Paula, I received it... Pat Paula Fernandes <paulamffernandes@gmail.com> wrote: Hi, I just posted a new message to the list and have not seen it? Paula On 8/30/07, Patricia Corbera wrote: > Since you used Testing #2 to write your message below, you must have seen it posted to the list... I didn't get a copy of that message from the list, only one with my e-mail address. > Maybe if you tried doing this test, using prt-madeira first address, and mine in the second, if my thinking is correct I should only receive the prt-madeira posting... > then send another using mine address first, and prt-madeira second > > Pat > > Luis Beal wrote: > Let us know what you find. > Luis B > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. > For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Patricia Corbera > > To: papagaia2@sbcglobal.net; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 11:35:11 AM > Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing #2 > > > I only received one e-mail from the first test... with my example I should have received the prt-madeira as well as the one for papagaia2@sbcglobal.net.. > > It's possible that my test example using my own e-mail address created a problem, but I'm not sure. > > This time I'm using my e-mail first, and then the prt-madeira... I should receive two, if my thinking is correct... > > Pat > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. > http://farechase.yahoo.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I got it Luis B "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ----- Original Message ---- From: Paula Fernandes <paulamffernandes@gmail.com> To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:20:07 PM Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing #2 Hi, I just posted a new message to the list and have not seen it? Paula On 8/30/07, Patricia Corbera <papagaia2@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > Since you used Testing #2 to write your message below, you must have seen it posted to the list... I didn't get a copy of that message from the list, only one with my e-mail address. > Maybe if you tried doing this test, using prt-madeira first address, and mine in the second, if my thinking is correct I should only receive the prt-madeira posting... > then send another using mine address first, and prt-madeira second > > Pat > > Luis Beal <luisbeal@yahoo.com> wrote: > Let us know what you find. > Luis B > > "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. > For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." > Cicero, Roman orator > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Patricia Corbera > > To: papagaia2@sbcglobal.net; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 11:35:11 AM > Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing #2 > > > I only received one e-mail from the first test... with my example I should have received the prt-madeira as well as the one for papagaia2@sbcglobal.net.. > > It's possible that my test example using my own e-mail address created a problem, but I'm not sure. > > This time I'm using my e-mail first, and then the prt-madeira... I should receive two, if my thinking is correct... > > Pat > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. > http://farechase.yahoo.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ____________________________________________________________________________________ Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/

Since you used Testing #2 to write your message below, you must have seen it posted to the list... I didn't get a copy of that message from the list, only one with my e-mail address. Maybe if you tried doing this test, using prt-madeira first address, and mine in the second, if my thinking is correct I should only receive the prt-madeira posting... then send another using mine address first, and prt-madeira second Pat Luis Beal <luisbeal@yahoo.com> wrote: Let us know what you find. Luis B "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ----- Original Message ---- From: Patricia Corbera To: papagaia2@sbcglobal.net; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 11:35:11 AM Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing #2 I only received one e-mail from the first test... with my example I should have received the prt-madeira as well as the one for papagaia2@sbcglobal.net.. It's possible that my test example using my own e-mail address created a problem, but I'm not sure. This time I'm using my e-mail first, and then the prt-madeira... I should receive two, if my thinking is correct... Pat ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Let us know what you find. Luis B "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ----- Original Message ---- From: Patricia Corbera <papagaia2@sbcglobal.net> To: papagaia2@sbcglobal.net; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 11:35:11 AM Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing #2 I only received one e-mail from the first test... with my example I should have received the prt-madeira as well as the one for papagaia2@sbcglobal.net.. It's possible that my test example using my own e-mail address created a problem, but I'm not sure. This time I'm using my e-mail first, and then the prt-madeira... I should receive two, if my thinking is correct... Pat ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/

