Hi - I think if you take out that first h you will find it, as Wilhelmstahl (there are two places by that name in Meyers-Orts gazetteer): 1. Dorf, Prussia, Schlesien (Silesia), district Oppeln, Landkreis, court and military districts in Ratibor, Standesamt; 772 people in 1910. Look in Poland or Austria now. 2. This is a train station in the same place as No. 1, see Rossnow. This is in the southern area, bordered on its south by what used to be Bohemia and Moravia. Look around Wroclaw today (formerly Breslau). Raciborz is the Polish name for Ratibor. Maureen Schoenky In a message dated 10/31/2009 10:23:35 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: While on the subject of 'other names for' might you be able to help me find another name for Whilhelmstahl, Russia? My Benjamin Huber's obituary gives that as his birthplace in 1887. I have not been able to find it in online searches. Thanks so much for any help you could provide. Helen ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

While on the subject of 'other names for' might you be able to help me find another name for Whilhelmstahl, Russia? My Benjamin Huber's obituary gives that as his birthplace in 1887. I have not been able to find it in online searches. Thanks so much for any help you could provide. Helen

Hi Brigitte, Thanking you for answering my Email. Anne -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Brigitte Jahnke Sent: Thursday, 29 October 2009 5:39 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names These places are: Lübben (Spreewald), south of Berlin and Gerswalde, Uckermark, north of Berlin Both are parts of the federal state Brandenburg. Brigitte --- On Wed, 10/28/09, Peter & Anne <[email protected]> wrote: From: Peter & Anne <[email protected]> Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names To: [email protected] Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:00 PM Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places please.? Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. Many Thanks Anne ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.698 / Virus Database: 270.14.37/2466 - Release Date: 10/29/09 06:39:00

