Bob, if you are defining "evidence" as primary church or civil rec for Johannes ZEH in Oppenhiem, you are correct. I only have Henry Jones bk citing he was "of Oppenheim"' I have not seen or searched any Oppenheim or Alzey documents. Nor have I seen any primary rec from the Hudson Camps, Schoharie... All my info comes from authors a la Simmendiger, MacWelty, Jones, Kocherthal, Knittle, Barker... I have not found him on any ship lists from London to NY or any dock listings of his arr at NY. I hear your critique of my notes and do not disagree. My notes are a carry over from many yrs of hard copies, PAF and the current version of FTM. Did I ans everything? And your suggestions for validating my weakly supported line? Thanks for your interest. Hal McCawley 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760.941.4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: "bob gillis" <robertgillis@verizon.net> To: "PFALZ" <PFALZ@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [Pfalz] Oppenheim Church Records > Hal McCawley wrote: > > I would appreciate your thoughts. > Best, > Hal McCawley > >> Thanks Bob for your interest. Please find below my eldest fam sheet >> and notes for my Johannes ZEH fam. >> I believe they were in the Alzey/Oppenheim area bef 1700, came down >> the Rhine with the 1710 Palatinates, appear on sporadic lists in >> Holland, London, NYC, the camps along the Hudson, and settled at >> Schoharie. While most of the fam stayed in Schoharie area, his son >> (my gf) George went on to Tolpehochen Cr in present day Lebanon Co, PA >> in the 1720s, then on to Hardy Co, WV by 1750 where they changed their >> name to SEE. > > > I cannot see that your have any evidence that your ancestor Johannes Zee > lived or was born in Oppenheim. Much of your information comes from > other researchers and does not show their sources. I cannot tell what > source covers what event. > > Apparently you are using PAF. I suggest that you get a genealogy > program such as Legac, TMG, Rootsmagic or even a late version of FTM > that allows you to enter Events/Tags, such as emigration and immigration > for other than BMDBs and allows you to cite sources for events and not > just have them as notes for a person. > > Have you found a source that tells when Johannes entered America? > > Se other notes embedded. > >> >> Descendants of Johannes ZEH >> 1 Johannes Zeh 1672 - 1750 b: 1672 in Oppenheim, Palatinate, Germany >> d: Bef. >> 07 Jul 1750 in Schoharie, NY >> >> .. +Anna Magdalena 1672 - 1750 b: 1672 in Germany d: 07 Jul 1750 in >> Weiserdorf, Schoharie, NY m: 1693 in Oppenheim, Rudelsheim, Germany >> >> .......... 2 Johan George See 1690 - 1751 b: Bef. 1690 in [My gf] >> Oppenheim, Palatinate, Germany d: 1751 in Hardy, VA not WV. > > > You should enter places as they were when the event occurred > >> >> >> .............. Margaret Tschudi 1690 - 1757 b: Abt. 1690 in Frenkendorf, >> Basel, Switz d: 1757 in Hardy, WV m: Abt. 1709 in NY? >> >> .......... 2 Johannes Gerhardt Zeh 1703/04 - 1710 b: 17 Feb 1703/04 in >> Ruhlsheim, Germany d: Bef. 1710 > > > His name would be Johan Gerhardt Zeh Johannes is equivalent to Johan > Johan > >> >> >> .......... 2 Ignatius Zeh 1706 - 1710 b: 14 Aug 1706 in >> Rudelsheim,Germany >> d: Bef. 1710 >> >> .......... 2 Johannes Petrus Zeh 1708/09 - 1710 b: 09 Jan 1708/09 in >> Rudlehiem, Germany d: Bef. 1710 >> >> .......... 2 Johan Adam Zeh 1710 - 1771 b: 29 Sep 1710 in West Camp, >> Ulster, >> NY d: 15 Dec 1771 in Schoharie, Schoharie, NY >> >> .............. +Anna Meier 1726 - b: 1726 m: 16 Aug 1750 in St. Paul Luth >> Ch, Schoharie, NY >> >> .......... 2 Christian Zeh 1716 - 1763 b: Abt. 1716 in Schoharie, NY >> d: 13 >> Sep 1763 in Schoharie, NY >> >> .............. +Anna Sophia Lawyer 1713/14 - 1759 b: 12 Feb 1713/14 d: 22 >> Apr 1759 in Schoharie, NY m: 05 Apr 1750 in St Pauls Luth Ch, Schoharie, >> Schoharie, NY >> >> .......... 2 Johannes Zeh 1717 - 1748 b: Abt. 1717 in Schoharie, >> Schoharie, >> NY d: Abt. 1748 in Schoharie, Schoharie, NY >> >> .............. +Anna Catharina Bellinger 1720 - 1751 b: Abt. 1720 in >> Schoharie, NY d: Apr 1751 in Schoharie, NY m: 03 Mar 1737/38 in Schoharie >> Ref Ch, Schoharie, NY >> >> .......... *2nd Wife of Johannes Zeh: >> >> .............. +Maria Elizabeth Bellinger 1713 - b: Abt. 1713 in NY m: >> Aft. >> 31 Mar 1751 in Schoharie, NY >> >> .......... 2 Maria Margareths Zeh 1718 - b: Abt. 1718 in Schohaire, >> Schoharie, NY >> >> .............. +Marcus Bellinger 1682 - 1746 b: Abt. 1682 in Germany >> d: Bef. >> 20 May 1746 m: 11 Oct 1737 in Loonenburg Ch, Schoharie, Schoharie, NY >> >> .......... 