Joel, Thanks for that information. I do not seriously doubt what you say. However, some argue that John Thomas Pate married in 1864 in Dooly County. The marriage record that I found definitely did say 1864, and the marriage record was from Dooly County. Was there a John Pate who married a Henrietta (ANYBODY) in Dooly County in the mid-1860s, that you know of? Jeremy ******************************************************************************* >From: "Joel Pate" <patej@nettally.com> >Reply-To: PATE-L@rootsweb.com >To: PATE-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [PATE GENEALOGY] John Thomas Pate married Henrietta Kirkland 1867 >in Wilcox Co GA >Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 14:14:28 -0500 > >Jeremy: >I think that John Thomas Pate married Henrietta KIRKLAND in Wilcox Co GA 19 >Jan 1867. The copy of the marriage license you have should give you a clue >as to when and where it was issued and when the marriage ceremony was >perform and by whom. I have information that indicates a John Owen(s) JIC >(Judge of the Inferior Court) married them probably in Wilcox Co GA. > >It is entirely possible that the Clerk who issued the license recorded her >surname as KIRKLING. These types of errors are why we have cousins who >spell their surname as PAIT or PAYTE. > >I believe that Henrietta Kirkland was the daughter of Irwin Kirkland (b 16 >Mar 1816-d ca 1867) and Cynthia Coleman (b 27 Sep 1816) Irwin Kirkland and >Cynthia Coleman married in GA some time prior to the birth of Henrietta >Kirkland in 1847. Henrietta Kirkland would have been approximately age 2 or >3 in the 1850 census of GA. > >Consider this household in the 1850 census of Emanuel Co GA >Page 450B, Dist 28, site 94/94 [22 Aug 1850] >Irvin Kirkland----------34 W/M b GA >Sinthy Kirkland-------33 W/F b GA (Cynthia Coleman) >Elizabeth Kirkland--10 W/F b GA >Ivy Kirkland------------- 5 W/M b GA >Henrietta Kirkland--- 2 W/F b GA >Remer Kirkland------9m W/M b GA > >Also consider the 1870 census of Wilcox Co GA. If John Thomas Pate married >Henrietta Kirkland on 1867 in Wilcox Co GA, they probably would have been >enumerated in the 1870 census of Wilcox Co GA. >Consider Page 211, House Creek Dist, site 363/360 >John Pate------------22 W/M b GA 1848 >Henrietta Pate-----21 W/F b GA 1849 >Cinthia Pate--------- 2 W/F b GA 1868 > >In that era it was customary to name the first born daughter for the >maternal grandmother. Cynthia Jane Pate b ca 1868 was named for her >maternal grandmother, Cynthia Coleman. > >Researchers have surveyed cemeteries in Wilcox Co GA and have published the >findings of that survey, in book form and on the Internet. > >Consider this entry from the survey of graves in the Oklahoma Baptist >Church Cemetery in Wilcox Co GA- >John Thomas Pate----22 Jan 1847-24 Feb 1924 >Henrietta Pate-----------18 Jun 1847- 7 Jun 1906 > >I believe these dates to be an accurate representation of what was cut into >the gravestones. > >I think that, if you research further, you will find that- >Cynthia Jane Pate b 22 Apr 1868 d 11 Jul 1934 married 27 Jul 1883 in Dooly >Co GA to Daniel Warren Spires b 30 Jul 1864 d 12 Feb 1939. > >Joel >

Jeremy: It is entirely possible that they did marry in Dooly Co in 1864. At least one researcher put the record, as 1864 and Dooly Co, into the LDS data base. Somewhere I picked up a note that they had a son named Lee born before the daughter named Cynthia Jane Pate b in 1868 That would certainly support a 1864 marriage date. IF, Big IF, the marriage records for both Dooly and Wilcox Co GA for the 1860's are in the micro film archives in the Georgia State Archives, it would be possible to resolve this question. Consider this point. Look at the debate and discourse we are having in 2004 and then try to go back to about 1915 and try to image the struggle