Thank you so much for that David. I really appreciate your eloquence, as I have found it somewhat difficult finding information that is understandable, and not just a string of dates and heads of state that assume that you know what has gone before - especially for this Prussian area. I did indeed see your posting about the Register of Transients, and it was that correspondence that stirred my interest in this family again. It is a little frustrating for me, as I live 4 hours from my nearest LDS Centre in Rockhampton. (it is open infrequently anyway) I would be very extremely surprised if my ancestors were Catholic. My great grandmother was married in the Port Mackay Presbyterian Church, and my grandfather (her son) was Church of England. The parents (Theodor Frederick PASS & Albertine nee FRANTZ) of the family group that arrived, as well as one of their daughters were buried in the Lutheran Section of the Mackay Cemetery. Incidentally, this daughter Mathilde, is noted as being born in Sweden. As her parents were alive when she died just a year after their arrival, I am guessing that info is correct. Would you have any idea how a birth in Sweden would fit into the historical picture of that area? Theodor's (the father) occupation is given as Landmann on the shipping intelligence - a farmer, I expect - or said he was a farmer for emigrating purposes. On my great grandmother's Marriage Certificate it states her father was a "Licensed Drayman". So David, if I read what you have written correctly, we would not be talking about the same Luben, which for the purposes of the other posting was near Berlin - is that right? Again, many many thanks for your explanations. Estelle > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 11:13:06 +0900 > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > Estelle, > > In the distant pass, the Prussians were a Slavic people, but in the time period in which you are concerned, you're talking about Germans. Prussia was conquered by the Order of the Teutonic Knights in the Middle Ages. > > In 1618, the Elector of Brandenburg John Sigismund married the daughter of the Grand Master of the Order and united Brandenburg with the Duchy of Prussia. In 1701, the Holy Roman Emperor raised the Elector of Brandenburg to the status of a King and he took the title King of Prussia. The Kingdom of Prussia continued to expand as it acquired territory in other parts of "Germany", such as Silesia (1772), Westphalia, the Kingdom of Hanover (1866), The Duchies of Schlesvig-Holstein (1864). > > In the aftermath of the Franco-Prussian War (1871), the Kingdom of Prussia was able to achieve the unification of Germany with its King taking on the additional role of Emperor of Germany (Kaiser). Other German states that were part of this union which formed the German Empire included the Kingdoms of Saxony, Bavaria and Wurttemberg. The Prussian Chancellor, Bismarck, became Chancellor if the newly united Germany. He was also responsible for another German people, the Austrians, being excluded from the German Empire. > > Poland disappeared from the map of Europe as a result of being partitioned between the Kingdom of Prussia, the Russian Empire and the Austro-Hungarian Empire. > > Poland was re-established as an independent country in 1919 in the aftermath of the First World War. It was given a 'corridor' to the Baltic Sea to enable it to have it's own port to the outside world. This corridor was carved out of West Prussia. > > Thanks to Stalin, Poland was bodily shifted westward, as the then Soviet Union acquired territory in the aftermath of the Second World War. The modern day Russian enclave of Kaliningrad was until 1945 the north-eastern half of the German province of East Prussia, the south-western half becoming part of Poland. In 1945, Poland was also compensated for the loss of its eastern territories to the Soviet Union (modern day Ukraine and Byelorussia) by being German territory. This included Pomerania, Silesia, and parts of Brandenburg . Some 12 million Germans were expelled from these territories. > > So when you've got a mid-19th century record that states your family came from a place in West Prussia in 1873, that means it was a place in the Province of West Prussia, which was in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in turn was the leading state of the newly formed German Empire. They would have been citizens of the Kingdom of Prussia and by default citizens of the German Empire since 1871. I haven't checked the map, but the "Lubben near Berlin" would have been in Brandenburg, Pommerania or even Poznan, not West Prussia. > > With a surname like PASS, they're more than likely to be Germans not Poles, especially if they were Lutherans and not Catholics. The German word "Pass" being a pass, ie a mountain pass. > > If you haven't already done so, have a read of my posting of the 17th October concerning the Hamburg Police Register of Transients. The thread subject was "Town name diminutive question" and you'll find it in the list archives. > > David Armstrong > Maylands, > Western Australia > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Estelle Daniels > To: Prussia Mailing List > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 10:45 AM > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > > > Thanks for your reply David. > > Would it be right to speculate that my PASS family didnt like the Prussian affiliation with the Germans if they left for Australia in 1873? > > Further to the previous query, if West Prussia went to Poland, then "Luben" from where my family came is not one and the same as "Lubben" if that is near Berlin, as Bridget replied. > > Regards Estelle > > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:53:15 +0900 > > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > > > Estelle, > > > > Most if not all of West Prussia has been in Poland since the borders were re-arranged in 1919. Prior to that it was a province in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in 1871 took the dominant role in the German Empire, the King of Prussia also being the German Emperor or Kaiser. > > > > David Armstrong > > Maylands, > > Western Australia > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Estelle Daniels > > To: Prussia Mailing List > > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:31 AM > > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? > > > > Thank you > > Estelle > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Need a place to rent, buy or share? Let us find your next place for you! http://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/157631292/direct/01/

