Maybe we can find Stanley in the census if the children's names are known. If you already posted the names, sorry. I came in late in the picture. Ruth ---------- Here's Florian, Stanley's brother. Supposedly their father Adam, was in Turner Falls. But I haven't been able to find him. 1930 United States Federal Census Name: Flere Dydel Home in 1930: Erving, Franklin, Massachusetts View Map Age: 41 Estimated birth year: abt 1889 Birthplace: Poland Relation to Head of House: Head Spouse's name: Catherine Dydel Race: White Occupation: Education: Military Service: Rent/home value: Age at first marriage: Parents' birthplace: View image Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Flere Dydel 41 Catherine Dydel 39 Anthony Dydel 18 Blanche Dydel 16 Joseph Dydel 14 Sophia Dydel 12 Charles Dydel 10 Helen Dydel 6 ---------- New York Passenger Lists, 1820-1957 Name: Florian Riedel Arrival Date: 14 Jul 1906 Birth Year: abt 1887 Age: 19 Gender: Male Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Polish Port of Departure: Hamburg Port of Arrival: New York, New York Ship Name: Batavia Search Ship Database: Search the Batavia in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database From--Russia--Polish--Dombrowa? To: Turner Falls, Mass. Relative: father Adam Riedel, Turner Falls, Mass. ------------ Hamburg Passenger Lists, 1850-1934 1906 > Direkt Band 180 (Jul 1906) image 6 Florian Riedel...Dombrowa? --------- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turners_Falls,_Massachusetts Turners Falls is an unincorporated village and census-designated place in the town of Montague in Franklin County, Massachusetts, United States.

Stanley seems to have had a brother Flor(ian?) Massachusetts Marriages, 1841-1915 Groom: Flinyan Rydel Groom's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Race (Original): Groom's Race (Standardized): Groom's Age: 19 years Groom's Estimated Birth Year: 1889 Groom's Birthplace: , , Russia Bride: Katagyna Kolimaga Bride's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Race (Original): Bride's Race (Standardized): Bride's Age: 17 years Bride's Estimated Birth Year: 1891 Bride's Birthplace: , , Russia Marriage Date (Original): 08 Sep 1908 Marriage Date (Standardized): 08 Sep 1908 Marriage Place: Montague, , Massachusetts Marriage Registration Place: Montague, , Massachusetts Marriage Registration Year: 1908 Groom's Father: Adam Rydel Groom's Father's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Father's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Mother: Katazyna Wuls Groom's Mother's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Mother's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Father: Adam Kolimaga Bride's Father's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Father's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Mother: Malgozata Moiefskia Bride's Mother's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Mother's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Marital Status: Bride's Marital Status: Film Number: 2315507 Digital Folder Number: 4329359 Image Number: 969 Number of Images: 1 Reference Number: p 39 no 45 1910 United States Federal Census Name: Flora Reidall [Flora Rendall] Age in 1910: 22 Estimated birth year: 1888 Birthplace: Russia Relation to Head of House: Boarder Father's Birth Place: Russia Mother's Birth Place: Russia Home in 1910: Montague, Franklin, Massachusetts Marital Status: Married Race: White Year of immigration: 1907 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Ki Joseph Guis 29 Annie Guis 27 Stanislaw Guis 4 Flora Reidall 22 Katherine Reidall 19 Bolesla Reidall 8/12[0] ---------- 1920 United States Federal Census Name: Flore Reda Home in 1920: Millers Falls, Franklin, Massachusetts Age: 32 Estimated birth year: abt 1888 Birthplace: Poland Relation to Head of House: Self (Head) [Head] Spouse's name: Katharina Reda Father's Birth Place: Poland Mother's Birth Place: Poland Marital Status: Married Race: White Sex: Male Home owned: Own Year of immigration: 1906 Able to read: No Able to Write: No Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Flore Reda 32 Katharina Reda 30 Polesla Reda 10 Antony Reda 8 Bronestava Reda 6 Joseph Reda 4 Sophie Reda 2 --------------- -------------- Is there any chance that Stanley moved his family to Illinois? World War I Draft Registration Cards, 1917-1918 Name: Stanislaw Rytel City: Chicago County: Cook State: Illinois Birthplace: Russia Birthplace: Zaecevo? Russia Birth Date: 8 May 1890 Race: Caucasian (White) FHL Roll Number: 1504080 DraftBoard: 85 Age: 27 Occupation: machinist Nearest Relative: Dependant: wife & 2 children Height/Build: med/med Color of Eyes/Hair: blue/brown Date: June 5,1917

