In a previous email, I asked "Ruth" to straighten me out if I was wrong. I meant Rebecca Christenson, who seems to have all kinds of knowledge in this area. Sorry! BTW-Ruth Keyes Clark is the one who claimed to have found evidence of two, maybe three, Richard Paces who could be "Richard III" of North Carolina. I wish Ruth had disclosed her sources. Does anyone have access to Ruth's research or have any idea what her evidence was? Roy Johnson

Becky 1721...I have there was a Richard Pace as a Test. on Land record for another on Morattuck River Location in 1721 NC,and there is a Moratuck River in Bertie Co NC 1732 A Richard Pace in Bertie Co NC Witness Will of Wm Cain & wife Elizabeth 1736 March 13 in Bertie Co NC Richard Pace wrote his will 1738 Feb Courts Richard Pace died in Bertie Co NC per Will and some Bible records I note he was born in 1661-1676 Va If I had those Bible records I lost them... We often have Electric problem s and when that happen my Genealogy prog can wipe off stuff which drive me up the Wall... his wife was Rebecca sons were Richard Wm & Thomas and 7 daug The Wills of NC 1665-1900 only show one Richard Pace dying in NC some Show this Richard -m- 1699 Rebecca Poythress In my Mind seems like there was a Richard Pace b-1699in Va -m- a Elizabeth Cain and ended up in GA but they at one time claim it was the Bertie Co NC Richard but might have been Son of the Abv Richard Pace as he did have a son Richard but I myself have not investigated this one yet... George & Richard Pace;s talk abt confuse me ((Grin)) Here is what I found on Va Pace notice this says Charles City Co Va Here is George Pace and Sara Macocke Charles City County Virginia Court Records 12 Oct 1650 P-179" know all men by these presents and Witness that I Richard Pace sonne & apparent of Mr. Geo Pace of Comm. of Charles City Mount March in Va sonn & heir as first issue by mother Mrs Sara Macocke wife unto my forsaid father (both be deceased)Do hereby by these presents for my selfe my heirs and ex'ors adm's and ass's for ever absolutely confirm and allow sale of eight or nine hundred Acres of Land being neere unto Prieces hundred sold by my father Mr Geo Pace unto Mr Thomas Drewe as per Bill of sale dated 12 Day Oct 1650. Richard Pace also confirmes sale of land to Thomas Drew dated 25 Feb 1658/9 signed Richard Pace Rec 19 may 1659 (I did not add the Wittness names ) CAVALIERS AND PIONEERS, PATENT BOOK 1 PART 1 PG 10 IZABELLA PERRY, wife of William Perry, Gent;, 200 acs, with the Corp of James City, 20 Sept 1628 p62 At the S. side of the Plantation called Paces Paine granted to herselfe & her late husband Richard Pace, dec'd 5 Dec 1620; W. on land of John Burrowes now in the tenure of John Smith, E. to land graunted to her Son George Pace & N. on the maine River, 100 acs for her own per. Adv., being an Ancient planter & the other 100acs. as the devdt. of Francis Chapman having been graunted to him 5 Dec 1620 & by him made over to Richard Richards and Richard Dolphenby & by them made ovter to sd. Izabella at a Court at James City 21 Jan 1621 ( I have a question here is the Date abv when Richard Pace died 5 Dec 1620 or is this the Date that Land was granted ?) Next paragraph GEORGE PACE sonn & heire apparent to Richard Pace dec'd 400 acs. with in the Corp of James Citty 1 Sept 1628 p 64. On S. side of the river at the plantaion called Paces Paines,graunted to his father 5 Dec 1620; W. on land of Francis Chapman, now in the tenure of William Perry, Gent., his father in law, & N. on the maine river, 100 acs. due for the per. adv. of Richard Pace & 200 acs. by trans. of Lewis Bayly, Richard Irnest, John Skinner, Bennett Pulle, Roger Macker, & Ann Mason whoe came in the Marmaduke 1621 ( I ask is this a Ships name :) Darlene ----- Original Message ----- From: "Becky Mosely" <beckymosely@comcast.net> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 7:05 AM Subject: [PACE-L] Re: DNA Richard Pace > Roy - Do all the participants who paper trace back to a RICHARD of NC match? Or do we have DNA evidence of descendants of two different Richard NC lines/ancestors? Many thanks, Becky > > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. > Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out! > > __________ NOD32 1.1280 (20051108) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > >

Back in 1999 Marina Michaels was looking for information on the above on the Pace Forum # 759' a listing of their children was: Vie D.Pace b. 1856 Jane Thomas Pace b 1858 Alice Deborah Pace b. 1860 Ann Militia Pace b. 1862 mary Drillie Pace b. 1864 Lee Pace b. 1868 Edward Oscar Pace b. 1871 A posting by Brenda Howorko on this list dated 4 Dec. 1999 seems to be the same family and connects them to Edward Pace & Rachel Houchin One of their children Alice Deborah Pace seems to Have married a cornelius Jasper Clemmer. So would she not be a granddaughter of Edward Pace and Rachel Houchin.

Thanks to Ruth; I believe this answers Becky's question. I maintain the DNA study but I am not a qualified Pace genealogist. As a John of Middlesex descendent I have understandably paid more attention to that line. My plate is pretty full and I don't have time to research the other lines. Ruth is obviously an expert on that topic. But my understanding of the evidence that we have might be helpful: First, we have a clear paper trail from Richard of Jamestown to George to "Richard II" We do not know whether George had children other than Richard II. I do not believe we have documentation on "Richard II"'s children; someone correct me if I am wrong. Then we have Paces appearing in NC who from circumstantial evidence MAY be the children of "Richard II". One of these has been designated by descendents as "Richard III" and presumed to be the son of "Richard II". The paper evidence for this connection is solely in the Winifred Aycock Lane letter, a reminiscence by an old lady of what her mother told her. Winifred Aycock Lane is the daughter of Richard+Rebecca and the granddaughter of Richard+Mary, the presumed "Richard III". She affirms that her grandfather was born in Virginia in a place "where five counties meet" on a creek near a river, and that her grandfather was a junior, so his father' name was Richard.. She gives names for her grandfather's brothers, as told to her by her mother. From this it is ASSUMED that her grandfather's father was "Richard II". But if there were other Richards in VA, this might not be. To read about the Lane letter (three versions) go to: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pace/documnts/aycock.htm Then our paper trail picks up in NC and the evidence improves, but some of the specific lineages submitted are in question. John Pace's chart using name comparisons to try to sort out some of these lineages is interesting: http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/names.htm Hope I have all of this straight. Ruth, straighten me out if I don't. Roy Johnson

Roy - Do all the participants who paper trace back to a RICHARD of NC match? Or do we have DNA evidence of descendants of two different Richard NC lines/ancestors? Many thanks, Becky

Oops, here's where I have to back up and confess that I have more expertise in DNA than I do in Pace genealogy. By Richard of NC, I was referring to that line that goes from Richard of Jamestown to George to Richard (II) to James to Richard (III), etc - the line that most believe to descend from Richard of Jamestown. All of you know that story better than I and many of you know how firm the connections are in the paper trail. I did not mean to suggest that this group DID NOT descend from Richard of Jamestown, but I feel that I am correct in stating that the DNA study did not PROVE the connection. What the Pace DNA study has shown is that a group of male Paces who believe that they descend from Richard of J. do in fact have a common male ancestor that might have been Richard of Jamestown. It supports the genealogical tale in that it does not disprove it. The DNA study does not tell us who that common male ancestor was - that conclusion has to be reached through wills, deeds, and whatever other paper trail can be found. The only way that DNA can prove descent from Richard of J. is to extract some DNA from his bones if you can find them. [I'm using the concept of "proof" loosely here, since DNA results only give us a probability that a hypothesis is true or false. A better way to state it is to say that it is highly, highly, extremely unlikely that the two big Pace lines (Middlesex & NC) descend from a common ancestor in recent generations. It is so unlikely that I can regard it as "proven."] I'm descended from one of the Paces who settled in Clarke Co, AL, in the first decades of the 19th century and who believed that we descended from Frederick Pace of Wales. In a web search a few years ago, I discovered that Bruce Howard and some others had concluded that Frederick of Wales was a myth. Mr. Howard seemed so adamant in this conclusion that I bought his book in the hope that it would allow me to flesh out my Pace ancestry all the way back to England. Instead, I found that his conclusion was based on the disappearance of some Paces in the Carolinas and the appearance shortly afterward of some very similar folk in Alabama. He made some large assumptions and concluded that these two groups were the same people. This could well be true, but it's a leap of faith that's a bit too large for me. So, I'm back to assuming that I descend from Frederick Pace of Wales. Only one line related to me has contributed DNA to the study (results show no relationship to other Pace lines), and I'm hoping for a couple of more divergent samples before I conclude firmly that Bruce Howard has it wrong. The other reason for my interest in the Pace DNA study is that I have a bit of training in the area. My university training was in plant genetics and I am employed as something of an applied geneticist (a plant breeder) who is trying to use the modern DNA (molecular) technologies in my work. It has required a lot of work for me to bring my skills up to modern levels and I find it fascinating that a group of laymen have been able to use DNA results to reach useful conclusions in their area of interest. Joe ----Original Message Follows---- From: Compurose@cs.com To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Re: PACE-D Digest V05 #173 Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2005 00:39:33 EST Joe has written that " To my mind, the Pace Y chromosome study has proven conclusively that two Pace lines (John of Middlesex and Richard of NC) did not descend from a common male ancestor here in America." and also "..... the Pace DNA study has not proven that either group descends from Richard Pace of Jamestown." I have not followed the posts about the DNA testing too carefully. I was interested in learning a connection of John of Middlesex to Richard Pace of Jamestown and when I read there was none, I didn't follow through to learn that there is no connection of Richard of NC to Richard of Jamestown either. Question - would you identify the Richard of NC... is this the line that has "always" been thought to be directly connected to Jamestown? And have there been any lines definitely connected, by DNA, to Richard of Jamestown? ==== PACE Mailing List ==== You can search archived messages from the Pace Mailing List by going to http://searches.rootsweb.com. If you need instructions just ask me - gordonpace@comcast.net

The DNA study by itself cannot prove that anyone is a descendant of Richard Pace of Jamestown. The paperwork has to first prove that a particular line of Paces are descendants of Richard of Jamestown, then the DNA study can be used to determine if other participants share a common ancestor with the participants who can prove their lineage to Richard of Jamestown. As there have been questions created about the long-accepted link between Richard Pace of NC being the descendant of Richard of Jamestown, these questions have to be resolved with the paper trail before anyone can say that DNA has shown they are RELATED to Richard of Jamestown. In fact, we have very little DNA evidence for most of the Pace lines. The DNA study has been very effective in determining that there are at least two main groups of Paces in the United States - and also other Pace lines which have not had as much research performed and WRITTEN about. We have learned that the John Pace of Middlesex line, the majority (or the most written about) of the NC Pace lines, and the Michael Pace/Pees lines are very distinct lines and have no common ancestor in "modern" times. But, as for Group 3 of the Pace DNA study, we really have very little representation of family lines in the DNA project. Most of the Group 3a participants are descendants of William Pace and Ruth Lambert - a line that has several theories of the lineage back to the early Richard Pace of NC. Other participants are from two different Hardy Paces, an unconnected George Pace, and two participants whose DNA results can only give us the *ancestral* DNA results for Richard Pace whose wife was Elizabeth Cain - and not any further back. Group 3b is not any better in representation. Basically there are three lines represented - the John Pace (wife Sarah) of Surry Co., NC, the William Pace (wife Sicely Walker) line, and the Jesse Pace line. We have been advised by FTDNA that Group 3a and Group 3b share a common ancestor and that a rare 2-step change occurred that separates the two groups. At this point we have no way of telling when and with which Pace this change occurred. We don't even have enough DNA evidence to determine which group - 3a or 3b, if either - has the DNA pattern of the early Richard of NC. So few NC Pace lines are represented in the DNA study. We really need Pace descendants with documented lines to the early Richard Pace of NC that descend from lines other than Richard Pace (wife Elizabeth Cain) to find participants from their lines to be tested. Until we have participants from other documented lines we will not be able to determine when the split between Groups 3a and 3b occurred. DNA testing still has the potential to help many NC Pace descendants determine where they fit in the Pace family tree, especially if the split between Groups 3a and 3b can be determined. This has been discussed in greater detail at the Pace Society reunion this past summer and a more detailed article will be appearing in an upcoming issue of the Pace Society quarterly Bulletin. Rebecca Christensen

