Dear James & Mimi, Thanks so much for the suggestions and to Mimi for her offer to check Heritage Quest. I tried googling for information on Hill Island to see if it was it considered part of Dauphin Co, like the Susquehanna River, and if it had a township designation, but didn't find much. We checked for tax lists, but I don't remember seeing an occupation. I'll recheck. In Carroll Baumgardner's book, "A Genealogical Record of the Family Baumgardner," he states Christian Baumgardner married Betsy Shelly and he tells how Christian lost a shad fishery in a poker game one night. I have a copy of a York County estate record showing Christian Baumgardner purchased property in Newberry Twp, York Co. on 22 Sept 1801 for 300 pounds from estate of Andrew Sweisgood. On 9 Aug 1802 Christian Baumgardner sold this same same property to Abraham Shelly for 300 pounds, and an Administrative bond for the estate of Abraham Shelly, the son of Elizabeth (Lane) and Daniel Shelly, Sr, dated 4 Mar 1812, lists Christian Baumgardner as one of the executors and Abraham Shelly's estate papers list Christian Baumgardner paying him for a shad fishery. Could one of these properties be the shad fishery Carroll Baumgardner mentions Christian lost in a poker game? Who knows... Unfortunately, Carroll's records were thrown away by his daughter upon his death. In "History of York County', page 614-615 regarding Shad Fisheries they write, "Nothing game more interest to the river settlements in early days than the extensive shad fisheries, an industry now almost unknown above the am of the Susquehanna Canal at Columbia. Shad fishing has greatly declined south of the dam, of late years, all caused by injudicious management..." So, it sounds like they may have been fishermen. If so, what did the Susquehanna fishermen do in the off season??? And if they were shad fisherman, where would they follow that profession in Donegal Twp????? Lots of questions. If I only knew the answers.... James & Mimi - thanks again for your suggestions and offers of help. Sherry

Hi Sherry,      I'm not really sure what a Shad fishery was but I suspect it was a place along the river where someone raised Shad.  Normally Shad moved up the Susquehanna River in the spring of each year, April and May.  I suspect a Shad fishery was a place where shad were raised and then sold the fish at market, especially during the times of year when the shad were not running.       In 1857 there was a stink when the the guys at Safe Harbor, Conestoga Twp. put a barrier across the river that kept the shad from moving up stream.  Finally the guys from Columbia came down stream in canoes and removed the obstruction.  The guys at Safe Harbor threathened to blow them out of the water using the Griffin gun that had been developed at Safe Harbor but apparently cooler heads prevailed and the gun wasn't used.       Shad was a big part of life on the Susquehanna until the 1900s when hydroelectric dams were constructed along the river and the Shad could no longer get upstream.      There is an article from the Columbia Spy on our web page http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~pacahs/index.htm  about the fish wars between Columbia and Safe Harbor, its May 8, 1858 and from our web page go to History in Newspapers and then Conesotga, then scroll down to May 8, 1858.       You can also check two Lancaster newspapers at the Penn State Digital Collection from the 1848 to about 1872, they have the Columbia Spy and the Lancaster Intelligencer.  You might check these sources for on Shad Fisheries and your surnames.  They may also have York County newspapers, I've never checked. https://secureapps.libraries.psu.edu/digital/      The Lancaster County Historical Society had a larger run of the Columbia Spy but apparently that has disappeared.      Check a map of Pa. or Dauphin County to see where the county line runs in regard to islands in the Susquehanna.  I think the line dividing Lancaster County and York County was close to the York County shore and so most of the islands were in Lancaster County.  I don't know if the same applies to Dauphin County.                                                                                                                   Jim ________________________________ From: Sherry Shallenberger <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:31:16 AM Subject: Re: [PALANCAS] Baumgartners of West Donegal Twp Dear James & Mimi, Thanks so much for the suggestions and to Mimi for her offer to check Heritage Quest. I tried googling for information on Hill Island to see if it was it considered part of Dauphin Co, like the Susquehanna River,  and if it had a township designation, but didn't find much.  We checked for tax lists, but I don't remember seeing an occupation.  I'll recheck. In Carroll Baumgardner's book, "A Genealogical Record of the Family Baumgardner," he states Christian Baumgardner married Betsy Shelly and he tells how Christian lost a shad fishery in a poker game one night.  