2 Maria Barbara Zeh 1720 - b: Abt. 1720 in Schoharie, >> Schoharie, >> NY >> >> .............. +Frederick Carl Schell 1715 - 1798 b: Abt. 1715 in >> Bissinger, >> Wirdebergerlant, Germany d: 19 Jan 1798 m: 27 Dec 1738 in Schoharie >> Ref Ch, >> Schoharie, NY >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Footnotes for Johannes ZEH: >> !ANCESTOR CHART: Recd from Betty Jane See James dated 3 Feb 1992. >> >> !ANCESTOR SHEET & FAMILY SHEETS: Recd 4 Aug 1992 from descendant James >> Nugen, 20350 Hole-in-One #115, Redding, Ca 96002. Cites Johannes >> living in >> St. Catherine's, France on 2 June 1709 with 3 children and in 1717 >> living in >> Weisersdorf in Schoharie, NY with 4 children. >> >> "LONDON CHURCH BOOKS AND THE GERMAN EMIGRATION OF 1709." I find no >> mention >> of the name ZEH, any spelling. by JOHN P. DERN . 1/07 "akstaub" >> <akstaub@comcast.net <mailto:akstaub@comcast.net>> >> >> Hunter Subsistence Lists starting with >> 1 July 1710 is the first I find Johannes Zeh listed. There he owes >> for 3 >> adults, himself and ?(not listed). >> 4th Oct 1710 he owes for1 adult and 1 child. >> By "ye One and Thirieth" of December (note:the 31st) he either moved >> or was >> moved to the Mannor Livingston and he was assessed for 3 adults and 1 >> child. >> They are evidently not in order because the next notation is dated >> 25 Dec 1710 and he was assessed for 3 adults and 2 children. >> 24 June 1711 still at Livingston, assessed for 3 adults and one child. >> 29 Sept 1711 assessed 3 and 1. >> 24 Dec 1711, > same 3 & 1. >> There are four more entries and they stop at 13 Sept 1712. All are >> for 3 >> adults and 1 child. 1/07 "akstaub" <akstaub@comcast.net >> <mailto:akstaub@comcast.net>> >> >> Simmendinger Register. It states only the following: " ZEH, >> JOHANNES (6) >> and MAGDALENA with 4 children." [Note: the numeral 6 following the >> name indicates Johannes was found at the camp >> "NEW STUTTGART". 1/07 "akstaub" <akstaub@comcast.net >> <mailto:akstaub@comcast.net>>] >> >> !Book of Names" by Lou MacWelty 1969 @ P-72 lists Johannes ZEHE on >> Hunters >> List @ East Camp as "Soldiers in Canadian Exposition of 1711", >> P-75/100 has >> 4 lists totaling 6520 names of Palatines in London in 1709 with List 3 >> P-101 >> dated 2 Jun 1709 at St Catherines has John ZEG, h&w, age 42, Catholic >> with 3 >> sons aged 1, 6, & 1/2 ( it is believed the 1/2 s/b 11). >> <http://www.fortklock.com/names1709thirdlist.htm> >> >> !"The Palatine Families of NY" by Hank Jones 1985. P-1126/9 lists >> history of >> Johannes ZEHE (Hunters List # 838), wife Magdalena & 9 children from >> Oppenheim, Platinate,Germany, 1710 Immigration, Schoharie, NY on down >> to his >> death 7 Jul 1751. One of the 9 is listed as 'iv, "A Child" bapt 2 Oct >> 1742 >> (Schoharie Ref. Chbk.) This "child" may have been Adam, a s/o >> Johannes, who >> md. Margaretha Eckhardt 1 Mar 1767 (Schoharie Luth Chbk) (HJ)' >> >> !"More Palatine Families" by Henry Z Jones 1991. P-410 states Johannes >> SECH >> was a Palatine from Popery when he was admitted to the Lord's Supper in >> Protestant Communion at the Lutheran Church at Savoy in London shortly >> after >> 9 Oct 1709. >> >> !"The Kocherthal Records" by J Christian Krahmer Oct 1926. P-17 Lists >> Johannes and Anna Magdalena ZECH at 29 Sep 1710 bapt of son Johan Adam in >> NY. P-72 lists Johannes ZEHE on Gov Hunters 1711 Ration lists at East >> Camp. >> >> !"Early Eighteenth Century Palatine Emigration" by W A Knittle. P-252 >> lists >> Hans Pieter SOUS and Johannes SOUS with Vrou among 2nd Palatine Party >> sailing on 23 May 1709 from Holland to London. P-291 has NY Substance >> Lists >> with Johannes ZEHE listed in 1710 with 3 over 10 yrs age and 0 under, >> and in >> 1712 with 3 over and 1 under 10 yrs age. P-299 shows Simmendinger >> Register >> with Johannes ZEH ca 1717 with wife Magdalena and 4 children in >> New-Stuttgardt (Weiserdorf), Schoharie Valley, NY. P-203 has story of >> Magdalena ZEH as self appointed captain of 1715 Schoharie Uprising. >> >> !PEDIGREE: P-325 of "Early Families of Schoharie Co. NY" by Wm Barker >> 1985 >> (unpublished) lists 4 generations of descendants citing Hank Jones' >> books. >> >> PEDIGREE: Rec 4/2002 from descendant John ZEH <JohnZeh1@mindspring.com >> <mailto:JohnZeh1@mindspring.com>> > > > > > ********* > Information for list members: > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/DEU/PFALZ.html > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > PFALZ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.19/663 - Release Date: 2/1/2007 > 2:28 PM > >