I just deleted a long list of subject lines that included Pow-Wow, Longevity and Death Certs online. I got more than a little disturbed to see that someone suggested that Fred Houts, a long-time list member and wonderful guy for sharing information, might be rabble rousing! Any of you who have been on the list as long as Fred has should know better! When did we become so uncivil? Well, here's some rabble rousing for you! Did it ever occur to folks that simply clicling on REPLY when answering a list posting might cause some of us who actually have a life outside genealogy to hit the delete button instead of reading every single REPLY? Please change the subject line so as to give some idea exactly what the content of your posting is, and if you have a personal reply for another list member, send it to them, not the list. Don't make personal attacks on other list members. One last thing - please don't start a REPLY on my rabble rousing because I'm just going to delete all of them! Justin, is that suggestion "gentle" enough? Sorry, but I just couldn't stand by and see Fred attacked. Diana

My grgrandfather Charles Calvin Bartels was a Lutheran minister in Loganton for a short time about 1872. He married Sophia Jane Wohlford daughter of Sophia Snook and Philip Wohlford. Jim

Hi Jan - My grgrgrandmother was Sophia Snook who married Philip Wohlford. Her parents were Mathias Snook and Maria Christina Kleckner. Sophia, Philp and Mathias are buried in Loganton (Mathias with second wife and Maria Christina is buried at Shracktown. Jim

My great-grandfather Petros Vlachos (Spelling) owned the Marathon Bakery in Altoona, PA. I am looking for any information on him, his family, and/or the bakery. He wore a mourning band because his son Gregory died in the flu epidemic at the end of WWI. Is there any information available from anyone on him? Alexis Francos

Oh - and Justin - on those roots, try this: Try a blessing around them - do a little prayer ritual and then hold your palms a few inches around the bushes and send them loving energy. That's one of the things my dad taught me. Jan Blessed Be; Bright Blessings; Beautiful Beginnings; Big Boons; Bodacious Blockbusters; Brilliant Brainstorms ; Boundless Benefits

Ahhhh - Sassafras tea - one of the highlights of springtime. If it tasted awful, perhaps it brewed too long. It tends to get bitter. After leaving Ohio for CA, my mother would send me a package every spring. I missed that after she died and was very happy a few years ago to find some on a grocery shelf. When I tried it, Ugh! I thought the root seemed a bit too dry, but if they are now processing the whole root - that explains the difference. Jim - you have SNOOK in your tree? So do I - just collateral though. Justin, thanks for including those urls - I was going to ask if any of those books were available. Jan Blessed Be; Bright Blessings; Beautiful Beginnings; Big Boons; Bodacious Blockbusters; Brilliant Brainstorms ; Boundless Benefits

Sassafras tea was supposed to thin the blood. Many of the older folks used it in the spring after a long cold winter. Originally the bark of the roots was used but when the commercial people started making it they chipped up the entire root. I remember my dad getting the roots and washing them in the creek that ran below our house, then pealing the bark off and cutting it up to make tea. Leah

Another interesting book with many old customs of the Pennsylvania Germans, called "Folk-Lore of the Pennsylvania Germans": http://www.sacred-texts.com/ame/fpg/index.htm I cannot attest to its reliability but there appears to be some good anecdotal info here. Justin At 10:37 PM 1/25/2007, you wrote: >Jim - I'm pretty sure it was an Embich/Embick. I'll check with my >husband when he gets home tonight (from Loganton). > >Gloria > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 10:24 PM > Subject: Re: [PACENTRE] Pow-Wow In Loganton > > > Wonder if this was a Wohlford or Snook or a Kleckner. I have > family by that > name in Loganton. > > Jim In VT > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

It amuses me to hear you, Justin, say you had sassafras tea "on more than one occasion." I had a friend in KY before I was married who sent me a coffee can filled with sassafras root which grew prolifically there. My mother helped me brew sassafras tea and ugh! I never wanted any more! Gloria Harbach Sassafras tea is a common remedy for a host of ailments, and I have had it on more than one occasion. The tea is made from roots of the sassafras tree, which has a very unique and pleasant odor, in the roots and in any branches which are broken off. The tea, in high quantities, is suspected by some to be carcinogenic, so it is not something that you want to make a habit of using, but it provides a refreshing alternative from time to time. It has been some years since I have had any, and planted some roots in the backyard last year, so we'll see if they grow at all. Given my experience, probably not! Another one is catnip tea for upset stomach, particularly among small infants and children, made from the leaves of the catnip plant. Justin

