Re: "Do they suggest he is NOT descended from the claimed Edmund Pace, presumed son of John Pace/Sarah Burgh?" I wouldn't draw that conclusion from the DNA evidence. To me, the results suggest that 26541 is in fact related to Roy's group 3, but the details of descendancy can't be determined from Y-chromosome testing. This donor seems to bridge both of Roy's groups 3a and 3b in that he carries the 3b allele (12) on marker 6, but he carries the 3a allele (29) on marker 21. The only other donor claiming descendancy from Edmund or Edmond is 21419 (Roy has them adjacent in the chart). These two are identical for Roy's two differentiating markers (6 & 21), but they differ at marker 23. These markers do change over time (generations) via mutations. The nature of mutations is that they are relatively rare, they occur at random and they are unpredictable. That's why we can't use them to answer specific questions relative to our family tree (such as the one that you phrased), but we can use them to answer more general questions. But even these answers are more properly given in terms of probabilities rather than certainties. Joe Anderson ----Original Message Follows---- From: "MAC" <olems@bellsouth.net> Reply-To: "MAC" <olems@bellsouth.net> To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] Re: New DNA results #26541 Date: Sat, 8 Apr 2006 16:58:01 -0500 Is anyone out there familiar enough with DNA testing to explain what the new results for #26541 mean? I have no idea how to interpret these differences. Do they suggest he is NOT descended from the claimed Edmund Pace, presumed son of John Pace/Sarah Burgh? M.A. Causey ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roy Johnson" <royj@webster.edu> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2006 9:23 PM Subject: [PACE-L] New results 26541 >25 marker upgrade just posted on Results page >for #26541. I re-organized >the order of the listings to bring like results >closer together; note >interesting combinations in markers 6, 21, 23. >I will leave it to members >of those lines to sort out the meaning. > >http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm >Roy Johnson >DNA coordinator ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Be sure to check the Pace Family Genealogy Forum at http://genforum.com/pace/ and the Pace Network at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pace

Mac I don't know much abt the DNA .. Roy and Rebecca and a few others are far more into reading it .. but I like to ck out the lines by Census to see if I agree with what the Donor claim But I do find it strange that 26541 donor MATCHES exactly with 20864 donor which claims another line . I know 26541 line is straight by Census records and Descends from your Edmond Pace I believe, I will ck out 20864 by Census and see what I come up with ... I also know #21419 matches real close to your 26541 Donor Which Descends from Stephen Pace who is brother to your Edmond Pace & Sarah Walker who we think descend from John Pace Sarah Burge .. I have cked out 21419 by Census and other people notes and does prove to be possibly from John Pace & Sarah Burge ...We are at a total loss at proving forsure who Children were of John Pace and Sarah Burge other than Burrell Pace your Edmond by Bible records and Letters and Burrell war report .. I will post to Pace mailing list Census an other info I find on Donor 20864 Darlene ----- Original Message ----- From: "MAC" <olems@bellsouth.net> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2006 2:58 PM Subject: [PACE-L] Re: New DNA results #26541 > Is anyone out there familiar enough with DNA > testing to explain what the new results for #26541 > mean? I have no idea how to interpret these > differences. > > Do they suggest he is NOT descended from the > claimed Edmund Pace, presumed son of John > Pace/Sarah Burgh? > > M.A. Causey > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Roy Johnson" <royj@webster.edu> > To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2006 9:23 PM > Subject: [PACE-L] New results 26541 > > > > 25 marker upgrade just posted on Results page > > for #26541. I re-organized > > the order of the listings to bring like results > > closer together; note > > interesting combinations in markers 6, 21, 23. > > I will leave it to members > > of those lines to sort out the meaning. > > > > http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm > > > Roy Johnson > > DNA coordinator > > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > Be sure to check the Pace Family Genealogy Forum at http://genforum.com/pace/ and the Pace Network at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pace > > __________ NOD32 1.1477 (20060408) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > >

Is anyone out there familiar enough with DNA testing to explain what the new results for #26541 mean? I have no idea how to interpret these differences. Do they suggest he is NOT descended from the claimed Edmund Pace, presumed son of John Pace/Sarah Burgh? M.A. Causey ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roy Johnson" <royj@webster.edu> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2006 9:23 PM Subject: [PACE-L] New results 26541 > 25 marker upgrade just posted on Results page > for #26541. I re-organized > the order of the listings to bring like results > closer together; note > interesting combinations in markers 6, 21, 23. > I will leave it to members > of those lines to sort out the meaning. > > http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm > Roy Johnson > DNA coordinator

Here is an abstract of a will made by a Thomas Pacey in Maryland in 1666. Apparently, the only heir and descendant (?), was a female named Jemima Long. Ref: “The Maryland Calendar of Wills, Volume I, Wills from 1635 (Earliest Probated) to 1685, Pages 28&#8209;40,” at http://www.usgennet.org/usa/md/state/wills/01/028.html Pacey, Thomas, Charles Co., 3d Nov., 1666; 2d May, 1667. Jemima Long, execx. and sole legatee. In event of death of sd. Jemima without issue, estate to be used for free schools. Test: Wm. Turnor, Griffith Jenkins. 1. 272. On the same page as the Pacey abstract is an abstract of a 1665 will made in Anne Arundel Co. It lists Robert Paca as a Testator. Robert Paca was the great grandfather of William H. Paca, signer of the Declaration of Independence. There will be more on the Paca subject later. --------------------------------- New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big.

I had interest in Edmund Pace children so I had collected Census on Tishmingp MS I notice #26541 lists Albert as grandson of Edmund Pace & Sarah Walker The 1850 Census List Albert G Pace age 22 be b- abt 1828 in Tennessee as a School Teacher he is in HH of Mother Elizabeth Pace age 54 born in NC born abt 1796 and surrounded by many other Pace's .... All on 1850 Cen same Page Tishmingo MS note to be made two of these HH list son David W Pace HH 806ElizabethPace age 54 b-NC HH 805 Abner J Pace age 25TN with wife Eliza J HH 807 Sion Pace age 35 TN wife Martha HH 808 Ruel Pace age 33 TNwife maybe Jincy 1860 Cen shows same area Albert Pace age 33 School Teacher with wife Eliza with son David N K age 4 two doors away is a Wm Pace age 38 wonder if he is brother ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roy Johnson" <royj@webster.edu> To: <PACE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2006 7:23 PM Subject: [PACE-L] New results 26541 > 25 marker upgrade just posted on Results page for #26541. I re-organized > the order of the listings to bring like results closer together; note > interesting combinations in markers 6, 21, 23. I will leave it to members > of those lines to sort out the meaning. > > > > http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm > > > > > > Roy Johnson > > DNA coordinator > > > > ==== PACE Mailing List ==== > To share info which may be of interest to others, reply to the mail list (PACE-L@rootsweb.com). To say thank you or otherwise reply personally, reply to sender. > > __________ NOD32 1.1471 (20060404) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > >

25 marker upgrade just posted on Results page for #26541. I re-organized the order of the listings to bring like results closer together; note interesting combinations in markers 6, 21, 23. I will leave it to members of those lines to sort out the meaning. http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/results.htm Roy Johnson DNA coordinator

Hi all Does anybody have the Deluxe Membership on www.ancestry.com? I have the normal membership but it doesn't let me do searches on the passenger lists of ships. I have two enquiries I would like to make but don't really want to pay extra if someone else could help me out. I'd be really grateful. With kind regards Jaquie Cook nee Pace -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is a PRIVATE message. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete without copying and kindly advise us by e-mail of the mistake in delivery. NOTE: Regardless of content, this e-mail shall not operate to bind CSC to any order or other contract unless pursuant to explicit written agreement or government initiative expressly permitting the use of e-mail for such purpose. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jaquie, Most Family History Centers (FHC) associated with the Family History Library in Salt Lake City have the complete ancestry.com available free of charge to patrons. You can locate the closest FHC by going to www.familysearch.org and on the front page is a box you can type in your location to find the one nearest your home. Rebecca Jaquie Cook <jcook28@csc.com> wrote: Hi all Does anybody have the Deluxe Membership on www.ancestry.com? I have the normal membership but it doesn't let me do searches on the passenger lists of ships. I have two enquiries I would like to make but don't really want to pay extra if someone else could help me out. I'd be really grateful. With kind regards Jaquie Cook nee Pace

Roy, I have found another DNA Donor from John Pace b-1807 -1810 Harlan Co Ky son of Mary Polly Pace b-1765 -1775 we have no proof who her Husband was but he was a Pace ...This John Pace also is brother of my Richmond Pace b-1803 My Kit # 13827 and Possibly Bro to Simeon Pace #7791. DNA will helps us decide if he ends up with DYS 390=26 as I have or DYS 390=-25 as Possible Brother Simeon Pace I show two sites not sure which is correct one to have her go To... The Pace Society DNA or to Family Tree DNA

