<<Wasn't John Pace an immigrant? >> DNA evidence linked John's descendents to Gordon Pace of Canada, who has traced his ancestry back to Shropshire, England, on the Welsh border. Nearly overwhelming circumstantial evidence indicates John was the brother of Gordon's proven ancestor George and was born in 1665 in Shropshire. This is dealt with on the DNA Results page and the evidence is given at: http://www.pacesociety.org/DNA/johngeorge.htm My gg grandfather was James Blair Pace, son of Francis Pace. James Blair Pace came to Missouri in the 1830s. Francis moved from Goochland County to Pittsylvania County and James Blair came to Missouri from there. My line is replete with James Blair Paces. I have always wondered where the name came from. Roy Johnson -----Original Message----- From: James Blair [mailto:jnb05042000@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 3:39 AM To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PACE-L] Newsome I descend from the Surry Newsomes through the marriage of Silas Pace to Mary Newsome (Solomon, Thomas, William, William). Elizabeth Newsome was a sister of Mary's grandfather Thomas. She is mentioned in her father's will (probated 1691). Nothing else seems to be known about her. Wasn't John Pace an immigrant? "Newsome" (or "Newsham", "Newsam", etc) occurs as a given name as well as a surname, in 17th-century England. But no doubt that line of enquiry has already been researched. James __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ==== PACE Mailing List ==== To share info which may be of interest to others, reply to the mail list (PACE- L@rootsweb.com). To say thank you or otherwise reply personally, reply to sender.
PLEASE COUSINS, IT seems to me that, When any two people are Swapping INFORMATION on the LIST, <I see nothing wrong with that> BUT it would be more Clarifying to I. D. the intended Recipient THAN to just, BLANKLY STATE, SO & SO. That would be appropriate, <ONE ON ONE> But that Method on the list IS confusing. One would be more informative by I.D.ing the intended recipient. THANKS CUZ A T <atpowelljr@aol.com>
Well spotted. I think that's pretty conclusive. I looked it up in Avant and he quotes Anne Foster's will as naming her daughters "Elizabeth and Anne Newsome". If that's correct it clinches it. I won't bother to hunt down the will at present, since it seems clear that she was not John Pace's wife, but will look for it when I get a chance. Yrs, James __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Your point is well taken, in reviewing census records It may be Mary in 1700 and Polly in 1710. And that is why we do not accept a single listing as fact, but take that info and build a case with the aid of other researched info. I have copies of old court records where the same persons name both given, and family, are spelled different in the same record..Pearce families in Ohio and Indiana as well as others were changed from PACE. The german Paces were PEES before they landed in America. Thats why it is named researching, and not named copying, whatever some wants to post. Will Rogers use to say, believe nothing you hear, and only half of what you read!! The fun has always been in the chase,not the catch. Happy researching and documenting. Jack Pace
I descend from the Surry Newsomes through the marriage of Silas Pace to Mary Newsome (Solomon, Thomas, William, William). Elizabeth Newsome was a sister of Mary's grandfather Thomas. She is mentioned in her father's will (probated 1691). Nothing else seems to be known about her. Wasn't John Pace an immigrant? "Newsome" (or "Newsham", "Newsam", etc) occurs as a given name as well as a surname, in 17th-century England. But no doubt that line of enquiry has already been researched. James __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Way back when------- Paces started researching this family line, early researchers assumed that John Sr. wife was Elizabeth Newsome because they knew her given name was Elizabeth and because they named their fourth son Newsome that Elizabeth was a Newsome. A William Newsome family in Surry County (close to Paces Pains) had a daughter Elizabeth and it became convient to connect her with John Pace Sr. This has been researched and this lineage is not acceptable to join the Jamestown Society.There were Nusams and Newsomes in Lancaster County but a connection with an Elizabeth there has never been documented. So for now I guess it is just Elizabeth with a ?. Jack Pace / Wmsburg.
