Hi everyone Bill Wright and I have taken the discussion of Philip Geene, of Exeter off line. We have tumbled onto new information, and the end result is we don't know!!! If any one else is interested in this "Greene" discussion, we can always put it back onto the group. I had to send some documents for Bill to look at and of course, you can't send attachments to the list. We are both long established researches, but sometimes, other's can see what you cannot, especially when you are very close to the subject. Thank heavens for this list, or I would not have found what I did, and wouldn't have found Bill! Bonnie (Baker) Weber