https://beta.familysearch.org/#form=advanced-records Massachusetts Marriages, 1841-1915 Groom: Stanislaw Rydhll Groom's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Race (Original): Groom's Race (Standardized): Groom's Age: 22 years Groom's Estimated Birth Year: 1891 Groom's Birthplace: , , Russia Bride: Mary Boruk Bride's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Race (Original): Bride's Race (Standardized): Bride's Age: 20 years Bride's Estimated Birth Year: 1893 Bride's Birthplace: , , Russia Marriage Date (Original): 13 Jan 1913 Marriage Date (Standardized): 13 Jan 1913 Marriage Place: Montague, , Massachusetts Marriage Registration Place: Montague, , Massachusetts Marriage Registration Year: 1913 Groom's Father: Adam Rydhll Groom's Father's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Father's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Mother: Katie Kolos Groom's Mother's Titles & Terms (Original): Groom's Mother's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Father: John Boruk Bride's Father's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Father's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Bride's Mother: Mary Gotacholz Bride's Mother's Titles & Terms (Original): Bride's Mother's Titles & Terms (Standardized): Groom's Marital Status: Bride's Marital Status: Film Number: 2409945 Digital Folder Number: 4329370 Image Number: 469 Number of Images: 1 Reference Number: p 41 no 1

> I now know, he married a Mary Boruc/Boruk/Borek/Boruch. all of the children of Stanislaw and Mary have passed on , and we have no way to know the spelling. Sean, Don't get too worried about "the correct spelling," the only correct spelling would not be in English, all we have in the US records would be what someone said or wrote down based on what the name sounded like. When searching, we just have to hope the sites we use have liberal wild card and soundex options. And add Boruck to your list, a "ch" or "k" at the end of a surname can also be spelled "ck" in the US. I have been studying my Barusch family that came here, so consider Borush as well. Less likely to appear as the sound is different, but one never knows what the clerks may have recorded. Also you could find records filed as Barack, Baruch, etc. if someone misread the first vowel when a record was indexed.

sean creney wrote: > Marie, could I ask the source you looked at, does it give more > information then what I probably saw on Ellisisland.org? Sean, I have a subscription to ancestry.com, which is where I viewed the manifest (both pages). They're images of the same manifests as on ellisisland.org. -Marie

