Anyone have and willing to fax or mail a photocopy of actual subject Will - not a transcription? The Will will be appreciated as I'm still troubled by the reading of the transcription. Thanks, Gene '

The name was "Mary" Lou, not Betty Lou Soesbee. Thanks to all who assisted or tried to assist. Mary Lou passed away about 8 years ago, but I did speak with her widowed husband late today. He gave me the necessary clues to find the links I was seeking. Here's how lineage appears to come together from census reports and/or other clues for apparent sister and brother Olivina Queen and James Smith Queen Wm Lewis Queen, Jr. ...Olivina Queen (b. ca 1810) ......John Montraville Queen, Sr. (b. 5-1830) .........Mary Queen (b. ca 1856) m. Joseph P. Morrow ............Robert Creighton (sp?) Morrow (b. 1888 d. 1971) ..............Mary Lou Morrow (b. ca 1915 d. ca 1997) Wm Lewis Queen, Jr. ...James Smith Queen (b. 1819) .....John Merritt Queen (b. 1848 d. August 1934 per tombstone) ........Harriett Queen (b. ca 1879) m. William A. Smathers In her 1984 letter, a copy acquired by me, Mary Lou states that: 1. John Montraville Queen was her g. grandfather. Check. 2. John Montraville was an out-of-wedlock son of Olivina. 3. Olivina's father was Wm. L. Queen, Jr. (d. of William listed on 1832 marriage bond to Ross Carter) 4. An "aged Queen man (John)" lived on Balsam Mountain above the Beta community and visited the family when Mary Lou was "quite young". The family referred to him as "cuz". She also mentioned John Merritt Queen's daughter, Harriet Queen Smathers. Mary Lou would have been about age 19 when John Merritt Queen died. I'd certainly appreciate any additional clues linking James Smith Queen to Wm L. Queen, Jr.; still, I'm now ready for the YDNA results of a descendant of James Smith Queen to arrive. Gene

Today while visiting her great-grandmother, I asked the 16 yr old daughter of my niece to ask mom the name of mom's mother and grandparents. (Until age 12, Mom lived with her grandparents.) Heather asked and mom replied that her mother was Ellen Elizabeth and that her grandparents were Abraham Moses Young and Sara Young. Today Heather heard her g.grandmother speak the names of Heather's g.g.g.grandparents. The names clearly known by a woman who, for the first 12 years of her life, lived with a man born in 1852 and a woman born in 1856. Are those of us who really know or knew our parents, grandparents, etc. speaking and sharing those names and fond memories from our lips to our children and grandchildren? Should we be doing so? Gene

For those interested in Julius A. Queen and Amanda Crotts Queen. According to the new birth index for North Carolina Birth Index 1800-2000 on Ancestry.com the following children were listed under this couple. Donie Alice Queen w- f- 4 May 1898 Willie Octavia w-f- 23 Aug 1899 Thomas Franklin Queen w-m- 15 Oct 1901 (on Thomas they had the father’s full name Julius Alexander Queen on some places they Amanda down as Amanda D. or Amanda L.) Lillie Ann Queen w-f- 30 July 1904 Lucy Bell Queen w-f- 4 Aug 1906 These children were all born in Cleveland County. Could have been Caesar. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Anyone have any info regarding the lineage of this lady back to her g. grandfather, John Montraville Queen, son of Olivina Quen and James R. Love? Anyone have any ancestral or descendant info regarding James R. Queen (1859-1917) and Medora Shelton? All assistance appreciated. Thanks, Gene

A 1984 letter from a researcher/g.grandau of John Montraville Queen, son of Olivina Queen and James R. Love includes this: I just remembered an aged Queen man (John) who lived on Balsam Mountain above the Beta Community. When I was quite young, he visited us, and my folks called him "Cuz" (cousin). I believe there was a Harriett in his family. (perhaps married a Smathers) This is someone my dad (1888-1971) used to visit. OEQ: The John Queen would have been John Merritt Queen (b. 1848 d. 1934), son of James Smith Queen. John M. had a dau, Harriett who married a Smathers. Additional comments from the letter: Olivina, herself was born about 1807-10. She had a sister Rebecca and (prob.) a brother Harmon or Hiram who married Polly Brock in 1824. I will mention James R. Queen and his wife Medora Shelton who are buried in Olvina's family plot here in Haywood. His dates are 1859-1917, and he is probably the son of Hiram and Polly. OEQ: Looking for strong evidence of children of Wm Lewis Queen, Jr. Gene