I never noticed that Luis Beal "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ----- Original Message ---- From: Patricia Corbera <papagaia2@sbcglobal.net> To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com; papagaia2@sbcglobal.net Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 11:19:28 AM Subject: [PT-MADEIRA] Testing I beginning to think when more than one e-mail address appears on the To: line that only the first address that is listed gets sent... I think that if prt-madeira@rootsweb.com is not the first address then it doesn't get sent to all list members, only to the first e-mail address... Has anyone else experience this possible 'glitch?" Pat ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC

I only received one e-mail from the first test... with my example I should have received the prt-madeira as well as the one for papagaia2@sbcglobal.net.. It's possible that my test example using my own e-mail address created a problem, but I'm not sure. This time I'm using my e-mail first, and then the prt-madeira... I should receive two, if my thinking is correct... Pat

I beginning to think when more than one e-mail address appears on the To: line that only the first address that is listed gets sent... I think that if prt-madeira@rootsweb.com is not the first address then it doesn't get sent to all list members, only to the first e-mail address... Has anyone else experience this possible 'glitch?" Pat

Hi Pat Vencislau Rodrigues Ferreira. He was christened on 22 Mar 1827, Acro da Calheta he was born on the 2nd of March. Interesting to note that on the left margin of the record it says Vencislau fo de Joao Roiz Fra. However in the record it gives the father's name as Manuel Rodrigues Ferreira (a mistake I assume) and the mother's name Margarida Antonia. Joao and Margarida were married on 14 Apr 1825 in Arco with Joao's parents being Jose Rodrigues Ferreira and Maria da Ressurecio(deceased). Margarida's parents were Antonio Rodrigues Capelo and Maria de Jesus. On 8/29/07, Patricia Corbera <papagaia2@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > Hi Paula, > > If you list some of the names that you're researching, it's possible that I have some of your Rodrigues Ferreira ancestors, but not from Arco da Calheta... some of the individuals I have with that surname, I do not have a location listed for, other than Madeira... > Same holds true for your Pestana and Abreu surnames. > I have relatives that migrated to South Africa with the surname of Freitas and da Silva Se'. > > Pat > > Paula Fernandes <paulamffernandes@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > My lines are Rodrigues Ferreira of Acro da Calheta, Pestana of Camara > da Lobos, and de Abreu of Funchal. > > Wondering if any of your ancestors went to Demerara, South America as > I am trying to bridge the gap. > > Paula > > On 8/28/07, Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: > > Hi Pat.... > > > > I got that info thru nobiliario of Madeira and also a book about the > > bettencourt family. > > > > we are more than 100 times related being the closest as 9th cousins thru > > Pedro Delgado and Maria Rodrigues. I descend thur their daugther maria dos > > Prazeres and you thru their son Antonio Nunes. > > > > And yes.....we started all this because the borrageiro connection :) > > > > Leandro > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi This was what I listed........... My grand mother, Guilhermeina Agnes de Abreu b. Aug. 28 1893 d. Mar ? 1920 Demerrara married Francisco Aniceto Pestana who was b. Apr. 17 1887 and d. Dec 17 1928 Demerara. They were married Jan 25 1911. Gulihermenia's parents were Manuel de Abreu of Funchal b.Dec 17 1860 d. Apr 19 1928, Demerara married Mary Isabella Rodrigues Ferreira b. Jul 2 1871 d. Nov 11 1926 and were married on Sept 7 1887. Manuel's first wife was Antonia Rodrigues Mary Isabella's parent were Venceslau Rodrigues Ferreira b. Mar 2 1827 Arco da Calheta, who married Gregoria Fernandes. Venceslau's parents were Joao Rodrigues Ferreira married to Margarida Antonia. And Joao's parents were Jose Rodrigues Ferreira married to Maria da Ressurecio. On 8/29/07, Patricia Corbera <papagaia2@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > Hi Paula, > > If you list some of the