I believe he was married in the Miller's fall /Turner's fall area of Massachusetts. I just found out today from wife's family Stan married a Mary Boruc, Boruck/boruch. Sorry noone seems to know the spelling. I also did a search at the Mass records for military draft and benefits, he did not show up. Thanks for the push to the right direction. Sean > Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 14:22:47 -0500 > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [POLAND] Help with information on Stanislaw Rydel > > Debbie is right, census records are very important, and can possibly > answer a lot of your questions. The 1930 census gives age at first > marriage, 1910 gives years in present marriage. > > I would guess you also have some vague idea when Stanislaw married, > based on when his children were born? > > Another important document to get is his World War I Draft > Registration card, it would tell you if he was married by then and > might also have his birthplace recorded, which could be a valuable bit > of information, especially if he gives the gubernia. I don't think > that is available for free, the database for subscribers and sometimes > free at military holidays is: > > http://www.ancestry.com.au/search/db.aspx?dbid=6482 > > All men of his age were required to register, although I am not sure > if he enlisted on his own if a draft registration would have been > required. > > Also, it costs a lot, but if all else fails, ordering the Social > Security Application of any of Stanley's deceased children would tell > you what they said their mother's maiden name was. That is usually, > although not always, accurate. Of course, if they have passed away, > their birth or death certificates would be other options, and probably > less costly, although parental information on death certificates is > not always reliable. > > Social Security Death Index: > > http://ssdi.rootsweb.com > > On 12/9/10, sean creney <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name?My wife's great > > grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. > > Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? > > He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, is Stanislaw came to the USA > > in 1907 via the Kroonland on August 6th. It says on the official document he > > was heading to Turner Falls, Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid > > for the trip. My wife's Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father > > was stanley and died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife > > Mary, When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give > > more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden name. > > > > > > > > Thank you in advance > > > > Respectfully, > > Sean Creney > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Debbie, To answer some of the questions, from what I saw on Ellisisland.org, it says he was single. I have found Mary in a census, and I noticed Stanly as he was called later on was not part of the household. I know he married a Mary Borek/Boruch/Boruc. I am looking through photographs and some other documents to see what the correct spelling was. You all have been a great help, this is addicting especially when little clues help get you to go a little further. Sean > Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:32:24 -0600 > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [POLAND] Help with information on Stanislaw Rydel > > Sean, > > I think the term Poland/Russia is causing you confusion. You might > consider reading a little about the Partitions of Poland: > http://www.kasprzyk.demon.co.uk/www/history/index.html > > A section of Poland was ruled by Russia during the years you > mentioned. Of course Russia's rule lasted about 150 years prior to the > end of WWI. > > You can use Shtetlseeker to see how many and where the Da~browski > villages are in Poland: http://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/LocTown.asp > > Did the Passenger Arrival Record show that Stanisl~aw Rydel was > married or single when he arrived in the U.S.? > > Locating him on the U.S. census can help you determine when, if ever, > he became a citizen and when he married. > > Debbie > > > sean creney wrote: > > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name? My > wife's great grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, > Poland/Russia. Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it > have changed names ? He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, > is Stanislaw came to the USA in 1907 via the Kroonland on August > 6th. It says on the official document he was heading to Turner Falls, > Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid for the trip. My wife's > Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father was stanley and > died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife Mary, > When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give > more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden > name. > > > > > > Thank you in advance > > > > Respectfully, > > Sean Creney > > > >> > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you everyone all I could see was his father's name and that he was going to Turner falls while on Ellis Island.org. Marie, could I ask the source you looked at, does it give more information then what I probably saw on Ellisisland.org? I am not sure if there were more pages to view. All of you have been giving me great clues and some things seem to be panning out. I now know, he married a Mary Boruc/Boruk/Borek/Boruch. all of the children of Stanislaw and Mary have passed on , and we have no way to know the spelling. I am going to the town they were married to see what I can dig up. Everyone again Thank you , the leads that you have given me, got me out of the mud. Merry Christmas! Sean > Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 14:09:28 -0500 > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [POLAND] Help with information on Stanislaw Rydel > > sean creney wrote: > > manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia > > Sean, > > Stanislaw's manifest states his mother lived in Dombrowsky, Lomza, > Russia. This probably means he lived in "Dombrowsky" in the Lomza > powiat or gubernia. FWIW, both his last residence and his place of > birth on the manifest spell the village without the S in it: Dombrowky. > > Have you found these folks in US census records? You may be able to > determine an approximate year of marriage from them. One of the > questions on the 1930 census asked age when first married. > > -Marie > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Debbie is right, census records are very important, and can possibly answer a lot of your questions. The 1930 census gives age at first marriage, 1910 gives years in present marriage. I would guess you also have some vague idea when Stanislaw married, based on when his children were born? Another important document to get is his World War I Draft Registration card, it would tell you if he was married by then and might also have his birthplace recorded, which could be a valuable bit of information, especially if he gives the gubernia. I don't think that is available for free, the database for subscribers and sometimes free at military holidays is: http://www.ancestry.com.au/search/db.aspx?dbid=6482 All men of his age were required to register, although I am not sure if he enlisted on his own if a draft registration would have been required. Also, it costs a lot, but if all else fails, ordering the Social Security Application of any of Stanley's deceased children would tell you what they said their mother's maiden name was. That is usually, although not always, accurate. Of course, if they have passed away, their birth or death certificates would be other options, and probably less costly, although parental information on death certificates is not always reliable. Social Security Death Index: http://ssdi.rootsweb.com On 12/9/10, sean creney <[email protected]> wrote: > > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name?My wife's great > grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. > Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? > He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, is Stanislaw came to the USA > in 1907 via the Kroonland on August 6th. It says on the official document he > was heading to Turner Falls, Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid > for the trip. My wife's Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father > was stanley and died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife > Mary, When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give > more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden name. > > > > Thank you in advance > > Respectfully, > Sean Creney >

sean creney wrote: > manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia Sean, Stanislaw's manifest states his mother lived in Dombrowsky, Lomza, Russia. This probably means he lived in "Dombrowsky" in the Lomza powiat or gubernia. FWIW, both his last residence and his place of birth on the manifest spell the village without the S in it: Dombrowky. Have you found these folks in US census records? You may be able to determine an approximate year of marriage from them. One of the questions on the 1930 census asked age when first married. -Marie

