Margaret, I am sorry, but you are completely wrong. :-)) MELLO (or Melo) and SILVA are villages. So, when you write "da Silva de Melo" (or "da Silva e Melo") it means that some ancestors were FROM those places. Any way, following the portuguese tradition, GENERALLY the father's name comes LAST (you wrote the oposite). You may have DA followed by the (FIRST) name of the mother when, for instance, the father is unknown. For instance: DA RITA (name of the wife of the former president of Portugal). But, please remember, that was LONG AGO (a couple of centuries ago..). NOBRIGA (or NOBREGA) doesn't mean noble! It may (or may not) come with a "DE" (from) because it's the name of a place. There are places (villages, parrishes, - Note: it's FREGUESIA, not FRAGAZIA...) with that name. The example you wrote (Jose Campos) is true (the origin of the name may have been a nickname). Even so, it means that those people came FROM, or lived IN the fields, so "DOS CAMPOS" is also correctly used. Luis de K. e W. :-) Lisboa-Portugal ---------------------- MENSAGEM ORIGINAL ---------------------- Jose' NIce e-mail and I know that the "de" means "from". I have found that in other islands the names use "de" and "da" to signify the mother and the fathers names. For instance. Joao da Silva de Mello. Silva the fathers paternal name and Mello the mothers. Nobriga means noble however like some names it is acquired. If the family lived in the "campo" then the name could be Jose da Souza Campos. In searching the records in the library you have to be very careful because you can very easily track the wrong family. Or search the wrong line. Very easy to do. Indeed the families worked the land and left their mark. They went to Hawaii, U.S.A., South America, Africa and India, China etc. Their ofspring have done well and owe it all to their ancestors. They are proving how great the Portuguese people were and are whether they came from one fragazia or another. Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 7:31 AM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website Margaret, We are surrounded by Nóbregas! Now the "de" added to the name got carried away in Madeira. I don't give it too much importance. It was added to show nobility and so on. I believe that most Madeirans come from hardworking families that worked the land. Wed all come from good families. I am proud of their achievements and their hard work. Our ancestors built Madeira from nothing. Even to work the land took creativity, courage and hard work. I believe that many families in Camacha came originally from Caniço and I encourage those researching families in Camacha not to forget about Caniço. For example you mention the Ornellas. By the late 15th century they already had extensive landholdings in Caniço. Many new colonists came to work in their farms (fazenda). Under the old "colonia" system they owned most of the land rights in Caniço until late in the 20th century. Have a nice day. José Fernnades -----Original Message----- From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Margaret Sent: January 17, 2007 6:02 PM To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website Jose: My mother in law was a deNobrega. Many use the name Nobriga however in Camacha I found that her family all were identified by the deNobrega. The original home was in Val de Paraiso and some of the later generation still live there. Some went to Hawaii about 1906-7 and later to the U.S. Many of the later generation have done very well in the U.S, Africa and Brazil. There is a branch in Brazil that is very famous in Radio, and T.V. Have been for many years and several are medical doctors. In the U.S. the grandchildren are also doing well in what ever endeaver they choose. Some have married into the Ornellas family and have Freitas and Gouveia cousins. The Africa connection went back to Madeira and is with the Portugese gorvernment. I say this because we are very happy with our connection to that part of the world. Our roots are good and strong. Thank you Madeira. Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website Didn't want to interrupt your conversation, but when you mention Caniço I am in! The Fernandes, in my case, have been in Caniço since the 16th century. We have married into all of the families, including De Freitas and Nóbrega. In fact my grandmother was a Nóbrega. This was the 3rd we married into the Nóbrega family. In Saudades da Terra, it is written that by the mid-17 century there barely 200 (mostly huts) in the whole parish. The families there were mostly interconnected. Now a note on Camacha that you may already know. Camacha was part of Caniço until the end of the Spanish regime. I believe around 1638 it became its own parish. I suspect many of the families were original settlers in Caniço, who gradually cleared more land up the mountain. So it was natural to have much intermarriage between the two parishes. I have that in my family. Another interesting note was that reading a British writer, she writes in the mid-18 century that in her opinion many of the people in Camacha who were blond and red haired may have descended from a Scottish battalion which was headquartered there during the British occupation of the island in and around 1807 and 1814. Anyway, if you doing any research on Caniço, please let me know. Have a nice day. José -----Original Message----- From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Denise1270@aol.com Sent: January 13, 2007 1:57 PM To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website Hi Margaret, I went to Camacha and we even brought back some of those wicker items. One of them is a beautiful picnic basket. It's a really nice town. My grandfathers sister was married to Luis de Nobrega but I believe he was from Canico not Camacha. I don't have any other info on his family. I know he had a brother that lived in Cambridge, MA at one time. My grandmothers family was from Sao Miguel, Acores, One of her uncles was married to Adelaide Cristina da Carmara d'Ornellas, she was from Sao Pedro, Funchal and her parents were Pedro Jose de Ornellas and Elena Augusta da Camara. She went to live in Sao Miguel. And I know she had a sister named Vicencia Julia da Camara d'Ornellas. The Ornellas are from a well off line. I understand there is a street or something named after them. My grandfather said we had family that went near Oakland, CA but we don't know who and they would be dead now. They were Freitas though. Denise In a message dated 1/13/2007 1:26:31 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, marpg2000@comcast.net writes: Denise: The fun begins. My mother in law was Theresa deNobrega from Camacha. Her family members still exist there and have a store, bar, and one cousin now owns the wicker factory and is the "mayor". My sister is married to an Ornellas and they also reside in Camacha. In 1906 - 8 - 9, some of those famillies went to Hawaii and later to the U.S. Their lives have been very interesting and we marvel at how they were able to find their way through to the U.S. Germano Ornellas was my brother in laws grandfather. They also are related to the Miranda family. The Goveia family lived here also and followed the same route through Hawaii. Some Freitas lived in San Leandro however many of those mentioned here have sadly passed away. Nice place Camacha. Happy people, musical and dancers. There is a bust of a A. Ornellas in the plaza there and he is a noble man who was from Camacha and at one time quite prominent. Best wishes Margaret ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------- Clix ADSL até 24 Mb: a partir de € 29,90/mês A Internet mais rápida do mercado, agora com chamadas grátis e downloads ilimitados! 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