Hi, Patti, Don't know if the follow death notice from the Village Record is of any use to you, but it could be your John Smith Lilley's father. It is the earliest instance of Lilley at Accessible Archives. October 8, 1823 VILLAGE RECORD Death Notice DIED- Of the bilious fever, at his father residence in West Bradford, on the 26th ult. SAMUEL LILLEY, Jr. aged 24 years. The deceased was a young man of amiable and obliging disposition, respected within the circle of his acquaintance, of sober and industrious habits, and one in whom were centred the hopes of indulgent parents. The following information on the Griers will probably only muddy the waters, but it might also give some leads. I don't know if the next article refers to the same Rev. Grief, but it gives his father's name who was also the pastor of Brandywine Manor Presbyterian Church. Is this the same man as N.O. Grier? December 5, 1868 VILLAGE RECORD Biography RESIGNATION OF A VENERABLE PASTOR - Rev. J.N.C. GRIER, D.D., the aged pastor of the Presbyterian Church at Brandywine Manor, Chester county, has recently resigned his charge, on account of infirmity. He has been fifty four years pastor of the Church, having been installed in 1814, succeeding his father, Rev. Nathan Grier, who entered upon the duties of the charge in 1788, and filled the pulpit twenty six years. The congregation, out of esteem for Dr. Grier, refused to join with him in his application to the Presbytery to have the pastoral relation dissolved, but proceeded to call a co-pastor, at the same time settling a life annuity of $500 upon their venerable pastor. The labors of Dr. Grier have been greatly blessed. During his ministry more than twelve hundred persons have been added to the church, and seventeen young men from his congregation have entered the ministry. When he first entered upon the charge, the Manor Church was the only one within a radius of six miles. - Now there are five large and flourishing Presbyterian Churches on the same territory, as follows; Brandywine Manor, Waynesburg, Coatesville, Downingtown and West Nantmeal Out of about four hundred persons who were members when Dr. Grier became pastor, only two are now remaining. It is pleasant to contemplate the record of such a life. (Pottstown Ledger.) Below is some information on the Rev. Nathan Grier gives his wife's name as Susanna, daughter of Robert and Margaret Smith. It appears that he died too early to have been the N.O. Grier who raised John Smith Lilley, but it's worth following up. Aril 9, 1861 VILLAGE RECORD Biography Rev. NATHAN GRIER, was the son of John and Agnes (Caldwell) Grier, who came to this country from the north of Ireland. He was born, in Bucks county, Pennsylvania, in September, 1760; pursued his preparatory studies under the direction of his brother, Rev. James Grier; graduated at the University of Pennsylvania, in 1783; was licensed by the Presbytery of Philadelphia; and became Pastor of the church of 'Forks of Brandywine,'Chester county, as the successor of Rev. John Carmichael, in 1787. He possessed natural and acquired endowments which fitted him for great usefulness. He had a very commanding voice, and an earnestness and solemnity of manner, which secured attention. He spake as one who felt the weight of ministerial responsibility. He was a man of great firmness of purpose. What he regarded as duty, must be done. In all his relations, he always endeavored to know what was right, and to maintain it with vigor and independence. He was possessed of a social disposition, and in familiar intercourse with his friends he received and imparted much enjoyment. His reputation as an eloquent preacher and a learned divine, brought under his care, an unusual number of students for the ministry There were at that time no theological seminaries, and young men were trained for the ministry under the direction of the older and more celebrated divines. He had under his care at different times, twenty students in Theology, seventeen of whom entered the ministry of the Presbyterian church; one the Episcopal ministry; and two never applied for licensure. Among these students were David McConoughy, D.D., who became President of Washington College, Pa.; Levi Bull, D.D., who became an eminent minister in the Episcopal church; Robert White, Samuel Parke, and the preceptorsons, Robert S. Grier and John N.C. Grier. His wife was Susanna, daughter of Robert and Margaret Smith, by whom he had three daughters and two sons. Two of his daughters became the wives of Rev. Robert White and Rev. Samuel Parke, who had pursued their the ical studies under his care. His oldest son, Robert S. Grier, is Pastor of churches in Carlisle Presbytery and the youngest, John N.C. Grier, DD., succeeded his father, as Pastor of Forks of Brandywine, in 1814. Rev. << Nathan Grier>> , died March 30, 1814, in the vigor of life, and in the midst of usefulness. He was Pastor of the Brandywine church, twenty seven years. [NOTAE CESTRIENSES] April 20, 1814 CHESTER & DELAWARE FEDERALIST Death Notice On Thursday the 31st ult. the