names that you're researching, it's possible that I have some of your Rodrigues Ferreira ancestors, but not from Arco da Calheta... some of the individuals I have with that surname, I do not have a location listed for, other than Madeira... > Same holds true for your Pestana and Abreu surnames. > I have relatives that migrated to South Africa with the surname of Freitas and da Silva Se'. > > Pat > > Paula Fernandes <paulamffernandes@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > My lines are Rodrigues Ferreira of Acro da Calheta, Pestana of Camara > da Lobos, and de Abreu of Funchal. > > Wondering if any of your ancestors went to Demerara, South America as > I am trying to bridge the gap. > > Paula > > On 8/28/07, Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: > > Hi Pat.... > > > > I got that info thru nobiliario of Madeira and also a book about the > > bettencourt family. > > > > we are more than 100 times related being the closest as 9th cousins thru > > Pedro Delgado and Maria Rodrigues. I descend thur their daugther maria dos > > Prazeres and you thru their son Antonio Nunes. > > > > And yes.....we started all this because the borrageiro connection :) > > > > Leandro > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Cece and List Members, "Pat-did you write this correctly-if so you are saying that he married his sister-I think it's just a typo. I show that Beatriz Vaz Ferreira is the daughter of Vasco Fernandes & Eva Gomes Ferreira." Cece you are sooooo right, I goofed. Brites Beatriz Vaz Ferreira, is the daughter of Vasco Fernandes and Eva Gomes Ferreira... I duplicated the info from the line above... Who is embarrassd now ... ME! Thank You! (4) "N" unknown parents...of this association they had a son Vasco Moniz Barretto married to Violante Teixeira daughter of Tristao Teixeira and Guiomar de Lordello. You wrote the following (4) nor do I have the son Vasco Moniz Baretto (Pat do you have any source for this one?) Cece, this information from Noronha titulo Moniz (fol. 1) MONIZES. / ARMAS. / § 1.º / N.º 1 – Vasco Martins Moniz, filho 2.º de / Henrique Moniz, e de sua 2.ª mulher D. Ignez de Menezes, em título de Monizes em Portugal, It goes on to mention his marriages... scan down to Houve B. / 2 – Vasco Moniz Barretto, § 19.º // then scan down to (fol. 11) to § 19.º / N.º 2 – Vasco Moniz Barreto, filho B. de Vasco Martins Moniz, § 1.º, N.º 1.º , foi lettrado em leis. Casou com D. Violante Teixeira, Viuva de Joao Rodrigues da Camara, o Negrao, e filho de Triatão Teixeira, o 2.º Capitão de Machico, e de Guimar de Lordello, em titulo de Teixeiras,/ § .., N.º.., a qual morreu em 1549, e fez morgado de seus bens em o filho B. de seu 2.º Marido. This line continues with info on the children... I have removed the accent marks so that it transfers for easier reading. Pat Cece Camara <cece@soccer4all.com> wrote: OK-now Cece's input is attached also!! -----Original Message----- From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of Patricia Corbera Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 1:03 AM To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Vasco Martins Moniz & Beatriz Pereira Leandro and Cece, I have added my input within the text of Leandro's posting below... because the text color doesn't appear, I have added the notation ("Pat's Input") to indicate what I have in file. Pat Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: Hi Cece..... ok...lets see what i have about these couple: 1) List of Children: Garcia Moniz (my ancestor) married with Catarina Teixeira (Pat's Input) Parents of Garcia Moniz were Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Garcia married Catarina Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o velho) and Brites de Goes. (Cece's input) -My ancestor also -Ditto Pat's info Carmelite Friar Cristovao Moniz (Pat's Input) .I have a Cristovao Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) and Aldonca Cabral. Cristovao married ? a Isabel Eca's daughter of Pedro de Eca and Leonor de Camoes. (Cece's input-Do not have either of these, but I do have a grandson of Garcia by a similar name-Cristavao Moniz Barreto-he is the son of Garcia's daughter Helena Moniz de Meneses and Pedro Barbosa-and he was the Juis dos Orphaos de Machico) Ines Moniz married Joao Lourenco de Miranda (Pat's Input) .I have Ines/Ignez Moniz daughter of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Brites' parents Vasco Fernandes and Eva Gomes Ferreira. Ines/Ignez married Joao Lourenco de Miranda. (Cece's input) AHA...I have this same couple, Ines Moniz married to Joao Lourenco de Miranda - only I show Ines as the daughter of Vasco Martins Moniz and Beatriz Pereira (the grandfather of Vasco Martins Moniz-who married Beatriz Vas Ferreira) and sister of Henrique Moniz 2) Any dates: vasco birth: abt 1455 in portugal