Ross G. H. Cotton wrote: > Some people forget to make backups, as they should often do. > > I have at least 2 disks, and a Flash drive, that I use to make backups on, each time rotating between them. But my question, in case any body has an answer is: > > When you create a backup (call it one) and then backup over top (call it two), does anyone know if the backup number one is still intact but hidden? And therefore can be opened using some method. If you're asking about whether something can be totally destroyed by writing over it that way -- no. It cannot. There are a lot of data-recovery companies putting biscuits on the table by proving it, too. If you just want to keep old backups around a while, rename 'em... I'm up to 5currentj these days. Cheryl

Some people forget to make backups, as they should often do. I have at least 2 disks, and a Flash drive, that I use to make backups on, each time rotating between them. But my question, in case any body has an answer is: When you create a backup (call it one) and then backup over top (call it two), does anyone know if the backup number one is still intact but hidden? And therefore can be opened using some method. I know this is common in some programs, where the program automatically creates another backup that is overwritten later. Word Perfect and CorelDraw, does it if instructed to doso. Maybe this is something the PAF Insight creators, can consider in its next revison? Ross GH Cotton, Burlington ON CAN 905)639-2929 Genealogy of the COTTON surname is my Enigma. I haven't sent an attachment if the details are not mentioned above. Check out my Genealogy Web Page at www.skylinc.net/~rgcotton GOONS member responsible for tracking the family name COTTON, #1437 Coordinator for Cotton DNA testing Project, Worldwide

Philo, Good for you. You beat me to it. I too use RINs and MRINs all the time. In my GenCharts for PAF program I use them exclusively to identify people to print reports about. Lynn > Hello Group, > > I have been reading the discussion about RIN number > for some time and now want to tell who and why I use > RIN number. > > If is because PAF displays the RIN number that I use > PAF. > Other Genealogy program have a unique nubmer but they > do not display the number. > > When I first started to do my data entry into PAF 2.3 > in DOS years ago I created a 7 generation blank setup > for my ancestors in Ahnentafel order. As I entered my > direct ancestors into my database I used the RIN > number associated with them the Ahnentafel order until > I got past 7 generations. At that point I watched and > moved the direct ancestors to the proper RIN Number > when I reached about 30,000 names in the file to gave > up this > moving system. > > I am still using my original file after all these > years and so my RIN numbers have remained the same. > > I create ancestors and descendants book printout to > share either via E-Mail or printed form, listing the > RIN number on the file. I ask that when people want > to talk about any person on these reports that they > tell me the RIN number of the person they want to > discuss. > > My database is not at 51,600 names and with many names > exactly the same and many living about the very same > time period in the same places, I want to get to the > exact person another research is working with. > > I also use the RIN number when I want to Unlink and > Relink to a family. I know that using the RIN number > I have the same person and will not make an error. > > I do not know how anyone can do editing in there > database with out using the RIN number as the greatest > tool that PAF has given us for a great aid. > > Do not worry about blank RIN numbers. When a new > person is added to the database they will given the > blank numbers until all RIN numbers have been used. > > I can see if you keep making GEDCOM files of your > database and importing your file in a new name your > RIN number will changed. > > Also making reference to RIN in Notes is only useful > to the author and not others. A confidential tag > could be placed before this NOTE, if this type of > information is useful. > > Where can the program INSIGHT be obtained? I have not > heard about this program before. > > I hope that my usage of the RIN Number will give some > of you ideas of how they can be useful to you. > > Later, > Philo Redfield > RedfieldResearcher@yahoo.com > >

On Thursday, June 23, 2005 8:31 PM "singhals" <singhals@erols.com> wrote: | Did we decide that there is no way to get a list of everyone | who has X as a source? What about if there is IS only one | source? I wanted to save myself rekeying the same line abt | 300 times, so I created a source. | Now, I've finished inputting the names, and want to go back | and copy'n'paste the source line into the notes. Be a tad easier | if I could do it from a "Uses Source" list? | | Thanks.Cheryl You can generate a report that will list "Citations referencing a source" ... < File> < Print Reports... > then click the "Lists" tab The very last 'Type of List' is "Citations referencing a source" Then I usually click < Preview > It takes you to the Source List & you choose which source you would like by highlighting it in the listing. click < Select > and the report appears. You can then choose to print it out or not. :-) Jeannie

> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > It will also accept "dead," and it is typed with one hand. > >Ruby in WA > > Hello, Ruby! Don't know about your keyboard but on mine the word "deceased" is also typed with one hand! :-D Beverly -- Mailto:kngsldy@cableone.net Families are Forever!

