Around 1900, men baptized Jacob began to use the name James instead of Jacob. This is not universal, but it is very confusing. Marilyn Kline Washington -----Original Message----- From: Baker, Perry L <Perry.Baker@delta.com> To: Mary MacLeod <crwsggd@sonic.net> Cc: PA List <pacambri@rootsweb.com> Sent: Fri, Jul 26, 2013 12:08 pm Subject: Re: [PACAMBRI] Riffle research help! First - thank you so much for all the great information. I'm traveling today but let me share some thoughts and possibly reply later with more details. I have a copy of the marriage record for James D. McMullen and Sarah Nagle. It was obtained by my uncle on the 70s who was a Brother in the Catholic Church and it was transcribed and signed by a priest. We were always perplexed by the fathers name as James. We always assumed it was an error or that his father was Hugh James. I searched for other candidates who could have been James D. father named James who had a wife Catherine who had a son James circa 1834-1836. No matches have been found. Further James D. is closely tied the census family linking his sister Margaret and Elias Barnicle through both the 1890 Hugh obit and the 50th wedding anniversary announcement or the wedding witnesses. These all seemed very tight. I also have his Civil War pension records. Unfortunately no clues on his parents from those just the statement that he was born in Huntingdon County. I have to go back and read them again but I recall his birthdate even varies on those documents which frustrated me because I wanted to nail that down as his christening record shows 1835 the math on the 1850 census yields 1834 and his tombstone shows 1836. Unless another Father named James can be found to match just have to continue to believe the marriage record was not correct. And it only gets tougher after James D. My uncle always assumed the Logan connection but I noticed before his death he began to change the dates to reflect the 1890 death. I agree with your assessment that the 1890 Hugh is not the Hugh if Susan Logan and Sam McMullen. The 1890 Hugh was living next to Matthew and James McMullen on the 1850 census. Matthew and James were the sons of James McMullen and Ann Donoughe. Terry Kruise listed their children and I have not validated those documents but he listed the Hugh who died in 1890 as the son of James McMullen and Ann Donoughe and that lined up well based on the three brothers living next to one another. This is where we linked Hames D. To Hugh to James that married Ann Donoughe. The Souvenir of Loretto is where I think it gets mangled. I also have begun to wonder if Susan Jane was from one of the Hugh's. Susan possibly coming from Sysan Logan and Jane possibly coming from Jane Riffle (Marriner). No proof. I also wonder if Catherine was a Riffle. But I still think she may be. And my link would be to an unnamed female Riffle baptism record from Bedford County. That Riffle family is related to the other Riffle family. And I would not be surprised if all of the McMullens are not linked some how also. My plane is about to take off. More to come on this. Thanks for working with me on this puzzle. Perry Sent from my iPhone On Jul 26, 2013, at 2:49 AM, "Mary MacLeod" <crwsggd@sonic.net<mailto:crwsggd@sonic.net>> wrote: Perry, My grandfather's sister, Josephine (Dunlap) Noel, had two sons who married McMullen daughters of Marcellus McMullen, son of James and Sarah Nagle. I had James as the son of Hugh and Catherine and Hugh as the son of Samuel and Susan. I've been reviewing records I had and looking at records I hadn't previously collected and following the information that you and Linda and Donna have offered. What a gordian knot! It certainly appears that the Hugh married to Catherine is not the son of Samuel. In my review of records, I noticed the following and thought I should send it along to you since you do not have the CVR volumes. I