Estelle There is one researcher looking for PASS from Schrotz, Deutsch Krone at the Pommernkontakte! on the www.Deutsch-Krone.com<http://www.deutsch-krone.com/>website. Using Mapquest, Schrotz is located about 10 miles SE of Deutsch Krone [today: Wałcz]. Lüben is located about 10 miles NW of Deutsch Krone. My great grandmother's sister married a man born there ... Gustav Klemm. This family immigrated first to Australia in 1888 before coming to MN in 1893. Jane ND On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 7:31 PM, Estelle Daniels <[email protected]>wrote: > > Hello, > Excuse me for butting in here - but I have ancestors from "Lüben W. > Preussen" according to the Hamburg Passenger List for the "Herschel". My > PASS family disembarked at Port Denison (Bowen) in Queensland. > > Is this "Lüben" the same town/area that you have been referring to? > > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of > the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If > you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it > would be greatly appreciated. > > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now > Germany? > > Thank you > Estelle > > > Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 23:38:48 -0700 > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > > > > These places are: > > > > Lübben (Spreewald), south of Berlin > > > > and > > > > Gerswalde, Uckermark, north of Berlin > > > > Both are parts of the federal state Brandenburg. > > > > Brigitte > > > > --- On Wed, 10/28/09, Peter & Anne <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > From: Peter & Anne <[email protected]> > > Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > > To: [email protected] > > Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:00 PM > > > > Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places > > please.? > > > > Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. > > > > > > > > > > > > Many Thanks > > > > > > > > Anne > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get Hotmail on your iPhone Find out how here > http://windowslive.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=845706 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi My great-great grandparents [Friedrick Albert Holz & Auguste Wilhelmine Vierke] were married in 1862 at Lüben, Kreis Deutsch Krone, Prussia [today Lubno, Pilskie, Poland]. I have found their marriage record and her death record in the FHL film. Family history films for Germany, Preußen, Westpreußen, Lüben - Church records Kirchenbuch, 1757-1837<http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=titledetails&titleno=80857&disp=Kirchenbuch> Evangelische Kirche Lüben (Kr. Deutsch Krone) Kirchenbuchduplikat, 1860-1874<http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=titledetails&titleno=597529&disp=Kirchenbuchduplikat> Evangelische Kirche Lüben (Kr. Deutsch Krone) This might be another option for you to check especially since you mention Deutsch Krone. However, the closest I can find to Alt Zeithenhof is Zechendorf from a Deutsch Krone website http://www.deutsch-krone.de/. You may also be interested in this site if you have not yet visited it. http://www.deutsch-krone.com/ I don't locate your town in the Kartenmeister either http://www.kartenmeister.com/preview/databaseuwe.asp Jane ND On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 7:31 PM, Estelle Daniels <[email protected]>wrote: > > Hello, > Excuse me for butting in here - but I have ancestors from "Lüben W. > Preussen" according to the Hamburg Passenger List for the "Herschel". My > PASS family disembarked at Port Denison (Bowen) in Queensland. > > Is this "Lüben" the same town/area that you have been referring to? > > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of > the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If > you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it > would be greatly appreciated. > > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now > Germany? > > Thank you > Estelle > > > Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 23:38:48 -0700 > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > > > > These places are: > > > > Lübben (Spreewald), south of Berlin > > > > and > > > > Gerswalde, Uckermark, north of Berlin > > > > Both are parts of the federal state Brandenburg. > > > > Brigitte > > > > --- On Wed, 10/28/09, Peter & Anne <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > From: Peter & Anne <[email protected]> > > Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > > To: [email protected] > > Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:00 PM > > > > Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places > > please.? > > > > Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. > > > > > > > > > > > > Many Thanks > > > > > > > > Anne > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get Hotmail on your iPhone Find out how here > http://windowslive.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=845706 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks for your reply David. Would it be right to speculate that my PASS family didnt like the Prussian affiliation with the Germans if they left for Australia in 1873? Further to the previous query, if West Prussia went to Poland, then "Luben" from where my family came is not one and the same as "Lubben" if that is near Berlin, as Bridget replied. Regards Estelle > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:53:15 +0900 > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > Estelle, > > Most if not all of West Prussia has been in Poland since the borders were re-arranged in 1919. Prior to that it was a province in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in 1871 took the dominant role in the German Empire, the King of Prussia also being the German Emperor or Kaiser. > > David Armstrong > Maylands, > Western Australia > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Estelle Daniels > To: Prussia Mailing List > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:31 AM > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > > > Hello, > > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. > > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? > > Thank you > Estelle > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Need a place to rent, buy or share? Let us find your next place for you! http://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/157631292/direct/01/

