Have you tried looking at their death records? Maybe those list the parents names. Denise D'Antona In a message dated 11/14/2006 12:40:30 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gregobhte1@aol.com writes: Hi there.... im tracing my famil back and the most far that i got was with VASCO MONIZ DE MENEZES that married in 1684 Dona CRISPINA DE MENEZES. I just got an email from the Madeira archives saying that in their marriage certificate didnt show their parents names...so in that i dont know how to keep tracing back their parents if they dont appear in their cerificates.... anyone could help me in anyway please?? Thank you Leandro