Hi Martha: Thanks. That is interesting, wonder why previous Roll researchers hadn't found the court records. I correspond with another Roll researcher who visits NJ quite often, I will ask her if she can look around for any clues. "Washington McLean Roll" is a new name to me, surprised that he did not change to RALL as the others in Ohio did. Ed, do you know his line? I love all these twists and turns in genealogy! ____ Nancy Lohbrunner [email protected]

Hi Audrey, Jacob & Elizabeth (Mills) Roll had 11 children. They were: Aaron, Sally (Sarah), Abigail, Nancy, Mary Margaret, Philip (Philamon), Moses, Jacob, Joseph, Abram (Abraham), Betsey. He married: 04/11/1810 to Nancy Picket (or Pecket) from New Brunswick, New Jersey. They were married at New Providence, N.J. The notes at the bottom of their page: Jacob Roll owned the Grist Mill at New Providence, N.J. for several years. He sold out and went to Ohio. No date. He was a Chairmaker in Cincinnati, Ohio. The 2nd marriage children were: Hannah, John, Jane. Jacob did use the name Roll, but it was pronounced Rall. That seemed to be a big thing with part of these families. The name could not be pronounced as it looks. Lynn told me that when she was in school, to mispronounce her name was fighting words. Also when I lived in Van Buren, Indiana, everyplace I went they pronounced the name Rall. Even in Marion, Indiana. The little town of Roll, Indiana is also pronounced as Rall. It was a growing community at one time. Best wishes, Martha

This case did go to court. It was about the original land owned by Jan Mangelese given to him by the Indians. I have never seen the actual court records but I do know that these men lost the case and it was denied to return the land to the Roll Family. Washington McLean Roll played a big part in it because he was an attorney in Cincinnati, Ohio. I don't have any court records and have never seen them but I do know that they exist. Best to you, Martha

Forgot to tell you what lists I sent the notice about our Roll list to. (Really dumb!) Gen-NYS Dutch Colonies Ohio Valley Sorry about that. ____ Nancy Lohbrunner [email protected]

-- [ From: Nancy Lohbrunner * EMC.Ver #2.5.3 ] -- There is a new mailing list for anyone researching Roll/Rall surname, any spelling. To subscribe, send a message to: [email protected] (for mail mode) or to [email protected] (for digest mode) In the text of the message enter the word subscribe and nothing else. Remember to turn off your signature file, if you have one. You will receive instructions for subscribing, unsubscribing, and posting messages.

-- [ From: Nancy Lohbrunner * EMC.Ver #2.5.3 ] -- I have sent messages to three of the lists that I belong to telling others about our ROLL list. Sent a cc of it to our list. If you belong to some of the other "state" or "place" lists, could you also place a message, maybe we can pick up a few more members. Please let the ROLL list know what lists you will be advertising on so there will not be duplicates. Some of the members from our old list have not moved to Rootsweb, if you are still in contact with one of them, please tell them we miss them.

Dear Members of the Roll Family List, My Roll Family Genealogy Windmill has some new additions at... http://members.aol.com/whroll "The Old Fort in New York," a September 28, 1872, article from Appleton's Journal about Fort Amsterdam on Manhattan Island has been available on my Web pages a few weeks. I've added a new article, "Old New York," from the December, 1878, issue of Appleton's Journal. C. H. Jones reviews the then recently published book, "History of the City of New York," by Martha J. Lamb. For a book review, this article contains an amazing amount of history concerning New York during the Dutch colonial and pre-Revolutionary British period. I'm transcribing a new article, "Antiquities of New York," which appeared in the August, 1869, issue of "Catholic World." The author reviews the recently published book "Laws and Ordinances of New Netherlands," compiled and translated by E. B. O'Callaghan. The book review contains a portion of the Dutch colonial documents from the book. If you don't have access to the Web, I'd be glad to email you the text of the articles. My Genealogy Links page contains a few additional resources for researchers. Some of the pages contain the "new look" for my Web site. I would welcome comments about font sizes in the display (too large, too small, or just right?) and the general appearance of the pages in your browser, as different browsers display the pages differently. America Online's browser has the annoying feature of displaying all fonts one size larger than normal and fuzzying the graphics. All I have for testing purposes is Netscape 3.0 and AOL's brand of Microsoft Internet Explorer. A hint for those of you that have Web pages of your own...several browsers have the capability of viewing the source html (hypertext markup language) of Web pages. You can also view the html by saving the page and loading it into a word processor. I study what others have done with their pages, and learn new techniques from them. No fair copying, though...it's all copyrighted even if it doesn't say so. An incredible amount of work goes into a GEDCOM/HTML update, even though part of it is performed by conversion software. So I don't have my update ready yet. My hometown is Blythe, California, and there is a page about it at the Windmill, if you're interested. -Bill _______________________________________________________________ William Henry Roll Blythe, California [email protected] The genealogy of the ROLL, MANGEL and VAN WOGGELUM families on the World Wide Web at http://members.aol.com/whroll "A thousand candles have burned themselves out; yet I read on."

