Jose, I have done the National Geographic DNA testing, my results are posted on the Madeira DNA site. I am the only one so far with my particular Haplogroup....which is very interesting. Lou On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 14:07:18 -0400 "Fernandes, Jose" <jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca> wrote: > Lou, > > I am not sure we should be stuck. Others may have a >different perspective and we shouldn't give up. > > In my opinion it will be hard to trace our families to >Portugal (mainland). That is if you believe in fairy >tales we all came from Minho and Algarve so that should >be easy. I am one of those that believe that our people >came from many places, including outside Portugal. DNA >testing may assist us in that but paper records will be >almost impossible. I am told that we only started keeping >parochial records in the late 17th century. There are >some before then but they didn't have to be registered. > > Also, the Madeiran Government has often requested that >Madeiran archives and other related documents be >transferred to the Regional Government from Lisbon. To >the best of my information this has been denied by the >Portuguese government. So if you want to do further >research you must go to the Torre do Tombo in Lisbon. > > Cheers, > José > > -----Original Message----- >From: ABREU III,LOUIS [mailto:labreu@cablespeed.com] > Sent: June 6, 2006 1:17 PM > To: PRT-MADEIRA-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PRT-MADEIRA] Madeiran archives website > > Mr. Fernandes, > I have run into the exact situations that you > describe, it is what has made the search for my >ancestors > both fun and frustrating. I have often wondered how you > could determine the who/what/when/where......but by your > posting I would say I am stuck with no hope of tracing > from the island to the mainland. > > Regards, > Lou > > On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 11:23:58 -0400 > "Fernandes, Jose" <jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca> > wrote: >> Bob, >> >> I can only share my experience as a native-born Madeiran >>who continues to have strong links to the region and >>opinions... >> >> Camacho is a well-know name in Madeira but in my opinion >>is not equivalent to Smith. Fernandes, Gonçalves, Freitas >>etc. are more common. >> >> Over 500 years of colonization many decisions have been >>made. Anything could happen and it did happen. Some by >>priests others by Portuguese officials. Surnames can be >>all over the place. The old Madeira was also very class >>based. Some names denoted upper class. Some families with >>common names and who became rich wanted to be different. >>Thus you have Pereira Camacho to distinguish from others. >>Sometimes, if you married "up", the children took the >>most "rich" name. Sometimes they added a "de" and >>sometimes that "de" was taken away by officials and >>priests. >> >> Although all Madeirans have somewhat related (DNA could >>prove that) not all surnames denote a common ancestor. >> >> Many don't want to talk about it, but we had slaves who >>took the owner's name. We had Jews and moors that changed >>names. Pereira, for example denotes Jewish ancestry. >>There was a time that some families used the common >>Spanish tradition of naming their children after their >>mother. Therefore you would be known by your mother's >>surname. There were many children of "rich men" who were >>not given the father's surname. Usually children of young >>(poor) women who worked for rich families. Therefore you >>have "pai incognito". Let me tell you that father was not >>unknown. Everybody knew it but they were not "allowed" to >>name him. >> >> Madeirans changed surnames. It was easy to do it. Money >>and influence could buy anything. >> >> In my opinion there are the Pereiras and then there are >>the Pereira Camacho famnilies. It would be interesting to >>find out when that started and what prompted it. >> >> I don't think I have added to your research but all of >>the best. >> >> José Fernandes >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >>From: BOBCAMSCPW@aol.com [mailto:BOBCAMSCPW@aol.com] >> Sent: June 5, 2006 11:04 PM >> To: PRT-MADEIRA-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [PRT-MADEIRA] Madeiran archives website >> >> thank you everyone for the information. I now have a >>question about my >> family in Madeira. When I was doing my research I was >>told by someone that also >> was doing research in Madeira that I would need to >>research everyone with the >> middle name of Pereira because they would be related to >>each other. Do you >> know if that is true or not. I was told that the Last >> name of Camacho is >> like Smith there are so many of them that why you could >>tell who is related to >> whom was by there middle name unless one of the women >>got married to another >> Camacho with a different middle name then you would have >>to research that >> name. >> The main reason I ask this is that I have done some >>research and found that >> most of the surname are all the same. Using either >>Joao, Jose, and so on, >> but everyone has had the middle name of Pereira and then >>Camacho. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> Bob Camacho >> Researching the islands of >> Terceira for da Costa, and Evangelho, >> Graciousa for Reis, and >> Madeira for Camacho >> >> >> >> ============================== >> Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your >>family and the >> areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the >>last 12 months. >> Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >> >> >> >> >> >> ============================== >> Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your >>family and the >> areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the >>last 12 months. >> Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >> > > > ============================== > New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search >for your ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with >family and friends. Learn more: >http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=14599&targetid=5429 > > > > > > ============================== > Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not >only for > ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx >