Dear Luis: Thanks for you input. What I find interesting is that it seems that areas of the islands have different interpretations of the de and da. I have read many many of the documents in the films of the baptisms and marriges and that is what I have learned. However, things seem to vary from island to island. Interesting in my mothers family is that the name is d'Abreu Faria. NO da or de. Just plain d'. I believe that it means that they were from the Abreu clan. My fathers family were daSilva. No royalty but in the early days there were many capitaos and donnas and could be that it was a matter of pride to use the da and de. My great grandfather was Moniz de Piedade. Moniz was the family name and because they lived next to the church "Nossa Senhora de Piedade.", I had a difficult time locating the family because I thought the name was Piedade. No such family. Not really a problem but a lot of time and work to try to get this all straighten out. Best wishes Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: <luis_k_w@clix.pt> To: <prt-madeira@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 6:14 AM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > Margaret, > I am sorry, but you are completely wrong. :-)) > > MELLO (or Melo) and SILVA are villages. So, when you write "da Silva de Melo" (or "da Silva e Melo") it means that some ancestors were FROM those places. > > Any way, following the portuguese tradition, GENERALLY the father's name comes LAST (you wrote the oposite). > > You may have DA followed by the (FIRST) name of the mother when, for instance, the father is unknown. For instance: DA RITA (name of the wife of the former president of Portugal). But, please remember, that was LONG AGO (a couple of centuries ago..). > > NOBRIGA (or NOBREGA) doesn't mean noble! It may (or may not) come with a "DE" (from) because it's the name of a place. There are places (villages, parrishes, - Note: it's FREGUESIA, not FRAGAZIA...) with that name. > > The example you wrote (Jose Campos) is true (the origin of the name may have been a nickname). Even so, it means that those people came FROM, or lived IN the fields, so "DOS CAMPOS" is also correctly used. > > Luis de K. e W. :-) > Lisboa-Portugal > > ---------------------- MENSAGEM ORIGINAL ---------------------- > Jose' > NIce e-mail and I know that the "de" means "from". I have found that in > other islands the names use "de" and "da" to signify > the mother and the fathers names. For instance. Joao da Silva de Mello. > Silva the fathers paternal name and Mello the mothers. > Nobriga means noble however like some names it is acquired. If the family > lived in the "campo" then the name could be Jose > da Souza Campos. In searching the records in the library you have to be > very careful because you can very easily track the wrong family. Or search > the wrong line. Very easy to do. > > Indeed the families worked the land and left their mark. They went to > Hawaii, U.S.A., South America, Africa and India, China etc. > Their ofspring have done well and owe it all to their ancestors. They are > proving how great the Portuguese people were and are whether they came from > one fragazia or another. > > Margaret > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 7:31 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Margaret, > > We are surrounded by Nóbregas! Now the "de" added to the name got carried > away in Madeira. I don't give it too much importance. It was added to show > nobility and so on. I believe that most Madeirans come from hardworking > families that worked the land. Wed all come from good families. I am proud > of their achievements and their hard work. Our ancestors built Madeira from > nothing. Even to work the land took creativity, courage and hard work. > > I believe that many families in Camacha came originally from Caniço and I > encourage those researching families in Camacha not to forget about Caniço. > > For example you mention the Ornellas. By the late 15th century they already > had extensive landholdings in Caniço. Many new colonists came to work in > their farms (fazenda). Under the old "colonia" system they owned most of the > land rights in Caniço until late in the 20th century. > > Have a nice day. > José Fernnades > > -----Original Message----- > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Margaret > Sent: January 17, 2007 6:02 PM > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > Jose: > My mother in law was a deNobrega. Many use the name Nobriga however in > Camacha I found that her family all were identified by the deNobrega. The > original home was in Val de Paraiso and some of the later generation still > live there. Some went to Hawaii about 1906-7 and later to the U.S. Many of > the later generation have done very well in the U.S, Africa and Brazil. > > There is a branch in Brazil that is very famous in Radio, and T.V. Have > been for many years and several are medical doctors. > In the U.S. the grandchildren are also doing well in what ever endeaver they > choose. Some have married into the Ornellas family and have Freitas and > Gouveia cousins. The Africa connection went back to Madeira and is with the > Portugese gorvernment. > I say this because we are very happy with our connection to that part of the > world. Our roots are good and strong. Thank you Madeira. > > Margaret > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:24 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Didn't want to interrupt your conversation, but when you mention Caniço I am > in! > > The Fernandes, in my case, have been in Caniço since the 16th century. We > have married into all of the families, including De Freitas and Nóbrega. In > fact my grandmother was a Nóbrega. This was the 3rd we married into the > Nóbrega family. > > In Saudades da Terra, it is written that by the mid-17 century there barely > 200 (mostly huts) in the whole parish. The families there were mostly > interconnected. > > Now a note on Camacha that you may already know. Camacha was part of Caniço > until the end of the Spanish regime. I believe around 1638 it became its own > parish. I suspect many of the families were original settlers in Caniço, who > gradually cleared more land up the mountain. So it was natural to have much > intermarriage between the two parishes. I have that in my family. > > Another interesting note was that reading a British writer, she writes in > the mid-18 century that in her opinion many of the people in Camacha who > were blond and red haired may have descended from a Scottish battalion which > was headquartered there during the British occupation of the island in and > around 1807 and 1814. > > Anyway, if you doing any research on Caniço, please let me know. > > Have a nice day. > > José > -----Original Message----- > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Denise1270@aol.com > Sent: January 13, 2007 1:57 PM > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Hi Margaret, > > I went to Camacha and we even brought back some of those wicker items. One > of them is a beautiful picnic basket. It's a really nice town. > > My grandfathers sister was married to Luis de Nobrega but I believe he was > from Canico not Camacha. I don't have any other info on his family. I > know > he had a brother that lived in Cambridge, MA at one time. My grandmothers > family was from Sao Miguel, Acores, One of her uncles was married to > Adelaide > Cristina da Carmara d'Ornellas, she was from Sao Pedro, Funchal and her > parents were Pedro Jose de Ornellas and Elena Augusta da Camara. She went > to live > in Sao Miguel. And I know she had a sister named Vicencia Julia da Camara > d'Ornellas. The Ornellas are from a well off line. I understand there is > a > street or something named after them. > > My grandfather said we had family that went near Oakland, CA but we don't > know who and they would be dead now. They were Freitas though. > > Denise > > In a message dated 1/13/2007 1:26:31 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > marpg2000@comcast.net writes: > > Denise: > > The fun begins. My mother in law was Theresa deNobrega from Camacha. Her > family members still exist there and have a store, bar, and one cousin now > owns the wicker factory and is the "mayor". My sister is married to an > Ornellas and they also reside in Camacha. In 1906 - 8 - 9, some of those > famillies went to Hawaii and later to the U.S. Their lives have been very > interesting and we marvel at how they were able to find their way through > to > the U.S. Germano Ornellas was my brother in laws grandfather. They also > are related to the Miranda family. > > The Goveia family lived here also and followed the same route through > Hawaii. Some Freitas lived in San Leandro however many of those mentioned > here have sadly passed away. > > Nice place Camacha. Happy people, musical and dancers. There is a bust > of > a A. Ornellas in the plaza there and he is a noble man who was from Camacha > and at one time quite prominent. > > Best wishes > Margaret > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------- > > Clix ADSL até 24 Mb: a partir de ? 29,90/mês > A Internet mais rápida do mercado, agora com chamadas grátis e downloads ilimitados! > > Saiba mais em http://acesso.clix.pt/ > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Margaret.... I have an ancestor...Vasco Moniz de Meneses (died in 1692) from Sao Vicente son of Capitain Antonio Figueiro and Ana de Gouveia (from Machico). That Vasco married Dona Crispina de Meneses in 1684. Crispina is the daughter of Capitain Cristovao Moniz da Camara. Being that you mentoned that you have Moniz in your family, maybe we are related. By the way, for some reason even in the Arquivo Regional da Madeira, they cannot find any records of Vasco's father and mother and in that way im stuck and cannot trace back from there. Do u have any info that could help me?? Thank you Leandro -----Original Message----- From: marpg2000@comcast.net To: luis_k_w@clix.pt; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11.35PM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website Dear Luis: Thanks for you input. What I find interesting is that it seems that areas of the islands have different interpretations of the de and da. I have read many many of the documents in the films of the baptisms and marriges and that is what I have learned. However, things seem to vary from island to island. Interesting in my mothers family is that the name is d'Abreu Faria. NO da or de. Just plain d'. I believe that it means that they were from the Abreu clan. My fathers family were daSilva. No royalty but in the early days there were many capitaos and donnas and could be that it was a matter of pride to use the da and