On Thursday, June 23, 2005 7:15 PM "Brad Paul" <paulsstarrabbittree@yahoo.com> wrote: ... <snip> ... | The best thing to do is to run "insight" they will show you all your | individuals that are not linked to your main pedigree. Many times | these people become unlink when you delete someone. You may | find a lot more than you thought you had in there. | | R Paul And you could also generate a list from the reports menu that will list all unlinked individuals: < File > < Print Reports... > then click the "Lists" tab The first 'Type of List' is "Unlinked individuals" Then I usually click < Preview > :-) Jeannie

Philo Redfield <redfieldresearcher@yahoo.com> wrote: Where can the program INSIGHT be obtained? I have not heard about this program before. http://www.ohanasoftware.com/?sec=learnmore/pafinsightIt's this link will tell you about it. It's used by mostly LDS people looking up temple ordinance dates, but has other uses too. Some of the newer features of paf 5 - new sources, custom event etc give me problems then I use the merge options, but they say they are going to ungrade. I'm lookin forward for that. r paul __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

In a message dated 6/23/2005 9:44:56 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, paulsstarrabbittree@yahoo.com writes: 3.) Use "Insight" program to change Rin of any existing people of your choice, or let them change it all. Again with this last option your existing rin will change. Using the "Repair and Compact" function in PAF Insight will delete all of the empty RIN places in your database if you ask it to do that. I am not sure if it alters your existing RIN numbers, but it sure does clean up your database.

Brad Paul <paulsstarrabbittree@yahoo.com> wrote:Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 09:38:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Brad Paul <paulsstarrabbittree@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [PAF-5] RIN's To: Jeannie <westfieldfleck-jhf@comcast.net> Jeannie <westfieldfleck-jhf@comcast.net> wrote: On Thursday, June 23, 2005 7:15 PM "Brad Paul" wrote: ... ... | The best thing to do is to run "insight" they will show you all your | individuals that are not linked to your main pedigree. Many times | these people become unlink when you delete someone. You may | find a lot more than you thought you had in there. | | R Paul And you could also generate a list from the reports menu that will list all unlinked individuals: < File > < Print Reports... > then click the "Lists" tab The first 'Type of List' is "Unlinked individuals" Then I usually click < Preview > :-) Jeannie Yes, but that usually is only the tip of the iceberg. This report only shows if one individual is unlink. When you delete someone, many times that leaves not just one but several individuals link together but not to your pedigree. Example: brother and sister link together but maybe not link to your pedigree because you delete the parent that link them to pedigree, they are how link with other parent and an unknown spouse with all their brothers and sisters. These will not show up on the report you listed. If you run insight you will be in shock with what you find. ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List http://www.ausbdm.org/p5uindex.php __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

Under the citation detail on the source screen, there is a field for "Date Citation was made." What exactly does this mean? A publication date? There is already a space for publication info. Thanks, Melanie

Great! Thanks, Walt! Cheryl Walter Anderson wrote: > Cheryl, > Under "Reports" there is a tab for "lists." One of those lists > all the people that have one source. The report describes the Source > ant then lists all those people that use that source. Is that what you > want? > Also under "focus filter," you can find people by choosing > various aspects of a source. With this option you can edit from the > "find" list with only those you found. > > Walt > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "singhals" <singhals@erols.com> > To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 8:31 PM > Subject: [PAF-5] Sources -- did we decide we couldn't? > > >> Did we decide that there is no way to get a list of everyone who has X >> as a source? What about if there is IS only one source? I wanted to >> save myself rekeying the same line abt 300 times, so I created a >> source. Now, I've finished inputting the names, and want to go back >> and copy'n'paste the source line into the notes. Be a tad easier if I >> could do it from a "Uses Source" list? >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cheryl >> >> >> ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >> RootsWeb >> http://www.rootsweb.com/ >> > >

