I don't know if the book present in Picasa has an index at the end. It may. I have the work in files that my cousin sent me long time ago. Some files, which interested me particularly, I have printed - like the Correias Mirandas., the Chaves, the Afonso Pires, etc. Anyway, now we have almost all the Nobiliaries at our disposal. But what about the França e Vasconcelos nobiliary? Anyone can locate it? On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:35 PM, Luis Beal <[email protected]> wrote: > I have no idea. You guys were talking about this book so I googled it and > came across that link. My first thought was of an index too but if one > exists it will be at the very end of the book, the end of the last tomo. > Sorry that I can't be of more help, maybe Miguel knows, I believe he was > the one who made reference to the book. > Good luck, > > Luis Beal > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a > child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the > life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > > ________________________________ > From: JAndrade1 <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Wed, December 30, 2009 5:50:20 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > Hey Luis, > I was looking at the picassa pages you linked to here. I hadn't seen > any references to this source before. What is its focus and how is it > organized? Seems that each of the tomes has 100s of pages so > searching it without an index of some type is tough, Could you give > me some guidance here, at least some idea of where to look? > > On Dec 21, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Luis Beal wrote: > > > http://picasaweb.google.pt/cisne888/ This lady posted 9 books online > of Joao Agostinho Pereira d'Agrella > > Luis Beal > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain > perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it > is woven into the life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Miguel de Castro Henriques <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Mon, December 21, 2009 4:32:21 PM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > You can also try Pereira de Agrela in Google books instead of Pereira > d'Agrela. > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 10:30 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > if you go to http://www.google.com/books and type in d'agrela you will > > find > > some mention of possibly him. > > > > I found the following passage: > > > > aquelas informacoas sido tambem asseguradas por Pedro Agostinho > > Pereira > > d'Agrela da Camara e por aquele Joao Diogo de quem hoave o manuscrito. > > Eran > > ambos fithos do Morgado Joao Agostinho Pereira d'Agrela da Camara, > > por ouja > > morte, em Favereiro de 1835, ficou herdeiro da copia este ultimo, > > que era o > > successor no morgadio. > > > > I may not have copied it correctly as it is hard to read and this > > may or > > may > > not be your d'Agrela. > > > > Tom Freitas > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scot Austin" <[email protected]> > > To: <[email protected]> > > Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 10:24 AM > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > > > > > Miguel, > > > > Take a look at this tree: > > > > http://www.werelate.org/w/index.php? > > title=Special:ShowPedigree&pagetitle=Person:Nicolau_Agrela_%281%29 > > Nicolau is my wife's 4g-grandfather. Can you tell how they fit in? > > > > Thanks, Scot > > > > > > Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >> Hello David, > >> > >> Janette ansered you already. Anyway you must be a "de Agrella" from > >> Madeira, > >> transformed in De Grella. And if so Pereira de Agrela the > >> genealogist is > >> probably your relative, since there are not that many Agrellas in > > Madeira. > >> > >> > >> Cheers, > >> > >> > >> Miguel > >> > >> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 4:10 PM, <[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > >> > >>> I'm confused. Who or what is"Pereira d'Agrela"? > >>> Thanks, > >>> David DeGrella > >>> Tennessee, USA > >>> On Sat, 19 Dec 2009 05:48:56 -0800 Janette Chun > >>> <[email protected]> > >>> writes: > >>> > >>>> Thanks Miguel. I find it quite interesting that the Gois & > >>>> Mendonca > >>>> names, although carried by the male line in later generations, > >>>> seems > >>>> to have its genesis in the female line with Beatriz, her mother, > >>>> and > >>>> now, thanks to you, her grandmother. > >>>> Turns out that I had heard of Pereira d'Agrela after all. I was > >>>> going > >>>> through some old genealogy files yesterday, and lo and behold, > >>>> thanks > >>>> to Pat (on this forum) I have about 33 pages of this genealogical > >>>> record sent to me circa 2002 : )) Thanks Pat! I will have to > >>>> check > >>>> my old laptop to see what other treasures I might have stowed away. > >>>> Janette > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 19-Dec-09, at 2:50 AM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Hello Janette, > >>>>> You're welcome. I am glad I was of some help. Yesterday it was > >>>>> a > > >>>>> field day > >>>>> too because I also