Jim - I'm pretty sure it was an Embich/Embick. I'll check with my husband when he gets home tonight (from Loganton). Gloria ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 10:24 PM Subject: Re: [PACENTRE] Pow-Wow In Loganton Wonder if this was a Wohlford or Snook or a Kleckner. I have family by that name in Loganton. Jim In VT ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have excellent news! I see that "The Long-Lost Friend" is online in full text: http://www.sacred-texts.com/ame/pow/index.htm This was the book which was a major guide to pow-wow among our Pennsylvania German ancestors. I am certain that there were regional variations on these practices, and some local remedies were omitted, and others included which weren't used here, but this is an excellent guide to the type of thing that we are talking about and how it was used by some of our ancestors, and some among us today. Justin At 08:52 PM 1/25/2007, you wrote: >I remember going to my dad's place of business to get a ride home >from town with him and as I walked in, I noticed an old woman >leaving - dressed in black. This would have been in the mid to late >1940s. Dad said he just sold his wart (on his hand) to a pow-wower. >I was very skeptical, but he showed me it was gone in just a few days. > >Also, my mother-in-law went to a pow-wower who was known for this >"skill" in the Loganton area. This was also in the late 40s or early >50s. She claimed he took care of her physical problems. > >Gloria Harbach > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Wonder if this was a Wohlford or Snook or a Kleckner. I have family by that name in Loganton. Jim In VT

Sassafras tea is a common remedy for a host of ailments, and I have had it on more than one occasion. The tea is made from roots of the sassafras tree, which has a very unique and pleasant odor, in the roots and in any branches which are broken off. The tea, in high quantities, is suspected by some to be carcinogenic, so it is not something that you want to make a habit of using, but it provides a refreshing alternative from time to time. It has been some years since I have had any, and planted some roots in the backyard last year, so we'll see if they grow at all. Given my experience, probably not! Another one is catnip tea for upset stomach, particularly among small infants and children, made from the leaves of the catnip plant. Justin At 08:59 PM 1/25/2007, you wrote: >Interesting I live in Ohio Amish Country and though I don't know any >personally, I did work home health for a time. Amish young girls >and older single >women are often privately hired to care for the chronically ill. > >I did meet one family who had an older Amish woman whose father was noted as >being successful at laying on of hands healing. She reported no success with >adults, but claimed to have "the gift" with children. > >There are also still herbiest practitioners among the Amish, though even they >are turning more to modern medicine. > >My great uncle of Clearfield County was the son of a miller, but knew a lot >of woods lore. He gave me boneset tea one spring and it was terrible, but he >used it as a tonic. His sister, my grandmother used sassafras tea >for "female" >problems. Our high school biology teacher used to warn us about some of the >local tea treatments as compounds that could dangerously lower blood pressure >per him. > >just some jottings, >Jean > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I hope this e-mail will be the final clarification on this particular matter. Utah Death Certificate images are online, an addition to the index which has been there for some time. The site given before references you to that. Missouri and West Virginia are also states which have done this sort of thing and Georgia is in the process of doing so. Pennsylvania and New York have no such program in the works at this time. Justin

Interesting I live in Ohio Amish Country and though I don't know any personally, I did work home health for a time. Amish young girls and older single women are often privately hired to care for the chronically ill. I did meet one family who had an older Amish woman whose father was noted as being successful at laying on of hands healing. She reported no success with adults, but claimed to have "the gift" with children. There are also still herbiest practitioners among the Amish, though even they are turning more to modern medicine. My great uncle of Clearfield County was the son of a miller, but knew a lot of woods lore. He gave me boneset tea one spring and it was terrible, but he used it as a tonic. His sister, my grandmother used sassafras tea for "female" problems. Our high school biology teacher used to warn us about some of the local tea treatments as compounds that could dangerously lower blood pressure per him. just some jottings, Jean

I remember going to my dad's place of business to get a ride home from town with him and as I walked in, I noticed an old woman leaving - dressed in black. This would have been in the mid to late 1940s. Dad said he just sold his wart (on his hand) to a pow-wower. I was very skeptical, but he showed me it was gone in just a few days. Also, my mother-in-law went to a pow-wower who was known for this "skill" in the Loganton area. This was also in the late 40s or early 50s. She claimed he took care of her physical problems. Gloria Harbach

i must have missed the first posting on this. where can i find death certificates on line for pennsylvania or ny state? like others, i am particularly interested in names of parents of the deceased. thanks. marcia marcia sandmeyer wilson 259 leonia ave. leonia, nj 07605 please check out my website: http://marciasandmeyerwilson.com On Jan 25, 2007, at 8:37 PM, rayfri wrote:

