--- On Sun, 1/3/10, DONNA COOPER <saarisr@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > From: DONNA COOPER <saarisr@sbcglobal.net> > Subject: Tables that Work! > To: rootsweb-help@rootsweb.com > Date: Sunday, January 3, 2010, 10:57 AM > Good Morning, this may be a long ride > so fasten your seat belts. > > I am a coordinator of a county that has been doing cemetery > photos now for 4 years or so, and so I can suggest something > different that works very well. We have a lot of dial up > users and so it is very important to keep the pages where > they will open for all our viewers. > > I use a table with 5 columns and link the photos to the > decease's name. My headings are Name, Born, Died, Research > Notes or Inscriptions and Researcher or Resource. We are > documenting our work as we go with obits and death > certificates so all these columns are needed. > > Barry County, Missouri, has 162 cemeteries and we have a > little more than 3/4 of the photo work done now but will > probably finish up the project in 2010. We won the Oakley > Award in 2009 for our cemetery work, which also includes > restoration and preservation of graves stones.  >     > > Here at this link below you can see my cemetery pages. > After on the site you might go to Oak Hill Cemetery and see > the work that we recently did on that one because it is a > good example to view. It is a very large cemetery with about > 2500 photos. I might add that we also did one with 5500 > photos so you can see that we are not strangers to cemetery > work and we know what works. > > http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~mobarry/cemetery/rschcemtery.htm > > The problem I have had is not with tables but with web > programs. The older pages were done with Front Page and so > now I am trying to re-do some of those and convert to CSS. I > am using Dream Weaver and Coffee Cup for the newly designed > pages but am staying with the same table style because it > works. > > Enjoy the ride! > > Donna Cooper > > --- On Sun, 1/3/10, singhals <singhals@erols.com> > wrote: > > > From: singhals <singhals@erols.com> > > Subject: Re: [ROOTSWEB-HELP] What is best for big > table? > > To: rootsweb-help@rootsweb.com > > Date: Sunday, January 3, 2010, 10:03 AM > > On behalf of other dial-up users can > > I ask -- > > > > what's wrong with a table that has only three columns > -- > > the > > NAME of the deceased (as a link to the full photo), > > birth-date, and death-date.  That way, if I-the-user > > want to > > see all 500 of 'em I can, but if I only want the > Zickaman > > entry, I don't /have/ to wait for the other 499 > thumnails > > to > > load.  And incidentially, Charles-the-webmaster > > doesn't have > > to spend time resizing photos, d/l a new program and > > figuring out how to use it. > > > > Even working on local, off your HD, pulling up and > > displaying 40 or 50 thumbnails takes a measurable > length > > of > > time. > > > > I get more and more discouraged browsing even the > GenWeb > > these days, as more and more webmasters lean to > fancier > > and > > more elaborate displays of less and less data.  For > > myself > > and others I know, so long as the data is presented > > coherently and legibly, what color the background is, > or > > which image is used for the background on the side-bar > is > > a > > matter of indifference.  There's a site I use fairly > > often > > that insists on using a beige calico print as > background, > > thus causing every 3rd or 4th letter of the text to > > vanish. > > > > Cheryl > > > > > > > > > > J.A. Florian wrote: > > > Hi Charles, > > > > > > There's no *easy* answer, unfortunately. > > > > > > Here's how I'd do it. > > > > > > 1. Get an *idea* of how you'd like it to be > arranged, > > IF possible to do. > > > But.... > > > 2. Wait to get the CD before finalizing your > plan. > > > 3. Visit the Fayette Co PAGenWeb -- they have a > large > > cemetery photo > > > database.  See if you like their design. > > > If you do, Click View Source and save it as a > TXT > > file. > > > 4. When you get the CD, browse through them in > the > > Details view of Windows > > > Explorer - gives size. > > > As you browse, note if you'll have to crop sides > and > > bottom BEFORE deciding > > > on a uniform size. > > > 5. I'd arrange by > > > -- Cemetery first > > > ---By Surname second > > > (By date or by cemetery row is just too hard). > > > 6. Copy all the pics to a backup drive.  Work > on > > them on the backup drive. > > > Do all cropping first--- keep in mind what size > you > > want for all photos. > > > 7. Decide on a uniform width x height and begin > > revising each photo to that > > > size.  At the end of each filename put > something > > like _d for "done" OR move > > > each to a "done re-sizing" folder. > > > 8. Decide how many you want per folder.  Move > > sets into separate folders. > > > 9. Make thumbnails using EasyThumbnails free > > program.  Make sure to do a > > > test on 1 photo.  use the settings tab to set > > your height and width for > > > thumb size > > > 10 decide how many thumbs you can put on a > horizontal > > line... make your > > > table for all the "A" names... 1 for "B" names, > > etc.   On some alphabet > > > letters (C, L, M, Mc, R, S, T, V, W) you will > likely > > need several pages > > > (s_names_1.html and keep numbering each till the > last > > one) > > > 11. Make 1 html page of thumbnails. > > > 12. Label each thumbnail. > > > 13. Go back to the large photos.  Decide how > you > > want to present them.  