In family history, one is apt to come across strange coincidences. Maybe everyone has experienced such findings that make your hair curl. Last year, a researching cousin in the UK Midlands had persued the CULLWICK-FASEY events to do with my great grandmother's brother, you might call, the CULWICK-PACE-FASEY connection. Just a few miles north of me, on a rural road I often use, I've passed by a sign that says FASEY LANE. Last summer, when I went by, I saw a man waiting for his daughter to arrive on the school bus. I stopped and asked him if the FASEY people still lived on this Fasey Lane, and that I had a family connection to that name in England. He said that they had moved on to a place nearby. I said my hobby was Family History and my name was GORD PACE. He said he was PHIL PACE and descends from Ebenezer Pace. We were amazed but the school bus suddenly arrived so I said goodbye and moved on. Yesterday, I was preparing a PACE document from my records for another PACE descendent and came across EBENEZER PACE in the document. He was of course one of the Nova Scotia Paces that Don Pace has extensively researched that descend from JAMES PACE - b 1724 d 1784 St. Augustine Florida + AURELIA DUPREE - came to NS in 1784 with three sons and brother in law DARIUS PACE (? - 1823) + DOROTHY RAINES and both JAMES and DARIUS were sons of RICHARD IV PACE - b 1699 Bladen Co. NC d 1775 + ELIZABETH CAIN m 1723 EBENEZER PACE 1809-1885 was a shoemaker, lived at Haggets (now Hacketts) Cove. A Methodist, he led the singing in the William Black Memorial Church in Glen Margaret when it was first erected - Buried Glen Margaret Cemetery. (near site of Swiss Air crash) + Elizabeth ISNOR - m Dec 28, 1831. (B.6 Apr 1813) I printed the lineage out with some detail about EBENEZER, drove up to see Phil Pace. We looked at the map of Nova Scotia, where Ebenezer and Phil lived, and all. I asked about the PHASEY people again and he said he was married to one. He said there were only about four Phasey folk in Canada. Strange, my great grandmother's sister, in England, marries one and another PACE marries one. EDWIN/EDWARD CULWICK - born abt 1845 BROMSGROVE 1851 Rednal census - shows as 6 years old + PHOEBE NAYLOR of Sedgley m 16 May 1864 MARRIAGE NOTICE - All Saints West BROMWICH - EDWARD, x, 22, bach, carter of West Brom, father VICARAGE, carter and PHEBE, (x), 23, spinster, father JOB NAYLOR, miner. Witnesses SAMUEL CULLWICK (signed) and PHEBE ANN JUKES, (x). EDWARD was a coal miner in Laney Green, Staffordshire. He died there on 6th November 1873 from bronchitis and pneumonia – informant EMILY PACE (my ggrand/mother & sister) of Laney Green, present at death (she signed). PHOEBE NAYLOR was bt at Sedgley on 11 Apr 1841, parents JOB and MARY NAYLOR. She appears to have been named after an older sister PHOEBE born 1831, who died aged 3. PHOEBE married, secondly, JOHN FASEY on 9 August 1880 at Sedgley (VTR). They were on the 1881 & 1891 census but couldn't be found on the 1901 and had possibly emmigrated, we figure. Another rare happening A few years ago, I visited Don Pace, of the NS Paces, now living in Alberta. Don said, when he was younger he was in the Armed Forces Signal Corps in the Belgian Congo. I said, I had a cousin who was in that and also in the Congo. Don took a picture off the wall and handed me. It was of a group of army men he was with in the Congo. There was my cousin in the picture.

Darlene (and the list), It probably would be a good idea to write directly to Roy to have him update the lineage information on the Pace DNA page so that Jesse Pace and earlier generations aren't shown as being as part of the lineage of the participants you have sponsored - but only the lineage as far back as documented be listed. That way, more isn't read into the DNA results than should be. There is a lot that can be learned from the DNA results, especially when there are mutations that occurred earlier in the lineages rather than later, but the submitted lineages should only what can be documented. There are other lineages as well that have been posted as part of the Pace DNA project based on published books and online information, rather than on documented research, and in some cases it is very obvious that they are wrong - more than one version of ancestors for the same person, the DNA results indicate the lineage is incorrect, etc. Rebecca darlene <darlene@adweb.net> wrote: Rebecca, Thank you for info on DNA I sure appreciate it..some questions,and Hypothesis an my notes in Brackets [my notes] Basic early lineages of the 3 participants (as submitted) [I was led astray by a Gedcom & Brcue Howard Book without cking results. The Gedcom said Jesse Pace Possible Husband of Mary Polly Pace so Does Bruce Howard Book, and Bruce himself told me when you see possibly does not mean it so] 1 - Jesse Pace (c1773 NC - ) [My investigation shows No Proof that this Jesse Pace is Husband of Mary Polly Pace b-1765-1775 but know that all you have to work with on DNA Results , because I believed whats in Books and on Gedcom's without doing my own cking and put it down as gospel ] 2 - Richmond Pace (1803 KY - bef Nov 1845) 3- John R. Pace (1829 - ) - descendant/DNA participant #13827 - DYS 390 = 26 [it sounds like if John Pace b-1807 which I have document that He & Richmond Pace were given care of Mary Polly Pace b-1765-1775 that appears on the 1820 Census in Harlan Co Ky and if John Pace DNA show DYS 390=26 then we could assume thier father would have DYS390=26? or if JohnPace DNA shows DYS 390=25 then we are somehow related to John Pace and Sarah Burge or Wm Pace and Secily Walker ] 3 - William Pace (1832/6 -) - descendant/DNA participant #53888 - DYS 390 = 26 2 - Simeon Pace (1812 KY - aft 1860 KY) - descendant/ DNA participant #7791 - DYS 390 = 25 <snip>