and death in 1510 in vila de torreao in portugal (sources for that was genea) (Pat's Input) I have this information for Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes... Per Chico - moniz-pdf chart- " Vasco Martins Moniz passou a Madeira c. 1450, e fez seu assento em Machico, he died in Portugal in 1510, in the home of his mother." No mention of his date of birth.... (Cece's input) For Vasco Martins Moniz, son of Henrique Moniz & Ines de Meneses Barreto- born c1470 per Paulo, "He died in Portugal in Vila de Torreao in his mothers house in 1510" also per Paulo. Here are my additional notes- Fidalgo Cavaleiro da Casa Real Registao: He is the 2nd son of Henrique Moniz. He was the first of his family to come to Madeira, Portugal. He first came to Machico where he had large house. He died in Portugal in Vila de Torreao in his mothers house in 1510. He gave 1/3 Morgado to his first son Garcia Moniz. He was married 3 times. of the title Monizes served in Africa Paulo says c1470 3) his ancestors: yes...can go back way way way back.... (again using the source of genea - from the internet) 4) weddings according to my knowledge as well he married 3 times. Beatriz vaz Ferreira, Ines Cabral, Joana Teixeira (Pat's Input) (1) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco, I only have one marriage for this Vasco and that was to Brites Pereira. Source: M. F. Doria (aka Chico) Moderator of Brazilan List Group Per Chico - " Vasco Martins Moniz, filho de Martim Fagundes e de Branca Lourenco, primeiros ancestrais desta familia. Vasco Martins foi armado cavaleiro em Tavira em 1415, antes da tomada de Ceuta, e + antes de 1439. Foi vedor da fazenda da casa do infante D. Henrique. C.c. Beatriz Pereira, filha de Paio Pereira, "homem honrado do Algarve." (2) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Pereira, I have only one marriage for this Vasco, and that was to Aldonca Cabral daughter of Fernao Alvares Cabral and Tereza de Andrade... (3) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes, I have the following spouses/associates for him...(1) Brites Vaz Ferreira daughter of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes (2)Joana Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o Velho) and Brites de Goes (3) "N" Cabral daughter of Diogo Cabral and Beatriz Goncalves Camara (4) "N" unknown parents...of this association they had a son Vasco Moniz Barretto married to Violante Teixeira daughter of Tristao Teixeira and Guiomar de Lordello. hope that helps in some way (Cece's input) - Leandro is referring to #3 above - and I have the same 3 wives for him - wife (1) Beatriz Vaz Ferreira- Pat-did you write this correctly-if so you are saying that he married his sister-I think it's just a typo. I show that Beatriz Vaz Ferreira is the daughter of Vasco Fernandes & Eva Gomes Ferreira. Although I do have the following note on her - Familias de Madeira, Portugal (Teixeiras) has her marrying Henrique Teixeira?- obviously something I meant to check out "someday" wife (2) Joana Teixeira-Lancarote Teixeira and Beatriz de Gois wife (3) Ines Cabral - daughter of Diogo Cabral and Beatriz Goncalves Camara I do not have an association (4) nor do I have the son Vasco Moniz Baretto (Pat do you have any source for this one?) Leandro ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Cece, "Been there, done that" and probably will re-visited it many times before I take my last breath. "to error is human." No one person is perfect... Sorry that I didn't recall our exchange on mtDNA. I'll check my e-mail input on the subject. I have a correction to make. On one of my input comments I sourced a M. F. Doria (aka Chico). Chico is Francisco A. Doria (F.A.D.) and not M. F. Doria... Cece Camara <cece@soccer4all.com> wrote: Pat Ok then my 2 Vasco Martin Moniz's aren't duplcates-wheww...I was getting worried there, since I did not have parents for the elder Vasco and Beatrz and wives names were so close... add that to my dates being screwy and one of them bring missourced earlier, and I was beginning to feel embarrassed (at best) of my work! Thanks you so much for making me feel "not so stupid" after all...you just start to question EVERYTHING you've done when you find something wrong!!! That missource really got to me! (I promise I'm doing better already and going back to check my sources and put in text and page #'s & everything-you'd be proud Luis!) I will continue on to read the other follow ups now! Thanks Pat! Cece -----Original Message----- From: Patricia Corbera [mailto:papagaia2@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:09 PM To: cece@soccer4all.com; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Vasco Martins Moniz & Beatriz Pereira Cece, I have a Vasco Martins Moniz married to Brites Pereira... This Vasco's parents are Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco. Martim