Hey, John ... you've certainly given me a lot to think about. Your note makes a nice addendum to the notes from other folks. You do bring up a couple points not mentioned before, and clarify some others. Thanks so much for taking the time to respond to me. I know that it can take as long as 45 mins. to prepare an email of that length with detailed info ... so thank you. I'm saving all the responses to my PAF-5 email folder so I can go over them after my drive is replaced and I can actually get down to business on this. Grace in Georgia, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Waugh" <waugh.dube.dunn.lacroix@gmx.net> To: "Grace Inman" <Grace@eufaula.rr.com> Cc: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 6:23 AM Subject: Re: [PAF-5] Backup files > Hi Grace, > Both Bill and Stewart have given good advice about backups. > At the risk of repeating, let me just add a couple of comments and > opinions. > > Bill was describing that essentially the PAF program creates a "backup" > file in compressed (.zip) format, and saying that you could use PAF, or > any other (.zip) readers/programs (including modern Windows XP itself) to > later un-zip, i.e., read and use, that data if/when needed. > > Stewart suggests NOT leaving the program-default name for the > program-created back-up which PAF will simply name as > > (whatever-your-current-data-filename-is).ZIP > --(whatever-your-current-data-filename-is).PAF > is what you/PAF are using for data entry and display in the PAF program. > > He rightly suggests adding a date code to the name, which with modern > Windows can be written any way that pleases you. (i.e., no limit to length > of filename or characters used) However I use a modified version of the > older condensed type of name, and I name my back-ups with a continuous > date format, thus: > > mycurrentdata_20050720.zip (you should always use a two digit format for > month and day, i.e., 01, 02, etc. which will keep your data in correct > chronological/alphabetical sort order) > > and if I need more than one file made per day, I would add a letter, thus: > mycurrentdata_20050720a.zip, mycurrentdata_20050720b.zip, etc. > > As Stewart says, this has the advantage of keeping all your progressive > days' backups in correct chronological/alphabetical order, which makes it > easier later on to find the appropriate file/date you need and to delete > older versions as they become obsolete. > > In simplest terms, a backup is just that, a backed-up copy of another > file. > > Letting PAF create a "backup" results in the program creating a .zip > compressed file. This format takes up less space, and thus is more easily > transported, especially on older limited-size removable media. > > But an exported .GED (a GedCom) is also a backup as it too is a copy of > your data. So I always make it a two step process when making a backup > from PAF. First I choose the menu option of Backup in PAF, utilize the > above naming technique, and let the program do its thing and create a > compressed .ZIP file. > > Then I immediately create another backup by exporting a GedCom, by > choosing that option from the menu, and giving it the same name (including > date code). Of course, this file ending will be in (.GED) format. That way > I always have two current copies of my working data file, and I have them > in two formats as well. > > A third type of backup one can make is to simply copy the current PAF data > file to a different directory, but even here I would advise to add the > date coding into the name of the copy. Thus you would have > (your-current-data.PAF) and a duplicate file with a different name > (your-current-data_20050720.PAF). As long as you were careful to notice > which file you opened when you opened the PAF program and only did data > addition to the main file, (the one without the date code) this would be > fine. If you chose this option in addition to the others discussed above, > for added safety I would recommend moving that second .PAF file to some > other "storage" directory on your system, as opposed to leaving it in the > actual working program directory. > > (By the way, if you have not done so, you should create a series of > folders, as Stewart suggests, using the PAF options. I think though that > you have to actually go to the location on your drive using Windows, and > create and name this group of folders/directories first, then use PAF to > find them and set them as program choices. I don't think PAF allows you to > create the directory structure, only just choose what has already been > created. I may be wrong on this, it's been a while since I've done that. > But anyway, that's exactly what I have too, as Stewart has, inside the (My > Documents) folder, I have a folder called PAF, and inside that I have > several folders called, Backup, Export, Import, Web, etc. This helps in > organizing the data. Once you choose a location in the process of creating > a PAF backup, the program will remember it and automatically open to that > location the next time, but of course you can still always choose > different locations whenever you want.) > > So you see, making a backup of your data is simply copying the > information, but that can be done in many ways and in several formats. > Whatever you choose, BE CONSISTENT! Figure out a method that works for > you, but then DO IT! And do it regularly. > > Now just a word about placing the backup (or any files) on writable CD. > The PAF program can NOT write to a CD. So you would need to do all or some > of the above to actually create a file copy on your hard drive, then using > Windows File Explorer (NOT Internet Explorer), navigate to your newly > created file (that is, go find it!) and then manually copy it to the CD. > There are various CD Writer programs which sometimes come pre-installed on > your system or with a CD-writer and they are simply a different (hopefully > more user friendly) method of navigating to your data and then writing > that data to CD. But the bottom line is again, PAF can NOT write to CD (It > can write to Floppy so using that was a bit easier to integrate moving the > backup data to the removable medium before CD. If your data file is still > not too big, you could continue to use floppy disks as back up medium > instead of CD, but in the end CDs are now/and will be, more universally > usable, and they definitely are capable of immensely larger file storage, > and they are ostensibly less prone to file corruption so therefore more > secure. > > Finally, as the others have pointed out: move your backups to some other > secure physical location. It does no real good to make a back up of your > current data and leave it on the harddrive right next to that current > data! Sure if the program corrupts your working data, you'll have a back > up copy, but if your hard drive crashes.....wears out, dies......and > sooner or later it will....you'll have lost both your original data and > your back up files! So get it off the hard drive at least. And out of the > room, and out of the house, etc. As many precautions as you want to take. > Print the whole thing out on a periodic basis too! That's a backup also! > If you ever have digital problems, at least you'd still have all your data > in one format to re-enter and restore later on. > > A lot of chatter this morning, eh? Sorry! But I think you've now got a > better idea that backups come in many forms, and the real key element is: > CHOOSE A SYSTEM, DO IT, AND DO IT CONSISTENTLY! > > Good luck, > John > > > > > > > > Responding to the following quoted message RECEIVED 23:02 07.20.05, FROM > Grace Inman : > QUOTE: > Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make > the > best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of > PAF.5, > I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should > do > it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum > protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. > Grace in Georgia, USA > > In God we trust. > > END-QUOTED. > >

