I have an interesting problem. William Laurence, born about 1781-1786, Shady Grove, Antrim Township, Franklin County, Pennsylvania, married Sarah Gordon, born13January1790, op cit., on 16October1810. The family had three children, while in Shady Grove, Pennsylvania, as follows: Margaret, born 5August1811, Susan, born 23December1817, and Elmira, born about 1819. The family abruptly left for Upper CANADA in 1819. Why? I noticed in an earlier post by Carolyn K. Shearer, <awscks@erols.com>, that no birth or death records were recorded in Pennsylvania that early, i.e., before 1865. So, how can these LDS records be correct? What could be the source of this information? I know from word-of-mouth that the Laurences were United Empire Loyalists. Antrim Township was settled by many "Scotch-Irish" (Scottish persons) from County Antrim, Ulster. However, the French were present before such migrations. Also, the 5th migration of French Huguenots occurred around this period in the later 1700s. Is suspect that the Laurences were French Huguenots from Ulster. My surname, Lawrence, was Anglicized in Upper CANADA. William Laurence named his Canadian-born son, William Francis Lawrence. The "Francis" means "man of France" in English. This causes me to believe that the connection to Europe was ultimately to France. The family were Methodists in Upper CANADA, and this causes me to believe they were French protestants, likely Huguenots. I find an Elmira Lawrence buried at Bookton Cemetery, Windham Township, Ontario, CANADA along with (her father?) William Laurence, born 1781, died 9Sep1864. However, I cannot locate her sisters. Her brother, William Francis Lawrence is buried there as well. Why cannot I find the sisters? Carolyn mentioned, and I have selected, the following records are available at the following addresses: 1. Kittochtinny Historical Society (Physical Address?)(E-mail address?) a. early land warrents; 2. PA State Archives, Harrisburg (Physical Address?)(E-mail address?) a. Board of County Commissioners (Physical Address?)(E-mail address?) (1) Tax Records, 1794-1848, 64 rolls (MG-4) b. Recorder of Deeds (Physical Address?)(E-mail address?) (1) Index to Deeds, Grantees, 1785-1963, 21 rolls (2) Index to Deeds, Grantors, 1785-1963, 30 rolls (3) Index to Plots in Deeds, undated, 1 roll c. Register of Wills and Clerk of the Orphans' Court (Physical Address?)(E-mail address?) (1) Index to Administrations, 1784-1962, 2 rolls (2) Estate papers (3) Index to Minors' Estates, 1784-1822 (4) Orphans' Court dockets, 1785-1903, 22 rolls (5) Index to Wills, 1784-1963, 2 rolls (6) Wills, 1784-1905, 9 rolls. It is absolutely amazing to me that I lived in State College, Pennsylvania for almost 27 years without knowing any of this information! Can someone guide me through the process? Thanks you, Howard

For a list of material on Franklin County from LDS library check out: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlc/supermainframeset.asp?display=localitydetails&subject=187523&subject_disp=Pennsylvania,_Franklin&columns=*,180,0 If this search line is too long (i.e. you can not access it) try this: 1. Go to http://www.familysearch.org/default.asp 2. In the right hand column of the home page click on "Search the Family History Library Catalogue..." 3. On the catalogue page click on "Place Name" 4. On the Place Seach page in the first box type "Franklin" (do not use the quotes) in the second box "Part of" type in "Pennsylvania." 5. The next screen will give ten listings of "Franklin" in Pennsylvania. Click on the last one for a listing of all records for Franklin County that can be found in the library at Salt Lake. You can order ANY record listed as being on microfilm or microfiche from your local Family History Center. The cost per reel of film is about $3.25 for a three week loan. Microfiche can be purchased for a small cost (10-15 cents per page) It will then stay in your local FHC permanently. This may seem very basic but it is surprizing how many people I talk to that do not know that you can do this. Note: If you do not know the location of your local Family History Center go to the LDS home page, http://www.familysearch.org/default.asp and click on "Find a Local Family History Center" Happy Researching! Carolyn

Hello Fellow Listers: Just wanted to pass along a hint on where else to find Birth Dates.... I recently visited the Franklin Co. Court House in search of Tax Lists. I went to the basement and began to pull out the original old/early Tax Lists/Books. To my amazement I found during one of the years - a list of children under their father's name with full birthdates. These children were listed as Poor Children or Pauper Children. The same person who listed these children also took the time to fill in where a person lived [on whose property] if the said person was a renter. He also listed the Single Freemen and the name of the head of household in which they lived. What a wonderful find - A gold mine!!!! for a genealogist. NOTE: Not all Tax Lists include such wonderful information. Best Wishes... Donna HELLER ZINN of Newville, Cumberland Co., PA.

