"and judge for yourselves" is being picked up by your Homeland Security group I live in a free country and am proud of it.

the rest of the message was not allowed to transfer, so much for your freedom in the US. Let's see if this transfers before I complete this.

It's possible John of Middlesex was not a farmer but a tradesman, a carpenter, and came from a family that had only three known siblings, born over a span of 15 years, from ANNE PACE Chr. in 1655, JOHN 1665 GEORGE 1670 This indicates to my way of thinking father JOSEPH PACE of Prees was not a farmer but a merchant and was known to be associated with the market town of Wellington, Shropshire. This idea is further supported by the fact that JOHN bought 150 acres in 1693 so he didn't seem to have someone else pay his passage, and do indenture, etc. etc. This further indicates he came from a "merchant family" background. Also, his brother GEORGE (my 6X gg/f) wasted no time leaving the Prees, Shropshire area and migrating to new territory, establishing himself in the 1720's in an area where PACE descendents, even of today, operate a lucrative farm business. So, I think the above facts may vindicate JOHN came from a trades or merchant background, He probably got to know the other PACE people of the James River area if he didn't already know them before leaving England, having maybe travelled to London and lived there a brief time before emmigration. I see also the name Also, if the PACE descendency in England, of Joseph & Margaret was anything like that of John, the son, Then there must have been more emmigration of Paces from England than what we know or imagine, today. Look at: http://www.phc.igs.net/~gordpace/uk/lon/stepney.htm or the other London parishes I've looked for PACE, then there are all the other variations of PACE to consider, that could be present in London. file:///C:/win98%20backup/~gordpace/uk/sal.htm We'd need a crew of researchers to undertake such a search. Fortunately, I was able to save the dozens of LDS Batch numbers of London parishes before the Genealogy Industry took over the lists. GTPace in Canada

I've tried to link the NEWSOME name to any area where the JOHN we think was JOHN of M, may have tread in the Welsh Marches of the western part of English Midlands or in the Monmouthshire area of Gloucestershire but nothing of the NEWSOME name was to be found in those areas. Looking into London parishes it's clearly obvious the NEWSOME name was always in the same parish as RICHARD, and many other LONDON parishes where I've collected NEWSOME Christenings. So if JOHN PACE of Middlesex Co Va was 'exposed' to the NEWSOME name, it was not very likly from his native turf but more likely from the same environment as RICHARD whether that being in London or Jamestown area, later. So when the scene shifts to the James/Rappahannock River areas of mid/latter 1600's colonial Virginia I'd have to decide the NEWSOME name was closer to the RICHARD environment than that of John of Middlesex, yet John of Middlesex was exposed to the Newsome name, somewhere in time prior to 1693. following email: don't go away

I've just completed a DVD movie about early PACE Christenings in several parishes, UK counties of Gloucestershire, Worcestershire, Shropshire, on my travels there, over the years, and looking at my collection of booklets I purchaced, here and there, which give the reader a good account of early England, when it was still French from the Norman period of William the Conquerer. The Pacy sur/de Eure peoples had assisted William with his former ally Harold in his successful conflict, in 1066, and were compensated. At this time, many Norman churches were built in England. This is a time when masonary obviously became a substantial building technique in England as suddenly, magnificant church buildings went up, all over England and our PACE ancestors were Christened in them, as I've illustrated in this DVD. As far as DNA of today's PACE descendents is concerned, one should remember that William compensated those that helped him from Pacy/de Eure, and area of France. To be more specific, William compensated those from Pacy of the River Eure district of France. These people did not happen to be from the same family, they were from many families. The commonality was that they helped him and they probably took the name Pacy sur Eure and as surnames developed in the post Saxon era, the "sur/de" was probably dropped and the Pacy, later variations of it occured, so no doubt, various DNA results of peoples of this surname or variations of it would occur today in descendents. The name came from a region of France, not a specific family. The name had a meaning, The meaning is well known in the Italian language. That is another story, obviously, but not here, today. In business, in former years, when customers got to know what my name was, I was treated with respect, especially by Italians, as I still have Italian friends today, and this is a very respected name in the Balkan area of Europe. I would say, we are blessed, to be of such a name. So for DNA purposes, it is no wonder that so many different lines of PACE, or variants of it, are to be found in DNA research work, today. Just keep ploughing ahead. GTPace in Canada