It > > > is MUCH harder to do one html page for each > larger > > photo. > > > It is much EASIER to just link a thumbnail > directly to > > its corresponding big > > > picture, without it being on a web page (not one > you > > make).  But you won't > > > be able to add a title under the picture.  So > if > > you have photoshop, you > > > could add text to each photo, like maybe the > cemetery > > name?  Or a copyright > > > and phototaker name?  Visitors will see the > > deceased's info on the > > > tombstone.  A pic without an html page just > opens > > on a white rootsweb page. > > > 15. If you do the pic-no page route, just link > each > > thumb to its bigger > > > picture. > > > 16. upload after doing 1 folder of pics-- makes > it > > easier and faster to > > > upload. > > > 17. If you don't want others to have access to a > > folder of pics (as a > > > directory only), put an index.htm page in that > > folder.  On the page, just > > > have navigation back to the site's main page AND > the > > A-B-C-D navigation to > > > the cemetery photos, or at least to the > > cemetery/index.htm (the main index > > > page for the whole project) > > > 18. I forgot, do a navigation table of A, B, C, D > for > > each surname letter. > > > If one letter has 2 pages, llink to a "Main page > for > > the Letter A" for > > > example.   But instead of a "page" for > > this table, put it in an _include. > > > Much easier to link to one _include, rather than > have > > to manually put the > > > nav table on every page. > > > > > > Other people might do it differently.  I've > never > > found an easy way to do a > > > huge pic project.  Take it one section at a > > time.  And, good luck-- you'll > > > be working for many months. > > > > > > Judy > > > PS  I use Frontpage too. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 4:10 PM, Charles Barnum > <jcnreno@charter.net> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > >>Good New Year to you All, > > >>Cemetery Survey: > > >>A lady is sending me 500 headstone photos on > disk > > and sending me the > > >>names in a special format I asked her to use. > > >>Name; date one; date two; comments. > > >>I usually convert that to a table in MS Word > using > > the ";" as the column > > >>separator. (The lady does not have Excel.) > Then, I > > usually convert that > > >>to Excel and then decide if I want a table or > > <pre> text form for the > > >>web page. However, I have discovered a way to > > convert a Word file > > >>directly into a <pre> format for using > > Expression Web 3. (Expression Web > > >>3 is a glorified  program of FrontPage that > > has massive flaws when it > > >>comes to tables.) > > >>What is the best way to display a 500 name > cemetery > > file with linked > > >>photos? How do you do it?  I use EW3 but > often > > fall back to using > > >>FrontPage because it is easier to use and does > not > > crash like EW3 does. > > >> > > >>Happy New Year, all is well that ends well. > > >>Charles > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ROOTSWEB-HELP-request@rootsweb.com > > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the > > subject and the body of the message > > > >

Experiment in Terror Here is what a person may have to go through if converting (I know, the EW fans will say there is no converting) a FrontPage page in html to an EW page in xhtml. 1—Open the page. Switch to Code View. 2—Repalce the old head to a new head with <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//Dtd XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/tr/xhtml1/Dtd/xhtml1-transitional.dtd"> <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml"> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv="Content-Type" /> 3—Remove the tag for any THEME that exists on that page. 4—Select and Replace every <strong> tag using the Replace command. If you don’t do this it may (does) produce a code error message for every <p> tag and <td> tag. 5—Remove all code for your Table except <table>. 6—Open Design view. Select the table(s). Go to Table Properties. Select the Alignment. Select the Float. Select the Cell Padding. Select the Cell Spacing. Select the Width. Select the Height. Select the Border size. Select the Border color. Select or do not select Collapse border. Select the BG color if any. 7—Then go back to Design View. Select all but one column of Cells. Select Cell Properties. Select Horizontal Alignment. Select Vertical Alignment. Select Rows spanned. Select Columns spanned. Select Border Size. Select Border Color.(Do not forget to select the Border color even if you selected Border color in the Table, or you may end up with the old FP color for the cell Borders. Select Width and height or leave blank. Then go back to Design View and select the last Column of cells and do it for that batch. (Gosh, why not just select the entire table of cells? Because EW may think you have selected the Table instead of all of the cells and it may not make your changes. ) 8—Return to Design View and select the entire page and click B in the tool bar to make the text bold if that is what you use. 9—Click Preview so you can see what the converted page looks like. I use Mozilla preview setting because I want all Fire Fox users to see my pages okay. 10—All done? No. Remember I said I was converting from FP to EW from html to xhtml. You will now have to click the Code Error detector. There you will find code errors left over from the old FP days. You will have to fix all of those errors. THEN, Click Compatibility detector. It will show you incompatible code like: <div align="center"> saying “The WWW regards this code as outdated.” You can fix those or leave them as these types of incompatible code are apparently overlooked by most browsers. 11--I then Optimize the code. I used only the tools supplied by EW to convert this page. There is nothing done here using EW that I could not do using FP or any other decent program. I know some will say, you should have had a DWT page or this or that. But why does EW provide those tools if they are no good? Building a new page from scratch does not have all of these problems, but for those poor folks converting from an existing FP site, you will be up night and day. I do not want an answer. I just want to point out some facts. Have a great day. Charles