de. My great grandfather was Moniz de Piedade. Moniz was the family name and because they lived next to the church "Nossa Senhora de Piedade.", I had a difficult time locating the family because I thought the name was Piedade. No such family. Not really a problem but a lot of time and work to try to get this all straighten out. Best wishes Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: <luis_k_w@clix.pt> To: <prt-madeira@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 6:14 AM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > Margaret, > I am sorry, but you are completely wrong. :-)) > > MELLO (or Melo) and SILVA are villages. So, when you write "da Silva de Melo" (or "da Silva e Melo") it means that some ancestors were FROM those places. > > Any way, following the portuguese tradition, GENERALLY the father's name comes LAST (you wrote the oposite). > > You may have DA followed by the (FIRST) name of the mother when, for instance, the father is unknown. For instance: DA RITA (name of the wife of the former president of Portugal). But, please remember, that was LONG AGO (a couple of centuries ago..). > > NOBRIGA (or NOBREGA) doesn't mean noble! It may (or may not) come with a "DE" (from) because it's the name of a place. There are places (villages, parrishes, - Note: it's FREGUESIA, not FRAGAZIA...) with that name. > > The example you wrote (Jose Campos) is true (the origin of the name may have been a nickname). Even so, it means that those people came FROM, or lived IN the fields, so "DOS CAMPOS" is also correctly used. > > Luis de K. e W. :-) > Lisboa-Portugal > > ---------------------- MENSAGEM ORIGINAL ---------------------- > Jose' > NIce e-mail and I know that the "de" means "from". I have found that in > other islands the names use "de" and "da" to signify > the mother and the fathers names. For instance. Joao da Silva de Mello. > Silva the fathers paternal name and Mello the mothers. > Nobriga means noble however like some names it is acquired. If the family > lived in the "campo" then the name could be Jose > da Souza Campos. In searching the records in the library you have to be > very careful because you can very easily track the wrong family. Or search > the wrong line. Very easy to do. > > Indeed the families worked the land and left their mark. They went to > Hawaii, U.S.A., South America, Africa and India, China etc. > Their ofspring have done well and owe it all to their ancestors. They are > proving how great the Portuguese people were and are whether they came from > one fragazia or another. > > Margaret > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 7:31 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Margaret, > > We are surrounded by Nóbregas! Now the "de" added to the name got carried > away in Madeira. I don't give it too much importance. It was added to show > nobility and so on. I believe that most Madeirans come from hardworking > families that worked the land. Wed all come from good families. I am proud > of their achievements and their hard work. Our ancestors built Madeira from > nothing. Even to work the land took creativity, courage and hard work. > > I believe that many families in Camacha came originally from Caniço and I > encourage those researching families in Camacha not to forget about Caniço. > > For example you mention the Ornellas. By the late 15th century they already > had extensive landholdings in Caniço. Many new colonists came to work in > their farms (fazenda). Under the old "colonia" system they owned most of the > land rights in Caniço until late in the 20th century. > > Have a nice day. > José Fernnades > > -----Original Message----- > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Margaret > Sent: January 17, 2007 6:02 PM > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > Jose: > My mother in law was a deNobrega. Many use the name Nobriga however in > Camacha I found that her family all were identified by the deNobrega. The > original home was in Val de Paraiso and some of the later generation still > live there. Some went to Hawaii about 1906-7 and later to the U.S. Many of > the later generation have done very well in the U.S, Africa and Brazil. > > There is a branch in Brazil that is very famous in Radio, and T.V. Have > been for many years and several are medical doctors. > In the U.S. the grandchildren are also doing well in what ever endeaver they > choose. Some have married into the Ornellas family and have Freitas and > Gouveia cousins. The Africa connection went back to Madeira and is with the > Portugese gorvernment. > I say this because we are very happy with our connection to that part of the > world. Our roots are good and strong. Thank you Madeira. > > Margaret > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:24 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Didn't want to interrupt your conversation, but when you mention Caniço I am > in! > > The Fernandes, in my case, have been in Caniço since the 16th century. We > have married into all of the families, including De Freitas and Nóbrega. In > fact my grandmother was a Nóbrega. This was the 3rd we married into the > Nóbrega family. > > In Saudades da Terra, it is written that by the mid-17 century there barely > 200 (mostly huts) in the whole parish. The families there were mostly > interconnected. > > Now a note on Camacha that you may already