know this will only add to the confusion. CATHOLIC VITAL RECORDS OF CENTRAL PENNSYLVANIA, by Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. III, page 255, record #5548: MC MULLEN, Jacobus (Jacobus/Cath. Riese, natives of Blair Co., PA) m. 08-25-1857 STB Sarah Anna NAGLE (Joannes/Birgitta Barnacle, natives of Chest Twp.) wi: Elias Barnacle/Margaretha McMullen (St. Benedict, Carrolltown, PA) CEN It's not like the priests never made mistakes in the records. The marriage record for my Dunlap great-grandparents has the bride's given name listed incorrectly. Maybe Fr. Englebrecht wrote James when he meant Hugh because the groom's name was James? Maybe he wrote Riese when it should have been Riffle? But I'm beginning to think that we need to consider that the Catherine married to Hugh may not have been a Riffle. Or that the James married to Sarah Nagle was not the son of Hugh and Catherine. Or both? Here are marriage records for the rest of the Hugh/Catherine children. Obviously Rosanna is the daughter of Hugh and Catherine and I think the Catherine Mary is their youngest, baptized Mary Catherine. Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania, Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. IV, page 235, record #5058: BARNIKLE, Joannem (Michaelis/Margarethae McKenny), aged 36 m. 06-07 1863 Rosa Anna Mc MULLEN (Hugh/Cath. "McMullen"), aged 30 wi: William Wertz/Sara Anna Noal PAE St. Benedict, Carrolltown, Pa. Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania, Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. V, page 206, record #4725: FEICHT, Georgium m. 10-29-1867 Catharinam Mariam MC MULLEN wi: Joannes Feicht/Helena McMullen "& others" EJB St. Augustine, St. Augustine, Pa. Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania, Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. V, page 205, record #4693: MC MULLEN, Carolus V. m. 10-15-1863 Catharina CONRAD wi: Henricus C. Hanigan/Maria C. McMullen JBS St. Augustine, St. Augustine, Pa. Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania, Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. III, page 360, record #7922: BARNACLE, Elias m. 11-24-1857 Marguerita Cecelia MC MULLEN wi: Joannes McKinzie/Rose Anna McMullen JBS St. Augustine, St. Augustine, Pa. Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania, Rev. A. Ledoux, Vol. III, page 360, record #7910: SWINHART, Jacobus m. 11-25-1856 Martha Johanna MC MULLEN wi: Jacobus McMullen/Maria J. McConnell JBS St. Augustine, St. Augustine, Pa. I could not find marriage records for Susan Jane, Matthew, or Francis J. It is beginning to look to me like Susan Jane McMullen born 10 Aug 1839, with Jacob Riffle as godfather may not be the child of Hugh and Catherine. Hugh and Catherine's daughter Margaret was born only 7 months after Susan. Susan Jane's mother is recorded as Mary rather than Catherine, and with the Riffle godfather she is more likely the daughter of the Hugh and Mary who are in Blair county in 1850 and in Loretto in 1860. If this is so, the Hugh in Tell, Huntingdon in 1840 may not be the same fellow married to Mary. Not sure of any of this. Also notice that the Hugh McMullen and wife Mary living in Loretto in 1860 have one of the Humphries children in their household, so this Mary McMullen may be a Riffle child of John and Jane Mariner Riffle. Her age places her neatly between Nancy and James, no guarantee, but a possibility. I think the Hugh McMullen who died in 1864 is the one married to Mary, but I don't think he is the son of Samuel and Susan McMullen. Last night I found a will for Samuel's daughter, Margaret, the one charged in Samuel's will with taking care of brother John. The will can be accessed at family search under PA Probate records, Cambria County, Wills 1808-1883, vols. 1-3, image 675. The will was written by Margaret on 1 June 1871. She died 6 Aug 1880. The will leaves