I would say yes, but still no certainty as there could be other Paces of the London area who came to the US. Ruth Scott Keys felt she had found two and possibly three Richard Paces in VA who could have come down to NC. If so they could have all been from the London area. I regret that we do not have access to her documentary evidence on this. Another way it increases it is that the Surname Profiler at http://cet12.geog.ucl.ac.uk/uclnames/ shows that there were relatively fewer Paces in the London area in the 1881 census than in western England (the probable John of M area). The fewer the Paces in this area, the greater the chance that the common ancestor of the NC Paces is Richard. I don't know whether anyone has noticed or not, but there is no documentary evidence that Richard of Jamestown and Richard of Wapping are the same, although the circumstantial evidence is so strong it could hardly be otherwise. I suspect that the early settlers of Jamestown were mainly from the London area, and outlying areas came later, as John of Middlesex apparently did, after Virginia was better settled. Anyone know? Roy Johnson -----Original Message----- From: Janders 45 [mailto:janders45@hotmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 9:52 AM To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PACE-L] New results, Antony Pace, London - EXCITING!!!! Let me parse this down to basics to see if I understand it: 1. An English Pace, with roots in the London area back as far as 1859, seems to be related to the descendents of Richard Pace of NC (1638-1677). 2. It is likely that Antony Pace and the Richard Paces of NC share a common male ancestor sometime within the past 500 years (and maybe quite a bit shorter time span). This seems to increase the probability that the Richard of NC Paces are descended from Richard Pace of Jamestown. Is this the correct interpretation? Joe Anderson ----Original Message Follows---- From: Rebecca Christensen <rchristen@sbcglobal.net> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PACE-L] New results, Antony Pace, London - EXCITING!!!! Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:38:40 -0800 (PST) Roy and all others interested, What exciting news!!!! especially for those of us in group 3a, and probably those in group 3b as well as the third panel for kit #8179 matches the third panel for both groups 3a and 3b participants that have upgraded. For emphasis, we have perfect matches in the third panel for group 3a, group 3b, and London kit #8179. FTDNA's webpages indicate the 34/37 match between Group 3a and London kit #8179 is "related" when you share the same surname and the shared ancestry is probably within the time period of surnames in Europe. For FTDNA's official blurb, see http://www.familytreedna.com/GDRules_37.html The third panel of markers tested by FTDNA contains the most volatile markers, including the 3 fastest mutating markers currently tested by FTDNA - CDYa, CDYb, and DYS 576. Often it is the third panel of markers that cause possible "relatedness" to fall apart, but in the Pace DNA study, these markers for the tested participants from the William Pace/Ruth Lambert line of Group 3a, kit #7811 of Group 3b, and kit #8179 of London have the same results! The difference in the London kit #8179 at Pace marker #2 (DYS 390) occurs on one of the faster moving markers as well. (FTDNA says they are going to update their outdated reporting of fast and slow markers in the first panel but haven't yet.) The DNA results for kit #8179 does put Antony in DNA Group 3a - although the lineages are different. So Roy's placement of him there is where he should be. Calculations for the number of generations to the Most Recent Common Ancestor (MRCA) are not necessarily very accurate. I wouldn't worry too much about the probablilities of how many generations back the common ancestor might be. They are just probabilities and can be way off from the actual number of generations. It is probably safe to assume the shared ancestor was before the ancestor of the Paces of Group 3a came to America - whether that was Richard Pace of Jamestown or not. It is a very interesting coincidence that Richard Pace of Jamestown and Wapping was from directly across the Thames River from Antony's ancestor George Pace of Rotherhithe and that Richard Pace was a carpenter and George Pace a bargebuilder - although MANY years separate the two of them. Also, with kit #8179 Antony's results at Pace markers #6 (DYS 385b) and #21 (DYS 449) matching group 3a, the group 3a results appear to be ancestral results at those markers with group 3b having the changes from the ancestral DNA values at those locations. More testing of NC Pace lines with the paperwork going back to the early Paces (not just those with brick walls!) is necessary to determine when the probable changes in the DNA for group 3b occurred and with which Pace the DNA changes happened, assuming that groups 3b and 3a are indeed closely related. This would apparently be very helpful for all those in Group 3b especially. Some initial thoughts. Rebecca Roy Johnson <royj@webster.edu> wrote: New 37 marker results are in for kit 8179, Antony Pace, London. The last 12 markers match 12/12 with the other three 37 marker submissions that we have in group 3-two in group 3a and one in 3b, but the last 12 markers match for all three. The closest matches are kits 6366 and 7833, who happen to trace to William Pace/Ruth Lambert, but this specific line is not necessarily significant, as we do not have 37 marker tests for other lines in group 3a. This greatly increases the chances of a common ancestor, and further cements the probability of group 3 having a London area origin, as Antony's grandfather was a barge builder on the Thames in London. Examining the John of Middlesex 37 markers, we find beaucoup differences, further separating these two lines and I believe tending to support my hypothesis that the Pace surname does not have a single origin in England. Take a look at the chart at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm. I have moved Antony's record to the 3a group to show the comparison better, even though he is not a descendent of the North Carolina Paces and therefore technically is not in this group. As usual, the differing alleles are marked in green. I have not found a calculation for 34/37 on FTDNA as to the probable distance to MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor) but from the graphs, I think it approaches 50% or better somewhere about 12 generations. Maybe others who have been studying DNA results can comment. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out! ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To subscribe or unsubscribe send email to PACE-L-request@rootsweb.com with the one word message: subscribe OR unsubscribe For digest mode, use PACE-D-request@rootsweb.com ==== PACE Mailing List ==== If you haven't done so within the last six months, please post a message describing your Earliest Pace Ancestor and how you descend from them. Please include dates, places, spouses, etc, if possible. Send the message to PACE-L@rootsweb.com