An old note from Olin "Tater" Ensley of Sylva, NC (Aug 1983) by way of Bob Moody. May be of interest to researchers of subject family: Lawson Queen was a boy that Grandma and Grandpa (Sims W. & Margaret H. Queen Ensley) raised or partly raised. He was some of Grandma's folks, but I can't tell you exactly. He was born May 22, 1880. I can remember his coming to Grandmas, and he died in August, 1946. Madge and Aunt Eva and Hubert and some of them went to his funeral in Tenn. He was a revenue officer for years. Got shot up bad one time and Grandma and Grandpa worried themselves sick about him. They thought for days he wouldn't make it but he got better and lived a long time after that, but he was crippled from that. OEQ: Lawson was apparently the son of Margaret's brother, Rev. Thomas Henson Queen, and his first wife Elizabeth Jane Ensley who died before 1887. Henson remarried in 1887. Margaret and Thomas Henson were children of James Smith Queen (1819). Gene

Still looking for any proof of the names of one or more children of subject. Wm. L. Queen, Jr. (b. ca 1774 (d. ca 1822) ? Son below???? James Smith Queen (b. 1819) (d. 1893) ..Wilson E. (b. 1861) (d. 1928) married Amanda Queen (1865-1900) of a branch of my lineage .....Bascome Queen (b. 1892) (d. 1971) .........Maisie Queen (b. 1917) James Smith Queen would not have known his father as an adult. However, he could have been told and remembered the name. Wilson, son of James S., would not have known his grandfather and would have learned no "first-hand" info from his dad regarding Wilson's grandfather. Bascome would be relaying info concerning his great-grandfather. This would have been info he learned from others. .........I'm looking for the best source of family folklore regarding Wm. Jr. It appears that it would have come from the lineage of a sibling of Jr. or one of the older children of Jr. - but not the James Smith Queen lineage. I find no documentary evidence that James Smith Queen was a son of Wm L. Queen, Jr. What are the best clues we have? Anyone? Thanks, Gene

Herbert N(ewton?) Queen [8/5/1894 - 2/4/1982] no spouse or children son of Aden Rucker Queen [12/22/1868 - 1/14/1644] and Martha Roenia Watkins son of William Allen Queen, Jr. [9/8/1837 - 10/4/1915] and Loucinda Rucker son of William Allen Queen, Sr. c. 1804 - bef 1880] and Mira Wilkerson possible son of James Queen [1777 - 1845] and so forth back to Old William ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:12 PM Subject: [QUEEN] Children of John ALbert Queen > OK family here are some questions. It appears that no one has dates for > the > first 8 children of John Albert Queen and Martha Jammerson So I ask > these > questions instead > Who does Herbert Queen bn Aug 5 1894 and died Feb 1982 in Rutherford Co., > NC > belong to? > Who does Roy Queen bn Oct 29 1908 and died Aug 1975 in Cleveland Co., NC > belong to? > Who does Clarence G. Queen bn July 7, 1914, and died June 13, 2001, in > Shelby, Cleveland Co., NC belong to? > Who does John W., Queen bn May 29 1904-died Jan 15 1988 in Rutherford, NC > belong to? > Could all of these be the Children of John Albert and Martha. Anyone with > insight help me fill in the gaps. > WEndy Peterson > > > ==== QUEEN Mailing List ==== > RootsWeb Threaded Mailing List archives > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ > QUEEN YDNA PROJECT > http://www.familytreedna.com/surname_join.asp?code=X96855&special=True > http://www.ysearch.org/ > > ============================== > Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the > last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx > >

OK family here are some questions. It appears that no one has dates for the first 8 children of John Albert Queen and Martha Jammerson So I ask these questions instead Who does Herbert Queen bn Aug 5 1894 and died Feb 1982 in Rutherford Co., NC belong to? Who does Roy Queen bn Oct 29 1908 and died Aug 1975 in Cleveland Co., NC belong to? Who does Clarence G. Queen bn July 7, 1914, and died June 13, 2001, in Shelby, Cleveland Co., NC belong to? Who does John W., Queen bn May 29 1904-died Jan 15 1988 in Rutherford, NC belong to? Could all of these be the Children of John Albert and Martha. Anyone with insight help me fill in the gaps. WEndy Peterson

Slightly off subject is the name Jammerson. In my opinion the name is an obvious back woods spelling of a more common name that has become accepted. Consider my GGreat grandfather Jameson (Jamison) Queen b.1818 Or the surname Jamison that you see in the Queen/Marsham line. Don Queen ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:12 AM Subject: [QUEEN] Children of John ALbert Queen > OK family here are some questions. It appears that no one has dates for > the > first 8 children of John Albert Queen and Martha Jammerson So I ask > these > questions instead > Who does Herbert Queen bn Aug 5 1894 and died Feb 1982 in Rutherford Co., > NC > belong to? > Who does Roy Queen bn Oct 29 1908 and died Aug 1975 in Cleveland Co., NC > belong to? > Who does Clarence G. Queen bn July 7, 1914, and died June 13, 2001, in > Shelby, Cleveland Co., NC belong to? > Who does John W., Queen bn May 29 1904-died Jan 15 1988 in Rutherford, NC > belong to? > Could all of these be the Children of John Albert and Martha. Anyone with > insight help me fill in the gaps. > WEndy Peterson > > > ==== QUEEN Mailing List ==== > RootsWeb Threaded Mailing List archives > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ > QUEEN YDNA PROJECT > http://www.familytreedna.com/surname_join.asp?code=X96855&special=True > http://www.ysearch.org/ > > ============================== > Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the > last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.2/65 - Release Date: 8/7/2005 > >