Comments: Before proceeding with any major site revamp, you better have a good backup on hand. Themes and Shared Borders are best removed in FrontPage by simply turning them off. If your navigation system is part of a shared border copy and save it so you can use it later. Depending on what you have in the way of a doctype or if you have none in place, you can use Global Find and Replace to make the change. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gearyfamily/expression-web/global-find-replace.html You can use Queries to make the cleanup easier http://any-expression.com/expression-web/tutorials/expression-web-querys.htm this is only a sample of what you can do Cleaning Tables http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gearyfamily/frontpage/tabletoclipboard.html will not work on tables where you have hyperlinks within the table. Creating and Styling Tables http://www.expression-web-tutorials.com/ew3/creating-table.html Once you have the proper doctype and charset in place, you can clean up some of the html/xhtml formatting by clicking apply xml style rules. This is a site done by Microsoft on the transition process http://expression.microsoft.com/en-us/dd326841.aspx it may or may not agree with the methods that Tina and I use and have taught. If you are using either FrontPage or Expression Web I invite you to join us on the rootsweb groups for those two programs. There is no easy button for cleaning up the code created by fp to ew. If you are happy with fp then by all means continue to use the program. Learn what the results are of the actions you take when using either of the programs. Pat ---------- Pat Geary, Microsoft MVP - Expression Web We discuss FrontPage and Expression Web http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gearyfamily/frontpage/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gearyfamily/expression-web/ http://www.expression-web-tutorials.com/ Migrating from FrontPage to Expression Web EBook Revised to include EW 3.0 http://frontpage-to-expression.com/

Pat, At least for my benefit this link is the best you have suggested: http://expression.microsoft.com/en-us/dd439540.aspx Anyone who reads that page will know all the work it takes to change. I am using XHTML Transitional, not XHTML Strict, but the principles are the same. A ncie lady asked me yesterday about changing her site from FP to EW . I suggested she not change. She has a very nice site and I see no need to change but that is her decision. Charles Patricia Geary wrote: > Comments: > > Before proceeding with any major site revamp, you better have a good > backup on hand. > > Themes and Shared Borders are best removed in FrontPage by simply > turning them off. If your navigation system is part of a shared > border copy and save it so you can use it later. > > Depending on what you have in the way of a doctype or if you have > none in place, you can use Global Find and Replace to make the change. > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gearyfamily/expression-web/global-find-replace.html > > You can use Queries to make the cleanup easier > http://any-expression.com/expression-web/tutorials/expression-web-querys.htm > this is only a sample of what you can do > > Cleaning Tables > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gearyfamily/frontpage/tabletoclipboard.html > will not work on tables where you have hyperlinks within the table. > > Creating and Styling > Tables http://www.expression-web-tutorials.com/ew3/creating-table.html > > Once you have the proper doctype and charset in place, you can clean > up some of the html/xhtml formatting by clicking apply xml style rules. > > This is a site done by Microsoft on the transition process > http://expression.microsoft.com/en-us/dd326841.aspx it may or may > not agree with the methods that Tina and I use and have taught. > > If you are using either FrontPage or Expression Web I invite you to > join us on the rootsweb groups for those two programs. > > There is no easy button for cleaning up the code created by fp to ew. > If you are happy with fp then by all means continue to use the > program. Learn what the results are of the actions you take when > using either of the programs. > > Pat > > > > ---------- > Pat Geary, Microsoft MVP - Expression Web > We discuss FrontPage and Expression Web > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gearyfamily/frontpage/ > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gearyfamily/expression-web/ > http://www.expression-web-tutorials.com/ > > Migrating from FrontPage to Expression Web EBook > Revised to include EW 3.0 > http://frontpage-to-expression.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ROOTSWEB-HELP-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.725 / Virus Database: 270.14.124/2599 - Release Date: 01/04/10 00:24:00 > >