Hi, The reason I have Elizabeth (Sickles) Roll is because it was already researched by someone else and I did not change the name until I saw proof that the name was not Sickles. I've seen the name Stickland and Strikhausen but nothing positive. It will not only be my records that will have to change but, at least, 4 other researchers and I will not change anything until I am certain that I am wrong. The name may very well be what several of you have and I am wrong but until I see the proof, I will leave it as it is and you will all have to bear with me. Silas Roll, 12th child of Matthias & Mary (Rutan) Roll, was a Physician. Notation at the bottom of this page reads: Silas Roll was a Physician. He was born in Ohio, buried in Oxford Twp., Cemetery. Fannie (Wilson) Roll is buried in Ross Cemetery, Millville, Ohio. Mary Martha (Moore) Roll was the daughter of Alexander and Mary (Obison) Moore of Butler Co., Ohio. Your names are as I have them on my page. John W. & William Thomas were the children by the first marriage. Children by the 2nd marriage were: Mary, Anne Eliza, Winfield Scott, Margaret Ellen. I have got to get a scanner. I can send these pages instead of typing it again. Then, some of you can send it back to me Gedcom Files. My records are open to anyone. I don't worry about anyone publishing. Maybe Marguerite Roll did. I have a lot of information on the Roll Family but there's a lot missing and plenty that needs to be done. Nancy did a good thing by getting this group together. It will add a lot to my records and I hope that my records will help other people, looking for their ancestry. By the way, Marguerite Roll never used that name except on the inside of her letters. On the Envelope, It was always, Mrs. Lyle C. Roll. She only signed the letter Marguerite. She, evidently, had a good marriage. Best to you, Martha

Sorry Andy, But I for one would not feel comfortable doing a search for someone else on GenServ. To access the information that the subscriber have placed there you do need to send in a GEDCOM. It needed be all of you line, but should probably have some substance. It cost a $1 a month, payable as $12 a year to belong to GenServ, and therefore be able to search the data base. One big plus is the that name of the submitter, their address and e-mail is printed with each search. So whatever you submit will be known as your work. It is easy then to make contact with the submitter. Kathleen Rizer Archivist for the 10,000 Descendants of Dennis Springer and Ann Prickett your query Subject: Help with Gedcom/GenServ? Can someone please help Me?! I have no genealogy programs that produce Gedcom files. I researched all of my genealogy before I ever sat in front of a computer. Does anyone out there know anything about GenServ? I did a free sample search and found that someone has information on my Grandmother's maternal Grandparents. Now I have no way to access it. Is there anyone willing to do this for me?!?Andy Reed ------------------------

Bill, I don't really know of any link from the Roll family to the Norris family, although there may be one. I just added some links on my webpage to help people find family websites that deal with Essex/Union County families. They may or may not be related. Was my webpage difficult to navigate, or was it some other ? If so I'll try to fix it... Take care. I really enjoy the Roll list! Dave

At 12:43 AM 11-04-1997 EST, you wrote: >Bill, > >I don't really know of any link from the Roll family to the Norris family, >although there may be one. I just added some links on my webpage to help >people find family websites that deal with Essex/Union County families. They >may or may not be related. Was my webpage difficult to navigate, or was it >some other ? If so I'll try >to fix it... Take care. I really enjoy the Roll >list! > >Dave > Dave, Ok. I thought there must be a link, because the Norris Families in America Web site has a link to my Roll Family Genealogy Windmill. There must be a reason for that. I'll email the owner. Great, I'll take a look at your new links. No...it was another site that's difficult to navigate, the The Norris Families in America Web site that you have linked. There are an awful lot of choices, and when you are not familiar with the family, it's hard to know where to look. -Bill _______________________________________________________________ William Henry Roll Blythe, California [email protected] The genealogy of the ROLL, MANGEL and VAN WOGGELUM families on the World Wide Web at http://members.aol.com/whroll "A thousand candles have burned themselves out; yet I read on."