Estelle, In the distant pass, the Prussians were a Slavic people, but in the time period in which you are concerned, you're talking about Germans. Prussia was conquered by the Order of the Teutonic Knights in the Middle Ages. In 1618, the Elector of Brandenburg John Sigismund married the daughter of the Grand Master of the Order and united Brandenburg with the Duchy of Prussia. In 1701, the Holy Roman Emperor raised the Elector of Brandenburg to the status of a King and he took the title King of Prussia. The Kingdom of Prussia continued to expand as it acquired territory in other parts of "Germany", such as Silesia (1772), Westphalia, the Kingdom of Hanover (1866), The Duchies of Schlesvig-Holstein (1864). In the aftermath of the Franco-Prussian War (1871), the Kingdom of Prussia was able to achieve the unification of Germany with its King taking on the additional role of Emperor of Germany (Kaiser). Other German states that were part of this union which formed the German Empire included the Kingdoms of Saxony, Bavaria and Wurttemberg. The Prussian Chancellor, Bismarck, became Chancellor if the newly united Germany. He was also responsible for another German people, the Austrians, being excluded from the German Empire. Poland disappeared from the map of Europe as a result of being partitioned between the Kingdom of Prussia, the Russian Empire and the Austro-Hungarian Empire. Poland was re-established as an independent country in 1919 in the aftermath of the First World War. It was given a 'corridor' to the Baltic Sea to enable it to have it's own port to the outside world. This corridor was carved out of West Prussia. Thanks to Stalin, Poland was bodily shifted westward, as the then Soviet Union acquired territory in the aftermath of the Second World War. The modern day Russian enclave of Kaliningrad was until 1945 the north-eastern half of the German province of East Prussia, the south-western half becoming part of Poland. In 1945, Poland was also compensated for the loss of its eastern territories to the Soviet Union (modern day Ukraine and Byelorussia) by being German territory. This included Pomerania, Silesia, and parts of Brandenburg . Some 12 million Germans were expelled from these territories. So when you've got a mid-19th century record that states your family came from a place in West Prussia in 1873, that means it was a place in the Province of West Prussia, which was in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in turn was the leading state of the newly formed German Empire. They would have been citizens of the Kingdom of Prussia and by default citizens of the German Empire since 1871. I haven't checked the map, but the "Lubben near Berlin" would have been in Brandenburg, Pommerania or even Poznan, not West Prussia. With a surname like PASS, they're more than likely to be Germans not Poles, especially if they were Lutherans and not Catholics. The German word "Pass" being a pass, ie a mountain pass. If you haven't already done so, have a read of my posting of the 17th October concerning the Hamburg Police Register of Transients. The thread subject was "Town name diminutive question" and you'll find it in the list archives. David Armstrong Maylands, Western Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: Estelle Daniels To: Prussia Mailing List Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 10:45 AM Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names Thanks for your reply David. Would it be right to speculate that my PASS family didnt like the Prussian affiliation with the Germans if they left for Australia in 1873? Further to the previous query, if West Prussia went to Poland, then "Luben" from where my family came is not one and the same as "Lubben" if that is near Berlin, as Bridget replied. Regards Estelle > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:53:15 +0900 > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > Estelle, > > Most if not all of West Prussia has been in Poland since the borders were re-arranged in 1919. Prior to that it was a province in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in 1871 took the dominant role in the German Empire, the King of Prussia also being the German Emperor or Kaiser. > > David Armstrong > Maylands, > Western Australia > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Estelle Daniels > To: Prussia Mailing List > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:31 AM > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names > > > > Hello, > > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. > > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? > > Thank you > Estelle >

Hello, Excuse me for butting in here - but I have ancestors from "Lüben W. Preussen" according to the Hamburg Passenger List for the "Herschel". My PASS family disembarked at Port Denison (Bowen) in Queensland. Is this "Lüben" the same town/area that you have been referring to? This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? Thank you Estelle > Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 23:38:48 -0700 > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > > These places are: > > Lübben (Spreewald), south of Berlin > > and > > Gerswalde, Uckermark, north of Berlin > > Both are parts of the federal state Brandenburg. > > Brigitte > > --- On Wed, 10/28/09, Peter & Anne <[email protected]> wrote: > > From: Peter & Anne <[email protected]> > Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names > To: [email protected] > Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:00 PM > > Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places > please.? > > Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. > > > > > > Many Thanks > > > > Anne > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Get Hotmail on your iPhone Find out how here http://windowslive.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=845706