Hi Carolyn and Fellow Listers: Well done Carolyn!!!!!! I beg to differ though, with Carolyn concerning the years that Death & Birth Registers were kept in Pennsylvania. Perry County and other counties within Pennsylvania - I also think Franklin County is included - registered both Births and Deaths during the years 1853-1855. After 1855 the State discontinued the register until it asked the counties to register them again in 1892 [about] and continued to 1906 when the state took the responsibility and sent all to New Castle. Some counties also continued to register Births and Deaths in their own county court house - Perry Co. continued to 1919. [NOTE: Please check individual counties' information as all counties are different.] Best Wishes.... Donna HELLER ZINN of Newville, Cumberland Co., PA. ********************* Carolyn K. Shearer wrote: > > No birth or death records were recorded in PA that early, so they were > not there to burn.

All, The Franklin County Courthouse does have a death and marriage register covering late 1853 through 1855. I did not find a birth register. Dennis Best ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donna Heller Zinn" <djzinn@pa.net> To: <PAFRANKL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 11:41 PM Subject: Re: [PAFRANKL] Franklin County Records > Hi Carolyn and Fellow Listers: > > Well done Carolyn!!!!!! > > I beg to differ though, with Carolyn concerning the years that Death & > Birth Registers were kept in Pennsylvania. > > Perry County and other counties within Pennsylvania - I also think > Franklin County is included - registered both Births and Deaths during > the years 1853-1855. After 1855 the State discontinued the register > until it asked the counties to register them again in 1892 [about] and > continued to 1906 when the state took the responsibility and sent all to > New Castle. Some counties also continued to register Births and Deaths > in their own county court house - Perry Co. continued to 1919. > > [NOTE: Please check individual counties' information as all counties are > different.] > > Best Wishes.... > Donna HELLER ZINN of Newville, Cumberland Co., PA. > > > ********************* > > Carolyn K. Shearer wrote: > > > > No birth or death records were recorded in PA that early, so they were > not there to burn. >

To all Franklin County researchers) - I have seen the mention of 'all Franklin County records were destroyed when the Confederates burned the town of Chambersburg,' but I can assure you THIS IS NOT TRUE! The will and administration books seem to be complete, the loose papers pertaining to the estate settlements (inventories, etc) are on microfilm in the prothonotary's office and the clerk will retrive the originals from the basement if you want to see them. I have found the deeds to be complete also. The early land warrants are available at the Kittochtinny Historical Society. The ONLY thing I have found missing so far from the pre1865 period is the some of the guardian bonds and election records. No birth or death records were recorded in PA that early, so they were not there to burn. In addition here is a list of Franklin County records available at the PA State Archives in Harrisburg: Board of County Commissioners Tax Records, 1794-1848. 64 rolls (MG-4) Clerk of Courts Election Dockets, 1865-1920. 1 roll. (LR 119) Stallion Register, 1894-1908. 1 roll. (LR 123) Prothonotary Election Dockets, 1864-1936. 1 roll. (LR 120) Medical Registers, 1881-1959. 1 roll. (LR 121) Dental Registers, 1899-1953. Optometry Register, 1918-1978. Osteopathic Register, 1909-1923. Stallion Registers, 1894-1927. Veterinary Medical Register, 1889-1940. (above 5 series combined on 1 roll) (LR 123) Recorder of Deeds Deeds, 1784-1883. 39 rolls. Index to Deeds, Grantees, 1785-1963. 21 rolls. Index to Deeds, Grantors, 1785-1963. 30 rolls. Index to Plots in Deeds, undated. 1 roll. Mortgages, 1811-1868. 3 rolls. Soldiers' Discharge Book, 1919-1933. 1 roll. Register of Wills and Clerk of the Orphans' Court Administrators', Executors' and Guardians' Accounts, 1847-1900. 10 rolls. Index to Administrations, 1784-1962. 2 rolls. Appointments of Guardians, 1864-1908. 1 roll. Auditors' Dockets, 1852-1900. 6 rolls. Birth Records, 1894-1906. 2 rolls. Death Records, 1893-1906. 3 rolls. Delayed Birth Records, 1941-1963 (Births, 1873-1906). 3 rolls. Estate Papers, 1784-1822. 12 rolls. (LR 246) Index to Minors' Estates, 1786-1958. 2 rolls. Marriage License Dockets, 1885-1963. 24 rolls. Orphans' Court Dockets, 1785-1903. 22 rolls. Index to Orphans' Court Dockets, 1819-1963. 4 rolls. Widows' Appraisements, 1855-1961. 7 rolls. Wills, 1784-1905. 9 rolls. Index to Wills, 1784-1963. 2 rolls. Grove's Funeral Home Funeral Registers, 1916-1963 (Waynesboro area). 19 rolls. Source:http://www.state.pa.us/PA_Exec/Historical_Museum/DAM/rg/rg47m.htm