John Ben Pate had in trying to sort things out. I think he made some easy ASSUMPTIONs rather than thoughtful, well drawn rational and supported conclusions. His writings were based on incomplete and inaccurate data and his "findings" are flawed. Joel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy Utt" <jeremy_utt@hotmail.com> To: <PATE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2004 2:35 PM Subject: RE: [PATE GENEALOGY] John Thomas Pate married Henrietta Kirkland 1867 in Wilcox Co GA > Joel, > > Thanks for that information. I do not seriously doubt what you say. > However, some argue that John Thomas Pate married in 1864 in Dooly County. > The marriage record that I found definitely did say 1864, and the marriage > record was from Dooly County. Was there a John Pate who married a Henrietta > (ANYBODY) in Dooly County in the mid-1860s, that you know of? > > Jeremy > **************************************************************************** *** > > >From: "Joel Pate" <patej@nettally.com> > >Reply-To: PATE-L@rootsweb.com > >To: PATE-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: [PATE GENEALOGY] John Thomas Pate married Henrietta Kirkland 1867 > >in Wilcox Co GA > >Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 14:14:28 -0500 > > > >Jeremy: > >I think that John Thomas Pate married Henrietta KIRKLAND in Wilcox Co GA 19 > >Jan 1867. The copy of the marriage license you have should give you a clue > >as to when and where it was issued and when the marriage ceremony was > >perform and by whom. I have information that indicates a John Owen(s) JIC > >(Judge of the Inferior Court) married them probably in Wilcox Co GA. > > > >It is entirely possible that the Clerk who issued the license recorded her > >surname as KIRKLING. These types of errors are why we have cousins who > >spell their surname as PAIT or PAYTE. > > > >I believe that Henrietta Kirkland was the daughter of Irwin Kirkland (b 16 > >Mar 1816-d ca 1867) and Cynthia Coleman (b 27 Sep 1816) Irwin Kirkland and > >Cynthia Coleman married in GA some time prior to the birth of Henrietta > >Kirkland in 1847. Henrietta Kirkland would have been approximately age 2 or > >3 in the 1850 census of GA. > > > >Consider this household in the 1850 census of Emanuel Co GA > >Page 450B, Dist 28, site 94/94 [22 Aug 1850] > >Irvin Kirkland----------34 W/M b GA > >Sinthy Kirkland-------33 W/F b GA (Cynthia Coleman) > >Elizabeth Kirkland--10 W/F b GA > >Ivy Kirkland------------- 5 W/M b GA > >Henrietta Kirkland--- 2 W/F b GA > >Remer Kirkland------9m W/M b GA > > > >Also consider the 1870 census of Wilcox Co GA. If John Thomas Pate married > >Henrietta Kirkland on 1867 in Wilcox Co GA, they probably would have been > >enumerated in the 1870 census of Wilcox Co GA. > >Consider Page 211, House Creek Dist, site 363/360 > >John Pate------------22 W/M b GA 1848 > >Henrietta Pate-----21 W/F b GA 1849 > >Cinthia Pate--------- 2 W/F b GA 1868 > > > >In that era it was customary to name the first born daughter for the > >maternal grandmother. Cynthia Jane Pate b ca 1868 was named for her > >maternal grandmother, Cynthia Coleman. > > > >Researchers have surveyed cemeteries in Wilcox Co GA and have published the > >findings of that survey, in book form and on the Internet. > > > >Consider this entry from the survey of graves in the Oklahoma Baptist > >Church Cemetery in Wilcox Co GA- > >John Thomas Pate----22 Jan 1847-24 Feb 1924 > >Henrietta Pate-----------18 Jun 1847- 7 Jun 1906 > > > >I believe these dates to be an accurate representation of what was cut into > >the gravestones. > > > >I think that, if you research further, you will find that- > >Cynthia Jane Pate b 22 Apr 1868 d 11 Jul 1934 married 27 Jul 1883 in Dooly > >Co GA to Daniel Warren Spires b 30 Jul 1864 d 12 Feb 1939. > > > >Joel > > > > > >