Thank you very much, Billy. This seems to be a very simple way to keep track of sequential backups. Another good idea from the List! I surely do appreciate you folks. Grace in Georgia, USA. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Billy J. Morton" <bjmorton@poncacity.net> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 11:23 AM Subject: Re: [PAF-5] Backup files > Grace > > I Make three disks and label them 1, 2, and 3, > I back up to #1. the next time I work in the file I back it up to #2 the > next backup is to #3.then start over to #1 after three back ups to the > same > disk I reformat the disk. > Doing it that way you always if You back up a corrupted file and catch it > before You back again You have a uncarpeted back up to restore from, and > You > will only have to put the information entered before the last back up. > > 73s Bill > > NAVY MARINE CORPS MARS Serving those who serve > Bill Morton Blackwell,Ok 74631 > E-Mail: nnn0gbo@navymars.org or > bjmorton@poncacity.net > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Grace Inman" <Grace@eufaula.rr.com> > To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 10:02 PM > Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files > > > Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make > the > best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of > PAF.5, > I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should > do > it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum > protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. > Grace in Georgia, USA > > In God we trust. > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service > http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/ > > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > RootsWeb's WorldConnect Project: > Connecting the World One GEDCOM at a Time > http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/ > >

Grace I Make three disks and label them 1, 2, and 3, I back up to #1. the next time I work in the file I back it up to #2 the next backup is to #3.then start over to #1 after three back ups to the same disk I reformat the disk. Doing it that way you always if You back up a corrupted file and catch it before You back again You have a uncarpeted back up to restore from, and You will only have to put the information entered before the last back up. 73s Bill NAVY MARINE CORPS MARS Serving those who serve Bill Morton Blackwell,Ok 74631 E-Mail: nnn0gbo@navymars.org or bjmorton@poncacity.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Grace Inman" <Grace@eufaula.rr.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 10:02 PM Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. Grace in Georgia, USA In God we trust. ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/

Grace, Good Question! Despite backups being an essential safety net, over the years I have seen great confusion and actual loss of data because of the way in which backups have been handled. The steps that I teach and advocate are as follows: 1. In Tools > Preferences > Folders set up a specific folder for your back-up files. This would be somewhere on your hard drive - mine are kept in C:\........\My Documents\PAF\Backup. 2. When selecting or requested to do a backup - the suggested name of the zipped backup is your PAF database name - this should be changed to include the date of your backup - for example, my database is millar.paf, which for a backup (today) I would change the suggested name to millar-2005-07-21 (the .zip extension will be added automatically for you) This example of course is using the reverse European date system (Y-M-D) which is recommended for keeping a series of files in date sequence. For any time where you have multiple backups on the same day - for instance, where you create a backup to take to a FHC or on a research trip - add some data at the FHC - then create a backup at the FHC to take home - simply add an additional version number at the end of the second backup file name, for example: Millar-2005-07-21-2 3. The backed-up file should then - for security reasons - either - be burned onto a CD - copied to a floppy disc (if your PC still has a floppy disc) - copied to a USB memory stick - attached and emailed to a friend - uploaded (ftp) to a secure internet site. Whatever suits your off-site storage arrangements. Using this approach you will then have a series of past backups - all date marked. Periodically you would delete the older backup versions. This way, any restored backup will create a PAF file with the same name that has the date incorporated in it. From any restored backup, you can then make the deliberate choice to rename the restored backup as your main file (using Save-As). Backups are not only a safety net for restoring a lost file but used in this way can allow you to open up (restore) a past back for a specific date and compare it with your current database to track any changes that you may have made. Good luck, Stewart -----Original Message----- From: Grace Inman [mailto:Grace@eufaula.rr.com] Sent: 21 July 2005 04:03 To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. Grace in Georgia, USA In God we trust. ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/

