Thanks for joining our DNA group. As the co-administrator I have seen your results. We are a small group, but as you may know Katherine has started to use Portuguese DNA studies such as the Beleza study to "widen" the group. I also believe (this is only my opinion) that we may find matches in the Spanish groups, specifically Galician and Castillian groups. I know Katherine is continuing her work in that area. There is also a newsgroup of Portuguese Jews and their descendants all over the world, which I belong to, which will enlighten our research. As Madeirans and descendants of Portuguese we have to remain open to all possibilities. The least known aspect of our common history is our Jewish history. That can also be said about our Moorish and African history. Have a good day. José -----Original Message----- From: ABREU III,LOUIS [mailto:labreu@cablespeed.com] Sent: June 6, 2006 2:45 PM To: PRT-MADEIRA-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PRT-MADEIRA] Madeiran archives website Jose, I have done the National Geographic DNA testing, my results are posted on the Madeira DNA site. I am the only one so far with my particular Haplogroup....which is very interesting. Lou On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 14:07:18 -0400 "Fernandes, Jose" <jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca> wrote: > Lou, > > I am not sure we should be stuck. Others may have a >different perspective and we shouldn't give up. > > In my opinion it will be hard to trace our families to >Portugal (mainland). That is if you believe in fairy >tales we all came from Minho and Algarve so that should >be easy. I am one of those that believe that our people >came from many places, including outside Portugal. DNA >testing may assist us in that but paper records will be >almost impossible. I am told that we only started keeping >parochial records in the late 17th century. There are >some before then but they didn't have to be registered. > > Also, the Madeiran Government has often requested that >Madeiran archives and other related documents be >transferred to the Regional Government from Lisbon. To >the best of my information this has been denied by the >Portuguese government. So if you want to do further >research you must go to the Torre do Tombo in Lisbon. > > Cheers, > José > > -----Original Message----- >From: ABREU III,LOUIS [mailto:labreu@cablespeed.com] > Sent: June 6, 2006 1:17 PM > To: PRT-MADEIRA-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PRT-MADEIRA] Madeiran archives website > > Mr. Fernandes, > I have run into the exact situations that you > describe, it is what has made the search for my >ancestors > both fun and frustrating. I have often wondered how you > could determine the who/what/when/where......but by your > posting I would say I am stuck with no hope of tracing > from the island to the mainland. > > Regards, > Lou > > On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 11:23:58 -0400 > "Fernandes, Jose" <jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca> > wrote: >> Bob, >> >> I can only share my experience as a native-born Madeiran >>who continues to have strong links to the region and >>opinions... >> >> Camacho is a well-know name in Madeira but in my opinion >>is not equivalent to Smith. Fernandes, Gonçalves, Freitas >>etc. are more common. >> >> Over 500 years of colonization many decisions have been >>made. Anything could happen and it did happen. Some by >>priests others by Portuguese officials. Surnames can be >>all over the place. The old Madeira was also very class >>based. Some names denoted upper class. Some families with >>common names and who became rich wanted to be different. >>Thus you have Pereira Camacho to distinguish from others. >>Sometimes, if you married "up", the children took the >>most "rich" name. Sometimes they added a "de" and >>sometimes that "de" was taken away by officials and >>priests. >> >> Although all Madeirans have somewhat related (DNA could >>prove that) not all surnames denote a common ancestor. >> >> Many don't want to talk about it, but we had slaves who >>took the owner's name. We had Jews and moors that changed >>names. Pereira, for example denotes Jewish ancestry. >>There was a time that some families used the common >>Spanish tradition of naming their children after their >>mother. Therefore you would be known by your mother's >>surname. There were many children of "rich men" who were >>not given the father's surname. Usually children of young >>(poor) women who worked for rich families. Therefore you >>have "pai incognito". Let me tell you that father was not >>unknown. Everybody knew it but they were not "allowed" to >>name him. >> >> Madeirans changed surnames. It was easy to do it. Money >>and influence could buy anything. >> >> In my opinion there are the Pereiras and then there are >>the Pereira Camacho famnilies. It would be interesting to >>find out when that started and what prompted it. >> >> I don't think I have added to your research but all of >>the best. >> >> José Fernandes >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >>From: BOBCAMSCPW@aol.com [mailto:BOBCAMSCPW@aol.com] >> Sent: June 5, 2006 11:04 PM >> To: PRT-MADEIRA-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [PRT-MADEIRA] Madeiran archives website >> >> thank you everyone for the information. I now have a >>question about my >> family in Madeira. When I was doing my research I was >>told by someone that also >> was doing research in Madeira that I would need to >>research everyone with the >> middle name of Pereira because they would be related to >>each other. Do you >> know if that is true or not. I was told that the Last >> name of Camacho is >> like Smith there are so many of them that why you could >>tell who is related to >> whom was by there middle name unless one of the women >>got married to another >> Camacho with a different middle name then you would have >>to research that >> name. >> The main reason I ask this is that I have done some >>research and found that >> most of the surname are all the same. Using either >>Joao, Jose, and so on, >> but everyone has had the middle name of Pereira and then >>Camacho. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> Bob Camacho >> Researching the islands of >> Terceira for da Costa, and Evangelho, >> Graciousa for Reis, and >> Madeira for Camacho >> >> >> >> ============================== >> Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your >>family and the >> areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the >>last 12 months. >> Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >> >> >> >> >> >> ============================== >> Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your >>family and the >> areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the >>last 12 months. >> Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >> > > > ============================== > New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search >for your ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with >family and friends. 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