Hi, Sean Creney wrote: > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name? The name can be of German linguistic origin. But since Germans resettled all over central and eastern Europe, I feel sure you can find people by that name in Poland, Russia, Ukraine, etc. The other possibility, if Polish origin is involved, would be a connection with the Polish noun _rydel_, a term for a narrow shovel with a sharp point. At least, those are the two origins suggested by the late Polish name expert Prof. Kazimierz Rymut in his book on Polish surnames. As is so often the case, a surname, by itself, tells you nothing useful. It could be Polish. It could be German. It could be borne by descendants of Germans who settled in Poland or Russia or elsewhere. Surnames, by themselves, are usually disappointing in terms of how much useful information they convey. Put a surname and a place name together, however, and you've got something! So let's go on to the next part of the note: > My wife's great grandfather ships manifest states he was > from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. Does anyone know > where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? The name certainly could have been changed. But the form _Dombrowsky_ looks like a German phonetic spelling of a word Poles would spell _dabrowski_, where the A is a nasal vowel written with a little tail under it and pronounced much like -om-. Germans, hearing Poles pronounce that word, would not use the nasal A because there is no such character in their language; so they'd spell it as it sounded to them, -om-. It's pretty likely the word started out as _dabrowski_ (with Polish nasal A), but somewhere on the way out of the country, the emigrant dealt with German officials -- which was quite common -- and the spelling was modified. But the fact the name does have that -om- strongly indicates the name is Polish. Only the Poles retained the nasal sounds in the original Slavic mother tongue, and so the word for "oak grove" in Polish is _dabrowa_ (the first A is nasal, the second is not). Other Slavic languages replaced the nasal sound with other sounds, most often U. So if this place were in Russia, for instance, the name would be more like Dubravsky. The presence of -om- rather than -u- in the first syllable is a pretty good indication of Polish linguistic origin, since no one but Poles put an "om" sound in that first syllable. Most likely, therefore, this place was in the part of Poland seized by the Russian Empire in the late 18th century, and ruled by Moscow until after World War I. The use of the adjectival form, _dabrowski_ instead of _Dabrowa_, may indicate it came from a Polish usage such as _powiat dabrowski_ or _gmina dabrowska_, "Dabrowa county" or "Dabrowa district." Now the bad news -- there are literally hundreds of places in Poland with names such as Dabrowa, Dabrowka, Dabrowy, and so on. Without more info, it's virtually impossible to know which one this person came from. I had thought there were two possibilities worth looking at. There are villages called Dabrowskie in northeastern Poland near Suwalki, one 7 km, north of Oleck, the other 13 km southeast of Elk. But unless I'm very much mistaken, those areas were in East Prussia, not Russian Poland. So chances are they are not the relevant in this case. One area that might be worth considering is Dabrowa Bialostocka, near Bialystok in northeastern Poland. That area WAS under Russian rule, and Dabrowa Bialostocka was/is a big enough town that someone coming from that area might have "dabrowski" on his paperwork, in the sense "district of Dabrowa [Bialostocka]." Given how many Dabrowa's there are, it may be silly to focus on one. But that's the one I'd try first. I've heard of this place often because quite a few members of the Polish Genealogical Society of Connecticut and the Northeast have roots in that area, including perhaps the foremost American expert on Polish genealogy, Jonathan D. Shea. Many's the time I've seen someone come up to Jonathan and say "My great-grandfather settled in _ in the Northeast, and we think he was from Russian Poland" -- and Jonathan promptly said "If he lived in _ in this country, he probably came from _ in Poland." He seems to carry in his head the place associations valid for most Poles in northeastern America! So I think Jonathan and the other folks of PGSCTNE might be worth contacting. The Website is www.pgsctne.org. As I say, this is a long shot. But I think it's worth taking. All things being equal, someone described as coming from "Dombrowsky" just might be from the Dabrowa Bialostocka area. If so, chances are decent Jonathan or someone else from PGSCTNE can point you in the right direction. Who knows, they may even have family members entered in various PGSCTNE databases. It can't hurt to ask! That's my two cents' worth. I hope it's some help, and wish you the best of luck with your research. Fred Hoffman www.fredhoff.com