Hi Grace, There is one additional "best practices" item for backing up that has not been mentioned in this thread. You should also keep some kind of log that identifies in general terms what is different about each backup. For example, you might have a log that contains entries for Date, Filename, Comments with entries something like: July 14, 2005 Inman-2005-07-14 Completed Match/Merge for Millar line July 16, 2005 Inman-2005-07-16 Corrected errors in Connecticut place names July 18, 2005 Inman-2005-07-18 Added birth of Georgina Helen Inman July 20, 2005 Inman-2005-07-20 Added GEDCOM from Robert White (rwhite04.ged) and so on. If you ever had to go back and restore from a back up, this log of information about each back-up will be a great help in deciding which backup to restore from. If you happen to be running Windows XP, there is a way you can do this directly in the backup file. You will need to be familiar with Windows Explorer to do it. This is not the Internet Explorer that you use to surf the Internet. It is a utility program that comes with Windows that allows you to navigate and work with your files on your system. To run Windows Explorer, right click on the START button and select the Explore option. That will pop up the Explore window showing the usual Windows file system with folders listed on the left side and the folder contents on the right side. With your mouse, click on the folder where your backup files are located. You may have to click on more than one folder to "drill down" to your specific backup folder. Once you have highlighted the backup folder on the left, you should see your back-up file listed on the right. With your mouse pointing to the backup file name, right click on it. That will pop up a new dialog box with a Properties option at the very bottom. Once in the Properties pop-up box, select the Summary tab. There you will find a variety of fields you can use to enter information about your file. I suggest you enter the comments about the file in the Comments box at the bottom. Click OK. You now have saved the log information with the file itself. To show that info on your screen, you will need to use the Windows Explorer program again. So before you close it, click on the View pull down menu at the top of the Explorer window. Select the option Choose Details. In the list of details to be displayed, check the box for Comments and then click OK. Now every time you use Windows Explorer, and navigate to your backup folder, you will be able to view the comments with each backup file. I recognize that this sounds complicated at first, but once you do it a few times, it will become second nature. Good Luck, Richard Rands At 05:07 AM 7/21/2005, Grace Inman wrote: >Hi Stewart. Your method looks good. It's easy to do and seems to cover >all the bases. As mentioned in another email, I'm waiting for a tech to >replace my CD and DVD drives, which should happen in a few days. Right >now, they're both unusable. After they're replaced, I plan to do the CD >backups you describe, plus send my PAF file to my husband's PC for >additional protection (if he'll let me. :^ ) That thought occurs to >me, though ... you've gotta have a friend or relative who has the >available space on their PC, and is willing to use it for you. Thank you >so much. I really appreciate the help I get from this list. God bless you >folks in the U.K. Many prayers and petitions have gone up for you. >Grace in Georgia, USA > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Stewart Millar" <sm999@tiscali.co.uk> >To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 4:27 AM >Subject: RE: [PAF-5] Backup files > > >>Grace, >> >>Good Question! Despite backups being an essential safety net, over the years >>I have seen great confusion and actual loss of data because of the way in >>which backups have been handled. >> >>The steps that I teach and advocate are as follows: >> >>1. In Tools > Preferences > Folders set up a specific folder for your >>back-up files. This would be somewhere on your hard drive - mine are kept in >>C:\........\My Documents\PAF\Backup. >> >>2. When selecting or requested to do a backup - the suggested name of >>the zipped backup is your PAF database name - this should be changed to >>include the date of your backup - for example, my database is millar.paf, >>which for a backup (today) I would change the suggested name to >> >>millar-2005-07-21 (the .zip extension will be added automatically for >>you) >> >>This example of course is using the reverse European date system (Y-M-D) >>which is recommended for keeping a series of files in date sequence. >> >>For any time where you have multiple backups on the same day - for instance, >>where you create a backup to take to a FHC or on a research trip - add some >>data at the FHC - then create a backup at the FHC to take home - simply add >>an additional version number at the end of the second backup file name, for >>example: >> >>Millar-2005-07-21-2 >> >>3. The backed-up file should then - for security reasons - either - be >>burned onto a CD - copied to a floppy disc (if your PC still has a floppy >>disc) - copied to a USB memory stick - attached and emailed to a friend - >>uploaded (ftp) to a secure internet site. Whatever suits your off-site >>storage arrangements. >> >>Using this approach you will then have a series of past backups - all date >>marked. >> >>Periodically you would delete the older backup versions. >> >>This way, any restored backup will create a PAF file with the same name that >>has the date incorporated in it. From any restored backup, you can then make >>the deliberate choice to rename the restored backup as your main file (using >>Save-As). >> >>Backups are not only a safety net for restoring a lost file but used in this >>way can allow you to open up (restore) a past back for a specific date and >>compare it with your current database to track any changes that you may have >>made. >> >>Good luck, >> >>Stewart >> >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Grace Inman [mailto:Grace@eufaula.rr.com] >>Sent: 21 July 2005 04:03 >>To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com >>Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files >> >>Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make the >>best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of PAF.5, >>I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should do >>it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum >>protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. >>Grace in Georgia, USA >> >>In God we trust. >> >> >>==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >>PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service >>http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/ >> >> >> >> >>==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >>FreeBMD - Free Access to England and Wales Civil Registration Index >>Volunteer as a Transcriber Today! >>http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ >> > > > >==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >PAF-5-USERS Mailing List >http://www.ausbdm.org/p5uindex.php