know. Camacha was part of Caniço > until the end of the Spanish regime. I believe around 1638 it became its own > parish. I suspect many of the families were original settlers in Caniço, who > gradually cleared more land up the mountain. So it was natural to have much > intermarriage between the two parishes. I have that in my family. > > Another interesting note was that reading a British writer, she writes in > the mid-18 century that in her opinion many of the people in Camacha who > were blond and red haired may have descended from a Scottish battalion which > was headquartered there during the British occupation of the island in and > around 1807 and 1814. > > Anyway, if you doing any research on Caniço, please let me know. > > Have a nice day. > > José > -----Original Message----- > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Denise1270@aol.com > Sent: January 13, 2007 1:57 PM > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > Hi Margaret, > > I went to Camacha and we even brought back some of those wicker items. One > of them is a beautiful picnic basket. It's a really nice town. > > My grandfathers sister was married to Luis de Nobrega but I believe he was > from Canico not Camacha. I don't have any other info on his family. I > know > he had a brother that lived in Cambridge, MA at one time. My grandmothers > family was from Sao Miguel, Acores, One of her uncles was married to > Adelaide > Cristina da Carmara d'Ornellas, she was from Sao Pedro, Funchal and her > parents were Pedro Jose de Ornellas and Elena Augusta da Camara. She went > to live > in Sao Miguel. And I know she had a sister named Vicencia Julia da Camara > d'Ornellas. The Ornellas are from a well off line. I understand there is > a > street or something named after them. > > My grandfather said we had family that went near Oakland, CA but we don't > know who and they would be dead now. They were Freitas though. > > Denise > > In a message dated 1/13/2007 1:26:31 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > marpg2000@comcast.net writes: > > Denise: > > The fun begins. My mother in law was Theresa deNobrega from Camacha. Her > family members still exist there and have a store, bar, and one cousin now > owns the wicker factory and is the "mayor". My sister is married to an > Ornellas and they also reside in Camacha. In 1906 - 8 - 9, some of those > famillies went to Hawaii and later to the U.S. Their lives have been very > interesting and we marvel at how they were able to find their way through > to > the U.S. Germano Ornellas was my brother in laws grandfather. They also > are related to the Miranda family. > > The Goveia family lived here also and followed the same route through > Hawaii. Some Freitas lived in San Leandro however many of those mentioned > here have sadly passed away. > > Nice place Camacha. Happy people, musical and dancers. There is a bust > of > a A. Ornellas in the plaza there and he is a noble man who was from Camacha > and at one time quite prominent. > > Best wishes > Margaret > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------- > > Clix ADSL até 24 Mb: a partir de ? 29,90/mês > A Internet mais rápida do mercado, agora com chamadas grátis e downloads ilimitados! > > Saiba mais em http://acesso.clix.pt/ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- ---- > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Leandro: Very happy to hear from you. My grandmother was d'Abreu Faria and married Manoel Fernandes. I was able to get a copy of their cassamento but couldnot get back any further because between 1824 and 1860 records were not filmed. Also they lived in Campanario and the church Sao Braz was destroyed by fire and all records were lost. The archives in Funchal donot have the records either so it was a dead end. My mother always mentioned cousins "Moniz" who came to the U.S. and settled in Massachusetts but didnot mention how they were connected. On my fathers side the Moniz was in Sao Miguel, Azores. They go back to 1781 as far as I can see. Antonio Moniz de Piedade married Joanna Francesca 7, Feb/ 1811. Antonio son of Francisco Moniz de Piedade Joanna Francesca daughter of Henrique Joao Borges Maria, daughter of Antonio and Joanna born 11 May 1813 Interesting is that the Godfather of Maria was Jose' LEANDRO and Maria do Nasciemento, the fillhos do Henrique Joao Borges. Henrique Joao Borges is my gr. gr. gr. grandfather. The parents above were my gr. gr. grandparents and Antonio was known as Alferes Anttonio Moniz de Piedade in 1814. Coincidence dont you think. I couldnot get back any further because the records (films) were in very poor condition and not ledgeable. Maybe the Madeira Moniz went to Sao Miguel on vacation. Who knows? Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: <gregobhte1@aol.com> To: <prt-madeira@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 9:41 PM Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Moniz Family > Hi Margaret.... > > I have an ancestor...Vasco Moniz de Meneses (died in 1692) from Sao > Vicente son of Capitain Antonio Figueiro and Ana de Gouveia (from > Machico). That Vasco married Dona Crispina de Meneses in 1684. Crispina > is the daughter of Capitain Cristovao Moniz da Camara. > > Being that you mentoned that you have Moniz in your family, maybe we > are related. By the way, for some reason even in the Arquivo Regional > da Madeira, they cannot find any records of Vasco's father and mother > and in that way im stuck and cannot trace back from there. Do u have > any info that could help me?? > > Thank you > > Leandro > > -----Original Message----- > From: marpg2000@comcast.net > To: luis_k_w@clix.pt; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11.35PM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > Dear Luis: > > Thanks for you input. What I find interesting is that it seems that > areas > of the islands have different interpretations of the de and da. > I have read many many of the documents in the films of the baptisms and > marriges and that is what I have learned. However, > things seem to vary from island to island. Interesting in my mothers > family > is that the name is d'Abreu Faria. NO da or de. Just plain d'. I > believe > that it means that they were from the Abreu clan. My fathers family > were > daSilva. No royalty but in the early days there were many capitaos and > donnas and could be that it was a matter of pride to use the da and de. > My > great grandfather was Moniz de Piedade. Moniz was the family name and > because they lived next to the church "Nossa Senhora de Piedade.", > I had a difficult time locating the family because I thought the name > was > Piedade. No such family. > > Not really a problem but a lot of time and work to try to get this all > straighten out. > > Best wishes > Margaret > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <luis_k_w@clix.pt> > To: <prt-madeira@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 6:14 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > > Margaret, > > I am sorry, but you are completely wrong. :-)) > > > > MELLO (or Melo) and SILVA are villages. So, when you write "da Silva > de > Melo" (or "da Silva e Melo") it means that some ancestors were FROM > those > places. > > > > Any way, following the portuguese tradition, GENERALLY the father's > name > comes LAST (you wrote the oposite). > > > > You may have DA followed by the (FIRST) name of the mother when, for > instance, the father is unknown. For instance: DA RITA (name of the > wife of > the former president of Portugal). But, please remember, that was LONG > AGO > (a couple of centuries ago..). > > > > NOBRIGA (or NOBREGA) doesn't mean noble! It may (or may not) come > with a > "DE" (from) because it's the name of a place. There are places > (villages, > parrishes, - Note: it's FREGUESIA, not FRAGAZIA...) with that name. > > > > The example you wrote (Jose Campos) is true (the origin of the name > may > have been a nickname). Even so, it means that those people came FROM, or > lived IN the fields, so "DOS CAMPOS" is also correctly used. > > > > Luis de K. e W. :-) > > Lisboa-Portugal > > > > ---------------------- MENSAGEM ORIGINAL ---------------------- > > Jose' > > NIce e-mail and I know that the "de" means "from". I have found that > in > > other islands the names use "de" and "da" to signify > > the mother and the fathers names. For instance. Joao da Silva de > Mello. > > Silva the fathers paternal name and Mello the mothers. > > Nobriga means noble however like some names it is acquired. If the > family > > lived in the "campo" then the name could be Jose > > da Souza Campos. In searching the records in the library you have to > be > > very careful because you can very easily track the wrong family. Or > search > > the wrong line. Very easy to do. > > > > Indeed the families worked the land and left their mark. They went to > > Hawaii, U.S.A., South America, Africa and India, China etc. > > Their ofspring have done well and owe it all to their ancestors. > They are > > proving how great the Portuguese people were and are whether they came > from > > one fragazia or another. > > > > Margaret > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > > Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 7:31 AM > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > > > > Margaret, > > > > We are surrounded by Nóbregas! Now the "de" added to the name got > carried > > away in Madeira. I don't give it too much importance. It was added to > show > > nobility and so on. I believe that most Madeirans come from > hardworking > > families that worked the land. Wed all come from good families. I am > proud > > of their achievements and their hard work. Our ancestors built Madeira > from > > nothing. Even to work the land took creativity, courage and hard work. > > > > I believe that many families in Camacha came originally from Caniço > and I > > encourage those researching families in Camacha not to forget about > Caniço. > > > > For example you mention the Ornellas. By the late 15th century they > already > > had extensive landholdings in Caniço. Many new colonists came to work > in > > their farms (fazenda). Under the old "colonia" system they owned most > of > the > > land rights in Caniço until late in the 20th century. > > > > Have a nice day. > > José Fernnades > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Margaret > > Sent: January 17, 2007 6:02 PM > > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > > Jose: > > My mother in law was a deNobrega. Many use the name Nobriga however > in > > Camacha I found that her family all were identified by the deNobrega. > The > > original home was in Val de Paraiso and some of the later generation > still > > live there. Some