Rebecca, Thank you for info on DNA I sure appreciate it..some questions,and Hypothesis an my notes in Brackets [my notes] Basic early lineages of the 3 participants (as submitted) [I was led astray by a Gedcom & Brcue Howard Book without cking results. The Gedcom said Jesse Pace Possible Husband of Mary Polly Pace so Does Bruce Howard Book, and Bruce himself told me when you see possibly does not mean it so] 1 - Jesse Pace (c1773 NC - ) [My investigation shows No Proof that this Jesse Pace is Husband of Mary Polly Pace b-1765-1775 but know that all you have to work with on DNA Results , because I believed whats in Books and on Gedcom's without doing my own cking and put it down as gospel ] 2 - Richmond Pace (1803 KY - bef Nov 1845) 3- John R. Pace (1829 - ) - descendant/DNA participant #13827 - DYS 390 = 26 [it sounds like if John Pace b-1807 which I have document that He & Richmond Pace were given care of Mary Polly Pace b-1765-1775 that appears on the 1820 Census in Harlan Co Ky and if John Pace DNA show DYS 390=26 then we could assume thier father would have DYS390=26? or if JohnPace DNA shows DYS 390=25 then we are somehow related to John Pace and Sarah Burge or Wm Pace and Secily Walker ] 3 - William Pace (1832/6 -) - descendant/DNA participant #53888 - DYS 390 = 26 2 - Simeon Pace (1812 KY - aft 1860 KY) - descendant/ DNA participant #7791 - DYS 390 = 25 I have found a DNA for Richmond Pace b-1803 brother John Pace b-1807-1810.. She has a Bro who could do DNA and trying to Collect Money from Living relative's to have enough hopefully at least the 37 Marker.. I have offered to help as much as I Can .. I feel it will help prove up things a bit... I have worried abt the fact Simeon Pace has always lived away from the rest of my Pace family, and know My Pace family prob drove a few away with thier Staunch religious values ...I do know Richmonds brother John Pace did not leave Harlan Co Ky until after his Mother Mary Polly Pace and Richmond Pace died, then John Pace up and moved to Magoffin Co Ky ..Three of us girls have filled in & Documented all John Pace's lines in Magoffin Co Ky I truly Wish I could get our lines back .. but only Proof we have so far is that we descend from a Mary Polly Pace b-1765-1775 .. no proof we descend from a Jesse Pace .. Here again wrong infomation put on line with absolutely NO PROOF and I was one of the Guilty Parties Putting Information Down without proof in my hot little hands ......live and learn ((Grin)) Does anyone know who the William & Joseph Pace in Lee Co Va ??? I recently found that there was a Joseph and William Pace in Lee Co Va in 1804 Tax List .. where a lot of my Pace family migrated back and forth to Lee Co Va from Harlan Co Ky. This maybe a Connection I have never known abt... I truly would love to take it back farther and I just keep digging as we all do .. Darlene ----- Original Message ----- From: Rebecca Christensen To: darlene ; pace-l@rootsweb.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2006 4:49 PM Subject: Re: [PACE-L] Kit #53888 DNA Alleles are: Looking for DNA for John Pace Magoffin Co Ky Darlene, (and the list) I read this e-mail after replying to the earlier e-mail. It would be interesting to see the DNA results for a descendant of John Pace, brother of Richmond Pace. If the DNA change to 26 at DYS 390 (marker 2) from 25 is associated with Richmond Pace (that is, having occurred at his birth), then it would be expected that John Pace's descendant also would have the ancestral 25 result at DYS 390. But on the other hand, if a documented John Pace descendant had the 26 result, then it would seem less likely that Simeon Pace would be their brother - that is, if descendants of brothers Richmond and John both had the 26 at DYS 390, it would be expected that their father (Jesse?) would also have the 26, as would any other brothers. It should be kept in mind when making any conclusions about DNA results, the accuracy of the underlying family lineages is all important. If the lineages are wrong, then the conclusions being drawn are not necessarily accurate. Keep up the good work, Darlene! Your persistance in finding DNA participants and asking questions is great. I believe we can answer many more of our Pace questions with additional DNA testing. So far most DNA participants are those with questions about their lines. We need participants with lineages that go back to the early Paces to participate as well in order to answer some of the questions the rest of us have!!! Rebecca darlene <darlene@adweb.net> wrote: Roy says he is really busy Driving back and forth to help with his Family .. so I am putting on for you all and hopefully make it easier for Roy to Add when he has free time. I am also looking for someone to Do DNA on John Pace b-1807 HarlanCo Ky d- Magoffin Co Ky another bro of Richmond Pace to see what Marker 2 shows as court Records show both Richmond and this John sons of Polly Pace...The more DNA done the easier it will be to find key's of how families fit.... I will help all I can if someone needs help... Darlene Supposedly but no proof other than 1820 Cen shows a son b- abt 1812 brother of Richmond & John Pace ...Simeon Pace b-1810 does not appear on Harlan Co Ky census until 1840 However Court Records of Harlan Co Ky show him there in 1834 in a bit of trouble nothing major Kit 7791 Simeon Pace shows Marker 2 as 25 where as both Richmond's line shows Marker 2 as 26 hoping in my feeble mind to find its another Maker 2 close to My Marker 2-26.....I keep looking for an easy Key to make more proof on DNA (((grin))) This kit # 53888 exact match to my Kit #13827 and we both Descend from Richmond Pace by Way of Widow Poly Pace/Mary Pace .altho I don't have as many Markers . Kit #53888 DNA 37 Marker Living s/o Arthur Pace d-1969 Ky Documented s/o Leander Pace d-1936 Kydocumented s/o Wm Pace d-aft 1900Ky & bef 1910 documented s/o Richmond Pace b-1803 d-1845Ky documented s/o ! Widow Polly Mary Pace died before 1850 Cen ...No proof of who her husband was some say Possibly Jesse Pace but no proof to this date and time. Darlene Alleles are: 13 26 15 11 11 12 12 12 12 13 13 29 16 9 10 11 11 24 15 19 30 15 17 17 17 11 11 19 22 16 15 17 17 36 40 12 12 Darlene ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out!

Thomas mentions Ohel Dahl Pace 1848-1924 in his Pace lineage and that name showed up in Palmer Lee Pace's lineage posted on the list a few years ago. Here is that part that may help Thomas. Descendants of Silas Pace 1 Silas Pace 1726-1790 b 1726 + Mary Newsome 1750-1804 b Abt 1750 Bertie Precinct, NC ..2 Silas Pace 1778-1811 ..+ Elizabeth Foreman 1780-1863 b: NC m Abt. 1800 Edgefield Co SC ....3 Bartley Martin Pace 1806 - 1838 b: Abt. 1806 GA ....+ Elizabeth Taylor b 1813 Georgia ......4 Bartley Martin Pace b Apr 1837 Talladaga Co Alabama ......+ Alice J. Jarman b 1843 Sumter Co Alabama m 18 Nov 1868 SmithCoTX ........5 James M. Pace b 14 Apr 1872 Hopkins Co Texas ........+ Cora Ann Davis b: Feb 1880 Texas m: 1895 ....3 Maranda M. Pace ....+ Bynum ......4 Bartley Pace Bynum ..2 John Pace b: Abt. 1775 ..+ Sarah ....3 Thomas William Pace 1812-1866 b: Abbeville SC ....+ Drucilla b: 1816 SC ......4 John Davis Pace ......4 William T. Pace ......4 Silas M. Pace ......4 Haywood D. Pace ......4 Calvin D. Pace ......4 Cain Pace ......4 Ohel Dahl Pace 1848-1924 ........5 Thomas Jennings Pace b: 1866 ..........6 Thomas Jennings Pace b: 1888 ......4 Thomas Pace ......4 Major Pace ......4 Ewel Ulie P. Pace