Hello Group, I have been reading the discussion about RIN number for some time and now want to tell who and why I use RIN number. If is because PAF displays the RIN number that I use PAF. Other Genealogy program have a unique nubmer but they do not display the number. When I first started to do my data entry into PAF 2.3 in DOS years ago I created a 7 generation blank setup for my ancestors in Ahnentafel order. As I entered my direct ancestors into my database I used the RIN number associated with them the Ahnentafel order until I got past 7 generations. At that point I watched and moved the direct ancestors to the proper RIN Number when I reached about 30,000 names in the file to gave up this moving system. I am still using my original file after all these years and so my RIN numbers have remained the same. I create ancestors and descendants book printout to share either via E-Mail or printed form, listing the RIN number on the file. I ask that when people want to talk about any person on these reports that they tell me the RIN number of the person they want to discuss. My database is not at 51,600 names and with many names exactly the same and many living about the very same time period in the same places, I want to get to the exact person another research is working with. I also use the RIN number when I want to Unlink and Relink to a family. I know that using the RIN number I have the same person and will not make an error. I do not know how anyone can do editing in there database with out using the RIN number as the greatest tool that PAF has given us for a great aid. Do not worry about blank RIN numbers. When a new person is added to the database they will given the blank numbers until all RIN numbers have been used. I can see if you keep making GEDCOM files of your database and importing your file in a new name your RIN number will changed. Also making reference to RIN in Notes is only useful to the author and not others. A confidential tag could be placed before this NOTE, if this type of information is useful. Where can the program INSIGHT be obtained? I have not heard about this program before. I hope that my usage of the RIN Number will give some of you ideas of how they can be useful to you. Later, Philo Redfield RedfieldResearcher@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Mine too! Aloha Wayne, NH6K -----Original Message----- From: Guy Weller [mailto:Guy.Weller@kencomp.net] Sent: Friday, June 24, 2005 8:09 AM To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: Possible Spam [PAF-5] Re: PAF-5-USERS-D Digest V05 #121 Well on mine they are both typed with one finger! Guy -----Original Message----- From: Beverly <kngsldy@cableone.net> To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Date: 24 June 2005 17:48 Subject: Possible Spam [PAF-5] Re: PAF-5-USERS-D Digest V05 #121 >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> --- It will also accept "dead," and it is typed with one hand. >> >>Ruby in WA >> >> > >Hello, Ruby! Don't know about your keyboard but on mine the word >"deceased" is also typed with one hand! :-D > >Beverly > >-- >Mailto:kngsldy@cableone.net >Families are Forever! > > > >==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >PAF-5-USERS Mailing List >http://www.ausbdm.org/p5uindex.php > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== RootsWeb http://www.rootsweb.com/

>>How folks enter data into their family history program is a personal >>choice. Where they might run into a problem is if they make a Gedcom for >>TR didn't edit it. I just found a table of date abbreviations in the PAF help menu. I would assume that as long as you use one of those abbreviations you should be fine with TR, but I guess I could be wrong. Melanie

Search Advanced Focus/Filter Individual Filter Define - Sources 'Source Title' (or whatever field you want - title works best for me) Select your source from the pop-up list of your sources OK Show Results Only use the Edit function to retireve inds from list Regina Barry * rmbarry1066@earthlink.net * http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~rbarry4145/index.htm Affairs are easier of entrance than of exit; and it is but common prudence to see our way out before we venture in. Aesop

> I used to use RIN to identify people that I know are the same, but go by > different names, like children from one marriage who are adopted by a 2nd > spouse or by grandparents, aunts, uncles etc. I put a reference in the > Notes of each that # 999999 is the same person as # 000 and then explain why > the are the same. But I did it with the full knowledge that if I sent a > gedcom including those people to someone the Notes reference is useless and > confusing. I'm now trying to find and correct those entries by merging them > and showing both surnames, then explaining the situation in the Notes. > Dick Cazier Dick, You do not need to add a second individual in the case of an adoption. Such can always be noted in the notes (and is probably a good idea for clarity), but when you add a person to a second family where they were adopted, their listing in the family is automatically listed as adopted. That might meet your need without as much work amd provide a better connection within the family. The individual then has a multiple parents list. Bill

