I've forgotten which is the X and which is the Y - but - this much I DO remember. Males are either XX or YY (only because I don't remember which is which), and women are both, X and Y, XY. Or vice versa, males are YY and women are still XY. Women can pass on EITHER the X or the Y. Males can ONLY pass on the one 'cause that is all they've got and what makes them male.

Does anyone have online access, or an electronic copy, of the following article, William Penn and the Selling of Pennsylvania? Thanks, Kim http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0003 -049X%2819831014%29127%3A5%3C322%3AWPATSO%3E2.0.CO%3B2-6&size=LARGE William Penn and the Selling of Pennsylvania, 1681-1685 Richard S. Dunn Proceedings of the American Philosophical Society, Vol. 127, No. 5 (Oct. 14, 1983), pp. 322-329

Just for info, in looking for info on Aaron Eavenson, I clicked on http://books.google.com and entered Aaron Eavenson in the search box. Up came a full copy of the book "PA Archives, 5th series, Vol. 5, edited by Thomas Lynch Montgomery", printed 1906, and on page 798 under the 5th Co. Thornbury, Capt. Hugh Reed, (Rev. War) was Aaron Eavenson. On this site one can view either the full texts of many old books or see references to names in many others. Chandler Eavenson Sautee-Nacoochee, GA

Hi folks, I don't know if this date is too late for this list but I'll give it a try. Could someone please tell me where to look for a 1884 death record that took place in the city of Chester. Janet/Janette Strachan was buried 24 April 1884 in Chester Rural cemetery but they have nothing but her burial date. The family were Presbyterian. I want the death record in hopes of finding the names of her parents and where she was born in Scotland. Thank you, Janet

Dear listers, Can anyone on the list tell me where to find death, interment or gravestone information for persons buried in the Wilmington (DE) Friends Burying Ground? I am interested in persons surnamed DEAN who were Quakers and died at Wilmington between 1749 and 1758. According to the book "Collection of Memorials Concerning Divers deceased Ministers and others of the People Called Quakers," Lydia (Gilpin) Dean "departed this life the 2d of the tenth month 1750, and was interred in friends Burying-ground at Wilmington ..." Several of her children died in the year preceding her death. Her husband, William Dean, died in 1758 at Wilmington. It is the names of the children who died that I really want. I have looked at the FHL microfilm #006321, "Lists of births 1707-1851, marriages 1733-1917 and deaths 1736-1872 from the records of Wilmington Friends meeting." Not there. Thanks, Larry Dean Vancouver, WA, USA www.wa-net.com/~ladean/

DNA is certainly no fake and I'm sure it will revolutionize the genealogical research of tomorrow. However, I think we've said enough about it, and suggest that anyone who is curious should do some research on the subject....google searches will turn up all you want to know. This is not really the place to try to explain a very complex subject...anything you'd want to know is on the internet, for you to find and read for yourself. Sandra " My question to all the Y and X DNA is how and where can they get DNA from ancestors that died in 1700's and 1800's and how reliable is it? Is it like the "fake" coat of arms that was popular a few years ago? " -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: 10/24/2006

----- Original Message ----- "Sandra Ferguson" wrote > Have you checked the York Co Original Pa Land Records, by Neal Otto > Hively? He publishes them under townships, and includes data other than > just land records Sandra, That resource could be of interest to me. Is it online/ a book/ ? How do I access it? Larry Dean Vancouver, WA, USA www.wa-net.com/~ladean/

In my last email I messed up. I meant to say I DIDN'T think DNA was fake. But I also didn't proofread it before sending. Please do not think I don't approve of DNA testing. Again thanks to everyone for their replies, it really helps. I will keep this option on the back burner to break down some brick walls. I only wish I had a male family member I could have tested. Iris

I suggest you visit the 'new and improved' site for Records and Archives, that our fellow list member called to our attention last week........ to check what they offer. http://dsf.chesco.org/archives/cwp/view.asp?a=3&Q=609990 This is a wonderful resource for those of us out of area...so, bookmark it for future use. They do have marriage records for the period you're interested in (1852-1855), but nothing for the folks you mention. Therefore, you'll have to hope for church records. Sandra I can't figure out the subject of this post....Barr? It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the content..or, if it does, it's beyond me. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: 10/24/2006

I certainly did mean that DNA is fake. I completely and wholeheartedly support DNA research, results and evidence. All I meant was I didn't see how it could be collected that far back. But through this fabulous website I now understand. Thanks to everyone that has contributed to enlightening us. Iris

Is there anyone who can look up a marriage certificate in West Chester for------- John Patterson Massey and Margarita Kirkpatrick------January 20,1853--- Paying for this research is not a problem-------- I need the name of Johns parents-------- Mark Massey