In a message dated 7/21/2005 6:44:04 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, patjw28@earthlink.net writes: Due to illness, I was away from my genealogy for about four months. I'vr just started to get interested in it once more. For some reason, I can no longer back up my file. I've always been able to fit it on one floppy, but now it doesn't work. I go to File and Backup, file is already there--do you want to replace it, yes, and in three seconds it comes back with backup complete. I always check my floppies in the Run command and ask for directory A and it tells me there is no file. I've reformatted the discs, used diffferent ones, run check/repair (no problems). I'm very frustrated at this point and don't know what to do. Can someone help? My first guess is that somehow the place where the backup is saved has been changed from the A: drive to some other place. When you tell PAF to backup your data and the little screen comes up with the name of the file you want backed up, look at the top of the screen and see where the file is going. I suspect it is being saved to the hard drive (C:) instead of to the A: drive. Go to tools, preferences, folders and see where it says the file is going. If you want it to go to A: then type A:\ in the backup block. (I save my backups to the F: drive which is my USB memory stick) Alan B.

Due to illness, I was away from my genealogy for about four months. I'vr just started to get interested in it once more. For some reason, I can no longer back up my file. I've always been able to fit it on one floppy, but now it doesn't work. I go to File and Backup, file is already there--do you want to replace it, yes, and in three seconds it comes back with backup complete. I always check my floppies in the Run command and ask for directory A and it tells me there is no file. I've reformatted the discs, used diffferent ones, run check/repair (no problems). I'm very frustrated at this point and don't know what to do. Can someone help? Pat

Hi Stewart. Your method looks good. It's easy to do and seems to cover all the bases. As mentioned in another email, I'm waiting for a tech to replace my CD and DVD drives, which should happen in a few days. Right now, they're both unusable. After they're replaced, I plan to do the CD backups you describe, plus send my PAF file to my husband's PC for additional protection (if he'll let me. :^ ) That thought occurs to me, though ... you've gotta have a friend or relative who has the available space on their PC, and is willing to use it for you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate the help I get from this list. God bless you folks in the U.K. Many prayers and petitions have gone up for you. Grace in Georgia, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stewart Millar" <sm999@tiscali.co.uk> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 4:27 AM Subject: RE: [PAF-5] Backup files > Grace, > > Good Question! Despite backups being an essential safety net, over the > years > I have seen great confusion and actual loss of data because of the way in > which backups have been handled. > > The steps that I teach and advocate are as follows: > > 1. In Tools > Preferences > Folders set up a specific folder for your > back-up files. This would be somewhere on your hard drive - mine are kept > in > C:\........\My Documents\PAF\Backup. > > 2. When selecting or requested to do a backup - the suggested name of > the zipped backup is your PAF database name - this should be changed to > include the date of your backup - for example, my database is millar.paf, > which for a backup (today) I would change the suggested name to > > millar-2005-07-21 (the .zip extension will be added automatically for > you) > > This example of course is using the reverse European date system (Y-M-D) > which is recommended for keeping a series of files in date sequence. > > For any time where you have multiple backups on the same day - for > instance, > where you create a backup to take to a FHC or on a research trip - add > some > data at the FHC - then create a backup at the FHC to take home - simply > add > an additional version number at the end of the second backup file name, > for > example: > > Millar-2005-07-21-2 > > 3. The backed-up file should then - for security reasons - either - be > burned onto a CD - copied to a floppy disc (if your PC still has a floppy > disc) - copied to a USB memory stick - attached and emailed to a friend - > uploaded (ftp) to a secure internet site. Whatever suits your off-site > storage arrangements. > > Using this approach you will then have a series of past backups - all date > marked. > > Periodically you would delete the older backup versions. > > This way, any restored backup will create a PAF file with the same name > that > has the date incorporated in it. From any restored backup, you can then > make > the deliberate choice to rename the restored backup as your main file > (using > Save-As). > > Backups are not only a safety net for restoring a lost file but used in > this > way can allow you to open up (restore) a past back for a specific date and > compare it with your current database to track any changes that you may > have > made. > > Good luck, > > Stewart > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Grace Inman [mailto:Grace@eufaula.rr.com] > Sent: 21 July 2005 04:03 > To: PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files > > Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make > the > best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of > PAF.5, > I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should > do > it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum > protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. > Grace in Georgia, USA > > In God we trust. > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service > http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/ > > > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > FreeBMD - Free Access to England and Wales Civil Registration Index > Volunteer as a Transcriber Today! > http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > >

Hi Grace, Both Bill and Stewart have given good advice about backups. At the risk of repeating, let me just add a couple of comments and opinions. Bill was describing that essentially the PAF program creates a "backup" file in compressed (.zip) format, and saying that you could use PAF, or any other (.zip) readers/programs (including modern Windows XP itself) to later un-zip, i.e., read and use, that data if/when needed. Stewart suggests NOT leaving the program-default name for the program-created back-up which PAF will simply name as (whatever-your-current-data-filename-is).ZIP --(whatever-your-current-data-filename-is).PAF is what you/PAF are using for data entry and display in the PAF program. He rightly suggests adding a date code to the name, which with modern Windows can be written any way that pleases you. (i.e., no limit to length of filename or characters used) However I use a modified version of the older condensed type of name, and I name my back-ups with a continuous date format, thus: mycurrentdata_20050720.zip (you should always use a two digit format for month and day, i.e., 01, 02, etc. which will keep your data in correct chronological/alphabetical sort order) and if I need more than one file made per day, I would add a letter, thus: mycurrentdata_20050720a.zip, mycurrentdata_20050720b.zip, etc. As Stewart says, this has the advantage of keeping all your progressive days' backups in correct chronological/alphabetical order, which makes it easier later on to find the appropriate file/date you need and to delete older versions as they become obsolete. In simplest terms, a backup is just that, a backed-up copy of another file. Letting PAF create a "backup" results in the program creating a .zip compressed file. This format takes up less space, and thus is more easily transported, especially on older limited-size removable media. But an exported .GED (a GedCom) is also a backup as it too is a copy of your data. So I always make it a two step process when making a backup from PAF. First I choose the menu option of Backup in PAF, utilize the above naming technique, and let the program do its thing and create a compressed .ZIP file. Then I immediately create another backup by exporting a GedCom, by choosing that option from the menu, and giving it the same name (including date code). Of course, this file ending will be in (.GED) format. That way I always have two current copies of my working data file, and I have them in two formats as well. A third type of backup one can make is to simply copy the current PAF data file to a different directory, but even here I would advise to add the date coding into the name of the copy. Thus you would have (your-current-data.PAF) and a duplicate file with a different name (your-current-data_20050720.PAF). As long as you were careful to notice which file you opened when you opened the PAF program and only did data addition to the main file, (the one without the date code) this would be fine. If you chose this option in addition to the others discussed above, for added safety I would recommend moving that second .PAF file to some other "storage" directory on your system, as opposed to leaving it in the actual working program directory. (By the way, if you have not done so, you should create a series of folders, as Stewart suggests, using the PAF options. I think though that you have to actually go to the location on your drive using Windows, and create and name this group of folders/directories first, then use PAF to find them and set them as program choices. I don't think PAF allows you to create the directory structure, only just choose what has already been created. I may be wrong on this, it's been a while since I've done that. But anyway, that's exactly what I have too, as Stewart has, inside the (My Documents) folder, I have a folder called PAF, and inside that I have several folders called, Backup, Export, Import, Web, etc. This helps in organizing the data. Once you choose a location in the process of creating a PAF backup, the program will remember it and automatically open to that location the next time, but of course you can still always choose different locations whenever you want.) So you see, making a backup of your data is simply copying the information, but that can be done in many ways and in several formats. Whatever you choose, BE CONSISTENT! Figure out a method that works for you, but then DO IT! And do it regularly. Now just a word about placing the backup (or any files) on writable CD. The PAF program can NOT write to a CD. So you would need to do all or some of the above to actually create a file copy on your hard drive, then using Windows File Explorer (NOT Internet Explorer), navigate to your newly created file (that is, go find it!) and then manually copy it to the CD. There are various CD Writer programs which sometimes come pre-installed on your system or with a CD-writer and they are simply a different (hopefully more user friendly) method of navigating to your data and then writing that data to CD. But the bottom line is again, PAF can NOT write to CD (It can write to Floppy so using that was a bit easier to integrate moving the backup data to the removable medium before CD. If your data file is still not too big, you could continue to use floppy disks as back up medium instead of CD, but in the end CDs are now/and will be, more universally usable, and they definitely are capable of immensely larger file storage, and they are ostensibly less prone to file corruption so therefore more secure. Finally, as the others have pointed out: move your backups to some other secure physical location. It does no real good to make a back up of your current data and leave it on the harddrive right next to that current data! Sure if the program corrupts your working data, you'll have a back up copy, but if your hard drive crashes.....wears out, dies......and sooner or later it will....you'll have lost both your original data and your back up files! So get it off the hard drive at least. And out of the room, and out of the house, etc. As many precautions as you want to take. Print the whole thing out on a periodic basis too! That's a backup also! If you ever have digital problems, at least you'd still have all your data in one format to re-enter and restore later on. A lot of chatter this morning, eh? Sorry! But I think you've now got a better idea that backups come in many forms, and the real key element is: CHOOSE A SYSTEM, DO IT, AND DO IT CONSISTENTLY! Good luck, John Responding to the following quoted message RECEIVED 23:02 07.20.05, FROM Grace Inman : QUOTE: Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. Grace in Georgia, USA In God we trust. END-QUOTED.

