Hello Robert, Perhaps you could add his name to this sentence please? ;-)) My great grandfather was [-----------------] and was born 1858-1859 out of wedlock around Llangammarch Wells. Then we may be able to help you. Keep warm. Cheers, Jill -----Original Message----- From: powys-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:powys-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Robert Price Sent: 07 February 2013 15:58 To: POWYS@rootsweb.com Subject: [POWYS] illegitimate births Hello All, A cold greeting from the USA. My great grandfather was born 1858-1859 out of wedlock around Llangammarch Wells. From his own account I have his birth date and the name of his mother (Elizabeth Price...not many of those in the area!!). There is not a birth registered in either the Builth or Brecknock district for the birth date he says he was born on. He was living with his father and grandparents on the 1861 census in Merthyr Cynog. I have searched the census records up and down for his mother and have a few possibilities. I have read that if a child was born out of wedlock the father could be brought before a magistrate by the mother to swear that he was or not the father? Finding the mother of my great grandfather has been my greatest brickwall. Can anyone out there give me any suggestions of  any other records that might exist?? Thank You Robert Price ===================