> > Dear Iris, > > The answer is that they don't use old DNA.. They use DNA from a living person, usually with a cheek swab which is then mailed to the laboratory for analysis.. > > Eric > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Iris Harris <iris-harris@sbcglobal.net> > > To: <pa-old-chester@rootsweb.com> > > Date: 10/25/2006 8:47:31 AM > > Subject: [PaOldC] DNA > > > > My question to all the Y and X DNA is how and where > > can they get DNA from ancestors that died in 1700's > > and 1800's and how reliable is it? > > Is it like the "fake" coat of arms that was popular > > a few years ago? > > Iris > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to PA-OLD-CHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

My question to all the Y and X DNA is how and where can they get DNA from ancestors that died in 1700's and 1800's and how reliable is it? Is it like the "fake" coat of arms that was popular a few years ago? Iris

My own Smiths were in York County, and arrived in the 1750s....they came with a lot of others in their Seceder Church congregation....and, I found lots of other Scots who arrived in the same timeframe. Thus, it's very possible that when you say "they must have come from some county previous to 1753", they well may have been original emigrants rather than someone from elsewhere in the New World...so, they may not BE in any earlier colonial records. Have you checked the York Co Original Pa Land Records, by Neal Otto Hively? He publishes them under townships, and includes data other than just land records......in the one for Hopewell I found 'MY' Smiths. I traced my Smith line by forming a theory that 2 of the sons were named for real men, namesakes of 2 of the Smith 'boys'...Andrew Finley Smith and Alexander Douglas Smith....I looked for Andrew Finley and Alexander Douglas, and eventually found them in the same congregation with the Smiths...in York Co. With Smiths, you need to really think outside the box, when researching for them! You say, in your email, "thank so much to all of you who have answered my request on how to locate a William Smith in the early 1700's".....as none of these suggestions went to the list, would you mind posting them? We all are interested in new ways to trace our family members. Sandra -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: 10/24/2006

#318 PHEBE WHITE (Phebe,George,Thomas,George),b.2-11-1785,in Frederick Co.,Va.,;d.Bedford Co.,Pa.,8-24-1822;m.3-9-1811,at Lower Ridge Meeting, Va.,Thomas Smith,of St.Clair Twp.,Bedford Co.,b.Adams Co.,Pa.,10-11-1781 d.Bedford Co.,12-22-1846;son of James Smith and Mary Jones (m.10-12-1762 at York Pa.)of Bedford Co. Issue: 1117 Jane,b.1-5-1814;d.11-15-1895;m.Jeremiah Gordon. 1118 Nathan,b.12-12-1815;d.5-18-1891;m.Edith Griest. 1119 Samuel,b.9-13-1817;m.Eliza Margaret Cleaver. 1120 Abel W,b.9-29-1819;d.?;m.Sarah McCreary. 1121 Ruth,b.7-29-1822;d.3-11-1891;m.John M Blackburn. Thomas Smith m.12-22-1825,a 2nd wife,Leah Walker,b.4-5-1782,in York Co.; dau.of Abel Walker and Ann Vale,of Warrington Twp.No issue. Lew Smedley Visit the George Smedley Home Pages at: http://smedley.lewis.home.att.net and http://smedley.george.home.att.net

Thank so much to all of you who have answered my request on how to locate a William Smith in the early 1700's. The first proof I have of my Smith family is a John Smith, who bought land in York County, Huntington and Tyrome Townships, in October of 1753. He had bought the land of 50, acres from a George Smith and a George Branson. A William Smith bought land next to him, it was about 200 acres. The probate of William Smith, who died in 1777, names his widow Elizabeth and children, James, George, William, and Elinor. The will of John Smith, who died in 1784, names his wife Margaret, children, George, John, Eleanor, Elizabeth and Hugh. I believe the two, John and William are related, possibly brothers, and George may be another brother, father, or uncle. They lived in an area next to the Pine Hills in Huntington Township. James Smith, son of William, married {his cousin?} Elizabeth Smith, they lived on the John Smith land and some of the William Smith land. They called the area Smithfield. Now, my reasoning as to searching for a William Smith. A William Smith took a licensure of 100 acres just west of the Susquehanna in 1734. Could this have been the father of John and/or William, above, or could it have been the William, named above. Where does George fit into this family? There was a Ephraim Smith in Sadsbury, whowas probably related to the above Smith families, as the name of Ephraim has been passed down through the Smith family until the mid-1800's. I do have land plots of the Smith land in Huntington township, but they must have come from some county previously to 1753. So, I am wondering where to locate a William, or George Smith, previous to that date. Thank you again. I would like opinions on how to find/ sort out these above Smith family members. Judy Smith/Colorado

> We could test X DNA to find something about a person's parent, but if > we test X DNA of a female, we would not know if that X DNA had come > from her mother or from her father. If the xDNA came from her father, he got it from his own mother, right? So if you test xDNA in a woman, it's from either her mother or her paternal grandmother -- 2 possible families of origin. Next generation back, 4 possible families. Etc. Is that correct? JRB