Happy you asked because I am a backup proponent. There is no single way to back up your files that is totally safe but you can achieve maximum protection, (as good as it gets). Back up your database any way that is most convenient for you. PAF-5 creates a zip file that compresses your database about 10:1. You can restore this but only with PAF and it will overwrite your current database of the same name. You could also unpack it with Winzip or Windows XP zip utility and rename it, giving you a whole new database. You could also archive your current database using the zip utilities mentioned and it would be compressed to about 10% of its original size. You could export your entire database or any part of it as a new database and archive it using one of the zip utilities. If you select Other GEDCOM 5.5 when you export it could be opened in nearly any genealogy program, (not just PAF). That is the technical part. The important thing for maximum protection is, write your backups to several CDs. Then, send them to friends or relatives to hold for you and put one in your safe deposit box at your bank. You could also contribute one to your local library. If you just keep them at your home they could be destroyed or lost by theft, fire, flood, earthquake, or any other disaster. Personally, I don't trust floppy disks as about 1 in 3 of my older ones are no longer readable. Technology advances tend to make many of the things we trust now obsolete but CDs seem to have some future, at least in the short term. I'm sure I've given you much more information than you requested but when you have invested much of your life in creating a database that couldn't be duplicated protecting it is paramount. Regards, Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Grace Inman" <Grace@eufaula.rr.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:02 PM Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files > Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make > the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of > PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I > should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the > maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. > Grace in Georgia, USA > > In God we trust. > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service > http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/ > >

Thank you so much, Bill, for your prompt and thorough answer. I'm not sure that was exactly baby steps, but I think I can sort out all that you told me ... but it's gonna have to wait for morning ... it's after 11 p.m. here, so I'm gonna call it a day pretty soon. I have made some PAF CD backups in the past, but haven't passed them around the way you suggest ... will have to consider that. Also, at the moment, I'm waiting on a tech to replace my CD and DVD drives. DVD never did work, and CD only worked a short while. I let it go far too long, but they're under extended coverage warranty, so I guess it's free for me. S'posed to be done this week. After they're replaced and I can work with them again, I may have some questions about some of the steps and software you mentioned. Again, thank you. I appreciate all of the help that I get on the list ... sometimes I didn't even know that I needed certain info, but it turns out to be very helpful!!! :^ ) Grace in Georgia, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Linn" <billinn@suscom.net> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:04 PM Subject: Re: [PAF-5] Backup files > Happy you asked because I am a backup proponent. There is no single way to > back up your files that is totally safe but you can achieve maximum > protection, (as good as it gets). Back up your database any way that is > most convenient for you. PAF-5 creates a zip file that compresses your > database about 10:1. You can restore this but only with PAF and it will > overwrite your current database of the same name. You could also unpack it > with Winzip or Windows XP zip utility and rename it, giving you a whole > new database. You could also archive your current database using the zip > utilities mentioned and it would be compressed to about 10% of its > original size. You could export your entire database or any part of it as > a new database and archive it using one of the zip utilities. If you > select Other GEDCOM 5.5 when you export it could be opened in nearly any > genealogy program, (not just PAF). > > That is the technical part. The important thing for maximum protection is, > write your backups to several CDs. Then, send them to friends or relatives > to hold for you and put one in your safe deposit box at your bank. You > could also contribute one to your local library. If you just keep them at > your home they could be destroyed or lost by theft, fire, flood, > earthquake, or any other disaster. Personally, I don't trust floppy disks > as about 1 in 3 of my older ones are no longer readable. Technology > advances tend to make many of the things we trust now obsolete but CDs > seem to have some future, at least in the short term. I'm sure I've given > you much more information than you requested but when you have invested > much of your life in creating a database that couldn't be duplicated > protecting it is paramount. > > Regards, Bill > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Grace Inman" <Grace@eufaula.rr.com> > To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:02 PM > Subject: [PAF-5] Backup files > > >> Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make >> the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of >> PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I >> should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the >> maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. >> Grace in Georgia, USA >> >> In God we trust. >> >> >> ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >> PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service >> http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/ >> >> > > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > Replying to Posts > When quoting a post you're replying to, omit signatures and taglines that > are appended to the post. > >

