The results on this kit are interesting and relevant to further understanding this group. With results in for the three sons of the believed Frederick, we now have a perfect 37/37 match for two of the sons, William and Spencer, and a 25/25 match for two of the four descendents of John. This would make it likely that we have 37 markers of the DNA of the fathers of these sons, and virtually certain that we have 25 markers of his DNA. This group seems very firmly established. Too bad we can't find any documentary records on the father, but we can be sure that he was not "John the Tory" as has been alleged. The chart is at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/Walesetc.htm Roy Johnson