Sean, I think the term Poland/Russia is causing you confusion. You might consider reading a little about the Partitions of Poland: http://www.kasprzyk.demon.co.uk/www/history/index.html A section of Poland was ruled by Russia during the years you mentioned. Of course Russia's rule lasted about 150 years prior to the end of WWI. You can use Shtetlseeker to see how many and where the Da~browski villages are in Poland: http://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/LocTown.asp Did the Passenger Arrival Record show that Stanisl~aw Rydel was married or single when he arrived in the U.S.? Locating him on the U.S. census can help you determine when, if ever, he became a citizen and when he married. Debbie sean creney wrote: > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name? My wife's great grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, is Stanislaw came to the USA in 1907 via the Kroonland on August 6th. It says on the official document he was heading to Turner Falls, Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid for the trip. My wife's Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father was stanley and died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife Mary, When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden name. > > > Thank you in advance > > Respectfully, > Sean Creney > >>

I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name?My wife's great grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, is Stanislaw came to the USA in 1907 via the Kroonland on August 6th. It says on the official document he was heading to Turner Falls, Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid for the trip. My wife's Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father was stanley and died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife Mary, When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden name. Thank you in advance Respectfully, Sean Creney > > > > -- > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sean, A search at http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/rydel.html shows this data for Rydel with one 'l' • Ostroľeka (143) • Varšava (68) • Oľštyn (67) • ŠŤitno (66) • Novy Dvór Mazovecki (61) • Koľno (53) • Ľaňcut (47) • Sochačev (46) • Hrubešóv (36) • zachodni Varšava (36) Kuba On Dec 9, 2010, at 10:44 PM, sean creney wrote: > > I guess my questions are is Rydell, a Polish or russian name?My wife's great grandfather ships manifest states he was from Dombrowsky, Poland/Russia. Does anyone know where that might be located? Could it have changed names ? He was born around 1890. The things I do, know, is Stanislaw came to the USA in 1907 via the Kroonland on August 6th. It says on the official document he was heading to Turner Falls, Ma. It also states his father Adam Rydel paid for the trip. My wife's Grandfather was from turnerfalls, I know his father was stanley and died in 1968, I can't seem to find, when he married his wife Mary, When he became a naturalized citizen. I was hoping that it might give more information on his naturalazitoin records I don't know her maiden name. > > > Thank you in advance > > Respectfully, > Sean Creney > >> >> >> >> -- >>> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] >> ---------------------------------- >> Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. >> ---------------------------------- >> Browse the list's archives here: >> http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots >> Search the list's archives here: >> http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Kuba Przedzienkowski

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: marie yeager <[email protected]> Date: Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [POLAND] Possibly off topic, Balbern To: [email protected] Thanks Debbie, And thanks PD, > Marie: Well, it appears he was in "sniffin' distance" between 1900 and > 1904. Unless she went to NYC/Long Island to work as a maid, I would start in > PA. Philly indexes are online at LDS (if my brain hasn't been freeze dried). > Someone with expertise in Chester will have to advise for there. > I agree, that some how between 1900 and 1904 there should be something on this couple. I have yet to find it, and have not yet been able to locate anything on via lds as aside from a marriage in 1904 of which i have no idea of the local I am spinning my wheels there. I have an email in to the Presbyterian church closest to the 1900 residence. It appears to be an old parish, and as Caroline (my GG grandmother was married in a presbyterian church in Glasgow figure it may help to determine exactly when the family left for Philadelphia.) Caroline was in Philly by 1910, and Annabelle was by this time in Nassau County New York married to andrew with children. > > There are also missing children: 1910 says married 6 years and she had 3 > children, two living (Caroline & Anna M) so---who was missing child and > where is Anna in 1920? > Children listed are all born on Long Island. > In an attempt to simplify this a little, Andrew Hoffman and Annabelle Dougherty were my Great Grandparents. My grandmother passed away almost 6 months ago leaving us with little to go on. Caroline and Anna M listed on the 1910 census were her sisters. 1920 will reflect a Viola and Andrew. As to the missing child on the 1910 census I have no clue, and she/he had never been mentione to my knowldege. They had all passed away some years ago my grandmother was the youngest child in the family and Supposedly named after her deceased sister Anna (reflected on the 1910 census.) This family has a very strange history, I have no clue as to how to keep it simple but will try. Anna M listed in the 1910 census died as a child. I anticipate between 1910 and 1915 as she is on the 1910 census but not on andrews 1915 naturalization papers. I have an email out to the clerks office in the area as to the possible locations of the death documents for that period as the families exact location although within about 10 miles falls within mulitple municipalities. Add to the confusion, Viola can be found in the 1930 census (although the rest of the family is lost in 1930) "married" to Fred Dougherty in the Philly area. Yep, confusing but true. > > You've done well to get them from 1920 back to 1900. I would search Andrew > in Long Island 1900 or Philly/Chester. > I have an email out to the parish closest to the 1900 residence, I am hoping they can direct me in the correct direction. I agree that it will be in PA that I find Andrew met Annabelle. I do believe Andrew was Lutheran, however it seems there was no strict practice of religion in the family. > > WWI Draft listing is no help, but you are aware that the Rotterdam (look > under Holland in LDS)emigration lists give place of origin or at least where > the ticket was sold??? Check the LDS database for the years and film > numbers, unless they have put them online. There was some talk about them > being digitized. > Thanks for the tip. That I was unaware of, and will check into promptly. > And if you don't have it already, Annabelle's birth record should be > relatively easy to get using Free BMD since you have her month and year of > birth. > Annabelle according to Andrews Naturalization papers was born in Newcastle England. As I only recieved his papers two weeks ago, I have been searching for this since. I do on the other hand have her mother Carolines Scottish line documented in parish records back to the 1700's. But that family is another story and as it is not polish, will let it alone for now. Thanks All for the suggestions and direction. Marie -- Marie A. Yeager Sales Pelican Marine Center Inc.