Could someone please explain to me in real simple baby steps how to make the best kind of backup files? When I click "Backup" on the File menu of PAF.5, I always tell it to overwrite the current file. Is that the way I should do it, or not? If not, how should I be doing it to provide the maximum protection for my file(s)? Please and thank you very much. Grace in Georgia, USA In God we trust.

You are quite right and I have known of this function for sometime. You will also find that PAF makes no distinction between, say, brother and half brother. Accordin to PAF they are brothers - end of story. The same applies to cousins and half cousins etc. PAF doesn't show them as half cousins etc. They are simply 'Cousins'. Regards, Rollei (in Australia) Researching: LITTLE, Hibbard, Labies, Harmegnies, Gilbert, Bickford http://www.rolleilittle.com/ > >Rollie, >PAF 5 will calculate this relationship for you, as far as blood >relationship goes. If you already have that function set up, with you as >the person to calculate relationships to, the answer will apprear in the >lower left corner of the other person's (must be highlighted) Family >screen. If the function isn't set, go to Tools, select Relationship >Calculator and enter each individual's info (easiest by noting their RIN >and using it). Be sure you put your info (if you're trying to calculate >the other person's relationship to you) in the lower block. Otherwise you >get the reverse relationship. > >It that doesn't make sense, think of it this way: if you put your >grandfather in the top box and you in the bottom box, the answer will come >up that as grandfather (top box) is grandfather of lower box) If you >reverse the placement (you in top box & grandpa in the lower box) then the >answer comes up as grandson. > >Hope this helps. >Dick Cazier >----- Original Message ----- From: "Marie Young" <heartseas@bigpond.com> >To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 10:27 PM >Subject: Re: [PAF-5] What relation? > > >>Dear Rollie, >>Wouldn't we be 1/2 second cousins? or isn't there such a thing? You see, >>as >>I said in my last email, his grandfather was my grandmother's 1/2 brother. >>Marie >> >> >> >>==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >>FreeBMD - Free Access to England and Wales Civil Registration Index >>Volunteer as a Transcriber Today! >>http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ >> >> > > > >==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== >RootsWeb's WorldConnect Project: >Connecting the World One GEDCOM at a Time >http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/ >

Sherrie Apperson wrote: > All I care about is being able to document my families as correctly as > possible, but there isn't enough "standardized" terminology or procedure > to cover it all, YET . . . And when there IS standardization of terminology, you'll find some man who fits the definition of POSSLQ objecting to the term, wanting to replace it instead with PLQ or Roommates or Partners or "Good Friends" quotes and all. You can't win with this one (g) there'll always be an odd-ball who can't be forced into any hole, let alone the hectagonal one meant for him. Cheryl

Interesting. I was contacted by a descendant of a great grand uncle before Christmas claiming to have researched his branch of our family. We lost track of his family about 1880, finding no records in his home county. The person provided enough fragmented information to convince me he was credible but when I asked for details he answered, quote, " I HAVE PUT 7 YEARS OF LONG HOURS INTO RESEARCHING MY INFORMATION AND YOU WANT ALL OF IT. LONG HARD YEARS OF RESEARCH. YOU ASK ALOT." I haven't heard from him since. I only have a Yahoo email address so I may not ever be able to patch this branch of our family together. Regards, Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "twigs" <twigs@dsl.pipex.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 3:04 AM Subject: [PAF-5] Dont hog info, but ... > John writes from the unmarried citation thread: > "Cheryl, I certainly agree that it is your database. However some people > will take the attitude that they should not share this information with > others. > It is, of course, anyones right to keep their data to themselves. But > most people are anxious to share their data with others.

