At the FTDNA Rodgers Web site there are 3 DNA participants Rodgers John Rodgers, b. c1723 - Anne Mills [annemills1 AT comcast.net] Seth Rodgers, b. 1749 or 1760, m. Eliza Martha ? Parmenio Rodgers, b. 1788, m. Rachel Adams Alexander McQueen Rodgers I, b. 1824, m. Mary Jane Alden Parmenio Austin Rodgers, b. 1857, m. Sarah Elizabeth Hall Alexander McQueen Rodgers II, b. 1882, m. Alice Caldwell - R-3 Contact: Group Administrator terry Major Family <terry@bartons.org<mailto:terry@bartons.org>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> FTDNA's Rogers Web Site At the FTDNA web site they list 46 DNA participants. How do you fit into this group? Group Administrator hcfr2@aol.com<mailto:hcfr2@aol.com> <hcfr2@aol.com<mailto:hcfr2@aol.com>> This group has no web site they advertize. Probably why there is confusion on your part about Rogers family testing. Contact the group administrator and ask him for a web site that he posts results. Go there and see how many Rogers groups there are. For example this site advertizes 3 different spellings of the name Rogers. Go to http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/<http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/> our Hendricks web site and take a look at some of the things that are typical in the diversity of a Family. God Bless. Herb Hendricks Retired NASA Physicist Hendricks DNA Project Group Administrator Secretary Hendricks Family Association Herb_316@MSN.com<mailto:Herb_316@MSN.com> 1210 Long Meadow DR Lynchburg, VA 24502 434 832 7246 Major/Smith/Hendricks http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/<http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/>

Dear Herb, You've convinced me that the 12 marker test can give false positives. But does the 12 marker test give false negatives? Or is it a reliable method of eliminating families you do not match--such as the Benjamin Rogers family that we did NOT match. Are we right in assuming we are not related to this family? Thanks so much for your help. Carol