Then enter in the notes, Need death date, and when you want a list, use Advanced Search, and search for Need death date in the notes.Then print a custom list. Joan Lowrey At 05:48 PM 6/23/05 -0500, Kenneth Guilette wrote: >There are many ways to enter possible death dates so a person does not >appear to be living. However, keep in mind that if you enter a possible >date - the person will not appear when you generate a list of persons >who's Death Dates you have not found. > >I sometime use this type of list for research planning. > >Regards, > >Ken Guilette

Cheryl, Under "Reports" there is a tab for "lists." One of those lists all the people that have one source. The report describes the Source ant then lists all those people that use that source. Is that what you want? Also under "focus filter," you can find people by choosing various aspects of a source. With this option you can edit from the "find" list with only those you found. Walt ----- Original Message ----- From: "singhals" <singhals@erols.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 8:31 PM Subject: [PAF-5] Sources -- did we decide we couldn't? > Did we decide that there is no way to get a list of everyone who has X as > a source? What about if there is IS only one source? I wanted to save > myself rekeying the same line abt 300 times, so I created a source. Now, > I've finished inputting the names, and want to go back and copy'n'paste > the source line into the notes. Be a tad easier if I could do it from a > "Uses Source" list? > > Thanks. > > Cheryl > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > RootsWeb > http://www.rootsweb.com/ >

Did we decide that there is no way to get a list of everyone who has X as a source? What about if there is IS only one source? I wanted to save myself rekeying the same line abt 300 times, so I created a source. Now, I've finished inputting the names, and want to go back and copy'n'paste the source line into the notes. Be a tad easier if I could do it from a "Uses Source" list? Thanks. Cheryl

I've had people who exchanged data with cousins and who insisted on referring to people by their RIN rather than their name -- Is that 3654 or his grandson 7658? -- when, of course, the other cousin has him as 1243 and his grandson as 1872. and I've seen notes on order cards in the FHC that say "bd R2445". Using a RIN that way is --oh, let's be tactful!-- NOT a good idea. (G) Cheryl Patricia J Weisshaus wrote: > I don't agree with some of this discussion about the usefulness of RINs. > I find them extremely helpful when I do stupid things like attaching a > child to the last child I entered. All I have to do is remember the RIN, > detach the newest child from his brother/sister and reattach it to the > parent. This is one instance that I can immediately think of which > demonistrates the way RINs can be used. I'm sure there are others. > > Pat > > At 12:52 PM 6/23/2005, Stewart Millar wrote: > >> Eugene, >> >> Personally - I would never recommend using RIN numbers for any >> significant >> purpose - they provide the internal linkages for the programming to >> maintain >> links and relationships - the fact that there are gaps in the sequence is >> immaterial to the database and the "user" use of PAF. >> >> The true count is of course what is on your gedcom and should agree >> with the >> stats displayed on the File > Properties window and should equal the >> record >> count less the deleted records on the properties window. >> >> For the pedantically minded - RIN's can be re-ordered in two main ways: >> >> (1) - Re-import your gedcom file into a new database - RIN's will be >> assigned from #1 in the sequence of loading from the gedcom file. >> >> (2) - For the really pedantic - PAFInsight (from Ohana Software) provides >> features to re-number individual records or sequentially renumber >> groups of >> records. >> >> But I really cannot think why any one should bother - no significance >> external to PAF internal programming should ever be attached to RIN >> (or MRIN >> numbers). >> (now that's likely to start a debate!) >> >> Regards, >> Stewart >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: H. Eugene McInturff [mailto:hemack@lynxconnect.com] >> Sent: 23 June 2005 16:43 >> To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [PAF-5] RIN's >> >> There is a discrepancy of over 3000 count between the numerical sort of >> my data base and the number of individuals when I export a GEDCOM. >> Would someone enlighten advise me how to find and use these unused >> RIN's? Thanks........Eugene