and Branca are my 20th ggparents. Vasco and Brites Pereira had a son also named Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) who was married to a Aldonca Cabral. (This Vasco is my 18th Great Grand Uncle. His brother Henrique Moniz (alcaide-Mor) married to Ines Barreto de Menezes are my 18th ggparents). Henrique Moniz was also married to a Isabel da Costa. The third Vasco Martins Moniz that I have in file, son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Memezes, was married to a Brites Vaz Ferreira. Pat Cece Camara <cece@soccer4all.com> wrote: I am still trying to tie up some loose ends with these ancestors and could use some help I am looking for several things - 1. a list of children as complete as possible. 2. any dates surrounding this couple (and sources for dates if anyone has any). 3. Vasco's parents are Henrique Moniz & Dona Ines de Meneses Barreto (Monizes titulo). Anyone go back further than that? 4. How many other times was Vasco married and to whom? I show 3 right now (Registao genealógico de famílias que passaram à Madeira, Portugal-Luis Peter Clode-assuming I have them sourced correctly!!!) but the HHN Monizes Titulo only shows 2. And finally-any children with these other wives? Thanks for your help! Cece ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Since sourcing has become an open item on this list I'd like to take a few lines and talk about it. The main question is why do we source? There are various reasons but I'll touch on three. 1 - Shows credibility. When other people look at your work they can tell that you have done your homework instead of just grabbing info online, or from wherever, and tossing it into your database. When I check family trees online I can easily identify the genuine researchers from the "copy cats." 2 - It helps you to retrace your steps. Eventually we all screw up somewhere on our lines and have to retrace our steps to figure out why and how we reached the conclusion we did. The earlier we screw up in our genealogical "career" the better as we learn an important lesson early on. 3 - It helps others to easily retrace our steps. Eventually one might be confronted by another genealogist as to why we picked a certain couple as the parents of our ancestors as opposed to another couple that looks equally promising (as an example). When we send them our records with our sources they can retrace our steps and follow our line of thinking. If we do not have good sources we will not look very credible and it will be a longer, and probably costlier, process to prove our point. So how do we source? Remember those writing classes we took in college (or high school)? We had to write down the author's names, the book title, page, and paragraph #'s. With internet articles we add date article was written, date it was accessed, and web address. The point being if the professor wanted to know where you got the info he could do it easily, otherwise you could count on a failing grade. Same goes for our genealogical research. In addition to the above items we can add edition #'s, if applicable. With newspapers add column, paragraph, and line #'s. With microfilms add the item # as different items may have the same numbers, and film # and title. When deciding exactly what to source don't ever think that you will remember exactly where you got the information from, chances are you will either eventually forget or confuse it with another similar record. Instead, think ten years from now which information you would like to have written down in case you have to find that record again. So how do I know these things? Been there done that!!! Have a great day. Luis "Not to know what happened before we were born is to remain perpetually a child. For what is the worth of a human life unless it is woven into the life of our ancestors." Cicero, Roman orator ____________________________________________________________________________________ Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel. http://travel.yahoo.com/

Pat I'm pretty sure I've told you that Ed has had his DNA tested (me too-but that one is MTDNA which follows my mothers Irish side) Ed's results are on the Madeira DNA page - (DNA-Camara) http://www.ourfamilyorigins.com/madeira/dna.htm (not sure if links come through rootsweb, but I put it there just in case) Just an FYI since you asked! Cece

