Dear Lurking, Your "help the poor" or went back to a middle stage of Halloween. The "holiday" as we know it began when the Christians in Ireland wanted to convert the pagans. Halloween was Samhain (Sp?), the Celtic New Year. According to their belief, the old year was over at sundown and the new year did not begin till sunrise on the next day. Therefore, the time between was "out of time" and an occasion for the Fey to come more easily into "our" world. The Fey were NOT cute little fairies dancing on flower petals, they were big nasty creatures who took delight in messing up the lives of mortals. Self respecting pagans stayed home with their doors locked. As a demonstration that they were protected by "Jesus and all the saints," Christians dressed up and actually dared to go out on this dangerous night. The Catholic Church -- following an old established technique of overlaying a pagan holiday with a Christian one -- announced that henceforth that day would be "All Saints Day." (To be followed the next day by All Souls Day -- they didn't want to leave anybody out!) It was apparently relatively successful as a conversion technique. (Not that the Irish really completely gave up their conviction that there really were fey and little people still out there waiting to create mischief.) From there, there was a period when the poor went around from door to door with the phrase "help the poor." They were supposed to be given "circles of bread" (donuts???) -- a symbol of eternity. (Did this mean that they were to be eternally poor or that there would be bread eternally???? I have no idea who came up with the idea or why. I always thought it was a bit weird.) I think the "trick or treat" stage is American. I don't know exactly how it got started here, but I suspect that the Irish immigrants carried it over as a custom which got somewhat tilted along the way. I don't know if you have people in the north who claim that Halloween is a "Pagan" holiday (a contridiction in terms, surely, since "holiday" is a contraction of Holy Day) and that all Christians should therefore stay home with their doors locked until the evil associated with this night is safely over. Sound familiar??? Incidentally, for some reason Americans didn't seem to pick up on the practice of going around on St. Stephens Day (the day after Christmas) with a dead bird (or immitation thereof) saying, "The wren is dead, the wren is dead, A penny for it's head." Barbara joycestevens@juno.com wrote: > > After listening to all children this evening threatening to Trick or > Treat, I can only wonder what happened to "help the poor?" Is/was this > second phrase one used by post depression babies (me?) in the Midwest or > are there no poor people any more? > Just curious. > Lurking in Livonia > > ==== PENNA-DUTCH Mailing List ==== > New? Looking for a quick connection? Visit the surnames list associated with this mail list at http://members.aol.com/PennaDutch/pdlsurnames.html