Estelle, A quick if not terribly eloquent reply! Your family may well have been hungry when inspired to go to Australia in the 1870s. By then many already had friends or family who had emmigrated and were encouraging in their reports. These were difficult times in parts of Prussia with failed crops - and sons having a compulsory time in the army. Many Evangelicals/Lutherans once in Australia joined other Protestant Chruches if there was not a Lutheran Church handy. This happened in my father's family on the Darling Downs. However I was lucky that the first generation were extensively listed in the records of their new home - giving very helpful locations and dates of places of birth. If you are able to find something similar for your family it may help you work out where to start looking for ancestors in Europe. Without an accurate place name you could spend ages in futile searches. The changing borders of Europe are very confusing, especially to those outside Europe. You may also realise that after WII Poland effectively shifted west. This page explains things briefly yet clearly: http://donhoward.net/genpoland/genpoland/polhistory.htm And this little animation shows the changing borders of 'Germany': http://www.millenniacorp.com/_videos/centennia/centennia.htm Estelle, if you enter Luben (forget the umlaut) into http://www.jewishgen.org/communities/loctown.asp you will find a selection of possible locations in Germany and Poland - too many to try searching without knowing more about where your ancestors originated. These two have caught my eye so you may like to find maps of the region and become familiar with other place names to see if they show: Lüben, Lubin populated place 51°24' N 16°12' E E M U G Poland 213.0 miles WSW of Warszawa 52°15' N 21°0' E Lüben, Lubno populated place 53°20' N 16°21' E E M U G Poland 208.0 miles WNW of Warszawa 52°15' N 21°0' E And some nice older maps to look at: http://english.mapywig.org/news.php http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/digkonyv/topo/3felmeres.htm Search Queensland records extensively for further clues which should be lurking. Begin with the shipping list you have and see where others came from - sometimes whole communities moved. And I have just remembered this which might give you some historical 'insight': http://www.zgora.pl/muzeum/english/emigration.html Kind regards, Bronwyn. On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 1:45 AM, Estelle Daniels <[email protected]> wrote: > > Thanks for your reply David. > > > > Would it be right to speculate that my PASS family didnt like the Prussian affiliation with the Germans if they left for Australia in 1873? > > > > Further to the previous query, if West Prussia went to Poland, then "Luben" from where my family came is not one and the same as "Lubben" if that is near Berlin, as Bridget replied. > > > > Regards Estelle > >> From: [email protected] >> To: [email protected] >> Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:53:15 +0900 >> Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names >> >> Estelle, >> >> Most if not all of West Prussia has been in Poland since the borders were re-arranged in 1919. Prior to that it was a province in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in 1871 took the dominant role in the German Empire, the King of Prussia also being the German Emperor or Kaiser. >> >> David Armstrong >> Maylands, >> Western Australia >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Estelle Daniels >> To: Prussia Mailing List >> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:31 AM >> Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names >> >> >> >> Hello, >> >> This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. >> >> Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? >> >> Thank you >> Estelle >> >>

Estelle, Most if not all of West Prussia has been in Poland since the borders were re-arranged in 1919. Prior to that it was a province in the Kingdom of Prussia, which in 1871 took the dominant role in the German Empire, the King of Prussia also being the German Emperor or Kaiser. David Armstrong Maylands, Western Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: Estelle Daniels To: Prussia Mailing List Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:31 AM Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] "Lubben" other names Hello, This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? Thank you Estelle

Estelle, Sometimes links to Europe are found in different places. After many years of searching for my great-grandmother's home in Europe, I found it in the papers of her brother's descendants who had his baptismal record yet in a trunk. This gave me a place to start. So this was a third cousin link. Carol >