Darlene, (and the list) I read this e-mail after replying to the earlier e-mail. It would be interesting to see the DNA results for a descendant of John Pace, brother of Richmond Pace. If the DNA change to 26 at DYS 390 (marker 2) from 25 is associated with Richmond Pace (that is, having occurred at his birth), then it would be expected that John Pace's descendant also would have the ancestral 25 result at DYS 390. But on the other hand, if a documented John Pace descendant had the 26 result, then it would seem less likely that Simeon Pace would be their brother - that is, if descendants of brothers Richmond and John both had the 26 at DYS 390, it would be expected that their father (Jesse?) would also have the 26, as would any other brothers. It should be kept in mind when making any conclusions about DNA results, the accuracy of the underlying family lineages is all important. If the lineages are wrong, then the conclusions being drawn are not necessarily accurate. Keep up the good work, Darlene! Your persistance in finding DNA participants and asking questions is great. I believe we can answer many more of our Pace questions with additional DNA testing. So far most DNA participants are those with questions about their lines. We need participants with lineages that go back to the early Paces to participate as well in order to answer some of the questions the rest of us have!!! Rebecca darlene <darlene@adweb.net> wrote: Roy says he is really busy Driving back and forth to help with his Family .. so I am putting on for you all and hopefully make it easier for Roy to Add when he has free time. I am also looking for someone to Do DNA on John Pace b-1807 HarlanCo Ky d- Magoffin Co Ky another bro of Richmond Pace to see what Marker 2 shows as court Records show both Richmond and this John sons of Polly Pace...The more DNA done the easier it will be to find key's of how families fit.... I will help all I can if someone needs help... Darlene Supposedly but no proof other than 1820 Cen shows a son b- abt 1812 brother of Richmond & John Pace ...Simeon Pace b-1810 does not appear on Harlan Co Ky census until 1840 However Court Records of Harlan Co Ky show him there in 1834 in a bit of trouble nothing major Kit 7791 Simeon Pace shows Marker 2 as 25 where as both Richmond's line shows Marker 2 as 26 hoping in my feeble mind to find its another Maker 2 close to My Marker 2-26.....I keep looking for an easy Key to make more proof on DNA (((grin))) This kit # 53888 exact match to my Kit #13827 and we both Descend from Richmond Pace by Way of Widow Poly Pace/Mary Pace .altho I don't have as many Markers . Kit #53888 DNA 37 Marker Living s/o Arthur Pace d-1969 Ky Documented s/o Leander Pace d-1936 Kydocumented s/o Wm Pace d-aft 1900Ky & bef 1910 documented s/o Richmond Pace b-1803 d-1845Ky documented s/o ! Widow Polly Mary Pace died before 1850 Cen ...No proof of who her husband was some say Possibly Jesse Pace but no proof to this date and time. Darlene Alleles are: 13 26 15 11 11 12 12 12 12 13 13 29 16 9 10 11 11 24 15 19 30 15 17 17 17 11 11 19 22 16 15 17 17 36 40 12 12 Darlene ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Help this list grow - tell other Pace researchers about it. Also, the Pace Society of America home page is located at: http://www.pacesociety.org - check it out!

Thomas, I'm not surprised you got confused! There is a lot of conflicting information out there, besides the problem of the same names used over and over in the family and the record losses over the years that complicate everything. The DNA test results have shown that some conclusions over the years are wrong and also that some older research conclusions are probably more correct than some of the newer published research conclusions. Unfortunately, a lot of information has been published online by many people without any research being done at all - just a rehashing, right or wrong, of other people's ideas, often without any indication of where the information came from in the first place. Since you are a Pace by surname, you do have the option of participating in the Pace DNA study. That can tell you definitely whether you are related to the NC Paces believed to be descended from Richard Pace and whether you are in Group 3a or Group 3b or whether you related to the John Pace of Middlesex group, or one of the other Pace lines. The Pace Society of America also has a members only database of scanned images of original documents that can be viewed. The document images allow each member the opportunity to easily see the original documents themselves and thus not have to rely on the opinions of others, but be able to see if the documents support the conclusions being published. Not all Pace associated documents are already online, but there is a large number already. Also, back issues of the Pace Society Bulletin are available to members on the website. For more information on the Pace DNA Study or the Pace Society of America organization and database, see the Pace Society website at: www.pacesociety.org Hope this helps. If you post some information on your line to the list, at least as far back as you know to be correct, there may be some on the list that can help with some of the confusion. Rebecca Christensen Randy Pace <pace77@hotmail.com> wrote: Morning all, My name Is Thomas R. Pace, and supposedly descend from the Richard Pace line. Unfortunately, I have been out of the loop for a few years. I have a descending list of family members, again supposedly, up to Richard. Without going into too much detail, I need confirmation on the line if I'm to go forward. The Pace message board confused me into headaches. Any help is greatly appreciated. Thomas R. Pace ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Be sure to check the Pace Family Genealogy Forum at http://genforum.com/pace/ and the Pace Network at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pace