The following is all the Wilson, Franz and Roll book shows for Jonathan Smith Roll. Page 133. "Third child of Wesley and Ann Smith Roll, b 3/3/1828 near Westfield, Union County, New Jersey, d 3/10/1904 in Elizabeth, Union County, New Jersey, BD in Evergreen Cemetery of that city. M 9/4/1851 Lucinda, daughter of Capt. Kidd, b 1/16/1834 and d 12/6/1902 in Elizabeth, Union County, New Jersey, and is buried in Evergreen Cemetery of that city. They lived in Elizabeth, Union County, New Jersey, the greater part of their lives with the exception when they resided in Ovid, Senaca County, New York. During his life Jonathan Smith Roll followed the trade of a stone mason. Issue: John, d in inf., Joseph Hedges, Annie Lucinda and William Henry." Nancy

Jonathan Smith Roll 1828-1904 was the son of Wesley Roll 1801-1855 and Anne Smith 1802-1872. His grandparents were John Roll 1765-1810 and Mary Earl 1768-1852. Jonathan Smith Roll married Lucinda Kidd in 1851. You'll see the Kidd/Roll Bible pages on my web page http://members.aol.com/RLCww/kidd-so.html.

Who was the father of Jonathon Smith Roll? Nancy

I have seen Roll as Rall or Rawl and that is about it, but who knows what happened when a poorly educated town clerk took info from someone who might have had an accent of some type. How far back can you trace your ancestors and from what area? Nancy

Doe anyone know if ROLLINS and/or RAWLINGS is an offspring of ROLL? [email protected]

Bill, Actually, the Family Bible records come from the Gen Society of NJ. I don't know who owns the original Bible (maybe they do or maybe they have photocopies only). Since the original inscribers of the Bible are long since dead, it's not a copyright issue. I certainly don't own a copyright to it, so you can keep it on your page. The U.S. copyright law was rewritten in 1978. According to the "New York Public Library Desk Reference": "Works created before 1973 are protected for 28 years from the time they were first published. The copyright may be renewed for an additional 47 years. Works created since the beginning of 1978 may be copyrighted for the life of the author plus 50 years after his or her death. For works made for hire, and for anonymous and pseudonymous works (unless the author's identity is revealed in Copyright Office records), the term is 100 years from creation or 75 years from first publication, whichever period is shorter...." "However, anyone may make fair use of copyrighted material. The definition of this term depends on who is using the material, how much is used, the percentage of the entire work that the excerpt used constitutes, the purpose of the use, and the effect such use may have on the ability of the copyright holder to derive income from his or her creation...." For more information, contact Register of Copyrights, The Library of Congress, Washington, DC 20557. Fortunately, many records we use come under "public domain." A Freedom of Information Act request gives us access to government records. ---Robin

"A New Jersey Biographical Index" by Donald Arleigh Sinclair lists the following articles: * Baltus Roll (c1770-1831), "New Jersey History" (NJ Hist Soc mag) v.80:p.111-115 * J Martin Roll (b. 1843) "History of Trenton" by Francis B Lee 1895 v.2:p.75 with pic; "Manual of the Legislature of NJ" 96:p253 & 97:p278 * Joseph Harrison Roll (b. 1888) "History of Union County" by A Van Doren Honeyman 1923 v3:p221 Wilbur M Roll (b. 1866) "Manual of the Legislature of NJ" 25:340 No listings of Mangels, etc.

Dear Members of the Roll Mailing List, A tidbit: I was reading an article in "NEA Today" (a teacher-oriented journal). The author stated that email is protected by the copyright law, and is the property of the sender. It can not be published without the permission of the sender, according to the article. I was not aware of this provision. In fact, I thought the opposite to be true. Well, you learn something new every day! -Bill =============================================================== William Henry Roll ~ Blythe, California ~ [email protected] ROLL Family Genealogy on the WWW: http://members.aol.com/whroll Researching the genealogy of the ROLL-MANGEL-WOGGELUM families "A thousand candles have burned themselves out; yet I read on." ===============================================================

At 08:37 PM 10-30-1997 -0500, [email protected] wrote: >"A New Jersey Biographical Index" by Donald Arleigh Sinclair lists the >following articles: > >* Baltus Roll (c1770-1831), "New Jersey History" (NJ Hist Soc mag) >v.80:p.111-115 >* J Martin Roll (b. 1843) "History of Trenton" by Francis B Lee 1895 v.2:p.75 >with pic; "Manual of the Legislature of NJ" 96:p253 & 97:p278 >* Joseph Harrison Roll (b. 1888) "History of Union County" by A Van Doren >Honeyman 1923 v3:p221 >Wilbur M Roll (b. 1866) "Manual of the Legislature of NJ" 25:340 > >No listings of Mangels, etc. > Dear Robin, Thanks. I have I have NJ Historical Society, 80:111-115 on order, should be here in a day or two. I have removed ~your~ Jonathan Smith Roll family bible from my Web page, and provided a link to the coresponding page on your site. Shouldn't have put it up without your permission. Sorry. -Bill =============================================================== William Henry Roll ~ Blythe, California ~ [email protected] ROLL Family Genealogy on the WWW: http://members.aol.com/whroll Researching the genealogy of the ROLL-MANGEL-WOGGELUM families "A thousand candles have burned themselves out; yet I read on." ===============================================================