Dear Carol, 1) Are you suggesting that even though we did not match the descendants of this family, we may be related to them? There are more than one Rogers family in the world. There are many people in the world that have your same 12 marker that you match to. Some of our Hendricks families match perfectly up to even 25 markers but they separate into another group when you do the 37 marker case. This is not always the case but it happens. Matching to that Rogers family you are excited about with a 12 marker match maybe yours. It also may not be yours. The 12 marker test gives false positives because it matches to to many people, it may match to a Smith family. Did you do a Y-Search? This a good test to show you what I mean. Some 12 marker DNA profiles yield prolific family connections but they really are not. You have to do more testing to prove and sort out the false positives. As you put in more markers in the Y-search you get less and less possible connections. My Hendricks family is very unique even back to Western Europe we do not have a 37 marker DNA pattern that matches to anyone else. Y-searches verify this. However if I only do a 12 marker Y-search I pull up about a dozen people I match to. Why? Back in time we were all kin. The 12 markers are more common and do not separate people out. You have to test more markers to separate people out. We get Smiths, Jones and others who match to the Hendricks family with a 12 marker test. Am I communicating? Many other DNA groups get the same results. 2) Are you saying that we are NOT related to the families we matched in the 12 marker test? Or that we are only POSSIBLY related to them? Again I am saying, to know you have a match that is not a false positive, you have to do more testing to be certain. We have about 57 Hendricks DNA participants. We have 22 different Hendricks groups. How did we know this we do only 37 marker testing. How many Rogers groups do you have? One, two or 22? A 12 marker test does not separate out groups very well. Now if there is not many Rogers in the world then you don't have many groups. So you could conclude that since there are not many Rogers then a 12 marker test would be valid. From what I know about just the Rogers in Virginia this is not the case there are many Rogers Families. How do you know which one is yours? DNA matching is a start but family lineages is also necessary. Go to FTDNA and look at the Smith families. Access the site and see how many groups they have. How did they separate them out? Not with just 12 marker test. Some may be possible but this is generally not the case. DNA markers could be contrasted by describing a person. Each marker shows some characteristics. The more markers the more characteristics you have. What I am telling you is not Herb Hendricks opinion or any truths I established it is a fact in DNA testing. I'm just trying to tell you the facts. To many people have read the Genographic Project propaganda, spread it around and think 12 marker DNA testing is the only thing they have to do. Not so. God Bless. Herb Hendricks Retired NASA Physicist Hendricks DNA Project Group Administrator Secretary Hendricks Family Association Herb_316@MSN.com<mailto:Herb_316@MSN.com> 1210 Long Meadow DR Lynchburg, VA 24502 434 832 7246 Major/Smith/Hendricks http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/<http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/> ----- Original Message ----- From: Csnow108@cs.com<mailto:Csnow108@cs.com> To: SCANDERS-L@rootsweb.com<mailto:SCANDERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 11:21 PM Subject: Re: [SCAnderson] A True DNA Story Dear Herb, Please be patient with me. I'm not trying to be impertinent. I honestly want to understand what you are saying. And there may be other people out there in as much of a fog as I am. I've never heard of the Genographic Project. My cousin was tested last summer, and no one has suggested that he have more testing done. All the matches we got had the last name "Rogers" which is our family name. He did the 12 marker test primarily to find out if we were related to the Benjamin Rogers family that had settled close to our family in MO. We had been stewing over this one for years. It turned out that we did not match that family at all. 1) Are you suggesting that even though we did not match the descendants of this family, we may be related to them? I thought it very encouraging that our ancestors had migrated to the same areas as the 4 Rogers families we actually did match and which I've already discussed to some extent. Our brick wall had been Joseph Rogers, born in SC in 1788. But we had suspected that his family was originally from Virginia because that's where his wife's family (Mullings and Garrett) was from. Two of the families we "matched" had come from Virginia and gone to Tennessee. Joseph served in the Tennessee Militia during the War of 1812. So we have a few more similarities than just height and weight, so to speak. We have last name, 12 marker match, and geographic locations. So, bottom line: 2) Are you saying that we are NOT related to the families we matched in the 12 marker test? Or that we are only POSSIBLY related to them? God Bless you too, Carol ==== SCANDERS Mailing List ==== Anderson County, South Carolina SCGenWeb http://www.rootsweb.com/~scander2/index.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/~scander2/index.html> ============================== Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx<http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx>

Dear Herb, Please be patient with me. I'm not trying to be impertinent. I honestly want to understand what you are saying. And there may be other people out there in as much of a fog as I am. I've never heard of the Genographic Project. My cousin was tested last summer, and no one has suggested that he have more testing done. All the matches we got had the last name "Rogers" which is our family name. He did the 12 marker test primarily to find out if we were related to the Benjamin Rogers family that had settled close to our family in MO. We had been stewing over this one for years. It turned out that we did not match that family at all. 1) Are you suggesting that even though we did not match the descendants of this family, we may be related to them? I thought it very encouraging that our ancestors had migrated to the same areas as the 4 Rogers families we actually did match and which I've already discussed to some extent. Our brick wall had been Joseph Rogers, born in SC in 1788. But we had suspected that his family was originally from Virginia because that's where his wife's family (Mullings and Garrett) was from. Two of the families we "matched" had come from Virginia and gone to Tennessee. Joseph served in the Tennessee Militia during the War of 1812. So we have a few more similarities than just height and weight, so to speak. We have last name, 12 marker match, and geographic locations. So, bottom line: 2) Are you saying that we are NOT related to the families we matched in the 12 marker test? Or that we are only POSSIBLY related to them? God Bless you too, Carol