*RESEARCHER* APPLICATIONS DUE DECEMBER 31, 2010 The Museum's Center for Advanced Holocaust Studies is creating a series of sources on the history of the Holocaust, including the five-volume set *Jewish Responses to Persecution, 1933–1946* as well as independent volumes on a variety of topics. In support of this effort, the Center is seeking a qualified researcher to assist staff scholars with the editing, translation, and contextualization of Holocaust-related sources. The researcher will be particularly involved in work on volumes III–V in the *Jewish Responses to Persecution *series, which cover 1941 to 1946. The researcher will conduct surveys of Museum archival collections and library holdings and will contribute to the processing and contextualizing of relevant material under the supervision of staff scholars. Work is to begin on or after February 1, 2011. Applicants must hold graduate degrees and have experience in historical research and writing, as well as knowledge of the Holocaust. They must also have excellent writing skills in English and a thorough reading knowledge of Polish or Yiddish; knowledge of other central- or eastern-European languages is desirable. The researcher will not be hired as an employee of the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, but will perform the work on a contract basis. The initial contract will be for six months, with extensions possible. Payment will be between $1,500 and $3,000 per month depending upon the researcher’s education and experience. The researcher will also have the opportunity to participate in Center and Museum events such as colloquia, seminars, workshops, fellows’ discussions, and lectures. To apply, please send a cover letter indicating your dates of availability, along with a curriculum vitae, two academic references, and a short writing sample (no more than 1,200 words) by December 31, 2010, to: Jürgen Matthäus, Ph.D. Director, Applied Research Scholars United States Holocaust Memorial Museum Center for Advanced Holocaust Studies 100 Raoul Wallenberg Place, SW Washington, DC 20024-2126 To submit your application electronically, please e-mail [email protected] .