please join us for genealogy chat centered around northwestern Illinois and those Pennsylvania counties whose citizens helped settle this part of Illinois. Chat is Monday evening at 8pm CST (9pm EST) at www.freeportillinois.com Simply click the chat button on the right side of the screen, put your name in when requested, click the chat button and you will be there. Lou Cook _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Hello: Announcing a date confirmation for the "Mother Cumberland-A Harvest of Memories" Reunion 2003. Date: July 18, 19, 20, 2003 Place: Shippensburg, Cumberland Co., PA For: Anyone with an ancestor who lived in the area that was Cumberland County, PA during the 1700's. This includes all counties who can trace their parentage to Cumberland County such as Franklin, Bedford, Perry, Indiana, Westmoreland, parts of Lancaster & York, and several other counties.PA- If interested in being put on the mailing list, please send an e-mail PRIVATELY to: dcuillard@aol.com and put Mother Cumberland Reunion 2003 in the subject line. Please do not post directly to this list. Thank you so much. Donna Cuillard "Mother Cumberland-A Harvest of Memories" Reunion 2003 chairman Brady Family Heritage Association: Reunion Hosts

Courthouse of Franklin Co. 157 Lincolin Way E. Chambersburg, PA 17201 Att: Register & Recorder. They charge $.50 a copy. Moct of the old wills are on micofilm. Judy "Janet S. Smith" wrote: > Can anyone advise me on who/where to write for copies of Franklin Co. > Wills? Looking for Joseph T. HOOVER, died between 1880 and 1886. > Thanks, Janet Snyder Smith

Karen, Folks have given you plenty of good advice. I would add that you should be sure to bring plenty of paper clips. I ran out the first trip I made. I used them to sort out the many photocopies I made. I decided to invest in copies so that I could study the stuff more thoroughly at home. Make sure you copy the title pages too. That helps when you decide to reference what you have copied. I found that making copies of the census records that I wanted was very helpful later. I have referred to them many times. And I have wished that I copied others that I only wrote down the information for. So it goes without saying that you should save up your change for the copy machines! The volunteers are very helpful to explain things. For example how the copy machines work for microfilm. I also would recommend checking out the books first. There are one of a kind things there. And you may find something that will help you decide to look for other microfilms. My limit is usually about 3 days. Besides, you need to take home all of your new found information and process it. Make sure you stop and eat. It is important to keep your strength up. If you start out early when they open the doors, you can stake out a place to work. Plan to work when others are more likely to be eating. Then eat when others are working. The restaurant around the corner is great. Bring sticky notes. They are handy for many things. Bring file folders to keep your stuff organized as you gather it. Bring records of your existing research to refer to. It will help you stay on track. Have fun. Melinda Van Bossuyt llamabb@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~llamabb/

Can anyone advise me on who/where to write for copies of Franklin Co. Wills? Looking for Joseph T. HOOVER, died between 1880 and 1886. Thanks, Janet Snyder Smith