If I understand this correctly, testing xDNA would always connect you to one of the maternal lines, which would be doubling in number for each generation you go backwards. A single individual today wouldn't have a very big chance of proving he/she was descended from Anna Margaretha So-and-so in the 1740s, but if a large number of us who THINK we descend from her all had our xDNA tested, and a few of us showed up with the same DNA pattern, we few could compare our ancestry and see whether the overlap came from Anna Margaretha So-and-so or from another shared female ancestor. Computers, bless them... You remember a few years ago in England, archaeologists compared DNA from a 10,000-year-old female skeleton found Cornwall, to DNA swabbed from inside the cheeks of local school children and their teacher. The (male) teacher was found to be a descendant of the woman whose skeleton had been excavated. JRB On Monday, October 23, 2006, at 10:20 PM, pa-old-chester-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > 2. Testing DNA from X chromosome of a male subject, of course, would > show DNA material which he could only have received from his mother. > He can prove who his mother was. But that's as far back as can be > ascertained, because DNA from his mother could have come from the X > chromosome she received from her mother, OR from the X chromosome she > received from her father [who got it from HIS mother]. ...

Oh How I wish you were right..on X STRs.... maternal lines is mtDNA differnt part of DNA... I posted this same concept to the DNA mailing list almost a year ago... My answers were that the DNA in the older generations degades and thus is not readable...or something to that effect.. Probably correct, but I don't want to believe it.. Personally I believe the answer is out there in the junk dna somewhere... and feel that in another 2 - 5 years there will be answers to those questions.. Why would the X STRs degrade faster then the Y STRs ?? WE do know that yDNA degrades faster the mtDNA.. mtDNA is what they use for studying the 3,000 year old bodies they find... normally in the roots of the teeth.... Oh well really feel free to join the DNA mailing lists all those smart people love to answer questions... Nelda's websites - http://freepages.folklore.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ yDNA tests for Hurst, Beatty, Gilpin, Graves; all direct male relatives _________________________________________________________________ Get today's hot entertainment gossip http://movies.msn.com/movies/hotgossip?icid=T002MSN03A07001

Hi Iris, Good list to discuss DNA studies is GENEALOGY-DNA@rootsweb.com... I think understanding what the Y DNA test is, is better.. First, DNA is a complex string sort of like a ladder that twists upon its self.. and curls.. now certain areas are tested these areas are nomally called markers these markers have names.. as in STRs.(Think its Short Tantum Returns).and other names..most not all markers used for yDNA testing are named DYS (A division of STRs) but since there are more then one of these DYS markers they also get numbers... So in a 37 marker yDNA test there are 37 places that are tested... They will not be number 1 - 37.... an example of a DYS marker "DYS464" Some markers will have more then one result (answer) to the test... DYS464 normally has 4 but is know to both be null (not there) and with as many as 8.. How testing DNA either mtDNA or yDNA can help in genealogy is that you compare the answers to the tests with other people's answers to their tests.. It can not prove who you are related to.... but it will prove if you are related... and most important it will prove who you are NOT related to... It can shorten the paper trail hunt when you find someone your related to via DNA you can know for sure you are related instead of waisting years hunting a connect that does not exhist.. Now to your statements Your" We test YDNA to establish who the father(s) were". ANSWER: False the yDNA is not used for testing paternity cases.. it is an entirly different test.. uses different parts of the dna. YDNA can only point to a common ancestor not a particular father... We could test X DNA to find something about a person's parent, but if we test X DNA of a female, we would not know if that X DNA had come from her mother or from her father. ANSWER: THe Father's DNA came from either his mother or his father's mother... needing an Aunt to test hopefully getting different results for the markers used for the X STR testings... so you know where the X came from... So we don't test X DNA. ANSWER/ Some work is being done with X- STR's but much harder then Y-STR testing...yDNA... We do test mitochondrial DNA, which is different material altogether. ANSWER: All material tested for the different tests is a differnt part of DNA... Remember as of right now there is one heck of a lot of dna that is still classified as junk DNA.. (To me this just means they haven't found a use for it yet or an explanation about what it does, remember we are on the cuttuing edge of DNA studies...) This DNA material is contained outside of the nuclei of our cells --in the cells themselves, but not within the cell nucleus. This material, mtDNA, supposedly comes only from the mother --although the suggested website does not state how that can be. (can someone explain that one??) TRy the GENEALOGY-DNA mailing list not only do newbies like me read the emails/ and answer some... but some of the actual PHD's answer questions and in layman terms so you understand too.... Nelda Nelda's websites - http://freepages.folklore.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ yDNA tests for Hurst, Beatty, Gilpin, Graves; all direct male relatives _________________________________________________________________ Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a free trip! http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline