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    1. Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592
    2. Lonnie Pace

    3. Roy, Well, I might as well "pile on" too. In the black paragraph under the chart, you say "126591 is a descendent of the third brother, Spencer." We can't all be without error. I appreciate the work that you do, and only wish that I had your understanding of the subject. Let's see if I have this straight. I gather from the information that: A: it is believed that there were three brothers, John, William and Dempsey Pace, and B: we have DNA samples from direct line descendants of each of these three brothers, and the commonality of these samples appears to prove that belief, and C: There is no such thing as "Proof Positive", rather only a preponderance of the evidence submitted that strengthens said belief. Thank You, Lonnie Pace -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roy Johnson Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 8:11 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 Thanks for the heads up. Don't know where Ic ame up with Spencer. Roy -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Janders 45 Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 5:13 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 I see one error in the chart - Spencer should be Dempsey. Yes, Frederick Pace of Wales is alive and well, at least from a family tree/ancestral chart point of view. The DNA results only indicate that it is highly probable that the five individuals tested have a common male ancestor at some point in time, but the DNA results alone can't speak to the exact nature of that relationship. To determine this, we have to rely on other sources and, fortunately, the nature of the relationship of the three Clarke Co Paces, William, John, and Dempsey, is rather well documented. The DNA evidence does not "prove" that these old sources are true, but the evidence is consistent with the old sources, so it does suggest that they are likely to be true. As Roy pointed out, we can now be confident that the father of these Paces "was not "John the Tory" as has been alleged." Joe Anderson > From: [email protected]> To: [email protected]> Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2008 22:17:08 -0500> Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > I just re-read Bob Webb's commentary that at least one of these persons> might be a brother of Frederick rather than a son. The DNA would results> would neither prove nor disprove that belief. As far as the DNA is> concerned, this would be quite possible.> > Roy> > -----Original Message-----> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf> Of Roy Johnson> Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2008 9:57 PM> To: [email protected]> Subject: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > The results on this kit are interesting and relevant to further> understanding this group. With results in for the three sons of the believed> Frederick, we now have a perfect 37/37 match for two of the sons, William> and Spencer, and a 25/25 match for two of the four descendents of John. This> would make it likely that we have 37 markers of the DNA of the fathers of> these sons, and virtually certain that we have 25 markers of his DNA.> > > > This group seems very firmly established. Too bad we can't find any> documentary records on the father, but we can be sure that he was not "John> the Tory" as has been alleged.> > > > The chart is at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/Walesetc.htm> > > > Roy Johnson> > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in> the subject and the body of the message> > No virus found in this incoming message.> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: 11/1/2008> 7:56 PM> > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ When your life is on the go-take your life with you. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/115298558/direct/01/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: 11/1/2008 7:56 PM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

    11/02/2008 04:06:36
    1. Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592
    2. Roy Johnson

    3. I have no idea where I got Spencer. It is of course Dempsey. I changed that in the chart but forgot I needed to change it in the explanation also. Your analysis is totally correct. Also, have you clicked the link to the documentary evidence and Bob Webb's commentary? Bob seems to think some of the dates are out of whack and that William and John could be brothers to Frederick. Since brothers would have the same DNA as Frederick, DNA could not sort this out. What the DNA does is to give strong evidence that these donors have a common ancestor, and that they absolutely cannot be, as Bruce Howard proposed, descendents of John the Tory. Somewhere on the FTDNA site is a chart showing the percentages of likelihood of common ancestor, showing X percentage of a common ancestor within X generations. They have moved this on the site; I will have to search again to find it. It might be good for you to browse around on the FTDNA site (familytreedna.com) and read the tutorials etc. Rebecca Christensen is the one who knows DNA better than I do. I am mainly a go-between, and I had to learn enough to basically interpret the results and put the donors in the right place on the chart. I haven't had time to study in depth. There is information on what specific alleles show, and I haven't gotten into that at all. I'll make the necessary correction. ; Roy -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lonnie Pace Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 11:07 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 Roy, Well, I might as well "pile on" too. In the black paragraph under the chart, you say "126591 is a descendent of the third brother, Spencer." We can't all be without error. I appreciate the work that you do, and only wish that I had your understanding of the subject. Let's see if I have this straight. I gather from the information that: A: it is believed that there were three brothers, John, William and Dempsey Pace, and B: we have DNA samples from direct line descendants of each of these three brothers, and the commonality of these samples appears to prove that belief, and C: There is no such thing as "Proof Positive", rather only a preponderance of the evidence submitted that strengthens said belief. Thank You, Lonnie Pace -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roy Johnson Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 8:11 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 Thanks for the heads up. Don't know where Ic ame up with Spencer. Roy -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Janders 45 Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 5:13 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 I see one error in the chart - Spencer should be Dempsey. Yes, Frederick Pace of Wales is alive and well, at least from a family tree/ancestral chart point of view. The DNA results only indicate that it is highly probable that the five individuals tested have a common male ancestor at some point in time, but the DNA results alone can't speak to the exact nature of that relationship. To determine this, we have to rely on other sources and, fortunately, the nature of the relationship of the three Clarke Co Paces, William, John, and Dempsey, is rather well documented. The DNA evidence does not "prove" that these old sources are true, but the evidence is consistent with the old sources, so it does suggest that they are likely to be true. As Roy pointed out, we can now be confident that the father of these Paces "was not "John the Tory" as has been alleged." Joe Anderson > From: [email protected]> To: [email protected]> Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2008 22:17:08 -0500> Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > I just re-read Bob Webb's commentary that at least one of these persons> might be a brother of Frederick rather than a son. The DNA would results> would neither prove nor disprove that belief. As far as the DNA is> concerned, this would be quite possible.> > Roy> > -----Original Message-----> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf> Of Roy Johnson> Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2008 9:57 PM> To: [email protected]> Subject: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > The results on this kit are interesting and relevant to further> understanding this group. With results in for the three sons of the believed> Frederick, we now have a perfect 37/37 match for two of the sons, William> and Spencer, and a 25/25 match for two of the four descendents of John. This> would make it likely that we have 37 markers of the DNA of the fathers of> these sons, and virtually certain that we have 25 markers of his DNA.> > > > This group seems very firmly established. Too bad we can't find any> documentary records on the father, but we can be sure that he was not "John> the Tory" as has been alleged.> > > > The chart is at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/Walesetc.htm> > > > Roy Johnson> > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in> the subject and the body of the message> > No virus found in this incoming message.> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: 11/1/2008> 7:56 PM> > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ When your life is on the go-take your life with you. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/115298558/direct/01/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: 11/1/2008 7:56 PM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1761 - Release Date: 11/2/2008 9:51 AM

    11/02/2008 11:59:44
    1. Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 and Spencer Pace
    2. Lois Long Carey

    3. Somewhere in my notes I heard from a man who lived in N.C in the house that once belonged to Spencer Pace. Was there more than one Spencer Pace? Will try to find my notes! Lois carey * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Please note: My new email address is [email protected] Please remove [email protected] from your address books and files so that we can stay in touch! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lonnie Pace" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 > Roy, > > Well, I might as well "pile on" too. > > In the black paragraph under the chart, you say "126591 is a descendent > of the third brother, Spencer." > > We can't all be without error. I appreciate the work that you do, and > only wish that I had your understanding of the subject. > > Let's see if I have this straight. I gather from the information that: > A: it is believed that there were three brothers, John, William and > Dempsey Pace, and > B: we have DNA samples from direct line descendants of each of these > three brothers, and the commonality of these samples appears to prove > that belief, and > C: There is no such thing as "Proof Positive", rather only a > preponderance of the evidence submitted that strengthens said belief. > > Thank You, > > Lonnie Pace > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Roy Johnson > Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 8:11 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 > > Thanks for the heads up. Don't know where Ic ame up with Spencer. > > Roy > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf > Of Janders 45 > Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 5:13 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592 > > I see one error in the chart - Spencer should be Dempsey. Yes, > Frederick > Pace of Wales is alive and well, at least from a family tree/ancestral > chart > point of view. > > The DNA results only indicate that it is highly probable that the five > individuals tested have a common male ancestor at some point in time, > but > the DNA results alone can't speak to the exact nature of that > relationship. > To determine this, we have to rely on other sources and, fortunately, > the > nature of the relationship of the three Clarke Co Paces, William, John, > and > Dempsey, is rather well documented. The DNA evidence does not "prove" > that > these old sources are true, but the evidence is consistent with the old > sources, so it does suggest that they are likely to be true. As Roy > pointed > out, we can now be confident that the father of these Paces "was not > "John > the Tory" as has been alleged." > > Joe Anderson > > > >> From: [email protected]> To: [email protected]> Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2008 > 22:17:08 -0500> Subject: Re: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > I just > re-read > Bob Webb's commentary that at least one of these persons> might be a > brother > of Frederick rather than a son. The DNA would results> would neither > prove > nor disprove that belief. As far as the DNA is> concerned, this would be > quite possible.> > Roy> > -----Original Message-----> From: > [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf> > Of > Roy Johnson> Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2008 9:57 PM> To: > [email protected]> Subject: [PACE] Wales group kit 126592> > The results > on > this kit are interesting and relevant to further> understanding this > group. > With results in for the three sons of the believed> Frederick, we now > have a > perfect 37/37 match for two of the sons, William> and Spencer, and a > 25/25 > match for two of the four descendents of John. This> would make it > likely > that we have 37 markers of the DNA of the fathers of> these sons, and > virtually certain that we have 25 markers of his DNA.> > > > This group > seems very firmly established. Too bad we can't find any> documentary > records on the father, but we can be sure that he was not "John> the > Tory" > as has been alleged.> > > > The chart is at > http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/Walesetc.htm> > > > Roy Johnson> > > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please > send > an email to> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without > the quotes in> the subject and the body of the message> > No virus found > in > this incoming message.> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: > 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: 11/1/2008> 7:56 > PM> > >> -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please > send > an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > _________________________________________________________________ > When your life is on the go-take your life with you. > http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/115298558/direct/01/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1760 - Release Date: > 11/1/2008 > 7:56 PM > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

    11/03/2008 01:36:46