Dear Carol, I guess I wasted my time and breath writing the story. Some people are never convinced. Sounds like you are listening to the General Line from the Genographic Project. This is their little white lie that suckers people into getting their DNA done. Then people discover they are connected to 100s of people but possibly only a few have their surname. How would you separate people who have 12 markers. More testing. Then they advise you to get a 25 marker test. Again you don't match completely. Then they advise you to get a 37 marker test. Then an SNP test, etc. If you want to do a probability calculation you can but nothing like the real thing DNA markers to DNA markers with family lineages. Anyone who wants to connect to their family does more DNA markers to prove connectivity. Not less. I just got through a deep clades test that took me back to the last ice age in hopes of pinpointing where my family came from in Western Europe. Less testing did not tell me this more testing did and it begins to match you up to other names with confidence of connectivity not less. Less markers tell you less about you. If someone only told you I was 6 feet and weighed 190 pounds could you pick me out of a crowd of similar people? If they told you I had brown hair, green eyes and wore glasses you have better chance. If they told you I was right handed and had an old SC drawl would that not tell you more. Now where on earth did all these characteristics come from? Is less better here? NO! More is better. Same for DNA. People just keep on believing what they want to believe but the data of 12 markers just begins to connect you to your family. The more markers the greater the connectivity. Honest I really don't know how to convince you any better than say go study other people's work. Charles Kerchner is a good example. Put in Kerchner in your browser and look for work by Charles. He has worked every facet of this. Join Genealogy DNA-L. Talk with other DNA Group administrators who have worked their family and have greater than 50 participants. They have the experience and knowledge. Some of the people who have made postings on SC Genealogy sites show their lack of reading and knowledge. I have tried to talk sense to some of them but it is a hard ob to over come misinformation. Anyone with any experience that I have described will tell you exactly what I have posted. My information is from reading, experience and leaning on others who have no financial gain and are only driven by putting out good information not suckering people into getting tested without providing insight into where they are going. Any information is helpful but if you do DNA testing you do it to prove a connection with the greatest confidence you can. 12 markers are a start, 25 markers are better but 37+ markers gives the confidence plus family lineages that you are on the right tract. I would not put any confidence in connecting family members in 12 markers testing. All it generally does is generate false positives. 25 markers improve it but as per my example, read it again, does not a match make in all conditions. Again read: Trace Your Roots with DNA: Using Genetic Tests to Explore Your Family Tree<http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=eV3lrs4Dyv&isbn=1594860068&itm=1> Megan Smolenyak, Ann Turner Then go to Charles Kerchner's web site, order some of his information and read the free articles. oin Genealogy DNA-L and read the posting and ask the questions. Talk with Dale E. Reddick<mailto:dereddi@hargray.com>, a local SC Group Aministrator for the Reddick Project. I have forwarded a look see at his opinion of what I wrote. Become informed broaden your horizion. God Bless. Herb Hendricks Retired NASA Physicist Hendricks DNA Project Group Administrator Secretary Hendricks Family Association Herb_316@MSN.com<mailto:Herb_316@MSN.com> 1210 Long Meadow DR Lynchburg, VA 24502 434 832 7246 Major/Smith/Hendricks http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/<http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/> ----- Original Message ----- From: Csnow108@cs.com<mailto:Csnow108@cs.com> To: SCANDERS-L@rootsweb.com<mailto:SCANDERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 6:23 PM Subject: Re: [SCAnderson] A True DNA Story Mr. Hendricks, Don't the 12 marker tests actually prove that the two people are related but that the connection was farther back in time than people who match with the 25 marker test or the 37 marker test? I think it depends on how far back you want to go whether you want to choose a 12 marker test or a 37 marker test. Sometimes we don't want to rule out our relationship to people 10 or even 20 generations back because it helps us to determine family origins and countries of origin. A male cousin recently did the 12 marker test in a Rogers family project. As you can imagine a lot of matches were possible. But what was just helpful as the 4 matches he got were the matches he did not get. We found through this test that we were not related to several families who had come to the same area of Missouri our family had come to. At the same time we did connect to one Rogers family who practically lived "next door" to our ggg grandfather in Missouri and went to the area at the same time he did but then moved on to Texas. The earliest known ancestor of another of our matches was born in South Carolina in the late 1700's just as our ggg grandfather was. The other branch of the family we connected with settled close to where my gg grandfather settled in Arkansas. This family first came to Virginia in the early 1600's from there, they migrated to NC, then some of the family went to TN and SC just as our family had. Perhaps the actual connections are distant. But this test has helped us tremendously to hon our search. Regards, Carol Snow ==== SCANDERS Mailing List ==== Anderson County, South Carolina SCGenWeb http://www.rootsweb.com/~scander2/index.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/~scander2/index.html> ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx<http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx>