In addition to the items already suggested, I always bring the following: 1. small stapler and hole punch. This enables you to staple and punch papers you print out from the computer without going to the copy area. Also, bring a box of those sticky reenforcements for when the holes in your papers get torn. 2. Comfortable shoes, a jacket or sweater you can take on and off, comfortable sox. 3. waist pack - leave your purse in the hotel room. 4. rolls of change for the machines. This saves waiting in line for change machines. I always go to the bank here (so. CA) before I leave for Salt Lake. 5. small pair of scissors, colored highlighters (be sure to NEVER mark on anything at the library except your own copies) 6. copies (never bring originals) of your own documents, correspondence, etc. 7. Always check out the Salt Lake card catalog at home before you leave. Bring those printouts with you. This way you can hit the floor running when you get to the library. 8. Don't forget your medication, vitamins, etc. Also, bring a copy of your prescriptions including those for glasses. If anything happens to your medications or your glasses, you can get them refilled in Salt Lake. 9. I also take a couple of large manila envelopes, some 5x7 cards (different colors). 10. Take several #10 envelopes with your mailing address & already stamped. That way if you run into others with whom you would like to correspond, you are ready to hand them an envelope which they can use to write to you later. 11. Bring an address & phone list of those working on the same lines you are working on. This way if you need to phone someone from the library, you are ready with the numbers. I have used this on every trip I have taken to Salt Lake. Nearly always there is something that comes up that you need to ask someone about. 12. Bring several 3x5 cards that contain your address, phone #, e-mail address and list of your surnames. These can be posted on bulletin boards or handed out as needed. Do not take time in Salt Lake doing what you can do at home. 13. Bring timelines. One for each area and one for your surnames. 14. Write down variations of spellings. If you are having trouble finding a name, say it out loud. This may help you with pronounciation, etc. 15. Check formations of Counties. Then check parent counties as well as surrounding counties. This should all be done before your trip. 16. I put one of those zipper pouches in each of my notebooks. Each one contains all my supplies, that way no matter which notebook I am working in, my supplies are handy. 17. Bring/eat foods that do not cause so much thirst or that may cause indigestion. 18. Eat healthy. There is a tendency to go without eating. In the long run, this causes fatigue as well as an inability to concentrate. What NOT to bring: 1. Do NOT wear heavy or loud bracelets or other jewelry that will disturb others when it hits tables, etc. 2. Leave the heavy perfume at home also. Library research means working in close quarters with others. Common courtesy means "don't disturb your neighbors" in any way. 3. Put cell phones, pagers, etc. on vibrate. 4. Travel light. Don't bring cases of papers, etc. so that you take up too much room on the tables in the library.

Hello to all those interested in the Cumberland County, Pennsylvania Reunion 2003. We are now in the process of compiling a Surname Registry. Jocelyn Wilms of Canfield, Ohio has volunteered to establish and keep the database containing the Surname Registry. All those who are interested in participating in the Registry, please send your Cumberland County surnames and your mailing address to Jocelyn at: treeseek@zoominternet.net PLEASE DO NOT POST YOUR RESPONSE TO THIS LIST. PLEASE E-MAIL JOCELYN DIRECTLY AT THE ABOVE-LISTED E-MAIL ADDRES. THANK YOU. Please put MOTHER CUMBERLAND-REUNION 2003 in your subject line. The Surname Registry will be ready to distribution at the Reunion at a nominal cost. Those not attending the reunion may also purchase this directory at the same nominal cost as those attending. This is a great way to get your names in front of others who are interested. You do not need to attend the reunion to participate in the Surname Registry. Happy New Year to All! Donna Cuillard "Mother Cumberland - A Harvest of Memories" Reunion 2003 chair Hosts: Brady Family Heritage Association

Would you please see if there is more information available on John McCullough, the "famous Indian captive"? That intrigued me, I'd like to know details. Thank you Karen Patterson

Hi Judy - Could you check your book- American Revolutionery Soldiers of Franklin Co. for Abraham Henry or any Henry men from the Greene Twp or Green Village in Franklin County? Thank you, appreciate it ! Teresa

Hi Judy - Could you check your book- American Revolutionery Soldiers of Franklin Co. for Abraham Henry or any Henry men from the Greene Twp or Green Village in Franklin County? Thank you, appreciate it ! Teresa

Hello, I am looking for info on my great grandmother. She married a Keneth(?) Doyle. They had two children. William Keneth Doyle, Kathleen Ann Doyle (d. Oct 23, 1995 in Lansing, KS) Can anyone make a connection to these Doyles? Thanks, Amy Auten