New DNA entries Kit 12269 has extended to the new 67 marker test, but has found no match with any other Pace. There were several 25 marker matches with non-Paces, which may or may not be significant. To avoid so much scrolling, I am starting a new table below the current tale with alleles 38-67 and a note that is clickable to take anyone there who is curious. I do not believe many will make use of the markers beyond 37, which is probably why there are no matches at all for 12269 for any alleles above 25. Here is the lineage submitted by 12269. Kit #12269 Unsure 0. Donor 1. Father 2. Grandfather 3. Joseph B. Pace b. 11 Feb TN; d 27 Nov 1891 Clay Co? AR 4. Joacum L. Pace, (J.L., once Joseph L.) o born 1823-1825 TN o married 1847 Williamson Co lived in 1850 Hardin, 1860 Perry, 1870 1880 Humphreys Counties o died ca 1883 Humpreys Co TN 5. Thomas Pace Sr. o b 1793-1795 NC (or SC?) o he got an 1816 Maury Co TN appears on Williamson Co TN census from 1830- 1860; died between Oct 1867 - May1868 Williamson CO TN I am surprised that we have not found other Pace lines. Pace is not an extremely uncommon name in England; it is beyond belief that there were no others who emigrated. In fact, I ran onto a 19th century Pace immigrant from England living in St. Louis while I was browsing once. There was no clear connection to any of our Paces so I didnt keep it, but someone has to be descended from these later Pace immigrants. The other new result was from donor 63672, a 12 marker verifying the donors record that he is a descendent of William Pace/Ruth Lambert. Roy Johnson DNA coordinator
I don't see how she could get either a Pace or a Johnson lineage since both go through females. I did a 12 marker Johnson; no matches except 11/12 in Senegal and Gambia, West Africa, and predicted probable haplogroup was West African. My family lore says Swedish but there were some free Africans living among the Swedes in early Delaware and New Jersey, so it's possible. When I can, I plan to get further testing done to be sure of the haplogroup. Roy Johnson -----Original Message----- From: Atpowelljr@aol.com [mailto:Atpowelljr@aol.com] Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 1:43 AM To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PACE-L] RE-THIS COULD BE AN INTERESTING POINT FOR BOTH FAMILIES Now My 75 year old uncle from TN just had that DNA test done and we have the results done and was wondering if you had it done. It would be super interesting if you did or will have it done for all of us JOHNSON'S out here. HOW abt it one never knows WHERE that Cousin may be found That will bring that <BRICK WALL> Tumbling down. CUZ A T <atpowelljr@aol.com> ==== PACE Mailing List ==== Be sure to check the Pace Family Genealogy Forum at http://genforum.com/pace/ and the Pace Network at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pace
Now My 75 year old uncle from TN just had that DNA test done and we have the results done and was wondering if you had it done. It would be super interesting if you did or will have it done for all of us JOHNSON'S out here. HOW abt it one never knows WHERE that Cousin may be found That will bring that <BRICK WALL> Tumbling down. CUZ A T <atpowelljr@aol.com>
As it has been a while since first posting my Pace-Johnson connection and query, I'd like to do it again in case someone who might have info missed it or has since joined the list. I have taken my Johnson line back to KIMBRO JOHNSON b abt 1800 in NC. He is first found when he marries QUINETT PACE b abt 1805 in NC. They married February 15, 1820 in Wake Co., NC. They are then found on the 1830 through the 1880 Census records in Surry Co., NC. I don't know if they always lived in Surry and just happen to marry in Wake or if they moved to Surry Co. from Wake Co. between 1820 and 1830. I descend through their daughter, Jincy b abt 1836 who married Albert Dickens b abt 1833 in Surry Co., NC. If anyone has any info on these, I would appreciate hearing from you. Blessings, Julia Julia Williams Kodak Researching Adams, Anderson, Baker, Bedsaul, Bonham, Brannock, Caudill, Caldwell, Creed, Dickens, Franklin, Golden, Golding, Goodson, Gollehon, Johnson, Musser, Moore, Norman, Rowland, Sturgill, Suit, Upchurch, Williams and Wymer in SW VA and NC and the people of Shell Creek, TN. "The gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" Romans 6:23
I checked the DAR database. No one has ever applied or proven Revolutionary service under this person yet. Kim Stracener Zapalac
I have a very good Record of my PACE/JOHNSON Family Connection. ANY way I am satisfied with Knowing, Knowing who I Am. NOW: About the Names we have found that our Ancestors used; Mary?? Mary Elizabeth, Mary Ellen, Mary Jane, SO just how does one say that This Ancestor was Married to Elizabeth, & NOT Mary When those two names were so often used in conjunction with each other??? NOW AGAIN; <UNK>, United Kingdom, Unknown, UNK <Uncle> BUT, <UNK> as a Surname in associated with a European Family would be Exceptional. NOW COUSINS; I have 5 Pace Family Postings, that one Could credit with BEING answer's to My Questions___??? BUT in the manner that, James, three times & Roy Johnson twice, Failed to Direct your Comment to any one, WHY?? CUZ A T <atpowelljr@aol.com>