solved another old genealogical puzzle. Thanks > >>>>> > >>>> to Pereira d'Agrela. > >>>> > >>>>> Anyway, the Mendonça could come precisely from the first Manuel > >>>>> Travassos m. > >>>>> Maria Mendonça. On that era sometimes a name of an ancestor > >>>>> manifests 2 or > >>>>> three generations later. > >>>>> > >>>>> Cheers, > >>>>> Miguel > >>>>> > >>>>> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 6:15 AM, Janette Chun > >>>>> > >>>> <[email protected]> > >>>> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> Hello Miguel, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Wow! Thank you for solving this piece of the puzzle for me. I'm > >>>>>> sincerely grateful. > >>>>>> I'm not on the nobility quest but good to know. I'm still at a > >>>>>> little > >>>>>> confused on how or where the first Mendonca occurs in this > >>>>>> line, but > >>>>>> hopefully, once I get the documents, more will be revealed. > >>>>>> Janette > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On 18-Dec-09, at 1:32 PM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Hello Janette, > >>>>>>> In Pereira de Agrela Tomo 1-6 parte, pg 166 > >>>>>>> 1 Manuel Travassos m. Maria de Mendonça, they had: > >>>>>>> 2 - Manuel Travassos. o pequeninho. m. (1609) Isabel de Góis > >>>>>>> ( dau. of > >>>>>>> Domingos Martins de Magalhâes and Catarina Nunes), they had: > >>>>>>> Baltazar > >>>>>>> Manuel > >>>>>>> Maria Nunes m. Baltazar de Mendonça Soares > >>>>>>> Isabel de Castro m. Duarte Teixeira de Vasconcelos > >>>>>>> Beatriz de Góis m. Luís de Castro Ferreira. son of Diogo de > >>>>>>> > >>>> Castro > >>>> > >>>>>>> and Luzia > >>>>>>> Fernandes > >>>>>>> The Travassos were from the nobility. > >>>>>>> I don't know where Clode got his idea , but in this particular > >>>>>>> > >>> case > >>> > >>>>>>> he was > >>>>>>> not accurate. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Cheers, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Miguel > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Janette Chun > >>>>>>> > >>>> <[email protected]> > >>>> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Thanks Miguel. Yes I know of these all except Morgado Pereira > >>>>>>>> > >>> de Agrela. I haven't really looked at any of the Clode works, but > >>> > >>>> it was > >>>> > >>>>>>>> in fact through his work that I was able to get to this > >>>>>>>> > >>>> particular > >>>> > >>>>>>>> ancestor, thanks to a page from his book, which the archive > >>>>>>>> > >>>> sent me > >>>> > >>>>>>>> on > >>>>>>>> the Gois family. > >>>>>>>> I just recently took out a subscription to geneall but so far > >>>>>>>> haven't > >>>>>>>> discovered any new nuggets of information. Will keep looking. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Janette > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On 3-Dec-09, at 9:07 AM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Well,>>> You proibably know already all that are available, > >>>>>>>>> You > >>>>>>>>> > >>> have > >>> > >>>>>>>>> Felsiberto, HHN, > >>>>>>>>> Clode, and FMPS Clode and Meneses and Morgado Pereira de > >>>>>>>>> Agrela. > >>>>>>>>> Geneall has > >>>>>>>>> some info about Madeira genealogies. And the personal best > >>>>>>>>> Madeiran > >>>>>>>>> genealogies are to be found in some of our list colleagues > >>>>>>>>> I'll try to find out the Travassos in Pereira de Agrela. > >>>>>>>>> Once I > >>>>>>>>> looked for > >>>>>>>>> them and it had valuable and original info about them. > >>>>>>>>> At one point some a Travassos (from 15th century) whose > >>>>>>>>> alcunha > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> was > >>>>>>>>> " O Pequenininho) was the Carcereiro, the man in charge of > >>>>>>>>> Porto > >>>>>>>>> > >>> Santo prison. > >>> > >>>>>>>>> A friend, a nobleman was quite schocked to see him in such a > >>>>>>>>> station. Whatyou, from the noble Travassos, in such a terrible > >>>>>>>>> > >>> job? > >>> > >>>>>>>>> The Pequenininho had some flourished and philosophical. > >>>>>>>>> answer- > >>>>>>>>> > >>> Idon't > >>> > >>>>>>>>> recall the terms. But it was somnething like: " Alas my good > >>>>>>>>> > >>> friend, > >>> > >>>>>>>>> such is > >>>>>>>>> life that, though God forbid, one day you may be in the same > >>>>>>>>> position as myself." > >>>>>>>>> To be called Pequenininho- - is because he was very very > >>>>>>>>> small > >>>>>>>>> > >>> in stature, but not in dignity. > >>> > >>>>>>>>> Miguel > >>>>>>>>> > >>> ------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the > >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > >>> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >> without the > >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > > without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > > without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I looked at it and there is an index at the end of Tomo IV with pages listed under each book. The worst is that if you want to locate a page in a book it is guesswork as the pages have not been numbered. Just count 2 pages per sheet (meaning that for every 2 images it will be page 1 and page 1v.) and hopefully you can find the one you want :)   Luis Beal "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ________________________________ From: Miguel de Castro Henriques <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wed, December 30, 2009 10:43:05 AM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela I don't know if the book present in Picasa has an index at the end. It may. I have the work in files that my cousin sent me long time ago. Some files, which interested me particularly, I have printed - like the Correias Mirandas., the Chaves, the Afonso Pires, etc. Anyway, now we have almost all the Nobiliaries at our disposal. But what about the França e Vasconcelos nobiliary? Anyone can locate it? On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:35 PM, Luis Beal <[email protected]> wrote: > I have no idea. You guys were talking about this book so I googled it and > came across that link. My first thought was of an index too but  if one > exists it will be at the very end of the book, the end of the last tomo. > Sorry that I can't be of more help, maybe Miguel knows, I believe he was > the one who made reference to the book. > Good luck, > > Luis Beal > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a > child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the > life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > > ________________________________ > From: JAndrade1 <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Wed, December 30, 2009 5:50:20 AM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > Hey Luis, > I was looking at the picassa pages you linked to here. I hadn't seen > any references to this source before. What is its focus and how is it > organized? Seems that each of the tomes has 100s of pages so > searching it without an index of some type is tough, Could you give > me some guidance here, at least some idea of where to look? > > On Dec 21, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Luis Beal wrote: > > > http://picasaweb.google.pt/cisne888/ This lady posted 9 books online > of Joao Agostinho Pereira d'Agrella > > Luis Beal > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain > perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it > is woven into the life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Miguel de Castro Henriques <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Mon, December 21, 2009 4:32:21 PM > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > You can also try Pereira de Agrela in Google books instead of Pereira > d'Agrela. > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 10:30 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > if you go to http://www.google.com/books and type in d'agrela you will > > find > > some mention of possibly him. > > > > I found the following passage: > > > > aquelas informacoas sido tambem asseguradas por Pedro Agostinho > > Pereira > > d'Agrela da Camara e por aquele Joao Diogo de quem hoave o manuscrito. > >  Eran > > ambos fithos do Morgado Joao Agostinho Pereira d'Agrela da Camara, > > por ouja > > morte, em Favereiro de 1835, ficou herdeiro da copia este ultimo, > > que era o > > successor no morgadio. > > > > I may not have copied it correctly as it is hard to read and this > > may or > > may > > not be your d'Agrela. > > > > Tom Freitas > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scot Austin" <[email protected]> > > To: <[email protected]> > > Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 10:24 AM > > Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Help reading certificates/Pereira d'Agrela > > > > > > Miguel, > > > > Take a look at this tree: > > > > http://www.werelate.org/w/index.php? > > title=Special:ShowPedigree&pagetitle=Person:Nicolau_Agrela_%281%29 > > Nicolau is my wife's 4g-grandfather. Can you tell how they fit in? > > > > Thanks, Scot > > > > > > Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >> Hello David, > >> > >> Janette ansered you already. Anyway you must be a "de Agrella" from > >> Madeira, > >> transformed in De Grella. And if so Pereira de Agrela the > >> genealogist is > >> probably your relative, since there are not that many Agrellas in > > Madeira. > >> > >> > >> Cheers, > >> > >> > >> Miguel > >> > >> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 4:10 PM, <[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > >> > >>> I'm confused.  Who or what is"Pereira d'Agrela"? > >>> Thanks, > >>> David DeGrella > >>> Tennessee, USA > >>> On Sat, 19 Dec 2009 05:48:56 -0800 Janette Chun > >>> <[email protected]> > >>> writes: > >>> > >>>> Thanks Miguel.  I find it quite interesting that the Gois & > >>>> Mendonca > >>>> names, although carried by the male line in later generations, > >>>> seems > >>>> to have its genesis in the female line with Beatriz, her mother, > >>>> and > >>>> now, thanks to you, her grandmother. > >>>> Turns out that I had heard of Pereira d'Agrela after all.  I was > >>>> going > >>>> through some old genealogy files yesterday, and lo and behold, > >>>> thanks > >>>> to Pat (on this forum) I have about 33 pages of this genealogical > >>>> record sent to me circa 2002 : ))  Thanks Pat!  