Morrison coming out of Donegal? Please, I am not asking anyone to do my research for me, just looking for a small boost if anyone has this answer off the top of their heads.....I am mostly just curious at this very early part of my looking around. marsha in WV ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I also had "Boyds" in this area at this time. They were related to the Walkers, Renicks, and Flemings in PA. Does anyone have these in their records of family lines? Sarah ----- Original Message -- --- From: "Diane Graham" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 5:21 PM Subject: [S-I] Migration of 1718 group from Casco Bay to Northampton Co., PA > > > > My Boyds supposedly arrived at the "Forks of the Delaware before > arriving at Craig Settlemen(t became Allen Township.) > > Does this fit with anyone else...........or.............is more > definitive information available? I would love to know if they were > possibly part of the group under discussion. > > Diane > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

That concept of 'chain migration' is something that *has to* be thought about but trying to get a handle on some connections in American history, for the moment in terms of theorizing seems infinitely easier than late 17th-early 18th c. County Londonderry!! <groan> The for-sure common ancestor of the so-called Group 26 Smiths within the Northeastern Smith Project who came to America in 1718 is a Thomas Smith, born Derry 1688. You've had a lot of DNA experience, Linda — does a 66 out 67 match imply, in your mind, that the intersect would be within a certain number of generations? All the TN connection seems to be very East TN—Carter and Sullivan and seemingly from NC more than VA. There is a Jarvis Smith family who oral history says may have come to Wilkes Co. NC from York Co. PA and established iron bloomery. Could this family be the family we need to find a connection to —or not? A road we have to go down and hopefully have already found a willing DNA testor which will save time barking up a wrong tree. This Jarvis family also clearly has connections within Carter Co. TN! Jarvis and his siblings and many of his sons including Caleb fought in the Revolutionary War, including all of them fighting in the Battle of Kings Mountain, 1780. Jarvis' will is extant and a team member (we are lucky to have a strong team) is going to try and see the original in the next two weeks where its now resides in Raleigh. But what catches my eye, Linda, is your reference to land records. Will be back in time to wonder about that and the indexes etc... to find a land grant that had been lost—somebody was looking out for you! If it weren't for DNA, we would know nothing of related Smiths in Tennessee. I'm into matches in Australia too, but for my Ulster Croziers. The Aussies just don't have paper trails and I do, and so how to connect?! Arrrgh! Ruth On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 3:10 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Ruth, thanks for this information! I alas have not researched anyone in this Casco Bay to PA > migration, though it is believed many left New England for Pennsylvania in the early 1700s. Not only was > the climate improved, but Pennsylvania offered freedom of religion and, in the early 1700s, welcomed them. > So wonder is any remained. Once in PA, the next generation moved down the wagon road into Virginia. Many VIrginianas moved to Tennessee after the Revolution, esp. eastern TN. Depending on the area of TN, > they might have gotten a grant due to military service in North Carolina. Virginia soldiers received land in > the future Kentucky, not TN. But by the time the soldiers came to TN, eastern TN was largely in private > hands so the military grants are in the middle and west, with some federal land grants as well. I had to do > some research in the area. I'm no expert. A lot of the indexes are microfimed and in LDS, but in the end > we had to use an expert to search the original North Carolina landgrants, which he found. The grant > was missing from the TN state copy. The guy charged us $3 or some such amount to send us the grant. > (not $300 like we were charged for a probate packet once....grrrrrr.....). > > However your experience where a surprising DNA match sets you off on another direction is somewhat > typical. In my one situation, where we were looking for matches to Virginia (To TN) settlers from the 1770s, > our match was to an Australian! He had excellent proof of descent from a man in a town in Tyrone. We > knew about this man but no proof of relationship till the DNA match half the way around the world. > > It's possible that the Londonderry family sent other sons to America independently of Casco Bay. This is called 'chain migration'. So you cannot create a link between Casco Bay and TN because the link is back > to Ireland. > > With a common name like Smith a good DNA match is really appreciated. > > Linda Merle

On Mar 30, 2010, at 2:52 PM, [email protected] wrote: > There were definitely Boyds in the Casco Bay area. I got a book on > Boyds in western PA. If y ou provide more information I can see if > the family is in this book. Thank you Linda ================================================================= 1 Thomas Boyd -------------------------------------------------- Birth: abt 1715 Death: bef 19 Jun 1782, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania ? Father: ? Boyd Mother: UNNAMED It is said that In 1732, he left his home in County Armaugh, Ulster, Ireland, with his brother William and 2 unmarried sisters. In his will, he said that he was of (Alin?) Allen Township, Northampton County, Pennsylvania. Will 2-4-1782. Executed 6-19-1782. Alexander Boyd, and James Boyd were executors. Witness to will, Thomas Wilson, and Robert Hays. In 1743, this was still part of Bucks, county, untill 1752. Spouse: Elizabeth Birth: abt 1720 Death: (after 1765?)bef Jun 1782 The name Elizabeth possibly came from the church records (which church)? as tithe/pew rental. Marriage: abt 1738 Children: Alexander (~1740-) m. Sarah Miller (6 children) James (Major) Sr. (1743-1813) b. Bethlehem ? m. Nancy Brown Mary (~1746-) m. John Dunlap Elizabeth (Betsy) (~1749-) m John Brisbane Andrew (~1752-) m. Sarah Baird Thomas (~1755-) m. Ann Martin 1.2a James (Major) Boyd Sr.* -------------------------------------------------- Birth: 1743, Bethlehem, Norhampton County, Pennsylvania Death: 9 Oct 1813, Centre Co., Pennsylvania He served with the Northampton Co., Militia in the Revolutionary War. At the time of his will, he mentioned $ to church formerly called Grand Island Congregation. The history of Beech Creek says that Nancy Brown and James Boyd, and Lt. Jmes Hays and Sarah Brown Hays came to Beech Creek together on a flatboat. Spouse: Nancy Brown Birth: 1752 Death: 19 Sep 1800, Centre Co., Pennsylvania Marriage: 22 Feb 1774 Children: Thomas (1775-1847) m. Elizabeth Hughs Mary (Molly) (1776-1856) m. John Donnel Elizabeth (Betsy) (1778-1864) m. William Watson and Hugh McClelland James Jr. (1781-1863) m. Isabella McClelland Alexander Brown (1784-1813) Jennie (1786-1786) Nancy (1787-1827) m. James Steele John (1790-1792) Jane (1792-1865) m Joseph Holmes McClelland Sr. Other spouses: Phoebe McKelvey I have tried for years to definitely find the origins of Thomas Boyd (of Alin township) and surname of his wife Elizabeth.. I am grateful for any help. Diane >