A New Year's wish I'd like to have come true, would be to connect with or hear from descendants of Alexander THOMSON and Elizabeth EDMONSTONE from County of Renfrew Scotland>America, 1771>Lurgan Twp.Cumberland Co. PA/Green Twp. Franklin Co., PA, 1772. I descend from this couple's 14th child, James THOMSON, b. 1772 Cumberland/Franklin Co., PA, d. 1848 Ross Twp., Allegheny co., PA, and Nancy WRIGHT, b. abt. 1776, d. ca. 1815-1823, Allegheny Co., PA. Searching for descendants of James and Nancy who include: -- Ellizabeth nee THOMSON McTAGGA(E)RT, b. abt. 1801 Cumberland/Franklin Co., PA -- Hannah nee THOMSON WYLIE, b. abt. 1803, Cumberland/Franklin Co., PA -- Ann nee THOMSON CAROTHERS, b. 1805, Franklin Co., PA; d. 1863, Lawrenceville, Allegheny Co., PA -- Margaret nee THOMSON b. 1808, Gibsonia, Allegheny Co., PA. d. 1987, Pine Twp./Gibsonia, Allegheny Co., PA. These women were all older siblings of my greatgrandfather, Robert THOMSON (1815--1883) from Allegheny Co., PA. Another half-brother, William Peebles THOMSON, b. abt. 1824, d. 1908, Allegheny Co., PA; son of James THOMSON and Margaret PEEBLES; married #1 Louisa HOPEWELL and #2 Emma HOPEWELL. A safe and happy New Year to all! Marybeth Corrigall ACMBJC@aol.com

Hi all! I'm trying to get a line on my Haynes, Reed, and Gamble line (Gamble line newly discovered) and I'm kind of stuck. I could use some tips, esp. those of you who might know what records are available in Franklin County. Jacob Haynes was b. 1800, and was in the 1850 Metal Township Census with his wife Elizabeth (nee Gamble), (his last name was spelled Haines in this census, but spelled Haynes in the 1860 Metal Township Census)and with his kids Mary, Sarah, William, McGinley (who is supposedly named after Amos McGinley, He was the minister of the Lower Path Valley Presbyterian Church, Fannettsburg, PA, and was also in the 1860 Metal Township Census), and my 3rd great grandfather, John Haynes, born 1835/36 in Pa, moved with some of his family to Preston, Pratt County, Kansas, in the late 1800's. John Haynes and his wife Catherine Reed were in the 1860 Franklin County Census from Valley of the Shadow in Fannett Township. Their kids were: Mary Haynes, b. 1857/58, married Gust Leens; Anna Haynes, married John Levens; Jake Haynes, b. 1874 in Illinois, died 1949 in Great Bend, Kansas. Married Linnie Crabbe; and my 2nd great grandfather, Samuel Coons Haynes, b. 1862 in Spring Run, Franklin County, Pa. There might be a relation to a Coons line from Franklin County, and I found a marriage record of a Samuel Coons marrying an Elizabeth Haines, so he could have been named after him if he married into their family. I really don't know where to go from here. Would anyone have any suggestions for me? I have no further information on Catherine's Reed's parents. There were a bunch of Reed in that area, I dont' know what line she belongs to. There is a lot of Gamble information for Pa, but no idea where my Elizabeth fits in. I don't have much experience getting land, census, church, etc. records, so any advice you could give me would be much appreciated! Thanks so much, and Happy New Year Everyone! Anisah Haynes hianisah@yahoo.com ===== ~ Anisah Haynes hianisah@yahoo.com ICQ# 60362067 Instant Message: Anisah1969 ~ * * See New Pictures of My Kids: http://www.geocities.com/hianisah/ * * ~ Old Genealogists Never Die they just lose their Census ~ http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/6354/ ~ Time is Experience, and Experience is Wisdom ~ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/

In a message dated 12/31/00 5:11:28 AM Central Standard Time, PAFRANKL-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: << Any other bits of advice for researching in the LDS library? Thanks for your help, Karen >> Karen, My cousin was there over Thanksgiving for the second year. She says the "Granite Mountain" is awsome. You can't believe the amount of microfilm. Just the indexes is over whelming. I suggest you pack a lunch. ha ha Seriously, bring plenty of money, quarters I think, writing material, pencils etc. Good Luck and I know you will enjoy this experience. Kat JstPlnKAT@aol.com