Mr. Hendricks, Don't the 12 marker tests actually prove that the two people are related but that the connection was farther back in time than people who match with the 25 marker test or the 37 marker test? I think it depends on how far back you want to go whether you want to choose a 12 marker test or a 37 marker test. Sometimes we don't want to rule out our relationship to people 10 or even 20 generations back because it helps us to determine family origins and countries of origin. A male cousin recently did the 12 marker test in a Rogers family project. As you can imagine a lot of matches were possible. But what was just helpful as the 4 matches he got were the matches he did not get. We found through this test that we were not related to several families who had come to the same area of Missouri our family had come to. At the same time we did connect to one Rogers family who practically lived "next door" to our ggg grandfather in Missouri and went to the area at the same time he did but then moved on to Texas. The earliest known ancestor of another of our matches was born in South Carolina in the late 1700's just as our ggg grandfather was. The other branch of the family we connected with settled close to where my gg grandfather settled in Arkansas. This family first came to Virginia in the early 1600's from there, they migrated to NC, then some of the family went to TN and SC just as our family had. Perhaps the actual connections are distant. But this test has helped us tremendously to hon our search. Regards, Carol Snow

A True DNA Story (A necessary understanding in DNA testing) by Herb Hendricks In 2004 we had a Hendricks Family from old Pendleton District start doing their DNA testing. Our Hendricks DNA Project had taken the advice of the SC Hill and Freeman Family DNA Projects and insisted on all Hendricks DNA participants do a complete 37+ marker test for all Hendricks families. Why was this a necessity? To really prove and separate different family members into groups the Hill and Freeman DNA Groups had found by experience that this was a truth that the Hill and Freeman DNA Project had not implemented in the beginning. When the above Hendricks family had completed their numerous descendants DNA testing they were disappointed as they did not match to any other of the other Hendricks groups. So following up on what is logically suggested in DNA testing, as we are all from a large family of humans that originated commonly back in time, they did a Y-Search. A Y-search is where you can enter your family DNA profile and check to see if you are kin to some other group of people who match to your DNA profile. This was a method to check against someone else being a parent of your family line. Upon doing this the Hendricks family matched 100% to another family line we shall call "Smith" up through his 25 marker test. Some people in life face the fact that this could be a true connection and follow up on the lead. Please note that the "Smith" person was not required to do a 37+ marker test. The person from the "Smith family who had the 100% match to the Hendricks family on the 25 marker test was contacted. He agreed to let the Hendricks family sponsor his 25-37 marker test. A sample was acquired from the "Smith" and sent to the DNA test lab. After waiting in much suspense without knowing the results for over 3 months the tests came back. The 25-37 marker test was quite revealing. The "Smith" person did not match to the Hendricks family as there was a 6 marker distance that showed up in the 25-37 DNA marker test. So what is the consequence? The Hendricks family was put though an ordeal, paid money out of their pocket and was kept in suspense for over 3 months because of the ignorance of the "Smith" Family DNA Group Coordinator. As it turned out this Hendricks group had a unique Hendricks DNA profile but the ignorance of people in the system put them through an unnecessary ordeal. Education on what is necessary to establish truth is often helpful in life. So one who is managing project needs to follow up and do what is right instead of promising people little proof with low marker test. This same story has validity when separating various brother groups within families. So now and then you will see my posts on SC nets where I continue to fight against ignorance in DNA testing. HDH 2/16/2006 God Bless Herb Hendricks Retired NASA Physicist Hendricks DNA Project Group Administrator Secretary Hendricks Family Association Herb_316@MSN.com<mailto:Herb_316@MSN.com> 1210 Long Meadow DR Lynchburg, VA 24502 434 832 7246 Major/Smith/Hendricks http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/<http://www.ftdna.com/public/hendricks/>

