Many early early records of Orange County, NC *were* lost. I believe those that remain are at the state archives rather than the Orange County Courthouse in Hillsborough. A query posted to the Durham-Orange Genealogical Society at http://www.ncgenweb.us/dogsnc/queries should reach someone who can say for sure... Jeff Palmer -----Original Message----- >From: Daniel W Treadway <treadway@netins.net> >Sent: Jan 26, 2013 12:53 AM >To: Dorothy Grimsley <dorothygrimsley@bellsouth.net> >Cc: quaker-roots@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [Q-R] Hannah Allen and Nicholas Barker > >On Fri, 25 Jan 2013 17:43:35 -0600 > "Dorothy Grimsley" <dorothygrimsley@bellsouth.net> wrote: >> I am a descendant of Hannah Allen b. 1741 and Nicholas Barker b. >> 1737. Trying to find date and location of their marriage. >> Any help would be appreciated. >> Thank you, >> Dorothy L. Grimsley > >Dorothy, > >A family listing for this couple appears on page 346 of volume 1 of >Hinshaw's /Encyclopedia of American Quaker Genealogy/ in the Section >for Cane Creek Meeting, North Carolina: Nicholas Barker, son of Daniel >& Elizabeth b 3-8-1737; Hannah Barker, dt John & Phebe Allen b >7-10-1741, Chester Co., Pa. The first child listed is Emey, b >1-19-1764 in Gulford County NC. > >Supposing the bride must have been 18, that puts the marriage in a >range from about 1759 to 1763. I'm guessing 1761 or 1762 are the most >likely. > >On page 373 of the same volume I see that Nicholas Barker is taken >into membership on 1760,9,6. On 1764,8,4, Hannah Barker, (formerly >Allen) is reported to have mou (married out of unity). This date is >not the date of the wedding; it is when the wedding came to the >attention of the meeting. > >Now I'm thinking 1863 is a more likely year for the wedding. This >couple clearly valued their Quaker membership, or we would not have >seen their children listed. Why get married outside meeting, then? > To get married in meeting requires a request to the meeting at one >monthly business meeting. At that meeting a committee would be >appointed to investigate "clearness", and report back to the next >month's business meeting. So at a minimum, the time from deciding to >marry to being able to do it in meeting is more than four weeks. I >don't know colonial North Carolina law and custom at all well, but I'm >guessing a marriage before a minister or justice could be arranged in >a matter of days. If there's a baby on the way.... > >What this means is that the marriage was not a Quaker marriage, and >you will need to look elsewhere for a record of it. > >Cane Creek meeting Meeting is now in Alamace County, which was created >in 1849 from Orange County. Orange County was formed in 1752. Even >though all the children's births, beginning in 1764 are recorded as >having been in Guilford County, that county was not formed until 1770, >from parts of Rowan and Orange counties. So, if the the marriage is >recorded in civil records, it seems Orange County is the most likely. > The book I have says the Orange County court house burned in 1789, >but that marriage records begin in 1754. > >Now, with this search on WorldConnect > >http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=Search&includedb=&lang=en&ti=&surname=barker&stype=Exact&given=nicholas&bplace=&byear=&brange=0&dplace=&dyear=&drange=0&mplace=&myear=1763&mrange=1&father=&mother=&spouse=hannah+allen&skipdb=&period=All&submit.x=Search > >I find reports the marriage took place on 4 Aug 1762 at Holly Springs. >in Wake County. Wake county was formed in 1770 from Cumberland, >Johnston, and Orange Counties. > >Another one > >http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=cpugh1&id=I379 > >gives the same date, with the location being Orange County. this one >cites a source! /The Allen Family-Descendants of John and Amy Cox >Allen/ by Lester M Allen, Allen (pub 1987). It even says there's a >copy in the Randolph Public Library in Asheboro, NC. > >As I examine more online trees, I am beginning to fear nobody knows >this one. As I explained, the 4 Aug date recorded by Cane Creek is >not the date of the wedding. I suspect the 4 Aug 1762 date is simply >the same date moved back two years so as to be more than nine months >before the birth of the first child. > >Heres one >http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=clark-downey&id=I5007 >that the marriage was 25 Apr 1763 in Randolf [sic] County NC. No >source cited, but at least different from the rest. > >http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=punkinpetters&id=I487 >has 19 Jan 1763 in Randolph County. > >Randolph County was formed in 1779 from Guilford County, so the record >won't be in that courthouse. It still seems that if any civil record >exists, it will be in Orange County. The courthouse is in Hillsboro. > >I can't blame you for asking for help. Much good luck. > >-- >Dan Treadway >P. O. Box 72 Gilbert IA 50105 >treadway@netins.net >http://showcase.netins.net/web/treadway/