It is impossible to use DNA to connect to Richard of Jamestown, as we do not have a proven line to Richard to work from. It is ASSUMED that Richard of North Carolina was the great grandson of Richard of Jamestown, but there is no written record of which Richard moved from Virginia to North Carolina. Ruth Keys Clark felt there were at least two Richards in Virginia who could have moved to NC, one of which would be the original Richard's descendent. So this gives a 50-50 chance that Richard of NC was Richard of Jamestown's descendent. Many genealogists take this descent as proven fact, but there is no paper trail to prove it. Bruce Howard cites what he believes is strong circumstantial evidence that this is the same Richard, but then Bruce was wrong about John of Middlesex, and this must be taken as his opinion, not proven fact. What we have is a proven paper trail from today's Paces to Richard of NC and John of M, and we can use DNA from those descendents to prove/disprove relationships, but there is no way at present to be 100% certain we have DNA from Richard of Jamestown, although the circumstantial evidence seems pretty strong. Check out our results page at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm You should also check Gordon T. Pace (Canada)'s excellent web pages. We believe we have strong evidence that John Pace of Middlesex was John Pace b. 1665 in Shropshire, near the Welsh border. Again, there is no absolute paper trail, but the other evidence seems so strong as to make the connection better than 90% certain. Roy Johnson Pace DNA coordinator -----Original Message----- From: Compurose@cs.com [mailto:Compurose@cs.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 11:40 PM To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Re: PACE-D Digest V05 #173 Joe has written that " To my mind, the Pace Y chromosome study has proven conclusively that two Pace lines (John of Middlesex and Richard of NC) did not descend from a common male ancestor here in America." and also "..... the Pace DNA study has not proven that either group descends from Richard Pace of Jamestown." I have not followed the posts about the DNA testing too carefully. I was interested in learning a connection of John of Middlesex to Richard Pace of Jamestown and when I read there was none, I didn't follow through to learn that there is no connection of Richard of NC to Richard of Jamestown either. Question - would you identify the Richard of NC... is this the line that has "always" been thought to be directly connected to Jamestown? And have there been any lines definitely connected, by DNA, to Richard of Jamestown? ==== PACE Mailing List ==== You can search archived messages from the Pace Mailing List by going to http://searches.rootsweb.com. If you need instructions just ask me - gordonpace@comcast.net

Joe has written that " To my mind, the Pace Y chromosome study has proven conclusively that two Pace lines (John of Middlesex and Richard of NC) did not descend from a common male ancestor here in America." and also "..... the Pace DNA study has not proven that either group descends from Richard Pace of Jamestown." I have not followed the posts about the DNA testing too carefully. I was interested in learning a connection of John of Middlesex to Richard Pace of Jamestown and when I read there was none, I didn't follow through to learn that there is no connection of Richard of NC to Richard of Jamestown either. Question - would you identify the Richard of NC... is this the line that has "always" been thought to be directly connected to Jamestown? And have there been any lines definitely connected, by DNA, to Richard of Jamestown?

(This message forwarded from another list has some helpful information about navigating the BYU site that has the online books.) - jh * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ...A dream coming true. The Family History Library is starting to digitize their book holdings, mostly family histories to date, and they are putting them on-line, fully search able by any word or advanced search combinations. Five thousand plus of these books are on the Brigham Young University Library servers and readily accessible, NOW! Here is a partial clip of an announcement I just received and I have only made a quick check of how to find them and how to search, but it is very exciting "the LDS Family History Library has announced that it has begun the process of digitizing and making available on the Internet all of the Family History books in their collection. These are primarily books in the "929.273 Series" that are currently housed on the first floor of the Family History Library (previously housed on the fourth floor of the Joseph Smith Memorial Building). At the present time (September 2005), about 5000 books have been digitized and are available, and they have announced that they are adding about 100 titles a week to the on-line collection. Copyright issues are playing a role in determining the order in which they progress through this task; books out of copyright are being done first." Go to the web site of the Harold B. Lee Library at BYU at http://www.lib.byu.edu/ , then on the home page, follow the links: Find Other Materials; Electronic; On Line Collections at BYU; Text Collections tab; Family History Archive from the list of collections that are displayed. The search box on the left seems to be the one to find your books at and the search box on the right is for searching within the pages on screen. I have not used it enough yet to be proficient, but you bet I'll be checking this little treasure out, a lot!--Dick Hillenbrand Dick Hillenbrand <nygenes@gmail.com>