Let me parse this down to basics to see if I understand it: 1. An English Pace, with roots in the London area back as far as 1859, seems to be related to the descendents of Richard Pace of NC (1638-1677). 2. It is likely that Antony Pace and the Richard Paces of NC share a common male ancestor sometime within the past 500 years (and maybe quite a bit shorter time span). This seems to increase the probability that the Richard of NC Paces are descended from Richard Pace of Jamestown. Is this the correct interpretation? Joe Anderson ----Original Message Follows---- From: Rebecca Christensen <rchristen@sbcglobal.net> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PACE-L] New results, Antony Pace, London - EXCITING!!!! Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:38:40 -0800 (PST) Roy and all others interested, What exciting news!!!! especially for those of us in group 3a, and probably those in group 3b as well as the third panel for kit #8179 matches the third panel for both groups 3a and 3b participants that have upgraded. For emphasis, we have perfect matches in the third panel for group 3a, group 3b, and London kit #8179. FTDNA's webpages indicate the 34/37 match between Group 3a and London kit #8179 is "related" when you share the same surname and the shared ancestry is probably within the time period of surnames in Europe. For FTDNA's official blurb, see http://www.familytreedna.com/GDRules_37.html The third panel of markers tested by FTDNA contains the most volatile markers, including the 3 fastest mutating markers currently tested by FTDNA - CDYa, CDYb, and DYS 576. Often it is the third panel of markers that cause possible "relatedness" to fall apart, but in the Pace DNA study, these markers for the tested participants from the William Pace/Ruth Lambert line of Group 3a, kit #7811 of Group 3b, and kit #8179 of London have the same results! The difference in the London kit #8179 at Pace marker #2 (DYS 390) occurs on one of the faster moving markers as well. (FTDNA says they are going to update their outdated reporting of fast and slow markers in the first panel but haven't yet.) The DNA results for kit #8179 does put Antony in DNA Group 3a - although the lineages are different. So Roy's placement of him there is where he should be. Calculations for the number of generations to the Most Recent Common Ancestor (MRCA) are not necessarily very accurate. I wouldn't worry too much about the probablilities of how many generations back the common ancestor might be. They are just probabilities and can be way off from the actual number of generations. It is probably safe to assume the shared ancestor was before the ancestor of the Paces of Group 3a came to America - whether that was Richard Pace of Jamestown or not. It is a very interesting coincidence that Richard Pace of Jamestown and Wapping was from directly across the Thames River from Antony's ancestor George Pace of Rotherhithe and that Richard Pace was a carpenter and George Pace a bargebuilder - although MANY years separate the two of them. Also, with kit #8179 Antony's results at Pace markers #6 (DYS 385b) and #21 (DYS 449) matching group 3a, the group 3a results appear to be ancestral results at those markers with group 3b having the changes from the ancestral DNA values at those locations. More testing of NC Pace lines with the paperwork going back to the early Paces (not just those with brick walls!) is necessary to determine when the probable changes in the DNA for group 3b occurred and with which Pace the DNA changes happened, assuming that groups 3b and 3a are indeed closely related. This would apparently be very helpful for all those in Group 3b especially. Some initial thoughts. Rebecca Roy Johnson <royj@webster.edu> wrote: New 37 marker results are in for kit 8179, Antony Pace, London. The last 12 markers match 12/12 with the other three 37 marker submissions that we have in group 3-two in group 3a and one in 3b, but the last 12 markers match for all three. The closest matches are kits 6366 and 7833, who happen to trace to William Pace/Ruth Lambert, but this specific line is not necessarily significant, as we do not have 37 marker tests for other lines in group 3a. This greatly increases the chances of a common ancestor, and further cements the probability of group 3 having a London area origin, as Antony's grandfather was a barge builder on the Thames in London. Examining the John of Middlesex 37 markers, we find beaucoup differences, further separating these two lines and I believe tending to support my hypothesis that the Pace surname does not have a single origin in England. Take a look at the chart at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm. I have moved Antony's record to the 3a group to show the comparison better, even though he is not a descendent of the North Carolina Paces and therefore technically is not in this group. As usual, the differing alleles are marked in green. I have not found a calculation for 34/37 on FTDNA as to the probable distance to MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor) but from the graphs, I think it approaches 50% or better somewhere about 12 generations. Maybe others who have been studying DNA results can comment. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out! ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To subscribe or unsubscribe send email to PACE-L-request@rootsweb.com with the one word message: subscribe OR unsubscribe For digest mode, use PACE-D-request@rootsweb.com