PD, Nice! Debbie [email protected] wrote: > --- On Tue, 12/7/10, marie yeager <[email protected]> wrote: > >> His Arrival was on >> the Spaarndam out of Rotterdam. > >> Debbie, Regarding Andrews Naturalization Papers. His >> declaration off intent> was filed in 1909 in Mineola NY. By this time he had> married a Scot/English> woman by the name of Annabelle Dougherty from Philadelphia. >> By the time he> filed his petition for naturalization in 1915 his paperwork> listed his wife> Annabelle (Anna) Daughters Caroline Theresa, and Viola May> and Son Andrew> Jr. >> >> I have been unable to locate a marriage record for >> Andrew and Annabelle, as> I have no idea as to where, when or how they met. >> Annabelle can be located> in East Tredyfrin PA in 1900, I have not been able to> locate any definitive> location of Andrew/Andreas in 1900. > > Marie: Well, it appears he was in "sniffin' distance" between 1900 and 1904. Unless she went to NYC/Long Island to work as a maid, I would start in PA. Philly indexes are online at LDS (if my brain hasn't been freeze dried). Someone with expertise in Chester will have to advise for there. > > There are also missing children: 1910 says married 6 years and she had 3 children, two living (Caroline & Anna M) so---who was missing child and where is Anna in 1920? > Children listed are all born on Long Island. > > You've done well to get them from 1920 back to 1900. I would search Andrew in Long Island 1900 or Philly/Chester. > > WWI Draft listing is no help, but you are aware that the Rotterdam (look under Holland in LDS)emigration lists give place of origin or at least where the ticket was sold??? Check the LDS database for the years and film numbers, unless they have put them online. There was some talk about them being digitized. > > And if you don't have it already, Annabelle's birth record should be relatively easy to get using Free BMD since you have her month and year of birth. > > Have fun. > > [email protected] >

--- On Tue, 12/7/10, marie yeager <[email protected]> wrote: > His Arrival was on > the Spaarndam out of Rotterdam.  > Debbie, Regarding Andrews Naturalization Papers.  His > declaration off intent> was filed in 1909 in Mineola NY. By this time he had> married a Scot/English> woman by the name of Annabelle Dougherty from Philadelphia. > By the time he> filed his petition for naturalization in 1915 his paperwork> listed his wife> Annabelle (Anna) Daughters Caroline Theresa, and Viola May> and Son Andrew> Jr. > > I have been unable to locate a marriage record for  > Andrew and Annabelle, as> I have no idea as to where, when or how they met.  > Annabelle can be located> in East Tredyfrin PA in 1900, I have not been able to> locate any definitive> location of Andrew/Andreas in  1900. Marie: Well, it appears he was in "sniffin' distance" between 1900 and 1904. Unless she went to NYC/Long Island to work as a maid, I would start in PA. Philly indexes are online at LDS (if my brain hasn't been freeze dried). Someone with expertise in Chester will have to advise for there. There are also missing children: 1910 says married 6 years and she had 3 children, two living (Caroline & Anna M) so---who was missing child and where is Anna in 1920? Children listed are all born on Long Island. You've done well to get them from 1920 back to 1900. I would search Andrew in Long Island 1900 or Philly/Chester. WWI Draft listing is no help, but you are aware that the Rotterdam (look under Holland in LDS)emigration lists give place of origin or at least where the ticket was sold??? Check the LDS database for the years and film numbers, unless they have put them online. There was some talk about them being digitized. And if you don't have it already, Annabelle's birth record should be relatively easy to get using Free BMD since you have her month and year of birth. Have fun. [email protected]