went to Hawaii about 1906-7 and later to the U.S. > Many > of > > the later generation have done very well in the U.S, Africa and > Brazil. > > > > There is a branch in Brazil that is very famous in Radio, and T.V. > Have > > been for many years and several are medical doctors. > > In the U.S. the grandchildren are also doing well in what ever > endeaver > they > > choose. Some have married into the Ornellas family and have Freitas > and > > Gouveia cousins. The Africa connection went back to Madeira and is > with > the > > Portugese gorvernment. > > I say this because we are very happy with our connection to that part > of > the > > world. Our roots are good and strong. Thank you Madeira. > > > > Margaret > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Fernandes, Jose" jose.fernandes@yrdsb.edu.on.ca > > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > > Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:24 AM > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > > > > Didn't want to interrupt your conversation, but when you mention > Caniço I > am > > in! > > > > The Fernandes, in my case, have been in Caniço since the 16th > century. We > > have married into all of the families, including De Freitas and > Nóbrega. > In > > fact my grandmother was a Nóbrega. This was the 3rd we married into > the > > Nóbrega family. > > > > In Saudades da Terra, it is written that by the mid-17 century there > barely > > 200 (mostly huts) in the whole parish. The families there were mostly > > interconnected. > > > > Now a note on Camacha that you may already know. Camacha was part of > Caniço > > until the end of the Spanish regime. I believe around 1638 it became > its > own > > parish. I suspect many of the families were original settlers in > Caniço, > who > > gradually cleared more land up the mountain. So it was natural to have > much > > intermarriage between the two parishes. I have that in my family. > > > > Another interesting note was that reading a British writer, she > writes in > > the mid-18 century that in her opinion many of the people in Camacha > who > > were blond and red haired may have descended from a Scottish battalion > which > > was headquartered there during the British occupation of the island > in and > > around 1807 and 1814. > > > > Anyway, if you doing any research on Caniço, please let me know. > > > > Have a nice day. > > > > José > > -----Original Message----- > > From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com > > [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of > Denise1270@aol.com > > Sent: January 13, 2007 1:57 PM > > To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Archivo Regional da Madeira website > > > > > > Hi Margaret, > > > > I went to Camacha and we even brought back some of those wicker > items. > One > > of them is a beautiful picnic basket. It's a really nice town. > > > > My grandfathers sister was married to Luis de Nobrega but I believe > he was > > from Canico not Camacha. I don't have any other info on his family. > I > > know > > he had a brother that lived in Cambridge, MA at one time. My > grandmothers > > family was from Sao Miguel, Acores, One of her uncles was married to > > Adelaide > > Cristina da Carmara d'Ornellas, she was from Sao Pedro, Funchal and > her > > parents were Pedro Jose de Ornellas and Elena Augusta da Camara. She > went > > to live > > in Sao Miguel. And I know she had a sister named Vicencia Julia da > Camara > > d'Ornellas. The Ornellas are from a well off line. I understand > there > is > > a > > street or something named after them. > > > > My grandfather said we had family that went near Oakland, CA but we > don't > > know who and they would be dead now. They were Freitas though. > > > > Denise > > > > In a message dated 1/13/2007 1:26:31 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > > marpg2000@comcast.net writes: > > > > Denise: > > > > The fun begins. My mother in law was Theresa deNobrega from Camacha. > Her > > family members still exist there and have a store, bar, and one > cousin > now > > owns the wicker factory and is the "mayor". My sister is married > to an > > Ornellas and they also reside in Camacha. In 1906 - 8 - 9, some of > those > > famillies went to Hawaii and later to the U.S. Their lives have been > very > > interesting and we marvel at how they were able to find their way > through > > to > > the U.S. Germano Ornellas was my brother in laws grandfather. They > also > > are related to the Miranda family. > > > > The Goveia family lived here also and followed the same route > through > > Hawaii. Some Freitas lived in San Leandro however many of those > mentioned > > here have sadly passed away. > > > > Nice place Camacha. Happy people, musical and dancers. There is a > bust > > of > > a A. Ornellas in the plaza there and he is a noble man who was from > Camacha > > and at one time quite prominent. > > > > Best wishes > > Margaret > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > ------------- > > > > Clix ADSL até 24 Mb: a partir de ? 29,90/mês > > A Internet mais rápida do mercado, agora com chamadas grátis e > downloads > ilimitados! > > > > Saiba mais em http://acesso.clix.pt/ > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > ---- > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of > the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message