Joe, Yes, that about sums it up. The DNA results suggest a common ancestor between the NC Paces of Group 3a especially and Antony Pace who descends from George Pace of London ca 1859. (Has anyone else noted George's name? - Another interesting coincidence, but at this point that is all it is - a coincidence.) The problem remains that DNA results can't tell us who the common ancestor was. That still requires traditional research methods - research in original records with good documentation. But at least we now know that some descendant(s) of whomever that common ancestor was later lived in the same area that Richard Pace of Wapping did. Rebecca Janders 45 <janders45@hotmail.com> wrote: Let me parse this down to basics to see if I understand it: 1. An English Pace, with roots in the London area back as far as 1859, seems to be related to the descendents of Richard Pace of NC (1638-1677). 2. It is likely that Antony Pace and the Richard Paces of NC share a common male ancestor sometime within the past 500 years (and maybe quite a bit shorter time span). This seems to increase the probability that the Richard of NC Paces are descended from Richard Pace of Jamestown. Is this the correct interpretation? Joe Anderson

Sorry about that Richard Pace, buried at St. Dunstans @ Stepney, London England. Haste makes waste. Jack Pace

Roy and all others interested, What exciting news!!!! especially for those of us in group 3a, and probably those in group 3b as well as the third panel for kit #8179 matches the third panel for both groups 3a and 3b participants that have upgraded. For emphasis, we have perfect matches in the third panel for group 3a, group 3b, and London kit #8179. FTDNA's webpages indicate the 34/37 match between Group 3a and London kit #8179 is "related" when you share the same surname and the shared ancestry is probably within the time period of surnames in Europe. For FTDNA's official blurb, see http://www.familytreedna.com/GDRules_37.html The third panel of markers tested by FTDNA contains the most volatile markers, including the 3 fastest mutating markers currently tested by FTDNA - CDYa, CDYb, and DYS 576. Often it is the third panel of markers that cause possible "relatedness" to fall apart, but in the Pace DNA study, these markers for the tested participants from the William Pace/Ruth Lambert line of Group 3a, kit #7811 of Group 3b, and kit #8179 of London have the same results! The difference in the London kit #8179 at Pace marker #2 (DYS 390) occurs on one of the faster moving markers as well. (FTDNA says they are going to update their outdated reporting of fast and slow markers in the first panel but haven't yet.) The DNA results for kit #8179 does put Antony in DNA Group 3a - although the lineages are different. So Roy's placement of him there is where he should be. Calculations for the number of generations to the Most Recent Common Ancestor (MRCA) are not necessarily very accurate. I wouldn't worry too much about the probablilities of how many generations back the common ancestor might be. They are just probabilities and can be way off from the actual number of generations. It is probably safe to assume the shared ancestor was before the ancestor of the Paces of Group 3a came to America - whether that was Richard Pace of Jamestown or not. It is a very interesting coincidence that Richard Pace of Jamestown and Wapping was from directly across the Thames River from Antony's ancestor George Pace of Rotherhithe and that Richard Pace was a carpenter and George Pace a bargebuilder - although MANY years separate the two of them. Also, with kit #8179 Antony's results at Pace markers #6 (DYS 385b) and #21 (DYS 449) matching group 3a, the group 3a results appear to be ancestral results at those markers with group 3b having the changes from the ancestral DNA values at those locations. More testing of NC Pace lines with the paperwork going back to the early Paces (not just those with brick walls!) is necessary to determine when the probable changes in the DNA for group 3b occurred and with which Pace the DNA changes happened, assuming that groups 3b and 3a are indeed closely related. This would apparently be very helpful for all those in Group 3b especially. Some initial thoughts. Rebecca Roy Johnson <royj@webster.edu> wrote: New 37 marker results are in for kit 8179, Antony Pace, London. The last 12 markers match 12/12 with the other three 37 marker submissions that we have in group 3-two in group 3a and one in 3b, but the last 12 markers match for all three. The closest matches are kits 6366 and 7833, who happen to trace to William Pace/Ruth Lambert, but this specific line is not necessarily significant, as we do not have 37 marker tests for other lines in group 3a. This greatly increases the chances of a common ancestor, and further cements the probability of group 3 having a London area origin, as Antony's grandfather was a barge builder on the Thames in London. Examining the John of Middlesex 37 markers, we find beaucoup differences, further separating these two lines and I believe tending to support my hypothesis that the Pace surname does not have a single origin in England. Take a look at the chart at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm. I have moved Antony's record to the 3a group to show the comparison better, even though he is not a descendent of the North Carolina Paces and therefore technically is not in this group. As usual, the differing alleles are marked in green. I have not found a calculation for 34/37 on FTDNA as to the probable distance to MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor) but from the graphs, I think it approaches 50% or better somewhere about 12 generations. Maybe others who have been studying DNA results can comment. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out!

