Sandra, Thank you, again, for looking up the Wills and passenger lists, etc. Any "normal" person who might read these last several exchanges might conclude my search for Philip Carrel may be futile, and not worth pursuing further. It is possible that NO records still exist in PA for this family. I don't believe it. They are still hidden in some courthouse attic or church basement awaiting discovery. Like the "Energizer Bunny" I never quit. So much has not been transcribed or scanned yet. One example: In the Jefferson Co. OH deed books there is no record of Philip Carrel ever owning, paying taxes, or appearing on any documents related to land ownership. YET, in 2001, during a personal visit to the courthouse, aunt Joann Carroll was making Xerox copies of other Carroll deeds from the books. Several months later, back in Michigan, she discovered quite by accident she had made a copy of a page containing the name Philip Carrel on the bottom three lines. A partial record of some land transfer. She sent for a copy of the next page, and there was a complete record of a sale of some land by Philip Carrel and his wife Mary to another gentleman, dated May 1812. That entry still remains un-indexed, and except by a great good fortune, we never would have found it. It confirmed that our man was indeed in that county at that time. So I don't trust CDs or Indexes as being complete. That was a great lesson for me, and it should be for any serious genealogist. There is always more to be found. Cheers, Eric Olson cc: Old Chester List > [Original Message] > From: Sandra Ferguson <ferg@ntelos.net> > To: <ericbear01@earthlink.net> > Date: 9/8/2006 4:20:23 PM > Subject: * RE: CARLE / CARREL > > My point with the wills was that the name Philip Carrel, any spelling does > not appear in ANY will...that means, in the will of anyone.....for example, > the will of a parent. > Good luck with the church records...... always iffy at best, when you > think of all the little churches there once were, that no longer are extant! > > S. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eric Olson" <ericbear01@earthlink.net> > To: "Sandra Ferguson" <ferg@ntelos.net> > Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 7:10 PM > Subject: *** SPAM *** RE: CARLE / CARREL > > > > Yes, > > > > Sandra, I did receive a welcoming email from you, so that is working. > > Thank you. > > > > I did my best to write a coherent query, and included some birth > > information I did not have last year when I last visited. Of course I am > > also searching in other S. E. PA Counties for Carle / Carrel records. In > > fact I have just gone through the PA Land Warrants and Patents lists > > online, Record Group 17, and find some Carrels of various spellings, as > > first and second land owners, but still none that connects with my Philip > > Carrel. > > > > As I said, Philip Carrel died intestate, so no Will is expected to show > > up. > > However Philip's father, probably a form of John, may have left one. > > > > That about leaves the church records.... No always easily accessible > > online. > > > > Cheers, > > Eric Olson > > Seattle > > > >> [Original Message] > >> From: Sandra Ferguson <ferg@ntelos.net> > >> To: <ericbear01@earthlink.net>; <pa-old-chester@rootsweb.com> > >> Date: 9/8/2006 2:24:56 PM > >> Subject: CARLE / CARREL > >> > >> As you know, I'm sure, births and deaths weren't required by law to > > be > >> officially recorded till much after this date, so your only hope of > > finding > >> this sort thing is probably a church record.......and, as you have no > > idea > >> where, in the commonwealth of Pa they lived, you have your work cut out > > for > >> you, I'm afraid. As children were born in Lanc and Cumberland Cos, those > >> might be better bets. .... > >> Have you checked the Chester Co Federal census of 1790.?.(as one > > child > >> was born not long after this, it's somewhere to consider) ..the Chester > >> census is online and the URLs for that census are located on the Chester > >> County site mentioned in your Welcome Email, under census ( you did get > > your > >> Welcome Email, didn't you? I sent it to you personally, as we're > > undergoing > >> some technical changes at rootsweb and the software has to be > >> reprogrammed.....however, as you never let me know it arrived, I have no > > way > >> of knowing if you received it or not....if not, let me know and I'll > >> resend...it has a lot of helpful info). > >> I can tell you that no one named Philip Carle/Carrel, any spelling, is > >> mentioned in any area wills...including, Bucks, Berks, Phil, Lanc, > > Chester, > >> Del and Cumberland Cos....up to around 1840......nor is the name > > mentioned > >> in THE HISTORY OF CHESTER COUNTY PA, by Futhey and Cope.... > >> The 1765 Chester Archives list a Josh Carle who owned 150 acres in > >> Pikeland twp...nothing listed under other spellings. > >> I looked athe name up on the CD of emigrants to PA and found them > > aboard > >> the ship Patience...however, the names were spelled John Caspar Carrel 18 > >> yoa and Jacob Carrel, 40 yoa....ditto spelling on the Oath of Allegiance > >> and the listing in the book Pennsylvania German Pioneers Vol I. > >> > > Sandra > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>