Indeed, Gene has stated the question eloquently: "...where do we go from here?" First, I hope to do an annual summary of statistics and such for the new year. Having said that, a few observations if I may in initial response to Gene's query. For most of us, the DNA study has been more than successful, but in as much as it has enlightened us about various lineages, confirmed suspicions, and has related people who didn't know that they were related, Gene reflects a little disappointment in his eloquent soliloquy. For many of us, the illusive brick wall or question that prompted initial participation still remains. I still can't get beyond my Francis, actually I'm still looking for confirmation to Francis. Don't know more than I knew before, except that my DNA is good back to Francis youngest son. I still need a donor from another line. It will come. But, through contacts and help from the group, my data base and research has expanded exponentially from what I could have gathered otherwise. I am extremely blessed and grateful for meeting all of you - related or not. But I have a direction, and sooner or later the descendants of Group 2 Samuel, and Charles Harrington Queen, and those claiming such, and the descendants of my Francis - that would be me - are going to have to do some serious talking and testing and running down descendants down other lines. Samuel's descendant sits there all alone, DNA unconfirmed, and despite the best research documenting a line of descent, the DNA begs for confirmation, because circumstantial evidence is increasingly leading my group to explore descent from this group of English Queens that settled in what is now the Washington DC area of Maryland. We are both going to have to collaborate to find a descendant from a distinct ancestor down a different line to see whether we can refine this "Maryland" connection once and for all. Gene and many of the Group 1 Queens still can't knock down the thin tar-paper wall that separates them from Old William and each other. But they can hear each other clearly, smell the smoke from the pot-bellied stove in the other room, and hear the distant voices of common ancestors calling - and the pig-path to papa is unfolding before them. They just need a key to open the gate. It will come! The Charles group is coming along slow but nicely. They seem to be in control of their destiny, and I think are finding links into the Quinn study. Some updates along that line would nice. In fact, I think each Group or person representing a distinct haplogroup in the study ought to provide a summary of where they are and what they know at this point. Present and future researchers would benefit. We still have a few stragglers trying to make sense of their DNA. In some cases, the explanations are becoming clear. In other cases, more work needs to be done. We have realized that, even with an unusual yet straightforward name like "Queen," there is a lot of diversity in our origins. Similarities get explained through convergence and transmogrification - I just love big words! Quinn becomes Queen, Queen becomes Quein, McQueen becomes Queen, McOwen, McEwen and Coyne become Queen, Quin, Quinn, Quean, Gwinn, Guinn, and so on. We have learned that some Queens have become Poor, and some who started out Poor, ended up Queens, and most certainly the richer for it! None of us should be disappointed in the DNA results. The DNA is truth. It may not have been what one was looking for, but it points us in the right direction. Only our interpretations are suspect. And oh what we have learned about the behavior of DNA. Like Roger Clemons, we often don't what pitch is coming next - curve ball, fast ball, slider - sucker ball - outside corner, high and inside. We keep swinging - a few out of park. But each time we get up to bat, we know we have seen his pitches before. That knowledge, and a swift kick in the rear, ought to help many of us down the road to ancestral enlightenment. So, where do we go from here? Well, while we keep diligently moving along our current path, there are a few areas that offer promise. 1) Deep ancestral origins. Within each persons results, one can see the building blocks of the ancestral origins of the male YDNA. I am looking at my 25 marker matches and most of what I see are names grounded in English origin. More and more, and my research is leading me in this direction, I am coming to accept the fact the my "Queens" originated from England, perhaps along the Scottish and Welsh frontier areas. Each of the DNA study participants has the ability to look at the surnames and origins of matches at the 25 marker level. Most of the names are not related in the recent genealogical past, but share a common ancestor between 700 and 10000 years or so ago. This is pretty cool. 2) Coordination and integration with other similar surname studies, including Quinn, McQueen, etc. Within each of these groups, we do have some individuals who are cross-matching on the same alleles being tested, whether it be FTDNA, Relative Genetics, or another testing group. This coordination may need to occur at a level higher than the individual testing company's desire and capability. Gene, Scott Kendall and I have dabbled a bit with this for McQueen and Quinn over the past year or so, but I think that even as we find segregation within our own Queen study at FTDNA, we may find interesting clues by looking at all the tests on a macro level. And consolidation and display of results and information on a group of people sharing similar sounding surnames should prove interesting. 3) For some of us, there will be new panels of tests offering clues to general ethnic ancestry coming on the market - often referred to as admixture tests, these results can generally answer questions about all the other DNA that isn't YDNA or MTDNA. 4) Test prices are dropping and testing panels are expanding. It would be good to urge all the testing companies to offer reasonable priced testing to bridge the gaps between FTDNA and Relative Genetics for instance. More and more, even though the free marketplace has forced prices to drop or services to expand in competition, we don't want to end up with tests so far removed that we have a BETA/VHS crisis in the ancestry testing area. 5) We have to encourage the European descendants of the brothers and sisters of our ancestors who were too afraid to get on the boat, or didn't need to run from the hangman's noose, to get interested in testing. Because sooner or later, as genetic testing heats up, we are going to find matches with distant relatives - and that will help some of us do an end-run around the old brick wall. 6) We have to convince some of the confirmed descendants of the Royal families, whether it be the current Monarch, or Charles, Henry, to get tested. Cause I just know that the reason I match so few people with a rare DNA type is a direct result of all those royals inbreeding and keeping the DNA isolated. I feel the Royal blood coursing through my veins. Certainly, one of the descendants of the Tudors, Four Doors, or Stuarts would want to claim and meet an American relative, don't you think! Well, enough for now. I can tell your eyes are glazing over, or is that just the New Year's ham! Got to get the brisket going. I'll be around later! Rolla When replying to a digest post, quote only the specific text to which you are replying, removing the rest of the digest from your reply. Also, remember to change the subject of your reply so that it coincides with the message subject to which you are replying. TO VIEW PREVIOUS EMAILS BY SUBJECT, GO TO THE THREADED ARCHIVES AT http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/listowners TO VIEW PREVIOUS EMAILS BY DATES AND SUBJECT GO TO THE SEARCHABLE ARCHIVES AT http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/listowners > http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen/DNA/queenmarker.htm > > http://www.familytreedna.com/public/queenDNA/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to QUEEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.28/604 - Release Date: 12/26/2006 12:23 PM