Recently the Jamestown Foundation dug up remains in England trying to tie in a found skeleton at Jamestown with Griswalds family in England. Griswald was a early settler, and officer at Jamestown . The DNA was compared to that person know to be a Griswald family member / relative. The project was not a success and the skeleton altho believed to be Griswold it is yet unproven as to his genetic indemnity. Since the Pace Society has been kind to St Stephens it may be considered to get a DNA sample from Richard Pace (Sect. of State ) buried there for reference and comparison to a person that is well documented as a descendant of Richard Pace of Paces Paines or any other Pace D.N.A. participant. Project should get great press. Jack Pace / Williamsburg Va.

New 37 marker results are in for kit 8179, Antony Pace, London. The last 12 markers match 12/12 with the other three 37 marker submissions that we have in group 3-two in group 3a and one in 3b, but the last 12 markers match for all three. The closest matches are kits 6366 and 7833, who happen to trace to William Pace/Ruth Lambert, but this specific line is not necessarily significant, as we do not have 37 marker tests for other lines in group 3a. This greatly increases the chances of a common ancestor, and further cements the probability of group 3 having a London area origin, as Antony's grandfather was a barge builder on the Thames in London. Examining the John of Middlesex 37 markers, we find beaucoup differences, further separating these two lines and I believe tending to support my hypothesis that the Pace surname does not have a single origin in England. Take a look at the chart at http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm. I have moved Antony's record to the 3a group to show the comparison better, even though he is not a descendent of the North Carolina Paces and therefore technically is not in this group. As usual, the differing alleles are marked in green. I have not found a calculation for 34/37 on FTDNA as to the probable distance to MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor) but from the graphs, I think it approaches 50% or better somewhere about 12 generations. Maybe others who have been studying DNA results can comment. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator

Darlene, I once had a Paisley researcher try to help me find John Pace in her records. No luck. I guess the death of John Pace does continue to be unrecorded. Lt. Paisley could be a son of the Col. I have read something about Col. John Williams actually being present at the Battle of Shallow Ford (Patriot forces). Betty Hi all what I read....... the first instance was Col. John Williams, then under Leut. Pacely, then....This guy called Pacely Is a Leut does that mean Leut Col Paisley ;;;;;What you guys are saying makes sense Paisley and Pacely sure could be one in same ......... Shoot I just keep trying to find a Link to our Pace's ... I am sure so many of you have gone over so much Info searching ... I just keep hoping we will find a clue somewhere along the way...oh Well ! back to the Grind. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Betty A. Pace" <bapace2@juno.com> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 12:05 PM Subject: [PACE-L] Col. John Paisley > I believe I have read that Col. Paisley was a leader in the Patriot > forces in the vicinty of Surry Co. NC. It is not clear to me whether he > was personally present at the Battle of Shallow Force in Oct. 1780, the > battle where John Pace (wife Sarah Burge) was probably killed. He was > however a figure in fighting the Loyalists of Surry Co. NC. > > Darlene, > I believe the Col. Pacely referred to in the pension application of > Henry Connelly was probably Col. John Paisley of Guilford county, North > Carolina. At the bottom of the pension application he is mentioned as > Col. Paiseley. The following is quoted from the first website below: > "On page 232 Dr. Caruthers says: "Col. John Paisley, father of Rev. > William D. Paisley, was a patriot as well as a christian, and had all > along taken an active part in the service of his country. He was > present at the battle (Guilford Court House) with the men under his > command." Col. Paisley was a member of Alamance Church, and lived seven > miles southeast of Greensboro." > It is apparently a quote from Dr. Caruthers "Life of Dr. David > Caldwell." > > http://rankinfamily.org/Rankins%20of%20NC/Guilford%20County/ > Ch%204%20The%20Watson%20Wharton%20Genealogy.htm > > See also: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncguilfo/AlamancePresbyterianChurch.html > Records of the Alamance Presbyterian Church > > A very interesting genealogical letter about the Paisley family is > found at: > http://thejoyceconnection.homestead.com/PaisleyLetter.html > > Sorry, no Paces mentioned. > > John Krall > > On Feb 16, 2006, at 12:57 PM, darlene wrote: > > > Could we have been Pacely ... in Surry Co NC ? Some of my Harlan Co Ky > > > Pace's went to Floyd Co ky close to Harlan Co Ky and my Pace's somehow > > > stem from John Pace and Sarah Burge of Surry Co NC > > Darlene > > Info below from Floyd Co Ky web site.. > > > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyfloyd/Mis_files/henry_connelly.htm > > > > > > > > >> >

I believe I have read that Col. Paisley was a leader in the Patriot forces in the vicinty of Surry Co. NC. It is not clear to me whether he was personally present at the Battle of Shallow Force in Oct. 1780, the battle where John Pace (wife Sarah Burge) was probably killed. He was however a figure in fighting the Loyalists of Surry Co. NC. Darlene, I believe the Col. Pacely referred to in the pension application of Henry Connelly was probably Col. John Paisley of Guilford county, North Carolina. At the bottom of the pension application he is mentioned as Col. Paiseley. The following is quoted from the first website below: "On page 232 Dr. Caruthers says: "Col. John Paisley, father of Rev. William D. Paisley, was a patriot as well as a christian, and had all along taken an active part in the service of his country. He was present at the battle (Guilford Court House) with the men under his command." Col. Paisley was a member of Alamance Church, and lived seven miles southeast of Greensboro." It is apparently a quote from Dr. Caruthers "Life of Dr. David Caldwell." http://rankinfamily.org/Rankins%20of%20NC/Guilford%20County/ Ch%204%20The%20Watson%20Wharton%20Genealogy.htm See also: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncguilfo/AlamancePresbyterianChurch.html Records of the Alamance Presbyterian Church A very interesting genealogical letter about the Paisley family is found at: http://thejoyceconnection.homestead.com/PaisleyLetter.html Sorry, no Paces mentioned. John Krall On Feb 16, 2006, at 12:57 PM, darlene wrote: > Could we have been Pacely ... in Surry Co NC ? Some of my Harlan Co Ky > Pace's went to Floyd Co ky close to Harlan Co Ky and my Pace's somehow > stem from John Pace and Sarah Burge of Surry Co NC > Darlene > Info below from Floyd Co Ky web site.. > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyfloyd/Mis_files/henry_connelly.htm > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > Check out the new Pace Society of America web page at: > www.pacesociety.org, and please join the Pace Society of America for > only $25.00 per year. >