OK-now Cece's input is attached also!! -----Original Message----- From: prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:prt-madeira-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of Patricia Corbera Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 1:03 AM To: prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Vasco Martins Moniz & Beatriz Pereira Leandro and Cece, I have added my input within the text of Leandro's posting below... because the text color doesn't appear, I have added the notation ("Pat's Input") to indicate what I have in file. Pat Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: Hi Cece..... ok...lets see what i have about these couple: 1) List of Children: Garcia Moniz (my ancestor) married with Catarina Teixeira (Pat's Input) Parents of Garcia Moniz were Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Garcia married Catarina Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o velho) and Brites de Goes. (Cece's input) -My ancestor also -Ditto Pat's info Carmelite Friar Cristovao Moniz (Pat's Input) .I have a Cristovao Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) and Aldonca Cabral. Cristovao married ? a Isabel Eca's daughter of Pedro de Eca and Leonor de Camoes. (Cece's input-Do not have either of these, but I do have a grandson of Garcia by a similar name-Cristavao Moniz Barreto-he is the son of Garcia's daughter Helena Moniz de Meneses and Pedro Barbosa-and he was the Juis dos Orphaos de Machico) Ines Moniz married Joao Lourenco de Miranda (Pat's Input) .I have Ines/Ignez Moniz daughter of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Brites' parents Vasco Fernandes and Eva Gomes Ferreira. Ines/Ignez married Joao Lourenco de Miranda. (Cece's input) AHA...I have this same couple, Ines Moniz married to Joao Lourenco de Miranda - only I show Ines as the daughter of Vasco Martins Moniz and Beatriz Pereira (the grandfather of Vasco Martins Moniz-who married Beatriz Vas Ferreira) and sister of Henrique Moniz 2) Any dates: vasco birth: abt 1455 in portugal and death in 1510 in vila de torreao in portugal (sources for that was genea) (Pat's Input) I have this information for Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes... Per Chico - moniz-pdf chart- " Vasco Martins Moniz passou a Madeira c. 1450, e fez seu assento em Machico, he died in Portugal in 1510, in the home of his mother." No mention of his date of birth.... (Cece's input) For Vasco Martins Moniz, son of Henrique Moniz & Ines de Meneses Barreto- born c1470 per Paulo, "He died in Portugal in Vila de Torreao in his mothers house in 1510" also per Paulo. Here are my additional notes- Fidalgo Cavaleiro da Casa Real Registao: He is the 2nd son of Henrique Moniz. He was the first of his family to come to Madeira, Portugal. He first came to Machico where he had large house. He died in Portugal in Vila de Torreao in his mothers house in 1510. He gave 1/3 Morgado to his first son Garcia Moniz. He was married 3 times. of the title Monizes served in Africa Paulo says c1470 3) his ancestors: yes...can go back way way way back.... (again using the source of genea - from the internet) 4) weddings according to my knowledge as well he married 3 times. Beatriz vaz Ferreira, Ines Cabral, Joana Teixeira (Pat's Input) (1) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco, I only have one marriage for this Vasco and that was to Brites Pereira. Source: M. F. Doria (aka Chico) Moderator of Brazilan List Group Per Chico - " Vasco Martins Moniz, filho de Martim Fagundes e de Branca Lourenco, primeiros ancestrais desta familia. Vasco Martins foi armado cavaleiro em Tavira em 1415, antes da tomada de Ceuta, e + antes de 1439. Foi vedor da fazenda da casa do infante D. Henrique. C.c. Beatriz Pereira, filha de Paio Pereira, "homem honrado do Algarve." (2) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Pereira, I have only one marriage for this Vasco, and that was to Aldonca Cabral daughter of Fernao Alvares Cabral and Tereza de Andrade... (3) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes, I have the following spouses/associates for him...(1) Brites Vaz Ferreira daughter of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes (2)Joana Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o Velho) and Brites de Goes (3) "N" Cabral daughter of Diogo Cabral and Beatriz Goncalves Camara (4) "N" unknown parents...of this association they had a son Vasco Moniz Barretto married to Violante Teixeira daughter of Tristao Teixeira and Guiomar de Lordello. hope that helps in some way (Cece's input) - Leandro is referring to #3 above - and I have the same 3 wives for him - wife (1) Beatriz Vaz Ferreira- Pat-did you write this correctly-if so you are saying that he married his sister-I think it's just a typo. I show that Beatriz Vaz Ferreira is the daughter of Vasco Fernandes & Eva Gomes Ferreira. Although I do have the following note on her - Familias de Madeira, Portugal (Teixeiras) has her marrying Henrique Teixeira?