Reverend << NATHAN GRIER>> , the truly pious and much beloved pastor of the congregation in the Forks of Brandywine, Chester county. October 31, 1814 EDEN STAR Real Estate TO BE SOLD AT PUBLIC SALE, Agreeable to the last Will and Testament of the Rev. << NATHAN GRIER>> , deceased, on Thursday the 17th of November next, at 10 o, A.M. on the premises, the Real Estate of the deceased, being a valuable PLANTATION, containing about 75 acres of Land, situated in the township of Brandywine, and county of Chester, adjoining lands of John Grier, Sen. John Butler, and others - distant from Philadelphia about 36 miles, and one mile from the Manor Meeting House, convenient to places of Worship, of different professions, to Mills, &c Said Farm has on it a large two story Stone House, a Well of good standing Water, with a Pump in it, near the door, a good Stone Barn, Milk House, a Frame Carriage House, an Orchard of excellent Fruit. - Of this Farm about 25 Acres are excellent Woodland - 10 Acres of Timothy Meadow - the remainder judiciously and handsomely divided into small fields, in a high state of cultivation. - Attendance with be given, and conditions made known on the day of Sale, by JAMES RALSTON, and JOSEPH GRIER, Executors. More to think about: Pennsylvania Wills, 1682-1834 SMITH, ROBERT. Uwchlan. May 5, 1800: January 16, 1804. To wife Margaret the plantation I now live on; also household goods &c. during life: after her decease plantation to be sold & money divided among 8 children: Emma Porter & Hannah Grier, £5 each: John Smith, £150: Margaret Kenady, £35: Jonathan, Robert, Joseph & Isaac Smith £100 each. Isaac Smith to have the use of the mills he is now building for 20 years from this time & no longer. Executors: Wife Margaret and son John Smith. Wits.: William Denny, Mark Darrah, David Denny. GRIER, AGNES. Widow of John. New Britain, Bucks Co. December 11, 1804. January 14, 1813. To dau. Martha, widow of John Jamison, $14. To gr.dau. Grizzle wife of Moses Shaw $40. To gr.dau. Fanny, wife of Adam Kerr $14. To gr.dau. Martha, wife of John Kerr $13. To gr.dau. Agnes, wife of William Bryan $13. To gr.dau. Jean Tenbrook, wife of John Long, $13. To Cesar, my son John's black man $30. Rem. in 6 equal parts, five of them to my children, Matthew, John, Joseph, Nathan, and Fanny Ralston, and the rem. share to the children of son James, dec'd., viz: John, Mary, Agnes & Fanny, when 21. Executors: Sons Joseph and Nathan Grier. Wits: John Long, William Long. GRIER, NATHAN. Honeybrook. Minister of the Gospel. March 30, 1814. April 8, 1814. To dau. Martha Grier $20. To dau. Sarah Grier $10. Real & personal estate to be sold & divided among children, viz: Nancy, wife of Rev. Robert White, Robert S., John C., Martha and Sarah Grier, in equal shares. Executors: Bro. Joseph Grier and brother-in-law James Ralston. Wits: Matthew Stanley, James Hindman. GRIER, MATTHEW. Brandywine. May 28, 1818. September 21, 1818. To daus. Hannah Marple & Martha Grier £100 each. To son John E. Grier £100. Remainder of estate, real & personal to wife Catharine, to be disposed of as she sees fit. Executors: Son John E. Grier and son-in-law Jos. Marple. Wits: John N. C. Grier, James Ralston. Clearly, the Smiths and Griers were connected; could there be a generation missing??? Karen Greim Mullian booboopies@aol.com zeke196@juno.com In a message dated Sat, 19 Aug 2000 9:43:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time, "Patti Smith" <psmith11@columbus.rr.com> writes: << Hello List, I have traced my above families back to Chester Co., PA. My 3 g-grandparents were John Smith LILLEY and Amelia Jane GLENN. John Smith LILLEY was born in Chester Co August 11, 1822. His mother was Margaret Vaughn SMITH. It is thought that John Smith Lilley's father may have died young. John was raised by his aunt (sister to Margaret Vaughn SMITH) Agnes SMITH and her husband Rev. N. O. GRIER of the Old Manse Church at Brandywine Manor, Chester Co., Pennsylvania. I have not been able to find a marriage record for Margaret V. SMITH & Unknown LILLEY. Amelia Jane GLENN was born February 18, 1829 in Clermont Co., OH and was the daughter of Alexander GLENN & Martha BARR. Alexander GLENN was born October 26, 1792 in Birmingham Station, Chester Co., PA. Martha BARR's death record states that she was born February 11, 1797 in Washington Co., PA. Alexander GLENN & Martha BARR married in Clermont Co., OH on August 02, 1816. I have information on the the children of John LILLEY & Amelia GLENN and for Alexander GLENN & Martha BARR. My Chester Co. ancestors moved to Clermont Co., OH and then settled in Hardin Co., OH. Does anyone on this list know if there are guardianship records that exist and where I could write to obtain them? I would also like to exchange information with anyone researching the Lilley, Glenn, Smith & Barr surnames. Thanks! Patti Smith, Delaware, OH http://members.xoom.com/pasmith/ancestor.htm ==== PACHESTE Mailing List ==== Stop by our associated website for Chester County Genealogy at http://www.rootsweb.com/~pacheste/chester.htm >>