Hi all what I read....... the first instance was Col. John Williams, then under Leut. Pacely, then....This guy called Pacely Is a Leut does that mean Leut Col Paisley ;;;;;What you guys are saying makes sense Paisley and Pacely sure could be one in same ......... Shoot I just keep trying to find a Link to our Pace's ... I am sure so many of you have gone over so much Info searching ... I just keep hoping we will find a clue somewhere along the way...oh Well ! back to the Grind. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Betty A. Pace" <bapace2@juno.com> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 12:05 PM Subject: [PACE-L] Col. John Paisley > I believe I have read that Col. Paisley was a leader in the Patriot > forces in the vicinty of Surry Co. NC. It is not clear to me whether he > was personally present at the Battle of Shallow Force in Oct. 1780, the > battle where John Pace (wife Sarah Burge) was probably killed. He was > however a figure in fighting the Loyalists of Surry Co. NC. > > Darlene, > I believe the Col. Pacely referred to in the pension application of > Henry Connelly was probably Col. John Paisley of Guilford county, North > Carolina. At the bottom of the pension application he is mentioned as > Col. Paiseley. The following is quoted from the first website below: > "On page 232 Dr. Caruthers says: "Col. John Paisley, father of Rev. > William D. Paisley, was a patriot as well as a christian, and had all > along taken an active part in the service of his country. He was > present at the battle (Guilford Court House) with the men under his > command." Col. Paisley was a member of Alamance Church, and lived seven > miles southeast of Greensboro." > It is apparently a quote from Dr. Caruthers "Life of Dr. David > Caldwell." > > http://rankinfamily.org/Rankins%20of%20NC/Guilford%20County/ > Ch%204%20The%20Watson%20Wharton%20Genealogy.htm > > See also: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncguilfo/AlamancePresbyterianChurch.html > Records of the Alamance Presbyterian Church > > A very interesting genealogical letter about the Paisley family is > found at: > http://thejoyceconnection.homestead.com/PaisleyLetter.html > > Sorry, no Paces mentioned. > > John Krall > > On Feb 16, 2006, at 12:57 PM, darlene wrote: > > > Could we have been Pacely ... in Surry Co NC ? Some of my Harlan Co Ky > > > Pace's went to Floyd Co ky close to Harlan Co Ky and my Pace's somehow > > > stem from John Pace and Sarah Burge of Surry Co NC > > Darlene > > Info below from Floyd Co Ky web site.. > > > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyfloyd/Mis_files/henry_connelly.htm > > > > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > > Check out the new Pace Society of America web page at: > > www.pacesociety.org, and please join the Pace Society of America for > > only $25.00 per year. > > > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > If you haven't done so within the last six months, please post a message describing your Earliest Pace Ancestor and how you descend from them. Please include dates, places, spouses, etc, if possible. Send the message to PACE-L@rootsweb.com > > __________ NOD32 1.1413 (20060217) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > >

Darlene, I believe the Col. Pacely referred to in the pension application of Henry Connelly was probably Col. John Paisley of Guilford county, North Carolina. At the bottom of the pension application he is mentioned as Col. Paiseley. The following is quoted from the first website below: "On page 232 Dr. Caruthers says: "Col. John Paisley, father of Rev. William D. Paisley, was a patriot as well as a christian, and had all along taken an active part in the service of his country. He was present at the battle (Guilford Court House) with the men under his command." Col. Paisley was a member of Alamance Church, and lived seven miles southeast of Greensboro." It is apparently a quote from Dr. Caruthers "Life of Dr. David Caldwell." http://rankinfamily.org/Rankins%20of%20NC/Guilford%20County/ Ch%204%20The%20Watson%20Wharton%20Genealogy.htm See also: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncguilfo/AlamancePresbyterianChurch.html Records of the Alamance Presbyterian Church A very interesting genealogical letter about the Paisley family is found at: http://thejoyceconnection.homestead.com/PaisleyLetter.html Sorry, no Paces mentioned. John Krall On Feb 16, 2006, at 12:57 PM, darlene wrote: > Could we have been Pacely ... in Surry Co NC ? Some of my Harlan Co Ky > Pace's went to Floyd Co ky close to Harlan Co Ky and my Pace's somehow > stem from John Pace and Sarah Burge of Surry Co NC > Darlene > Info below from Floyd Co Ky web site.. > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyfloyd/Mis_files/henry_connelly.htm > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > Check out the new Pace Society of America web page at: > www.pacesociety.org, and please join the Pace Society of America for > only $25.00 per year. >

Could we have been Pacely ... in Surry Co NC ? Some of my Harlan Co Ky Pace's went to Floyd Co ky close to Harlan Co Ky and my Pace's somehow stem from John Pace and Sarah Burge of Surry Co NC Darlene Info below from Floyd Co Ky web site.. http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyfloyd/Mis_files/henry_connelly.htm