bequests " share and share alike" to the following relatives: Hugh McMullen, Alexander McMullen, Mary Kelly, Jane Mc Dermitt, Rebecca McMullen, widow of James, and Margaret Morris, wife of Cornelius. She appoints Cornelius Morris as her executor and as trustee for the arrangements made for her brother John. She also gives her household goods, her cow and sheep, and her interest in a lot of ground in Chest Springs that she and Margaret Morris purchased jointly to Margaret Morris. Brother John is to live and be cared for by Cornelius and Margaret Morris with the funds designated for him by Margaret McMullen. The share designated for her brother Hugh is to be invested by the executor and paid to him annually during his lifetime. So clearly Margaret's brother Hugh is still alive in June of 1871 while it appears that Mary's husband Hugh has been interred at St. Michael's in 1864. I have not been able to turn up Hugh, son of Samuel in any census but the 1880 and I almost missed this one: 1880 United States Federal Census Home in 1880: Allegheny, Cambria, Pennsylvania Household Members: Edward Little, 46, HOH, m, Carpenter, PA PA PA Jane R. Little, 41, wife, m, Keeping House, PA PA PA Mary E. Little, 12, dau, s, at home, PA PA PA Motilda Little, 10, dau, s, at home, PA PA PA Lawranse Little, 7, son, s, PA PA PA Joseph Little, 5, son, s, PA PA PA Margharet Little, 1, dau, s, PA PA PA Hew Mc Mullin, 77, Boarder, wd, retired Farmer, PA IRE PA Source Citation: Year: 1880; Census Place: Allegheny, Cambria, Pennsylvania; Roll: 1111; Family History Film: 1255111; Page: 383D; Enumeration District: 202; Image: 0055. It must be Samuel's son Hugh who died 21 Jan 1887 and is buried at Loretto, while James' son Hugh died in 1890 and is buried at St. Augustine. So far I haven't figured out who the parents of Hugh married to Mary, possibly the daughter of John Riffle, might be. No marriage records in CVR for any of the Hughs McMullen. I'm still chasing after some other bits, but I think I'll add this chunk to the discussion now. I look forward to all thoughts on this tangle... Mary MacLeod California (with Cambria County roots) On 7/23/2013 11:59 AM, Baker, Perry L wrote: Well Donna, that's a little bit of a troubling find because I've spent a lot of time eliminating the Riffle connection to that Hugh. I wish I could answer this quickly but I think it's better to arm you all with the facts as I know them. There were three Hugh McMullens living in the area with birthdates within 5 years of one another. One was the son of Samuel McMullen and Susan Logan. Another was the son of James McMullen and Ann Donoughe. I do have two of the Hugh's Obits. They have all been intermixed by researchers and there has been a lot of confusion. The first census report you show below from 1860 in Clearfield TWP is for the Hugh McMullen - born 1803 died 1890. CAMBRIA FREEMAN EBENSBURG, PA 7 Feb 1890 Hugh McMullen died at the home of his son-in-law Elias Barnicle, in Clearfield township, on Monday last, aged eighty-seven years and one month. Mr. McMullen was born on the third day of February, 1803, it being the third day of the week, the third day of the month, and the third year in the century. Elias Barnicle married Hugh and Catherine's daughter Margaret. Elias and Margaret were witnesses for the wedding of James (son of Hugh and Catherine) and his wife Sarah Nagle. The facts and Sources: >From the Souvenir of Loretto centenary: McMullen Hugh and Mary Catherine Riffel; James, Lucy, Susan Jane 1835-1839. Census records: 1850 census Cambria co Cleafield twp PA #3/3 Hugh McMullin 45 farmer Catherine 38 Rosana 20 Martha I. 18 James 16 Lucy 14 Margaret 10 Matthew I. 8 Francis L. 7 Charles V. 5 Mary C. 2 1860 census Cambria co Clearfield twp PA #1949/1959 Hugh McMullin 57 Catherine 49 Charles 14 Catherine 12 1880 census Cambria co Clearfield twp PA #10/10 Hugh McMullin 77 Catherine 69 >From researcher Terry Kruise who chronicled the St. Augsutine Cemetery: Mary "Catharine" (Riffle) McMullen, born about 1812, married Hugh McMullen. She died on 15 Jun 1883 at age 71 years, and was buried on 18 Jun 1883 at St. Augustine Cemetery in St. Augustine, Cambria County, PA. Hugh was born on 3 Mar 1803 and died 3 Feb 1890 at age 87. He was buried at St. Augustine on 5 Feb 1890. They do have tombstones there at St. Augustine, but they are a bit worn. Hugh is the son of James & Ann (Donoughue) McMullen >From Catholic Vital Records of Central Pennsylvania" ( Albert H. Ledoux, 1996). These were sent to me by another researcher I don’t have a copy of the books. James: Ledoux CVR, Vol. I, p. 131, #2786 McMullan, Jacobus (Hugonis/Catharinae) b. 07-04-1835 BP. 11-10-1837 gp: Joannes Fels/Maria Teresia Fels DAG [St. Michael's] Lucy: Ledoux CVR, Vol. I, p. 131, #02787 McMullen, Lucia (Hugonis/Catharinae) b. 04-04-1837 BP. 11-10-1837 gp: Joannes Fels/Maria Teresia Fels DAG. Susan Jane: Ledoux CVR, Vol. I, p. 141, #02995 McMullan, Susanna Joanna (Hugonis/Mariae) b. 08-10 BP. 8-20-1839 gp: Jacobus Riffle/Maria Riffle DAG. Matthew J.: Ledoux CVR, Vol. II, p. 11, #0193 McMullan, Matthaeus (Hugonis/Catharinae) b. 12-26-1841 BP. 04-02-1842 gp: Rev. P.H. Lemke/Maria Dearmitt PHL. Ledoux CVR, Vol. II, p. 201, #4955 McMullen, Matthaeus (Hugonis/Catharinae) b. 12-26-1841 BP. 04-02-1842 gp: Rev. P.H. Lemke/Maria Dearmitt PHL. Charles Vincent: Ledoux CVR, Vol. II, p. 41, #1059 McMullen, Charles Vincent (Hugh/Mary Catherine Riffle) b. 07-23-1846 HPG. The first child listed above is James D. McMullen who married Sarah Nagle (marriage witnessed by Elias Barnicle and Margaret McMullen). Susan Jane is not found in later census reports so she may not have lived long. I have not yet obtained the records for Rosana or Martha listed on the 1850 census. As per the census Rosana was born in 1830 (I've seen other researches quote November 1830 but have not seen the christening record). All of the information up until this point validates that the Hugh that died in 1890 is not the son of Samuel McMullen and Susan Logan but the son of James McMullen and Ann Donoughe. Here is the census report for Hugh and Catherine for 1830. They were together in 1830. By 1840 this Hugh and Catherine had relocated to Clearfield and lived next to his brothers Matthew and James McMullen. Name: Hugh Mc Mullen [Hugh McMullen] Home in 1830 (City, County, State): Tell, Huntingdon, Pennsylvania Free White Persons - Males - 20 thru 29: 1 Free White Persons - Females - 15 thru 19: 1 Free White Persons - Under 20: 1 Free White Persons - 20 thru 49: 1 Total Free White Persons: 2 Total - All Persons (Free White, Slaves, Free Colored): 2 This obviously means that they met by 1830. In 1830 John the Hatter was still in Northumberland PA and can be found there on the census reports. The history account states that he does not arrive to Cambria County until 1832. John did have 2 female children under 10 on the 1820 report, but I do not have birth documents for them at this time. As for the other two Hugh's - here is the obit for one of them: FROZEN TO DEATH - Hugh McMullen, a blacksmith by trade, was frozen to death, on Wednesday night, 13th inst., on the road leading from Altoona to Wapsononock, near the latter place. Democratic Standard, Hollidaysburg, Pa., Wednesday, January 27, 1864 The other one died in 1887. Both of these Hugh's who died in 1864 and 1887 are buried in St. Michaels in Loretto. The on-line record indicates that one of them was married to Mary Catherine Riffle. I'm not sure where that came from. The only documented information I know of for the Riffle name connection on Mary Catherine Riffle is from the Souvenir of Loretto records. Also from another researcher - -- IN -- ST. MICHAEL'S PARISH, LORETTO, PA., >From November 17, 1793, to October 10, 1899 M'MULLEN, Hugh (of Samuel) 1801 Jun. 21, 1887 So one of these two other Hugh's is the son of Samuel. Could he have married a Riffle too? Possible but an odd coincidence to say the least. Or did My Hugh McMullen marry a different Mary Catherine (not a Riffle)? That would mean the Loretto books are not correct. I know that's a lot. I'll let you digest all that and look forward to your reply. Thanks, Perry -----Original Message----- From: bdjlk@roadrunner.com<mailto:bdjlk@roadrunner.com> [mailto:bdjlk@roadrunner.