This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Roper Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/kgDBAEB/787.2 Message Board Post: In my previous Posts in this discussion thread, I mention the death notice of John ROPER (d 05 Jul 1820 - Henrico, VA) and speculate about the likelihood that the John ROPER shown in the 1810, 1820 and 1830 Census was John ROPER, son of David ROPER (b 13 NOV 1744, d 16 APR 1808 - Charles City, VA). In 1810, we have this record in Henrico for John ROPER: John ROPER: 1 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 -- 2 - 0 - 0 - 2 - 0 -- 1 - 6 In 1820, John ROPER appears again in Henrico as the head of this household: John ROPER: 0 - 2 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 1 -- 3 - 0 - 1 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 1 - 0 - 1 -- 1 - 1 - 1 - 0 -- 0 - 2 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 In 1830, John ROPER is still a head of household in Henrico: John ROPER: 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 1 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 - 1 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 1 - 2 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 1 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 8 This John ROPER seems to be age 60 to 69 (b abt 1761-70). Note that this is consistent with the range indicated by the 1810 Census record (b abt 1766-1784) and the implicit range suggested by the 1820 record (b bef 1776). Taken together, the indicated range is 1766-1770. While the 1820 Census enumeration in Henrico was presented in a quasi-alphabetical order, the 1830 enumeration appears to be in a proximity order. Here are the identifiable neighbors of John ROPER in 1830: William H. CHILDRESS Joseph BAILEY, Sen. Nancy FOSTER Edrig? WILLIAM Moses SYKES Jackson HAMPTON Shadrack FAGAN Ned GEORGE Betty GELMAN? Leonard SCOTT Samual BALL Task SCOTT John SCOTT Edward COX Edward MARABLE James CHRISTIAN (Manager at Wilton) Spotswood BRADLEY Joseph KNIGHT Nelson BUTLER Elijah THROGMORTON William GUNN Samuel THROGMORTON Caleb FRASER William FUSELL? Patsy ROBINSON Mima FUSELL? John ROPER Benjamin FUSELL Elizabeth MINOR ** London BROWN Becky PLEASANTS Cuffie PLEASANTS Mings GRIFFIN John WARRINER Milly PLEASANTS John WHITLOCKE James F. DELORA Mima FUSELL William G. O'KESSEE? Susanna MORRIS Terry HILL Mary Ann PEMBERTON Gervais N. KESSEE James LONITH Thomas I. WEST Sarah WASHINGTON Fielding BINFORD Samuel WILLIS Richard BINFORD Patsy COLEMAN Betty BINFORD Peter COLEMAN In 1850, John ROPER is still living and is found in the household of James and Elizabeth TURNER, of Henrico: United States Census -- 1850 My District, Henrico, Virginia 09 OCT 1850 Line 30, Dwelling 838, Family 838, James TURNER, Age 34, Male, Farmer, Born VA Line 31, Dwelling 838, Family 838, Elizabeth P. TURNER, Age 47, Female, Born VA Line 32, Dwelling 838, Family 838, Sarah TURNER, Age 10, Female, Born VA Line 33, Dwelling 838, Family 838, Thomas TURNER, Age 7, Male, Born VA Line 34, Dwelling 838, Family 838, Susan F. TURNER, Age 3, Female, Born VA Line 35, Dwelling 838, Family 838, John J. EPPS, Age 16, Male, Born VA Line 36, Dwelling 838, Family 838, John ROPER, Age 80, Male, -None-, Born VA, BLIND [Image 98 of 116 at the Ancestry.com presentation of Census data for this jurisdiction.] This record appears to me to be furhter evidence in support of the ascription of this John ROPER as the son of David ROPER (b 13 NOV 1744, d 16 APR 1808 - Charles City, VA). From the sequence of names in David ROPER's Will, it seems most likely that John ROPER is the eldest son. A birth year of abt 1770 would indicate that David ROPER was about age 26 at John ROPER's birth. John ROPER's presence in James TURNER's household is suggestive that he might be Elizabeth TURNER's father. John J. EPPS' appearance in this household is suggestive that Elizabeth ROPER might have been the widow of an EPPS, who married James TURNER about 1839. * I believe the clue to the identity of this Elizabeth TURNER is given in the deed dated 16 JAN 1834, a transciption of which is shown at Dr. L. David ROPER's website at http://www.roperld.com/rva18.htm . The text reads in part: "This Indenture made this sixteenth day of January in the year eighteen hundred and thirty four between John Roper, Edmond P. Roper, Lewis L. Charles and Martha P. his wife, Edmond Eppes and Elizabeth P. his wife and Sarah M. Roper the said Lewis S. Charles Martha P. his wife and Sarah M. Roper of the County of Albermurel and the said John Roper, Edmond P. Roper, Edmond Eppes and Elizabeth P. his wife of the County of Henrico of one part and John Whitlock of the last said County of the other part. ..." It is unclear from the instrument the relationship Edmond and Elizabeth EPPES bear to the other ROPERs named, but it APPEARS likely that Elizabeth P. EPPES is a ROPER. Martha P. CHARLES seems also likely to be a ROPER. What seems likely is that the farm of John ROPER is being sold DURING HIS LIFETIME and the proceeds being divided amongst his children. By 1834, John ROPER was probably also blind and therefore dependant upon his children for care. I am inclined to believe that this record iplicitly identifies for us the surviving children of John ROPER at the date of this 1834 instrument: Edmond P. ROPER, Martha P. (Roper) CHARLES, Elizabeth P. (Roper) EPPES, and Sarah M. ROPER, widow of another son of John ROPER. This is reasonably consistent with the 1810 Census record for John ROPER which shows what appears to be an older son -- possibly John Jr. -- and a younger son, as well as two younger daughters. The 1820 Census record appears to show two sons age 16 to 25 and three younger daughters. There is one Edmond EPPES in Henrico, VA, in the 1820 Census: Edmond EPPES: 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 1 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 1 - 0 -- 0 - 2 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 1 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 1 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -- 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 [Image 21 of 52 at the Ancestry.com presentation of 1820 Census data for this jurisdiction] Edmond is age 45 or over (b bef 1776). His wife, possibly Elizabeth, is age 26 to 44 (b abt 1776-94). Based solely upon proximity, I am inclined to believe that the marriage record of Elizabeth ROPER to William MINOR on 24 AUG 1819 may very well apply to John ROPER's daughter. Note the appearance of an Elizabeth MINOR in the 1830 Census enumeration two records away from John ROPER in Henrico. I am GUESSING that William MINOR died before 1830 and that Elizabeth Roper MINOR then subsequently remarried Edmund EPPES. This speculative ascription is somewhat supported by the finding of a marriage record showing the marriage of Martha P. ROPER to Lewis L. CHARLES on 22 MAY 1828 in Henrico County, VA. (This at least supports my inference that the reason the wives were shown in the deed record was because they were daughters of John ROPER.) * I am inclined to believe that the Elizabeth TURNER, age 60, shown residing within the household of Anslem C. and Martha GARTHRIGHT is probably John ROPER's daughter Elizabeth P. ROPER, following the death of James TURNER. There is a marriage record in Henrico showing: John ROPER m Mrs. Elizabeth GARTHRIGHT on 25 MAY 1814 at Henrico, VA. It is unclear to me whether this was the second marriage of Elizabeth's father John ROPER or perhaps the marriage of her brother John ROPER, but it seems likely that there is a family connection. * * * I would much appreciate hearing from anyone with additional insight or information regarding this family!