Darlene, It appears that Roy hasn't had a chance yet to post the results for #53888 to the Pace website so I can only make comments based on what you have written below and what is already posted on the Pace DNA results page. It is much easier for me to see what is going on visually than with words, but let me re-write what you have written in another way. Please correct me if I am interpretting any of the information incorrectly. Basic early lineages of the 3 participants (as submitted) 1 - Jesse Pace (c1773 NC - ) 2 - Richmond Pace (1803 KY - bef Nov 1845) 3- John R. Pace (1829 - ) - descendant/DNA participant #13827 - DYS 390 = 26 3 - William Pace (1832/6 -) - descendant/DNA participant #53888 - DYS 390 = 26 2 - Simeon Pace (1812 KY - aft 1860 KY) - descendant/ DNA participant #7791 - DYS 390 = 25 **NOTE** The modal (most common) and apparently the ancestral value as well for DYS 390 (marker 2 on the Pace results page) for both Groups 3a and 3b is 25. Darlene, since almost all participants in Groups 3a and 3b have a value of 25 at DYS 390 (marker 2), it appears those who do not have the 25 are the ones who have the change from the older, probable ancestral value. Put another way, the 25 at DYS 390 being shared with both Groups 3a and 3b, indicates that the 25 at that marker is probably the older of the two results and goes back to before the apparent DNA split between groups 3a and 3b. So, it would appear that the descendant of Simeon Pace (#7791) has no change at that marker but that the change from the 25 to the 26 is in the line of participants #13827 and #53888. Actually, since both participants #13827 and #53888 are descendants of Richmond Pace through TWO different sons (John R. and William) then it can be said that the result of 26 at DYS 390 is ancestral to Richmond Pace - that is, Richmond Pace himself also had the 26 result as descendants of two of his sons have that result. With these results, it is exp! ected that all descendants of Richmond Pace would have the 26 at DYS 390 (barring any additional mutations at the marker). If the assumption is correct that Simeon Pace is a brother of Richmond then it would appear that the DNA change to 26 from 25 at DYS 390 occurred at the birth of Richmond Pace and not earlier since the descendant of Simeon Pace (the suspected brother of Richmond) does not have the change to 26. So, it appears that the DYS 390 result of 26 is a DNA result that can help identify the descendants of Richmond Pace at this time. If Simeon is indeed Richmond's brother and Jesse's son as believed, then it would appear that Jesse, like Simeon, had the "older" value of 25 at DYS 390. At this point, the DNA results by themselves don't give us a conclusive answer either way whether Simeon and Richmond Pace are brothers or not. If the paperwork suggests they are brothers, both sons of Jesse, the current DNA results do not dispute that conclusion as the DYS 390 =26 result appears to be associated with Richmond Pace. At least, this is how it looks to me at this time, with the information provided and the few tests for these lines. But, it does appear to be a very interesting result - that is, it appears that we have a defining marker result for the Richmond Pace line. Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions. Rebecca darlene <darlene@adweb.net> wrote: One of My distant cousin had DNA done his # is 53888 and we match exactly He just had it done ....he gave me permission to Share with who ever I wanted to... We Both Descend from Richmond Pace by Way of two sons of Richmond Pace, Brothers...... Mine #13827 John R Pace b-1829 & he Descends from younger Brother Wm Pace b-1832-1836 DNA # 53888 So we know my DNA is good as his DNA #53888 matches exactly with my #13827, What really bothers me why does # 7791 who Decends from Simeon Pace b-1810-1812 we thought was Brother of Our Richmond Paceb-1803 his DNA & My DNA did not match ..could it be because Simeon Pace does not descend from same father as Richmond Pace .. 7791 marker 2 has 25 my 13827 marker 2 is 26 so could it mean Marker 2 distinguish same over all line but different Brother .. I like my line of thought... ((Grin)) .. but imagine you of greater minds will tell me not so and I understand... .... My mind is not too great right now as had a terrible bout with illiness but on the mend.. but I do like to make thing simple ((grin)) Also maybe one of you can tell me why it does not show on Family Tree DNA that my # 13827 an exact match to 53888 other are close are listed.. What do I need to do... oh My Darlene ==== PACE Mailing List ==== You can search archived messages from the Pace Mailing List by going to http://searches.rootsweb.com. If you need instructions just ask me - gordonpace@comcast.net