Searching for "Pace" turns up 6 volumes including one by W. James Pace on Dreadzil Pace of Talledega Co, AL (1993). This link might take you directly there, or just enter Pace in the search page. http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cgi-bin/docviewer.exe?CISOROOT=/FamHist33&CISOPTR=14250 joe ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Janders 45" <janders45@hotmail.com> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [PACE-L] Salt Lake info now is starting on Line Date: Tue, 08 Nov 2005 11:35:38 -0600 Interesting and thanks for the tip, Darlene. This link ought to take you to direct to the Family History page where you can search for families of interest: http://www.lib.byu.edu/fhc/ ----Original Message Follows---- From: "darlene" <darlene@adweb.net> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Salt Lake info now is starting on Line Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2005 09:08:32 -0800 I tried to go and see what they have but it all in pdf acrobat reader that I found.....and I still have not found why I can not make my dumb computer.. guess the Operator is the dumb one.. but my acrobat became corrupt and I took it off thinking I could down load another but when I do it keep freezing on me.. and I spent abt 4 hours on phone with Acrobat and they don't know why either so I can't view anything in pdf.. I guess I will have to take it in to somebody.. but not sure thats the Answer... if you find something good on Surry Co Pace' s or Harlan Co Ky Pace's let me know... Darlene LDS Family History Library has announced that it has begun the process of digitizing and making available on the Internet all of the Family History books in their collection. These are primarily books in the "929.273Series" that are currently housed on the first floor of the Family History Library (previously housed on the fourth floor of the Joseph Smith Memorial Building). At the present time (September 2005), about 5000 books have been digitized and are available, and they have announced that they are adding about 100 titles a week to the on-line collection. Copyright issues are playing a role in determining the order in which they progress through this task; books out of copyright are being done first." anyway go to Harold B. Lee Library is how I got in but you might try this athttp://www.lib.byu.edu/ it didn't work for me ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To subscribe or unsubscribe send email to PACE-L-request@rootsweb.com with the one word message: subscribe OR unsubscribe For digest mode, use PACE-D-request@rootsweb.com ==== PACE Mailing List ==== You can search archived messages from the Pace Mailing List by going to http://searches.rootsweb.com. If you need instructions just ask me - gordonpace@comcast.net

Interesting and thanks for the tip, Darlene. This link ought to take you to direct to the Family History page where you can search for families of interest: http://www.lib.byu.edu/fhc/ ----Original Message Follows---- From: "darlene" <darlene@adweb.net> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Salt Lake info now is starting on Line Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2005 09:08:32 -0800 I tried to go and see what they have but it all in pdf acrobat reader that I found.....and I still have not found why I can not make my dumb computer.. guess the Operator is the dumb one.. but my acrobat became corrupt and I took it off thinking I could down load another but when I do it keep freezing on me.. and I spent abt 4 hours on phone with Acrobat and they don't know why either so I can't view anything in pdf.. I guess I will have to take it in to somebody.. but not sure thats the Answer... if you find something good on Surry Co Pace' s or Harlan Co Ky Pace's let me know... Darlene LDS Family History Library has announced that it has begun the process of digitizing and making available on the Internet all of the Family History books in their collection. These are primarily books in the "929.273Series" that are currently housed on the first floor of the Family History Library (previously housed on the fourth floor of the Joseph Smith Memorial Building). At the present time (September 2005), about 5000 books have been digitized and are available, and they have announced that they are adding about 100 titles a week to the on-line collection. Copyright issues are playing a role in determining the order in which they progress through this task; books out of copyright are being done first." anyway go to Harold B. Lee Library is how I got in but you might try this athttp://www.lib.byu.edu/ it didn't work for me ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To subscribe or unsubscribe send email to PACE-L-request@rootsweb.com with the one word message: subscribe OR unsubscribe For digest mode, use PACE-D-request@rootsweb.com