- obviously something I meant to check out "someday" wife (2) Joana Teixeira-Lancarote Teixeira and Beatriz de Gois wife (3) Ines Cabral - daughter of Diogo Cabral and Beatriz Goncalves Camara I do not have an association (4) nor do I have the son Vasco Moniz Baretto (Pat do you have any source for this one?) Leandro ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Pat Ok then my 2 Vasco Martin Moniz's aren't duplcates-wheww...I was getting worried there, since I did not have parents for the elder Vasco and Beatrz and wives names were so close... add that to my dates being screwy and one of them bring missourced earlier, and I was beginning to feel embarrassed (at best) of my work! Thanks you so much for making me feel "not so stupid" after all...you just start to question EVERYTHING you've done when you find something wrong!!! That missource really got to me! (I promise I'm doing better already and going back to check my sources and put in text and page #'s & everything-you'd be proud Luis!) I will continue on to read the other follow ups now! Thanks Pat! Cece -----Original Message----- From: Patricia Corbera [mailto:papagaia2@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:09 PM To: cece@soccer4all.com; prt-madeira@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PT-MADEIRA] Vasco Martins Moniz & Beatriz Pereira Cece, I have a Vasco Martins Moniz married to Brites Pereira... This Vasco's parents are Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco. Martim and Branca are my 20th ggparents. Vasco and Brites Pereira had a son also named Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) who was married to a Aldonca Cabral. (This Vasco is my 18th Great Grand Uncle. His brother Henrique Moniz (alcaide-Mor) married to Ines Barreto de Menezes are my 18th ggparents). Henrique Moniz was also married to a Isabel da Costa. The third Vasco Martins Moniz that I have in file, son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Memezes, was married to a Brites Vaz Ferreira. Pat Cece Camara <cece@soccer4all.com> wrote: I am still trying to tie up some loose ends with these ancestors and could use some help I am looking for several things - 1. a list of children as complete as possible. 2. any dates surrounding this couple (and sources for dates if anyone has any). 3. Vasco's parents are Henrique Moniz & Dona Ines de Meneses Barreto (Monizes titulo). Anyone go back further than that? 4. How many other times was Vasco married and to whom? I show 3 right now (Registao genealógico de famílias que passaram à Madeira, Portugal-Luis Peter Clode-assuming I have them sourced correctly!!!) but the HHN Monizes Titulo only shows 2. And finally-any children with these other wives? Thanks for your help! Cece ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Cece..... ok...lets see what i have about these couple: 1) List of Children: Garcia Moniz (my ancestor) married with Catarina Teixeira Carmelite Friar Cristovao Moniz Ines Moniz married Joao Lourenco de Miranda 2) Any dates: vasco birth: abt 1455 in portugal and death in 1510 in vila de torreao in portugal (sources for that was genea) 3) his ancestors: yes...can go back way way way back.... (again using the source of genea - from the internet) 4) weddings according to my knowledge as well he married 3 times. Beatriz vaz Ferreira, Ines Cabral, Joana Teixeira hope that helps in some way Leandro

Leandro and Cece, I have added my input within the text of Leandro's posting below... because the text color doesn't appear, I have added the notation ("Pat's Input") to indicate what I have in file. Pat Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: Hi Cece..... ok...lets see what i have about these couple: 1) List of Children: Garcia Moniz (my ancestor) married with Catarina Teixeira (Pat's Input) Parents of Garcia Moniz were Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Garcia married Catarina Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o velho) and Brites de Goes. Carmelite Friar Cristovao Moniz (Pat's Input) .I have a Cristovao Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) and Aldonca Cabral. Cristovao married ? a Isabel Eca's daughter of Pedro de Eca and Leonor de Camoes. Ines Moniz married Joao Lourenco de Miranda (Pat's Input) .I have Ines/Ignez Moniz daughter of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Vaz Ferreira. Brites' parents Vasco Fernandes and Eva Gomes Ferreira Ines/Ignez married Joao Lourenco de Miranda. 2) Any dates: vasco birth: abt 1455 in portugal and death in 1510 in vila de torreao in portugal (sources for that was genea) .(Pat's Input) I have this information for Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes... Per Chico - moniz-pdf chart- " Vasco Martins Moniz passou a Madeira c. 1450, e fez seu assento em Machico, he died in Portugal in 1510, in the home of his mother." No mention of his date of birth.... 