Gleanings from my computer: From: paceshire@juno.com To: PACE-L@rootsweb.com Date: Mar 18 2006 - 9:21pm I disagree that John Pace Jr.,son of John Pace Sr. of Middlesex mother was Mary, but rather Elizabeth who most claim was Elizabeth Newsome. John Pace Sr. did not marry Mary Muray untill 10, feb. 1718. John Pace Jr. married Elizabeth Montague 24, Oct.1717. If your claim that John of Middlesex was married before Elizabeth to a Mary there is absolutly no proof af any history of John of Middlesex recorded before purchase of 150 acre plantation from Henry Nicholls in 1693.(Deed book 1a-pp588,591 Middlesex County Virginia.) Both John Jr to Elizabeth Montague and John Sr to Mary Murray marriages recorded Christ Church Parish Register p 116..Yurechko edition. If you are refering to the Hungar Parish bapt.28, April 1661) there has never been any proof of a connection between the Hungar Parish Paces with the Middlesex Paces. Jack Pace/ Wmsburg Va. Found the data on Elizabeth: Christenings Christ Church Parish Registers Middlesex Co. Virginia SARAH d/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace bap 22 Apr 1694 JOSEPH Sr. b. 1698 MARG't d/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace b. 15 Mar 1701/2 MARY d/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace bap 23 Jul 1704 JANE d/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace bap 22 Sep 1706 NEWSOME s/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace bap 06 Feb 1708 GEORGE s/o JOHN & Elizabeth Pace b.08 Jan 1715 Bap16 Jan. So I don't see why Elizabeth is in doubt. Roy Johnson
I think the Elizabeth is documented but I do not have that in front of me at present; someone else probably does. But the Newsome part is very iffy; it comes from the fact that John had a son (way down the line, not one of the first) named Newsome Pace. There are a lot of reasons to name a son Newsome other than the mother's maiden name. This s the sole circumstantial evidence and it is so weak as to be nearly nonexistent as far as I am concerned. Roy Johnson
Perhaps Elizabeth wasn't in doubt. Looking again at the donor page, I think I misinterpreted the question marks. I thought there was a question mark after Elizabeth and a question mark after Newsome, but perhaps the two question marks are bracketing the Newsome. Apologies. James --- royj@webster.edu wrote: > ... I don't see why Elizabeth is in doubt. > > Roy Johnson __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
That must be exasperating for your friend. Thank you for the correction. It shall be heeded. James James __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
No, Elizabeth's maiden name is not UNK. While I do understand you are using it to mean "unknown," UNK is a surname. One of my friends growing up was surnamed UNK. With the advent of the internet, her family size has increased greatly with the number of "UNK"-surnamed entries now filling databases. Rebecca James Blair <jnb05042000@yahoo.com> wrote: Thanks for the reply. V. helpful. So now we have "John Pace m. Elizabeth UNK". Proven by the parish records that she was Elizabeth, but her maiden name is unknown. James
Thanks for the reply. V. helpful. So now we have "John Pace m. Elizabeth UNK". Proven by the parish records that she was Elizabeth, but her maiden name is unknown. James James __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
MR. OR Cousin Allen Scott Monroe 10404 Dedham Court Austin, TX. 78739 I note that you Have posted at; Family Search - Individual Record. Daniel Johnson BIRTH: 1674 Va. Marriage; Agnes Unknown Then there is posted; William Johnson B; abt 1700 Middlesex County Va. Father; Daniel Johnson Mother; AGNES, UK Married: Margaret Pace B.- 1701 Middlesex Co Va. Father; John Pace Mother; Elizabeth Newsome Then Stephen Johnson B. 1740 Married; Susannah Pace- 1/OCT/1765 Goochland County Va. Father; John Pace Mother: Susannah Houchens Then Stephen Johnson Born ABT 1773 Place; Amherst County Va. Father; Stephen Johnson Mother; Susannah Pace Married: Elizabeth Perry: CHILD #-8 George Rodney Johnson Born in Nelson County Va 22/Jan/1819 Died 1/MAR/1913 M. Nancy Ellen Mitchell 20/OCT/1856 Nelson County Va Then; Sallie lee Johnson B. Mar/14/1860 Nelson County Va. You have married George W. Wilmer, Which was HER 2nd Marriage, Sallie L Johnson 1st Marriage was to John J. Wilmer their Children were; Virdie Wilmer M. Ed Sale With 8 Children Ora Lee Wilmer Born 1879 Married Tom Josh Campbell in 1899 3 Sons 1 Daughter Myra Campbell, Myra Campbell was MY Mother George W. Wilmer was a Double 1st Cousin to John J. Wilmer. COUSIN Allen Scott Monroe PLEASE CONTACT; A T POWELL AT, atpowelljr@aol.com> THANKS.
Several of the donor lineages on the PACE DNA site mention as ancestor John Pace d. 1720 in Middlesex County VA,and wife Elizabeth Newsome (with question marks after both "Elizabeth" and "Newsome"). From this it seems that the name of the wife of John Pace is not known, but some think that she might have been a Newsome, and some think that she might have been christened Elizabeth. I would be interested to know what leads to these conclusions. I assume from the question marks that there is no primary evidence, but what is the circumstantial evidence which might point to the wife being a Newsome, and/or an Elizabeth? The will of John Pace d. 1720 mentions a son named "Newsome". Is this the only reason people think his wife might have been a Newsome? Is there anything else? Thanks for any help. James Blair __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com