ROFL Justin - I was going to mention that - but . . . wasn't sure if it would be proper here. My grandparents performed certain rituals and were considered healers. I ordered a book on Lancaster County and found a chapter on PowWowing - and while reading it, realized that's what grandparents performed. Very interesting to me, as I have a practice in alternative healing and use many of the techniques that my father and grandparents used and taught me. I would love to hear about other's experiences. Jan Blessed Be; Bright Blessings; Beautiful Beginnings; Big Boons; Bodacious Blockbusters; Brilliant Brainstorms ; Boundless Benefits

Yes, Jan, I certainly concur there. Among other things I've really been watching for trans fats lately but there is so much today we are unaware of in our food, that was not the case when our ancestors grew their own food or purchased it in the town market from local farmers they knew. Still, they had problems in those days, too -- if you did happen to get seriously sick or develop a heart ailment or cancer, etc., there was almost nothing that could be done for you. Also "that dread disease consumption" (tuberculosis) plagued everybody in those days and I think for a while was the #1 killer. It was particularly a problem in towns where families lived close together, but took its fair share of deaths in rural areas, too. Those people just worked so hard physically that it is difficult for us to comprehend the amount of exertion involved. EVERYTHING they did or contemplated doing had to be accomplished by hand at each step in the process, and everywhere they went had to be walked or driven by horse, which involved physical effort as well. The old newspapers often have little "personal" items about residents walking 5, 10, or even 15 miles to town to spend the day, many of whom were in their 80s at the time. Distances were not a great impediment because they had the "gumption" to get up and make things happen -- they didn't know anything else. I just got a catalogue from Masthof bookstore, which specializes in Mennonite and Pennsylvania German genealogy, history, and culture, in southeastern Pennsylvania. One of the publications is apparently a reprint of a 17th century Swiss farming guide. It details advice on how to plant, various remedies, etc., and I'm sure would be interesting reading to those interested in the origins of this aspect of our history. On a related note, the old-time settlers, particularly the German settlers, had the tradition of Pow-Wow in some of the families, as well as a host of natural remedies. Everyone can form their own opinion and belief but I must state the facts so that researchers are aware of the tradition in the area. My late great-uncle David "Buss" Bilger (1907-2001) was very knowledgeable in this particular field in his time. A lumberman, he had extensive knowledge of the flora and fauna of the region and knew a host of teas, herbs, and home remedies of all sorts, to fit just about any type of problem. This is an old Pennsylvania Dutch tradition, and there are still some in the area today. A cousin of my grandfather's, Leonard "Toot" Resides (1918-1992) was a Pow-wower, and is said to have been able to stop a nosebleed with a certain Bible verse. Jacob Breon (1798-1874) of Spring Mills was also a noted pow-wower in his day. The old German book, "The Forgotten Friend" details many such practices. The contemporary publications of Jeff Frazier, "Pennsylvania Fireside Tales," have some accounts of these types of events that Jeff collected among the old-timers of Penns Valley and elsewhere in the state back in the 1970s and 1980s, when the pre-automobile generation was dying out. The tradition of folk remedies, pow-wow, hex signs, astrological calculations, etc., was particularly strong among some of the German settlers in Brush Valley area of Centre County. John Buchtel (d. 1810) was the most famous practitioner of this art. Over in Bald Eagle Valley, John H. Watkins (1794-1879) who lived back "in the ridges" above Bullet Run, along the border of Howard and Curtin Townships, and whose family had come from Maryland, was a noted folk healer. He possessed a book which he would let no one see, and which he called "The Book of Knowledge," and it was considered to be the source of his remedies and practices. This is a very interesting side of Centre County history that I invite others to discuss, particularly if you have additional information on individuals, particularly pow-wowers, and their practices. Justin Justin At 07:56 PM 1/25/2007, you wrote: >Justin - agree with your premise of hard work and activity. There are a >couple other things that come into the equation for present day early demise >also: pollution and junk food. My father's family members all >lived into their >90's and some past 100 - ggram 107. Only 2 that I can think of who died >early - in their 70s - and they left rural life to live and work in >manufacturing >cities where pollution was poisonous; Akron and Detroit. > >Jan > > > >Blessed Be; Bright Blessings; Beautiful Beginnings; Big Boons; >Bodacious Blockbusters; Brilliant Brainstorms ; Boundless Benefits > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Yes, that is the INDEX. Then you can click the name and see the image of the certificate. At 06:20 PM 1/25/2007, you wrote: > >In a message dated 1/25/2007 4:15:45 P.M. Central Standard Time, >[email protected] writes: > >The online index to 250,000+ Utah deaths was created by the State Office >of Vital Records and Statistics and has searchable information limited >to the name of the deceased person, their date of death, sex, and where >they died. > > >It says. . . "Limited to the name of the deceased person, their date of >death, sex, and where they died." Says nothing about naming the >parents of the >deceased. --FRED > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message