I have a copy of a York County estate record showing Christian Baumgardner purchased property in Newberry Twp, York Co. on 22 Sept 1801 for 300 pounds from estate of Andrew Sweisgood. On 9 Aug 1802 Christian Baumgardner sold this same same property to Abraham Shelly for 300 pounds, and an Administrative bond for the estate of Abraham Shelly, the son of Elizabeth (Lane) and Daniel Shelly, Sr, dated 4 Mar 1812, lists Christian Baumgardner as one of the executors and Abraham Shelly's estate papers list Christian Baumgardner paying him for a shad fishery. Could one of these properties be the shad fishery Carroll Baumgardner mentions Christian lost in a poker game?  Who knows... Unfortunately, Carroll's records were thrown away by his daughter upon his death. In "History of York County', page 614-615 regarding Shad Fisheries they write, "Nothing game more interest to the river settlements in early days than the extensive shad fisheries, an industry now almost unknown above the am of the Susquehanna Canal at Columbia.  Shad fishing has greatly declined south of the dam, of late years, all caused by injudicious management..." So, it sounds like they may have been fishermen.  If so, what did the Susquehanna fishermen do in the off season???  And if they were shad fisherman, where would they follow that profession in Donegal Twp????? Lots of questions.  If I only knew the answers.... James & Mimi - thanks again for your suggestions and offers of help. Sherry ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Jim, Thank you for the information on shad fishing and for pointing me towards the article on the Conestoga Historical Society's website, which was very interesting. While googling, I also found a couple other articles on shad fishing. Shad fishing sounds like it would have been quite amazing to watch. I will check out the other newspapers you suggested this weekend and continue looking for information about boundry changes involving the islands on the Susquehanna. Thanks again for all your help and suggestions. Have a great weekend. It looks to be a beautiful, sunny weekend here in northwestern Pennsylvania! Sherry

More names and places def. helps here as I kept coming up in YORK & Dauphin Cntys. The Island could have changed names as in property owners did .. Ran the names thru HeritageQuest* [online my Local Library-24/7 from home] as well as srching maps etc - Back w/something more definitive later [I hope] Enjoy helping others as so many in the rootsweb system have helped me over the years - beg. 1996. Try a Google - 'shad fishery Pennsylvania' - as that may pop-up w/something - I am out to mow the lawn [3rd time this season] and I was the 1st to bellyache about the long winter her in SW Va. [and loss of property in card game as in my PIERCE's of the Pierce-Arrow auto!] C1994-2009 Mimi Taylor Generation Gap SpecialistT for HALL-PRATT-TAYLOR + PIERCE "From Pierce-Arrows 2 Straight Arrows"C -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Sherry Shallenberger Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:31 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PALANCAS] Baumgartners of West Donegal Twp Dear James & Mimi, Thanks so much for the suggestions and to Mimi for her offer to check Heritage Quest. I tried googling for information on Hill Island to see if it was it considered part of Dauphin Co, like the Susquehanna River, and if it had a township designation, but didn't find much. We checked for tax lists, but I don't remember seeing an occupation. I'll recheck. In Carroll Baumgardner's book, "A Genealogical Record of the Family Baumgardner," he states Christian Baumgardner married Betsy Shelly and he tells how Christian lost a shad fishery in a poker game one night. I have a copy of a York County estate record showing Christian Baumgardner purchased property in Newberry Twp, York Co. on 22 Sept 1801 for 300 pounds from estate of Andrew Sweisgood. On 9 Aug 1802 Christian Baumgardner sold this same same property to Abraham Shelly for 300 pounds, and an Administrative bond for the estate of Abraham Shelly, the son of Elizabeth (Lane) and Daniel Shelly, Sr, dated 4 Mar 1812, lists Christian Baumgardner as one of the executors and Abraham Shelly's estate papers list Christian Baumgardner paying him for a shad fishery. Could one of these properties be the shad fishery Carroll Baumgardner mentions Christian lost in a poker game? Who knows... Unfortunately, Carroll's records were thrown away by his daughter upon his death. In "History of York County', page 614-615 regarding Shad Fisheries they write, "Nothing game more interest to the river settlements in early days than the extensive shad fisheries, an industry now almost unknown above the am of the Susquehanna Canal at Columbia. Shad fishing has greatly declined south of the dam, of late years, all caused by injudicious management..." So, it sounds like they may have been fishermen. If so, what did the Susquehanna fishermen do in the off season??? And if they were shad fisherman, where would they follow that profession in Donegal Twp????? Lots of questions. If I only knew the answers.... James & Mimi - thanks again for your suggestions and offers of help. Sherry ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. We are a community of 6 million users fighting spam. SPAMfighter has removed 2210 of my spam emails to date. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len The Professional version does not have this message