Can anyone help me sort out this puzzle? My g g grandfather was named John Davies and was born at Beacons/ Beccwns farm near Gelligaer in Glamorgan in about 1812. He married a Jane Watson in Gelligaer in 1842 though on the marriage certificate he gives his name as John Williams . They went to farm at Llandetty and then at Bodwigiad , Penderyn. The 1851 census has the family of John and Jane Williams living at Bodwigiad farm with their children Llewelyn (after his grandfather), Elizabeth  and Gwenllian, all with the surname Williams. However  their next child George was born at Bodwigiad in November 1852 and his birth certificate gives his surname as Davies and his parents as John Davies and Jane Davies formerly Watson. The 1861 census has Jane Davies as head of the household at Beccwns farm with no husband but with 2 more children, both born at Gelligaer, Glamorgan. I believe that Llewelyn Davies, father of John who changed his name then changed it back, was buried at Vaynor churchyard but when I went to look for his grave I couldn't find it. I did however find the grave of Llewelyn's son, John's brother, another Llewelyn who kept the Mount Pleasant Inn at Pentwyn, Vochriw, so I think there must be some family connection with Vaynor. Has anyone listed the Monumental Inscriptions for Vaynor Churchyard? Can anyone think of an explanation for the change of name and then the change back to what it was originally? Margaret

Hello Margaret I'm sorry if I've missed an earlier reply to this. I'm ready to be shot down for my theories below! I wonder if your gg grandfather actually changed his name at all? Rather in many of the records it would be someone else writing his name for him, an official including the census taker, the rector or vicar. In which case they would be writing what they thought to be his correct name. To take an example, my grandmother was called Maggie. Everyone, including her own son, thought her correct name was Margaret and so would fill in forms on her behalf when she was elderly saying so. After her death, my father discovered she'd been christened and registered as Maggie! At this period, although maybe quite late for this particular part of Wales, surnames hadn't quite established themselves. In Meirionnydd where I live, this was true even up to mid nineteenth century. In which case a person might be known by the old patronymic system, maybe by the old-fashioned, or by the new fangled English surname by the more modern. Even the person themselves might alternate depending with whom or in what context they were talking. This theory is a bit scuppered by the fact that you say John Davies (Williams) was Llewelyn Davies. The Davies bit is alright of course, but may he have been William Llewelyn Davies, so the father's first name becomes the son's second name causing John Williams? Might this explain being unable to find the father's grave - or, of course, maybe he didn't have a headstone. Another theory is that there may be a step parent involved. Was John the elder son and if so are you sure Llewelyn Davies was his father or might he have married John's mother, either Williams herself (unmarried) or previously married to a Williams who died, and John sometimes took his real father's name or sometimes his step father's? Come to think, he wouldn't need to be the elder son for this to be true if Llewelyn Davies had married twice. Maybe all this is a total red herring but might trigger a better reply. Rhian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Margaret Crouch" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 10:03 PM Subject: [POWYS] Vaynor and surrounding area Can anyone help me sort out this puzzle? My g g grandfather was named John Davies and was born at Beacons/ Beccwns farm near Gelligaer in Glamorgan in about 1812. He married a Jane Watson in Gelligaer in 1842 though on the marriage certificate he gives his name as John Williams . They went to farm at Llandetty and then at Bodwigiad , Penderyn. The 1851 census has the family of John and Jane Williams living at Bodwigiad farm with their children Llewelyn (after his grandfather), Elizabeth and Gwenllian, all with the surname Williams. However their next child George was born at Bodwigiad in November 1852 and his birth certificate gives his surname as Davies and his parents as John Davies and Jane Davies formerly Watson. The 1861 census has Jane Davies as head of the household at Beccwns farm with no husband but with 2 more children, both born at Gelligaer, Glamorgan. I believe that Llewelyn Davies, father of John who changed his name then changed it back, was buried at Vaynor churchyard but when I went to look for his grave I couldn't find it. I did however find the grave of Llewelyn's son, John's brother, another Llewelyn who kept the Mount Pleasant Inn at Pentwyn, Vochriw, so I think there must be some family connection with Vaynor. Has anyone listed the Monumental Inscriptions for Vaynor Churchyard? Can anyone think of an explanation for the change of name and then the change back to what it was originally? Margaret =================== Visit the Powys Mailing List webpage at: www.jlb2005.plus.com/powyslist.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message