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/742.1.2 Message Board Post: Hi Vicki, Have not worked on Roach's in quite awhile, that Henry Roach and Catherine Ashcraft theory won't hold much water, I'm afraid, it has been speculated for years,(since the 1980's)with absolutely no proof, the only children they actually had are documented in VA. Littleberry being one, I believe (If memory serves me right)" the fact that Catherine was even an Ashcraft has not been proven either... Shar

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/1079.1141 Message Board Post: Tombstone for Virgil does have Virgil A.S. Moore. Most other places show Virgil H. or Virgil M. How did you get the A.S.? Do you know what it stands for. I'mpretty sure his wis mother was Jane Stewart married to John Moore. Thanks

Sorry that I made a mistake about Muriel and Harold ROACH'S children, they were Sonny and Buddy Roach. Muriel was a LUNA. JOYCE --------------------------------- Yahoo! Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing, reviews, & more on new and used cars.

In the Luna family from Lewisburg and Marshall Counties Tennessee, there are ROACHES. One Harold Roach married Muriel Luna from Lincoln County,TN., she was the daughter of William Tocker Luna and Emma Tate. Harold and Muriel were living in Mexico during the 1940's and 50's. They had children two that I know of...........but they only went by nicknames. Who in the world could locate a Sonny or a Buddy Luna ? The family does not know what their real names were. I have tried to locate them , but no luck. Harold died I believe in California and Muriel probably re-married and died in Mexico. Joyce A. Luna --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Stark(e), York, Bond, Bowen, McDonald, Quailes, Wozencraft, Butler,Malcom,Hawk,Brown, Cunningham, etc. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/742.1.1 Message Board Post: Would you please exchange files privately - my mail bounced due to the excess messages... Thanks Diane S Sanfilippo

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH/SIMPSON Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2639.1.1 Message Board Post: Anderson Co., SC book Z page 413 Henry Roach sold to Elias Roach 50 acres adjoining A. Simpson November 29, 1848

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH/SIMPSON Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2639.1 Message Board Post: Anderson Co., SC book Z page 413 Henry Roach sold to Elias Roach 350 acres adjoining to A. Simpson

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH/SANDERS Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2639 Message Board Post: Anderson Co., SC Book Z page 376 May 6, 1848 Abraham Sanders sold to Elias Roach 50 acres adjoining Elias Sanders.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH/MCGEE Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2636.3 Message Board Post: Anderson Co., SC for Feb. 2, 1846 Berry Roach sold to Jesse McGee 185 acres on Wild Cat Creek Book Z page 54

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH/MCFALL Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2638 Message Board Post: Anderson Co., SC Book Y page 95 January 3, 1844 A.N. McFall, sheriff, sold to Forrester ROACH 100 acres on Waters of Richland Creek.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH Classification: Deed Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2636.2 Message Board Post: Oct. 17, 1842 Anderson Co., SC Book X page 419 Henry ROACH sold to Berry ROACH 152 acres on the Savannah River.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH Classification: Census Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2636.1 Message Board Post: 1840 Anderson Co., SC page 119 ROACH, Berry 2 males between 5-10 1 male between 10-15 1 male 30-40 2 females under 5 2 females 5-10 1 female 20-30 General Tax for 1840 Anderson District, SC Roach, Henry Roach, Berry

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: ROACH Classification: Census Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/hcB.2ACE/2637 Message Board Post: 1840 Anderson Co., Census page 119 Lewis ROACH age 20 to 30 female 30 to 40 2 females under 5