The Thomas Pace who married Alexia Fleming (dau of Alexander), according to Bruce Howard (p. 110 of his book), married second a widow Jane/Jeane Harvey, then third, Mrs. Mary Lilley, widow of John Lilley of Stafford County, in 1713. According to the deed abstract below, found in records of King George County, it appears that Mrs. Mary Lilley Pace must have married again after Thomas died in 1725, this time to a Thomas Vivion. (Just saw this while researching another surname so thought I'd post for anyone who may be interested since it mentions the Fleming land again. - Joyce Harris) King George County Deed Book 1 pp. 407-410 Indenture 7th/8th December 1726 between THOMAS VIVION and MARY his wife of Parish of Sittenbourn in County of King George Gent. and WILLIAM ROBINSON of same Gent. .. by deeds of Lease and Release .. for Two hundred pounds of lawfull money of England sell all that Plantation of 320 acres in the possession of THOMAS VIVION said plantation is part of a tract of land left by ALEXANDER FLEMING to ALASTIA [sic per abstract-must be Alexia? - jh] his Daughter and for want of heirs of her descended and came to ELIZABETH THORNTON her Sister who by Deed dated 1st July 1699 sold the said land to THOMAS PAISE who by his last will did bequeath the same unto MARY his wife party to these presents. Presence of William Doorins Thomas Vivion 6th January 1726 .. Deeds of Lease Mary Vivion and Release recorded. /jh

Anyone looking for this Wm Pace and Elizabeth I thought it was my Wm Pace and Elizabeth and still maybe another one of My William but sending to you all 1910 Jefferson County, Kentucky 8-WD LOUISVILLE Series: T624 Roll: 486 Page: 62 Richard H. Gieger h 39 m 1 6 KY KY KY Jennie J. w 31 m 1 6 1/1 KY KY KY Robert H., Jr. s 2 KY KY KY William Pace f/l 70 m 1 42 KY US US Elizabeth m/l 63 m 1 42 6/4 KY US US Charles Berry lodger 21 KY KY KY

Roy: Those maps of the Pace distribution in the British Isles in 1881 are very interesting. It shows that the Paces and Paceys were highly concentrated in specific areas and seems to pinpoint interesting areas for further research. I noticed that the highest concentration of Paceys was in the counties northwest of London which is among the eastern counties of England. The highest concentration of Paces is just west of there in Shropshire. It is interesting that the ancestors of Gordon Thomas Pace (and therefore John Pace of Middlesex) came from Shropshire, but by the early 1800's had mostly moved to the county just north, Staffordshire. We know that there were many Paces in Staffordshire in the 1880's but they do not show up on the map. We also know that these early Shropshire Paces often used the name Pacey. Gordon W. Pace -----Original Message----- >From: Roy Johnson <royj@webster.edu> >Sent: Feb 9, 2006 11:00 AM >To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [PACE-L] A hypothesis about the surname Pace > >Many years ago a Pace Society member visited York Minister Cathedral in >northern England and brought back a document stating that the Pace surname >was Norman and went back to Pacy sur Eure in France. It has since been >determined that this document was published (or at least got its information >from) an organization called the House of Names, not known for its accuracy. > > > >I recently ran the mapping study of place names at >http://cetl2.geog.ucl.ac.uk/uclnames/Surnames.aspx and got some very >interesting results. > > > >The Pace surname in 1881 was very strong in the eastern counties next to >Wales (and indeed even into central Wales!) and there was a fairly strong >representation up north on the Scottish border, but elsewhere, even around >London, it was weak. > > > >But the surname Pacey was very strong in the western counties where the >Normans mostly settled. > > > >So my hypothesis is that the Pacey surname came from Pacy sur Eure in >Normandy, but the Pace surname probably did not since it was hardly in those >Norman counties at all in 1881. Also, DNA of the western (John of Middlesex) >Paces in our study is very different from the DNA of the Paces that we >believe originated in the London area. (Of course there would be quite a few >Normans in London since it was the capital.) > > > >Of course there were changes in the spellings so that we may have Paces >whose ancestors were Paceys and are of that Norman background. > > > >It is very interesting to go to the mapping URL and put in alternative >spellings of the name, such as Pase, Paise, Paisey, etc. Each variation >seems to be highly localized in small sections of England in the 1881 maps. > > > >Social mobility has caused these names to move around so that the 1997 map >is different, but the 1881 maps would be more valuable for drawing >conclusions about the local origins of the variants of the Pace surname. > > > >Roy Johnson > > > > > > > > > >==== PACE Mailing List ==== >Check out the Pace GenConnect Boards where you can post or peruse Pace Bibles, Obits, Bios, Deeds, Wills, Queries, etc. Bookmark this URL: >http://boards.ancestry.com > ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com