3) his ancestors: yes...can go back way way way back.... (again using the source of genea - from the internet) 4) weddings according to my knowledge as well he married 3 times. Beatriz vaz Ferreira, Ines Cabral, Joana Teixeira (Pat's Input) (1) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco, I only have one marriage for this Vasco and that was to Brites Pereira. Source: M. F. Doria (aka Chico) Moderator of Brazilan List Group Per Chico - " Vasco Martins Moniz, filho de Martim Fagundes e de Branca Lourenco, primeiros ancestrais desta familia. Vasco Martins foi armado cavaleiro em Tavira em 1415, antes da tomada de Ceuta, e + antes de 1439. Foi vedor da fazenda da casa do infante D. Henrique. C.c. Beatriz Pereira, filha de Paio Pereira, "homem honrado do Algarve." (2) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Vasco Martins Moniz and Brites Pereira, I have only one marriage for this Vasco, and that was to Aldonca Cabral daughter of Fernao Alvares Cabral and Tereza de Andrade... (3) Vasco Martins Moniz son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes, I have the following spouses/associates for him...(1) Brites Vaz Ferreira daughter of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Menezes (2)Joana Teixeira daughter of Lancarote Teixeira (o Velho) and Brites de Goes (3) "N" Cabral daughter of Diogo Cabral and Beatriz Goncalves Camara (4) "N" unknown parents...of this association they had a son Vasco Moniz Barretto married to Violante Teixeira daughter of Tristao Teixeira and Guiomar de Lordello. hope that helps in some way Leandro ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am still trying to tie up some loose ends with these ancestors and could use some help I am looking for several things - 1. a list of children as complete as possible. 2. any dates surrounding this couple (and sources for dates if anyone has any). 3. Vasco's parents are Henrique Moniz & Dona Ines de Meneses Barreto (Monizes titulo). Anyone go back further than that? 4. How many other times was Vasco married and to whom? I show 3 right now (Registao genealógico de famílias que passaram à Madeira, Portugal-Luis Peter Clode-assuming I have them sourced correctly!!!) but the HHN Monizes Titulo only shows 2. And finally-any children with these other wives? Thanks for your help! Cece

Leandro, Please review what I have. There appears to be some confusion with these Vasco Martins Moniz/s... Pat. I have a Vasco Martins Moniz married to Brites Pereira... This Vasco's parents are Martim Fagundes and Branca Lourenco. Martim and Branca are my 20th ggparents. Vasco and Brites Pereira had a son also named Vasco Martins Moniz (o Moco) who was married to a Aldonca Cabral. (This Vasco is my 18th Great Grand Uncle. His brother Henrique Moniz (alcaide-Mor) married to Ines Barreto de Menezes. Henrique and Ines are my 18th ggparents. Henrique Moniz was also married to a Isabel da Costa. The third Vasco Martins Moniz that I have in file, son of Henrique Moniz and Ines Barreto de Memezes, was married to a Brites Vaz Ferreira. Brites' parents are Vasco Fernandes and Eva Gomes Ferreira. Eva daughter of Goncalo Aires Ferreira and an "unknown," mother. Pat Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: Hi Cece..... ok...lets see what i have about these couple: 1) List of Children: Garcia Moniz (my ancestor) married with Catarina Teixeira Carmelite Friar Cristovao Moniz Ines Moniz married Joao Lourenco de Miranda 2) Any dates: vasco birth: abt 1455 in portugal and death in 1510 in vila de torreao in portugal (sources for that was genea) 3) his ancestors: yes...can go back way way way back.... (again using the source of genea - from the internet) 4) weddings according to my knowledge as well he married 3 times. Beatriz vaz Ferreira, Ines Cabral, Joana Teixeira hope that helps in some way Leandro ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PRT-MADEIRA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Paula, If you list some of the names that you're researching, it's possible that I have some of your Rodrigues Ferreira ancestors, but not from Arco da Calheta... some of the individuals I have with that surname, I do not have a location listed for, other than Madeira... Same holds true for your Pestana and Abreu surnames. I have relatives that migrated to South Africa with the surname of Freitas and da Silva Se'. Pat Paula Fernandes <paulamffernandes@gmail.com> wrote: Hi, My lines are Rodrigues Ferreira of Acro da Calheta, Pestana of Camara da Lobos, and de Abreu of Funchal. Wondering if any of your ancestors went to Demerara, South America as I am trying to bridge the gap. Paula On 8/28/07, Gregobhte1@aol.com wrote: > Hi Pat.... > > I got that info thru nobiliario of Madeira and also a book about the > bettencourt family. > > we are more than 100 times related being the closest as 9th cousins thru > Pedro Delgado and Maria Rodrigues. I descend thur their daugther maria dos > Prazeres and you thru their son Antonio Nunes. > > And yes.....we started all this because the borrageiro connection :) > > Leandro