Morning all, My name Is Thomas R. Pace, and supposedly descend from the Richard Pace line. Unfortunately, I have been out of the loop for a few years. I have a descending list of family members, again supposedly, up to Richard. Without going into too much detail, I need confirmation on the line if I'm to go forward. The Pace message board confused me into headaches. Any help is greatly appreciated. Thomas R. Pace

Jaquie Cook wrote: > This is really confusing, was she from London or Yardley? They are over 100 miles apart. The age stays the same consistently so I don't think these are two different women. > What do you think? Any ideas? > Jaquie Jaquie, Here's some stuff to help or confuse more. Yardley Wood & Tanworth are on same rail line about 6 miles apart with WYTHALL in between. I have ancestry from Wythall & Tanworth too involving Ward, Hunt, Hassall, Culwick. You also have Hassall & Taylor Marriage probably took place in south Birmingham, maybe Harborne, Selly Oak, looking at the Chr places of their children ALFRED THOMAS PACE - b 1863 Harborne m Annie PITT (Pitt-popular in Shareshill, connected to Pace many times) descendent in OZ of Alfred Pace has a web site URL below ANNIE PACE - b 1869 Harborne CHARLES HENRY PACE - b 1872 Harborne CHARLOTTE ELLEN PACE - b 5 Nov 1873, Illshaw, Tanworth ELIZABETH PACE - b 1877 Tanworth-in-Arden ARTHUR PACE - b 1880 Tanworth-in-Arden Australian web site http://puck53.tripod.com/RP.html Alfred Emmanuel Pace born Dec 4,1899 Solihull, Birmingham England, to a Master Builder, Alfred & wife, Annie Pace (nee PITT). The fourth child of sisters Bertha; Emily & Annie & a stepfamily from a later marriage At Tanworth church a bellringer I talked to knew a PACE of Solihill who was a master builder, Walter or William Pace, not sure now. My ancestry from Tanworth/Wythall SARAH WARD (2X great grandmother) Christening: 06 JAN 1816 Tanworth, Warwick Father: JOHN WARD Mother: OBEDIENCE (Hunt) between 1822 & 1829 WARD family moved to Wythall SARAH m VICARAGE CULWICK who died and Sarah was with brother SAMUEL WARD Christening: 28 JUN 1829 Wythall, Worcester Father: JOHN WARD Mother: OBEDIENCE SAMUEL married ELIZABETH HASSALL of Saredon/Shareshill in 1855. I believe HASSALL is in your family too. You also have TAYLOR of Walsall or Hednesford. This is also in my PACE family. LUCY PACE Chr 21 Feb 1836 Norton Canes (d/o Joshua Pace & Hannah Hicken of Norton Canes) married a TAYLOR, 2nd marriage William HAYNES; son Samuel William Haynes married Mary Ann Pace,abt 1891,sister of my grandfather Charles Vicarage Much of this from my Culwick cousins,Birmingham area,desc.of Vicarage Culwick who married Sarah WARD of Tanworth/Wythall Hope this is a help. GTPace

Hi I've decided to start investating my family tree again after 3 years away and the internet has bought up some more information for me. This is the info to date: Charles Henry Pace b. 1905 m. 1935 d. 1981 marr. Edith Taylor b. 1906 m. 1935 d. 2003 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Charles Henry Pace b. 1871 m. 1904 d. Abt 1926 marr. Bessy Bould b. 1877 m. 1904 d. 1940 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Emanuel Pace b. 1838 m. 1853 d. ? marr. Jane Joiner b. 1838 m. 1853 d. ? My query tonight is about Jane Joiner. I've never had any joy in finding any information about Jane except from the 1881 census which gave her age and place of birth at Kensington, Middlesex. However, I've downloaded the 1861, 1871, 1881, 1891 and 1901 census which says in 2 that she was born in Kensington, Middlesex or London and in 3 of them as Yardley, Worcester. This is really confusing, was she from London or Yardley? They are over 100 miles apart. The age stays the same consistently so I don't think these are two different women. What do you think? Any ideas? Jaquie

This is a truly great link..... http://www.clocations.com/default.aspx Locates cemeteries, streams, lakes, churches, historic things, etc. All pinpointed and if you click the HYBRID view, it names roads as well as the ariel. The East Georgia Genealogical Society is compiling a book of family 'sketches' who were in the 28 county area covered by their organization. "EAST GEORGIA SETTLERS" Go to: http://www.rootsweb.com/~gaeggs/projects.html for full information on the project as well as the organization. (Not necessary to be a member.)