Through the National Geographic Study, we now have the first Italian Pace in our DNA study. Not surprisingly, there was no match with any of our Paces, but interestingly, the haplotype was I, the same as the John of Middlesex haplotype. This implies northern European or Viking origins. This is not surprising, as there was a thriving Norman kingdom in southern Italy/Sicily in the middle ages. I had earlier information that Italian genealogists believed the Pace name there to be of Norman origin, which is doubly interesting as we have some indication that the English Pace name might be of Norman origin, although this is not proven. I have added this entry with the other non-matching Paces, but eventually, I would like to separate out the Italian Paces and hopefully get more entries. Roy Johnson

I tried to go and see what they have but it all in pdf acrobat reader that I found.....and I still have not found why I can not make my dumb computer.. guess the Operator is the dumb one.. but my acrobat became corrupt and I took it off thinking I could down load another but when I do it keep freezing on me.. and I spent abt 4 hours on phone with Acrobat and they don't know why either so I can't view anything in pdf.. I guess I will have to take it in to somebody.. but not sure thats the Answer... if you find something good on Surry Co Pace' s or Harlan Co Ky Pace's let me know... Darlene LDS Family History Library has announced that it has begun the process of digitizing and making available on the Internet all of the Family History books in their collection. These are primarily books in the "929.273Series" that are currently housed on the first floor of the Family History Library (previously housed on the fourth floor of the Joseph Smith Memorial Building). At the present time (September 2005), about 5000 books have been digitized and are available, and they have announced that they are adding about 100 titles a week to the on-line collection. Copyright issues are playing a role in determining the order in which they progress through this task; books out of copyright are being done first." anyway go to Harold B. Lee Library is how I got in but you might try this athttp://www.lib.byu.edu/ it didn't work for me

Robert Pace age 37 Catherine Pace age 45 Bettie Pace age 12 John T.Pace age 8 Joseph Pace age 4 Anyone connected to them?

I agree with Cec. Gordon You have a great site and I also made some copies. I am also from the Line of Elisha Pace. Helen

I'm with Roy - Y chromosome studies can't really "prove" descent (or common descent in the case of two male subjects) from any particular individual. The results can be used to calculate the probability that two male subjects descended from a common male ancestor at some point "X" generations in the past. [This is based on the fact that sons almost always inherit an unaltered Y chromosome from their father, so the only changes in the Y are caused by mutations that occur at a known rate over generations]. Proof? To my mind, the Pace Y chromosome study has proven conclusively that two Pace lines (John of Middlesex and Richard of NC) did not descend from a common male ancestor here in America. The Pace study is the best example that I know of the practical application of Y chromosome DNA to solve an unresolved genealogical question. Congratulations are due to all who have worked on and contributed to the study! However, the Pace DNA study has not proven that either group descends from Richard Pace of Jamestown. That conclusion, and others like it, has to come from old-fashioned genealogy research, not from the boys in the white lab coats. Joe (No, it's not over anyone's head - lots of web sources can explain it to you. It may take some hard work on your part unless you already have a pretty good background in the biological sciences, but you can get there if you work at it hard enough.) ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Roy Johnson" <royj@webster.edu> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [PACE-L] Re: PACE-D Digest V05 #171 Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 11:14:20 -0600 <<Again, I will apologize in advance if this topic has already been discussed or is old news to all of you - but, has the DNA project (which is way over my head) proven the connection between William Henry Pace (1745-1815) and Elisha (1781-1851)? Gordon T.'s website referred to the Ed letter as his source for the connection>> 1) DNA cannot prove, it can only point. It can add verification to paper records that indicate a relationship, but it like a detective story--it is a clue. One clue is not proof. 2) Someone in the Henry-Elisha lines would have to answer your question about whether DNA tends to confirm that relationship, but DNA is better at log-ago general relationships, such as the John of Middlesex connection with Paces of Shropshire, England, and not with the Richard Paces of Jamestown origin. 3) I doubt that DNA is over your head. You probably are just too busy to have read the descriptions. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator

<<Again, I will apologize in advance if this topic has already been discussed or is old news to all of you - but, has the DNA project (which is way over my head) proven the connection between William Henry Pace (1745-1815) and Elisha (1781-1851)? Gordon T.'s website referred to the Ed letter as his source for the connection>> 1) DNA cannot prove, it can only point. It can add verification to paper records that indicate a relationship, but it like a detective story--it is a clue. One clue is not proof. 2) Someone in the Henry-Elisha lines would have to answer your question about whether DNA tends to confirm that relationship, but DNA is better at log-ago general relationships, such as the John of Middlesex connection with Paces of Shropshire, England, and not with the Richard Paces of Jamestown origin. 3) I doubt that DNA is over your head. You probably are just too busy to have read the descriptions. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator -----Original Message----- From: Cecilia Barton-Murrah [mailto:cec@imagesverite.com] Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 7:54 AM To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Re: PACE-D Digest V05 #171 Gordon T. Pace, I am an infrequent reader of this message board - since I am trying to research all of my lines I have limited time for each! Still, I have enjoyed the group e-mails. However, when you only stop by occasionally we sometimes forget our manors! I have checked out your website as suggested by Charles - and I am impressed - I have already printed out several pages for future reference. It is organized wonderfully! Thanks for all that you have done! And I hope you are able to stay connected. Cec Barton-Murrah To other Message Board members: Again, I will apologize in advance if this topic has already been discussed or is old news to all of you - but, has the DNA project (which is way over my head) proven the connection between William Henry Pace (1745-1815) and Elisha (1781-1851)? Gordon T.'s website referred to the Ed letter as his source for the connection. And, I have seen that letter. And, I do believe the connection is correct. However, the letter creates as many questions as it answers (in my opinion). I would love for it to be accepted as documentation for the Wm/ Elisha connection - but I worry that the DAR folks (and other organizations) won't see it as proof. Since Elisha is my connection to the earlier Pace lines I would greatly appreciate any information or help with this connection. Thanks, Cec ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To share info which may be of interest to others, reply to the mail list (PACE-L@rootsweb.com). To say thank you or otherwise reply personally, reply to sender.

If you are among those of us who claim John of Middlesex as our ancestor, or even if you are not, you may be interested in the Brother Cadfael series of mysteries set in Shropshire in the mid 1100's when Stephen and Maud were contending for the throne of England. Written by Edith Mary Pargeter under the pen name of Ellis Peters, this series of stories follows the mystery-solving activities of a crusader-turned-monk of the abbey of Saint Peter and Saint Paul in Shrewsbury, a town in north-central Shropshire. While the focus is on solving the mystery, Pargeter has done a remarkable job of describing the life and times of 12th century Shropshire. To locate these books, visit your favorite bookstore (online or brick and mortar) and search for Cadfael or for Ellis Peters. There are 20 novels written in chronological order (I'm presently on #11) as well as one book of three short stories including one that tells how Cadfael became a monk. Hope you find this interesting. Charlie Hartley

Lois, Not sure if it the correct place, but there is a Pamplin and an Evergreen in, or near, Appomattox County ,VA. Appomattox has a county website at www.appomattox.com that has a homepage link to a list of county churches that may help you. Evergreen is a very small place (this one, that is). My father's mother was a Pace. Married a Smith and lived in Appomattox, but was from Halifax County, VA. Jeff Smith Fairfax, VA Lois Long Carey wrote: >Captain R.A. Pace > >Pamplin City, Va-March 18 >Captain R.A. Pace, a veteran of the war between the States, >died here friday at the home of his son-in-law, >DR.E.E.WALKER, aged 76 years. He was an earnest >mason and membe of the M.E.Church. and will be >buried tomorrow at the family cemetery, near Evergreen. >He leaves two children-- Mrs. Walker, of the place >and John T.Pace of Petersburg-besides four nephews >and two nieces in Richmond, a brother in hadenville, >Mecklenburg county, and numerous relatives in >Kentucky, and several grandchildren here and in >Petersburg. > >Where is Evergreen and this family cemetery? >and what Walker did the daughter Marry? > > >Stephen Pace of this town , departed this life, >a young man and deservedly esteemed by his >relatives and friends. > >from the "Petersbury Republican" >Friday, september 20, 1816 > >who was his family? > > >==== PACE Mailing List ==== >To subscribe or unsubscribe send email to PACE-L-request@rootsweb.com with the one word message: subscribe OR unsubscribe >For digest mode, use PACE-D-request@rootsweb.com > > > > >