Looks like there is no one in North or South Dakota named Queen (Utah too) Check out this map http://msn.ancestry.com/search/surnamepage.aspxln=Queen&html=a&sourceCode=14368

Rolla and Gene Don't mean to sound dumb like but what should I be digging up now. Another set of Queens other than Joseph B's line Group 1. From the Home of Jimmy and JoAnne Redmond Sr

Thank you Gene, for your rapid response. Again Gene is correct - a sample of "one" proves little or nothing - Correct me Gene, if there is more than one sample. Wonder why Samuel Queen's descendants are unwilling to participate in the DNA study? Is there a DNA study that relates to Scotch, English and/or Irish Royalty/ Nobility? I believe there was supposed to be some sort of big secret concerning the Samuel Queen family ........? Now I have to add to my "before we go there" list that at least circumstantial evidence must be found that "Old William" can not be the William Queen born to Samuel Queen and Katherine Marsham. This has always been my second choice and it would be my first choice if it was not the McQueen baptismal record and the McQueen-Lewis land transaction. James B. Hardin

Geez, I am the last one to ask what the next step is for Group 1 Queens. It seems to me that you have two primary directions to put your energy towards, and that any other directions that present themselves may be a fortuitous but unintended result. First, at last reckoning, I don't think that all these 21 participants who share either perfect or extremely close DNA sequences with Old William have successfully developed a family tree clearly demonstrating how all you guys are related. Seems to me as if you are all still looking at each other and scratching your heads. Perhaps a family reunion is in order. Seems to me that in the absence of any other clear direction for research, that should be job one. If you can't figure out how to make the connections, then all of you should be focused on identifying the choke points, and modern descendants, that could shed light on this family tree. I just gotta believe that the answers are staring back at you and perhaps you can't see the tree for the forest! Of course, that's easy for me to say, since my DNA don't match no-one yet! On the other hand, it don't not match no-one yet! I can still fantasize, but my days may be numbered. Second, the other direction is to follow the DNA trail to pre-Old William connections, by focusing on non-Queens who are showing up as close matches in 25 or 37 marker tests. Although the odds are most of these are sired by a male Queen after Old William, it is quite possible that some of them may be pre-Old William, and that these folks may have information that might be explanatory, or exculpatory (I like that word), when it comes to potential relationships between Old William, Samuel, or some other Queens. It would be great to identify willing Old Samuel Queen descendants that would be willing to participate in our study. The fact is that in all of our research, whether it be Old William or Francis, there have been tidbits of research or little factoids that may be made to appear to connect to Samuel in some way. We must do what we can to either confirm or dispel these connections one way or the other. Along those lines, has anyone in their research come across a series of newspaper articles written in the 1920s and appearing in the Washington Sunday Star, written under the nomiker of "The Roving Reporter," that alledgedly deals with the descendants of the Washington-Baltimore Queens, or other Queens? An early Francis Queen researcher named Rubie Queen believed that these articles established a firm connection between Francis and the Washington-Baltimore Queens. If someone knows something about these articles or might have copies, we Francis Queen researchers would sure be interested Getting copies from the Library of Congress is extremely expensive, and we have been unsuccessful in running these down through interlibrary loan so far. thanks Rolla http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen/DNA/queenmarker.htm http://www.familytreedna.com/public/queenDNA/ http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen -------Original Message------- From: [email protected] Date: 08/04/05 20:23:08 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [QUEEN] Samuel Queen William Queen Connection? Rolla and Gene Don't mean to sound dumb like but what should I be digging up now. Another set of Queens other than Joseph B's line Group 1. From the Home of Jimmy and JoAnne Redmond Sr ==== QUEEN Mailing List ==== GenConnect at Rootsweb http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/FamilyAssoc/Queen QUEEN YDNA PROJECT http://www.familytreedna.com/surname_join.asp?code=X96855&special=True http://www.ysearch.org/ ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - Release Date: 8/4/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - Release Date: 8/4/2005