Marie, BTW This is the perfect forum for your inquiry! That's why Poland Roots is here. Can you provide a link to Andrew Hoffman's Passenger Arrival Record? I couldn't seem to locate it online. I assume that you've verified that the Andrew Hoffman whose Declaration of Intent you located is indeed your ancestor: "Regarding Andrews Naturalization Papers. His declaration off intent was filed in 1909 in Mineola NY. By this time he had married a Scot/English woman by the name of Annabelle Dougherty from Philadelphia. By the time he filed his petition for naturalization in 1915 his paperwork listed his wife Annabelle (Anna) Daughters Caroline Theresa, and Viola May and Son Andrew Jr." Have you located Andrew and the family on any census records? Since Andrew's petition lists some children, does it also list the year the oldest was born? That would give you a range (1900 - ) to look for a marriage record, probably in Pennsylvania. Even though people "don't know" or "don't remember" there is a paper trail to follow. You start with one and work backwards. those people who are alive certainly know when their parents' married. Locate those church marriage records and/or the marriage license _application_ and then go back from there, locating baptismal records (not just a certificate), and so on. Andrew Hoffman was considered an adult so he was allowed to travel alone though other people from his village may have been on the same ship making the experience not so traumatic. My own gr.aunt came over at age 16 (though she's listed as being older) and every once in awhile I think how brave she was to make the trip alone. I can't imagine myself doing that (some 40+ years ago). In fact, I can't imagine today's youth making the trip alone! I also find it interesting when a Pole, for example, marries someone in the U.S. who is yet another country. I guess love (and broken English) is the great communicator. <grin> A how-to book that explains the paper trail is: _GOING HOME: A Guide to Polish American Family History Research_, by Jonathan D. Shea: http://www.langline.com/GoingHome.htm Debbie marie yeager wrote: > Thank you both Brownyn and Debbie, > > I never expected to be consulting with this list regarding my mothers side > of the family. > > Debbie, Andrew arrived April 23,1894 according to his passenger list. His > declaration of intent states April 24, 1893. I have found no evidence that > 1893 could be correct and surmise that the passenger list is correct as the > date and ship are in alignment, only the year is off. > > Having been born 11/28/1878, this would mean he was only about 15 1/2 years > old at the time of arrival. (passenger record lists 16). His Arrival was on > the Spaarndam out of Rotterdam. In viewing the passenger list it appears > but not certain that he could have been travelling with another young man > named Karl Heyeman about the same name as andrew and perhaps a woman named > Anna Dambacher aged 26. It may be coincidence, I did figure it worth looking > into as they are the only three listed as german, listed together, and all > three destined for simply New York on this page. So far I have yet to find > these two other names connected in any way to Andrew. > > Debbie, Regarding Andrews Naturalization Papers. His declaration off intent > was filed in 1909 in Mineola NY. By this time he had married a Scot/English > woman by the name of Annabelle Dougherty from Philadelphia. By the time he > filed his petition for naturalization in 1915 his paperwork listed his wife > Annabelle (Anna) Daughters Caroline Theresa, and Viola May and Son Andrew > Jr. > > I have been unable to locate a marriage record for Andrew and Annabelle, as > I have no idea as to where, when or how they met. Annabelle can be located > in East Tredyfrin PA in 1900, I have not been able to locate any definitive > location of Andrew/Andreas in 1900. > > Sadly the last remaining person who may have been able to shed some light on > this passed away several months ago, however even before her passing the > infamous claims of "I dont know" or "I dont remember" seemed to be the > answer to any questions that were asked. I am thankful for what little > information I have been able to obtain to this point. I surely did not > anticipate to find Andrews birth location to be East Prussia. > > Thank you both again for the suggestions. > > On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Debbie Greenlee <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Marie, >> >> Didn't your gr.grandfather's Petition for Naturalization of >> Declaration of Intent list his place of birth as well as the others in >> his family who were being naturalized under his name? >> >> In what year did Andrew Hoffman become a citizen? >> >> Kaliningrad didn't receive this name until after WWII. It was >> Konigsberg when occupied by the Germans (East Prussia). >> In Polish it was Krolewiec. >> >> The town was pretty much destroyed during WWII but that doesn't mean >> there aren't records somewhere. consider contacting the Polish Civil >> Archives and ask them where the vital records are. You can write in >> English but their response will be in Polish. >> >> Naczelna Dyrekcja Archiwów Pan'stwowych >> ul. Rakowiecka 2D >> 02-517 Warszawa >> Poland >> >> email: [email protected] >> >> Debbie >> >> >> > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at [email protected] > ---------------------------------- > Discussion of Polish food, culture, and customs are welcome on the list as long as the discussion stays pertinent to the topic of this list: researching our Polish roots. > ---------------------------------- > Browse the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=poland-roots > Search the list's archives here: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?aop=1 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

sean creney wrote: > I found some pictures in my wife's family album. Unfortunetally, It's in Polish, and no one in the family speaks it now. I was wondering if someone could help? What is the policy on Pictures in the emails? I am hoping to have a clue of where in Poland they might have originated. Also, In the pictures there is one with two soldiers. I wasn't sure if anyone knew if they possibly could be Polish soldiers. > I will post when I am told about the policy of putting pics in the emails. Sean, Because RootsWeb lists distribute mail in plain text only (to prevent the spread of virus or other infectious content), RootsWeb cannot process attachments. You can upload the image to a web site of your choice and then provide a link (URL) to the image on the list. RootsWeb message boards allow attachments (image files and gedcoms), so you could post a message to the pertinent message board at http://boards.rootsweb.com/ Once you have chosen the appropriate board to which to post (surname board is the best place), click on "Begin New Thread" below the name of the board. To add an attachment to your post, click the "Attach a File" link then click on the "browse" button to locate the file you wish to attach. If you would like to post multiple attachments, click on the "Attach another file" link located below your first attachment. To remove an attachment before posting your message, click on the "remove" link next to it. -Marie