Dear Rollie, Wouldn't we be 1/2 second cousins? or isn't there such a thing? You see, as I said in my last email, his grandfather was my grandmother's 1/2 brother. Marie

Does anyone know what relation my grandmother's 1/2 brother's grandson and I be to each other? Marie

Regarding received "home" written CDs: Just want to point out here that, unfortunately, due to the way some versions of Windows work, as well as some versions of CD writing programs, and the inexperienced users of those, very often one creates an "intended to be written to CD" list of files, etc. and then somehow manages to only actually write that, instead of the actual data files, to the CD. In this case what the recipient gets....and this sounds to me possibly what you have, Becky.....is only a listing of the directory structure, or links to that directory structure, which exists on the original computer! In other words....useless information because actually NO information. And....when this does happen (and I've seen it more than once), IF one does also have similar programs installed on one's system, this CD of links and directory structure just act like shortcuts and so open up YOUR version of the program, but again...since there is actually no transferred data from the other system, so you are left looking at your own data. This may not be the case here, but it's good to keep in mind. I have experienced this very frustrating situation on at least 4 CDs from different people! Hope this helps, John Responding to the following quoted message RECEIVED 10:45 07.20.05, FROM Gary Templeman : QUOTE: That is certainly not the case, as you can have multiple PAF files open at the same time. It is difficult to diagnose the problem without having the FULL file names, but my guess is that it is an association problem, or the file being clicked is not what she thinks it is. Gary Templeman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeannie" <westfieldfleck-jhf@comcast.net> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 7:00 AM Subject: [PAF-5] Re: Sharing Info > > It could be that you need to <close> your file in PAF > before you can <open> your friend's file. ... > J.H.Fleck > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <HRETNUH@aol.com> > To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 2:03 PM > Subject: Sharing Info > > | Hi, I got great help from everyone on making copies of my paf files to > CD's. > | I was able to do that , get it on another computer. Now I just recieved > a > | CD from a relative of her paf files. The Problem is when it comes up it > says > | familysearch. I click on that and it says paf5, If I click on that it > gives > | me many choices but as a click on those nothing seems to work. The paf5 > | icon just takes me to my paf5. Is there something I'm doing wrong or is > that > | not usable. It seems to maybe her whole paf program. Thanks Becky > | > | ______________________________ > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > PAF-5-USERS Mailing List Archives > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/PAF-5-USERS/ > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== AVG Anti-Virus Users Disable the 'Certify outgoing messages' option via the E-mail Scanner tab. END-QUOTED.

Rollie, PAF 5 will calculate this relationship for you, as far as blood relationship goes. If you already have that function set up, with you as the person to calculate relationships to, the answer will apprear in the lower left corner of the other person's (must be highlighted) Family screen. If the function isn't set, go to Tools, select Relationship Calculator and enter each individual's info (easiest by noting their RIN and using it). Be sure you put your info (if you're trying to calculate the other person's relationship to you) in the lower block. Otherwise you get the reverse relationship. It that doesn't make sense, think of it this way: if you put your grandfather in the top box and you in the bottom box, the answer will come up that as grandfather (top box) is grandfather of lower box) If you reverse the placement (you in top box & grandpa in the lower box) then the answer comes up as grandson. Hope this helps. Dick Cazier ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marie Young" <heartseas@bigpond.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 10:27 PM Subject: Re: [PAF-5] What relation? > Dear Rollie, > Wouldn't we be 1/2 second cousins? or isn't there such a thing? You see, > as > I said in my last email, his grandfather was my grandmother's 1/2 brother. > Marie > > > > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ==== > FreeBMD - Free Access to England and Wales Civil Registration Index > Volunteer as a Transcriber Today! > http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > >

It could be that you need to <close> your file in PAF before you can <open> your friend's file. ... J.H.Fleck ----- Original Message ----- From: <HRETNUH@aol.com> To: <PAF-5-USERS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 2:03 PM Subject: Sharing Info | Hi, I got great help from everyone on making copies of my paf files to CD's. | I was able to do that , get it on another computer. Now I just recieved a | CD from a relative of her paf files. The Problem is when it comes up it says | familysearch. I click on that and it says paf5, If I click on that it gives | me many choices but as a click on those nothing seems to work. The paf5 | icon just takes me to my paf5. Is there something I'm doing wrong or is that | not usable. It seems to maybe her whole paf program. Thanks Becky | | ______________________________