Can you be more specific? Which religion? What is the time frame? Al Muth -----Original Message----- From: Carol Duff <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Thu, Oct 29, 2009 10:00 pm Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] West Prussia As always, I have an interest in the locations of which we have access to records. If any records are available from Eichfier or Dolfußbruck West Prussia, I would like to know. Thanks. Carol > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

"Fuhrmann" translates as both Wagoner and Carter. The English word Wagon is of Norse origin and has supplanted the Anglo-Saxon word "Wain" (as in the famous painting "The Haywain"). Wagenfuhrer is a (wagon)driver. David Armstrong Maylands, Western Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: Veronica Malmberg To: [email protected] Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 9:30 PM Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] PRUSSIA-ROOTS Digest, Vol 4, Issue 216 Wagoner What is the German word for wagoner? I have Fuhrmanns in my research. Is that the same thing? Veronica > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2009 07:06:37 +0900 > From: "David Armstrong" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] What did a 'Wagoner' do for a living? > To: <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > A wagoner is the predecessor today's truck driver. > > David Armstrong > Maylands, > Western Australia > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David Stroebel > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 4:40 AM > Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] What did a 'Wagoner' do for a living? > > > Hello, > > Can anyone please tell me what a 'wagoner' did in > Baden-Wurttemberg around 1820 for a living and did it pay > well? > > Thanks very much > > Dave ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

As always, I have an interest in the locations of which we have access to records. If any records are available from Eichfier or Dolfußbruck West Prussia, I would like to know. Thanks. Carol >

Estelle Daniels wrote: > Hello, > Excuse me for butting in here - but I have ancestors from "Lüben W. Preussen" according to the Hamburg Passenger List for the "Herschel". My PASS family disembarked at Port Denison (Bowen) in Queensland. > > Is this "Lüben" the same town/area that you have been referring to? Are you sure? it is listed for two places, neither anywhere close there, in Kr. Gifhorn (Wittingen) and Kr. Luneburg (Nahrendorf), both in Niedersachsen and one in former Schlesien, now much in Poland and a bit in Czech Republic. > This is the town -"Alt Zeithenhof, Deutschkron, West Prussia" - that one of the daughters - my great grandmother is supposed to have been born in. If you have any knowledge of the whereabouts on the location of that town, it would be greatly appreciated. Are you sure the spelling is correct for Alt Zeithenhof?, because I couldn't find this in any way. > Am I correct in thinking that "W. Preussen" is West Prussia and now Germany? no, it is completely gone and is nearly 100 percent in Poland. Deutschkron - the correct spelling is Deutsch Krone in English > > Thank you > Estelle >

Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places please.? Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. Many Thanks Anne

What is the German word for wagoner? I have Fuhrmanns in my research. Is that the same thing? Veronica > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2009 07:06:37 +0900 > From: "David Armstrong" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] What did a 'Wagoner' do for a living? > To: <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > A wagoner is the predecessor today's truck driver. > > David Armstrong > Maylands, > Western Australia > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David Stroebel > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 4:40 AM > Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] What did a 'Wagoner' do for a living? > > > Hello, > > Can anyone please tell me what a 'wagoner' did in > Baden-Wurttemberg around 1820 for a living and did it pay > well? > > Thanks very much > > Dave

A wagoner is the predecessor today's truck driver. David Armstrong Maylands, Western Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: David Stroebel To: [email protected] Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 4:40 AM Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] What did a 'Wagoner' do for a living? Hello, Can anyone please tell me what a 'wagoner' did in Baden-Wurttemberg around 1820 for a living and did it pay well? Thanks very much Dave ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

These places are: Lübben (Spreewald), south of Berlin and Gerswalde, Uckermark, north of Berlin Both are parts of the federal state Brandenburg. Brigitte --- On Wed, 10/28/09, Peter & Anne <[email protected]> wrote: From: Peter & Anne <[email protected]> Subject: [PRUSSIA-ROOTS] another names To: [email protected] Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:00 PM Hi List, I would like to know is there another spelling to these places please.? Lubben Brandenberg Prussia and Gersealde Uckermark Prussia. Many Thanks Anne ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message