I will have to > >>>> check > >>>> my old laptop to see what other treasures I might have stowed away. > >>>> Janette > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 19-Dec-09, at 2:50 AM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Hello Janette, > >>>>> You're welcome. I am glad I was of some help. Yesterday it was > >>>>> a  > > >>>>> field day > >>>>> too because I also solved another old genealogical puzzle. Thanks > >>>>> > >>>> to  Pereira d'Agrela. > >>>> > >>>>> Anyway, the Mendonça could come precisely from the first Manuel > >>>>> Travassos m. > >>>>> Maria Mendonça. On that era sometimes a name of an ancestor > >>>>> manifests 2 or > >>>>> three generations later. > >>>>> > >>>>> Cheers, > >>>>> Miguel > >>>>> > >>>>> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 6:15 AM, Janette Chun > >>>>> > >>>> <[email protected]> > >>>> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> Hello Miguel, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Wow!  Thank you for solving this piece of the puzzle for me.  I'm > >>>>>> sincerely grateful. > >>>>>> I'm not on the nobility quest but good to know.  I'm still at a > >>>>>> little > >>>>>> confused on how or where the first Mendonca occurs in this > >>>>>> line, but > >>>>>> hopefully, once I get the documents, more will be revealed. > >>>>>> Janette > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On 18-Dec-09, at 1:32 PM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Hello Janette, > >>>>>>> In Pereira de Agrela Tomo 1-6 parte, pg 166 > >>>>>>> 1 Manuel Travassos m. Maria de Mendonça, they had: > >>>>>>> 2 - Manuel Travassos. o pequeninho. m. (1609) Isabel de Góis > >>>>>>> ( dau. of > >>>>>>> Domingos Martins de Magalhâes and Catarina Nunes), they had: > >>>>>>> Baltazar > >>>>>>> Manuel > >>>>>>> Maria Nunes m. Baltazar de Mendonça Soares > >>>>>>> Isabel de Castro m. Duarte Teixeira de Vasconcelos > >>>>>>> Beatriz de Góis m. Luís de Castro Ferreira. son of Diogo de > >>>>>>> > >>>> Castro > >>>> > >>>>>>> and Luzia > >>>>>>> Fernandes > >>>>>>> The Travassos were from the nobility. > >>>>>>> I don't know where Clode got his idea , but in this particular > >>>>>>> > >>> case > >>> > >>>>>>> he was > >>>>>>> not accurate. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Cheers, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Miguel > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Janette Chun > >>>>>>> > >>>> <[email protected]> > >>>> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Thanks Miguel.  Yes I know of these all except Morgado Pereira > >>>>>>>> > >>>  de Agrela.  I haven't really looked at any of the Clode works, but > >>> > >>>> it was > >>>> > >>>>>>>> in fact through his work that I was able to get to this > >>>>>>>> > >>>> particular > >>>> > >>>>>>>> ancestor, thanks to a page from his book, which the archive > >>>>>>>> > >>>> sent me > >>>> > >>>>>>>> on > >>>>>>>> the Gois family. > >>>>>>>> I just recently took out a subscription to geneall but so far > >>>>>>>> haven't > >>>>>>>> discovered any new nuggets of information. Will keep looking. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Janette > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On 3-Dec-09, at 9:07 AM, Miguel de Castro Henriques wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Well,>>> You proibably know already all that are available, > >>>>>>>>> You > >>>>>>>>> > >>> have > >>> > >>>>>>>>> Felsiberto, HHN, > >>>>>>>>> Clode, and FMPS Clode and Meneses and Morgado Pereira de > >>>>>>>>> Agrela. > >>>>>>>>> Geneall has > >>>>>>>>> some info about Madeira genealogies. And the personal best > >>>>>>>>> Madeiran > >>>>>>>>> genealogies are to be found in some of our list colleagues > >>>>>>>>> I'll try to find out the Travassos in Pereira de Agrela. > >>>>>>>>> Once  I > >>>>>>>>> looked for > >>>>>>>>> them and it had valuable and original info about them. > >>>>>>>>> At one point some a Travassos (from 15th century) whose > >>>>>>>>> alcunha > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> was > >>>>>>>>> " O Pequenininho) was the Carcereiro, the man in  charge of > >>>>>>>>> Porto > >>>>>>>>> > >>>  Santo prison. > >>> > >>>>>>>>> A friend, a nobleman was quite schocked to see him in such a > >>>>>>>>> station. Whatyou, from the noble Travassos, in such a terrible > >>>>>>>>> > >>> job? > >>> > >>>>>>>>> The Pequenininho had some flourished and philosophical. > >>>>>>>>> answer- > >>>>>>>>> > >>> Idon't > >>> > >>>>>>>>> recall the terms. But it was somnething like: " Alas my good > >>>>>>>>> > >>> friend, > >>> > >>>>>>>>> such is > >>>>>>>>> life that, though God forbid,  one day you may be in the same > >>>>>>>>> position as myself." > >>>>>>>>> To be called Pequenininho- - is because he was very very > >>>>>>>>> small > >>>>>>>>> > >>> in stature, but not in dignity. > >>> > >>>>>>>>> Miguel > >>>>>>>>> > >>> ------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the > >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > >>> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >> without the > >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > > without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > > without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message