--- Rolla Queen <[email protected]> wrote: > Walter, > > I would go ahead and share this with the rest of the > list. I am sure it > would be of interest to those tracing back to Old > William. > > thanks > > Rolla > > http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen/DNA/queenmarker.htm > http://www.familytreedna.com/public/queenDNA/ > http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Walter Queen > Date: 08/04/05 07:02:00 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Death: Timothy E. Queen - Asheville, NC > > Rolla, attached is a link to the Obituaries > Asheville > NC Citizen's Times New Paper. My Uncle Timothy Queen > passed Aug 1, 2005. Not sure if this is information > that is passed on through the Queen website but will > send in case it is useful. > > http://www.citizentimes.com/obituaries/obit.php?id=26551 > > The following is Uncle Tim's family linage. > > 1.Timothy Edward Queen > 2.Walter Patrick Queen > 3.Moses J Queen > 4.James C Queen > 5.Moses Queen > 6.William Lewis Queen Sr > > Walt Queen > Louisville, KY > > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - > Release Date: 8/4/2005 >

Pleased to report that FTDNA has now received the 3d sample representing the lineage of Reuben Queen of Montgomery County, NC. Looking forward to results in 8-10 weeks. Thanks to all who have helped with this one. Gene

James has posed the question: Am I correct in believing that the DNA project has proved "Old William" is not a descendent of Samuel Queen & Katherine Marsham? Gene's response: It is my opinion that we have not proven the absence of a connection. One sample from a reported descendant of Samuel of Maryland is a significant mis-match from the DNA of old William. However, are we certain that the sample is representative of Samuel? I'm not. More samples are needed - and there are plenty of living descendants of this Samuel - but none I've contacted will cooperate in the DNA study, thus I've stopped asking. Gene

Gene is quite correct. Until we can get a few more confirmation samples for the Samuel line, we cannot definitively rule out a connection between Old William and Samuel. However, based on current DNA results, their is no paternal connection between the descendant of Samuel and Group 1 Queens. At this point, the DNA only confirm that we have at least two distinct groups - those descendant from Old William, and those descendant from Charles. As for my Francis, we also cannot definitively prove there is no connection between the other groups. We can only say at this point that the modern descendants do not share the same paternal DNA as the Old WIlliam, Samuel and Charles lines. We need more participants from those lines. Based on documentary research, we may be able to speculate that based on modern DNA results and a lack of any documentary support for a connection in the past, that it is likely that these different Queen groups were not related. Otherwise, if the documents are vague, we can make no such definitive statement. But we are getting closer. Rolla http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen/DNA/queenmarker.htm http://www.familytreedna.com/public/queenDNA/ http://webpages.charter.net/rlqueen -------Original Message------- From: O Eugene Queen Date: 08/04/05 16:44:21 To: [email protected] Subject: [QUEEN] Samuel Queen William Queen Connection? James has posed the question: Am I correct in believing that the DNA project has proved "Old William" is not a descendent of Samuel Queen & Katherine Marsham? Gene's response: It is my opinion that we have not proven the absence of a connection. One sample from a reported descendant of Samuel of Maryland is a significant mis-match from the DNA of old William. However, are we certain that the sample is representative of Samuel? I'm not. More samples are needed - and there are plenty of living descendants of this Samuel - but none I've contacted will cooperate in the DNA study, thus I've stopped asking. Gene ==== QUEEN Mailing List ==== Visit Reiley Kidd's homepg to view Queen information compiled and catagorized by first name: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Bluffs/2864/ QUEEN YDNA PROJECT http://www.familytreedna.com/surname_join.asp?code=X96855&special=True http://www.ysearch.org/ ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - Release Date: 8/4/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - Release Date: 8/4/2005

Gene stated: "Lest we forget, it could be that old William, himself, was a child born out of wedlock to a female Queen.. But, we likely don't want to think about that possibility.. " Gene is absolutely right on both counts! Some "possibilities" are much harder to contemplate than others. Having said that, before we "go there" it is necessary to have at least circumstantial evidence that "Old William" is not the William MacQueen born 18 August 1716, son of Timithy MacQueen baptized in King George's parish, Prince George's County, Maryland Colony. Does anyone have a transcription of the baptismal record? I have not seen a reference to the "mother" connected with this record. If we get to the "go there's" (eg. somebody finds the grave of "William MacQueen born 18 August 1716, son of Timithy MacQueen, died young) then it would also be necessary to consider, it could be that old William, himself, was a child born out of wedlock to a female that was not a Queen - but his father was a Queen. I would tend to think this more likely . Both of these types of "out of wedlock births" happened in various branches and generations of our Queen family after ."Old William" Queen's time, people were not any different in nature during & before "Old William" Queen's time. Rolla - !. Do we have DNA info on the "John Queen married Mary Unknown" line Some believe he is the John MacQueen, born 9 October 1719, son of Timithy & Jane MacQueen; others have him born in County Donegal, Ireland - will was proved Sep. 9,1805 in Loudoun Co., VA? 2. Am I correct in believing that the DNA project has proved "Old William" is not a descendent of Samuel Queen & Katherine Marsham? James B. Hardin