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 1:47 PM To: Baker, Perry L; JCTripp; pjohn685@comcast.net<mailto:pjohn685@comcast.net>; Cambria Co. PACAMBRIA; michael.mertle@comcast.net<mailto:michael.mertle@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [PACAMBRI] Riffle research help! I found the one connection to the John the Hatter Riffel were that these two children had Jacob Riffle as a baptismal sponsor: CVR Volume II, Baptisms of St. Augustine, St. Augustine, Pa., p. 259: 6230 LITZINGER, Jacobum Montgomery (Daniele / Lydia Joanna Riffle) b. 09-08 bp. 09-23-1849 gp: Jacobo M. Riffle / Maria Dodson JAG CVR Volume I, Baptisms of St. Michael, Loretto, Pa. p. 141: 02995 MC MULLAN, Susanna Joanna (Hugonis / Mariae) b. 08-10 bp. 08-20-1839 gp: Jacobus Riffle / Maria Riffle DAG I'm assuming this Jacob Riffle to be the owner of the Mansion House Hotel in Summitville in this obituary: Cambria Freeman, Ebensburg, Pa., October 14, 1871, p. 3. Obituary. RIFFLE - Died, at Summitville, on Saturday last, after a short illness, Mr. JAMES M. RIFFLE; aged about 52 years. Mr. Riffle came from Maryland to this county with his parents when he was quite young, and for the last thirty-five years he was a resident of Summitville. In his early life he was engaged for a long time in the mercantile business, but eventually purchased the old and well known "Mansion House" hotel, of which he was proprietor for many years prior to his death. He was well and favorably known throughout the county, and indeed throughout the State, and by his kind and genial nature and social disposition won hosts of true friends, who will learn with exceeding regret of his decease in the vigor and fullness of life. May he rest in peace eternal. As Jane mentioned, he can be found on the 1860 Census in Summitville with his wife and a child of John and Margaret (Riffle) Humphries, John W. Humphries. His mother Jane is a widow, living next door, with his brother-in-law John Humphries and another nephew. Here is the clincher and the big question mark. Assuming Hugh McMullen and Mary Catherine Riffel was this child's baptismal sponsors: CVR Volume II, Baptisms of St. Aloysius Gonzaga, Summit, Pa., p. 194: 4781 HUMPHREYS, Jacobum Riffle (Joanne / Margarita Riffle) b. 04-08 bp. 04-21-1849 gp: Hugo McMullen / Maria McMullen PD Why is John Humphries living with another Hugh and Maria McMullen on the 1860 Census in Loretto, while Hugh McMullen and Catherine are living in Clearfield township? Two Hugh McMullens married Riffles? 1860 Census Clearfield Twp., Cambria Hugh McMullin 57 Laborer 250 Pa Catharine (Riffel) McMullin 49 Pa Charles McMullin 14 Pa Catharine McMullin 12 Pa 1860 Census Loretto Borough, Cambria Hugh McMullen 55 Laborer 300 Pa Mary McMullen 45 Pa James Humphries 10 Pa Anyone know who Maria or Mary McMullen wife of the second Hugh is? or who the second Hugh is? Donna Noel Julian - - - - - - - - - - Search for more Cambria County information on our webpage: http://www.camgenpa.com/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PACAMBRI-request@rootsweb.com<mailto:PACAMBRI-request@rootsweb.com> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message - - - - - - - - - - Search for more Cambria County information on our webpage: http://www.camgenpa.com/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PACAMBRI-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message