I'm sorry that a simple request for a common courtesy offended this list member. Sandra has always managed the list with a wonderful degree of expertise and patience and helpfulness not found on other genealogical sites. We learn from her dedication and administrative talents, and if we need to be brought into line with a stronger rein, then, for the good of everyone participating, we need to respect her guidance. This list has had LOTS of activity which Sandra handled beautifully, sharing unselfishly her huge wealth of resources. It apparently took only one bad apple to change its character. Thanks, Sandra, and God bless. We miss your contributions and will look forward to your improved health and quick return in 2010. Frances -----Original Message----- From: ruby riley <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tue, Dec 15, 2009 12:18 pm Subject: [PaOldC] lack of activity I am new to this list. I posted a query and was told basically to google it. hen I got a personal e-mail from Sandra chastising me for not replying with a hank you for all the help. I resolved to send no more queries to this list. I nly write now to let you know why this list sees so little activity. True, his is probably the most highly organized list to which I have subscribed and ometimes has helpful information, but it is also the least friendly. ------------------------------ o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of he message

Ruby, we tell you to google it because we know (because we did it too *G*) that there is really good information out there on your query. So often it is better to let you learn to "fish" than to deposit material in your lap. It doesn't mean we don't care how you get along. Eliz On Tue, Dec 15, 2009 at 1:18 PM, ruby riley <[email protected]> wrote: > I am new to this list.  I posted a query and was told basically to google it.  Then I got a personal e-mail from Sandra chastising me for not replying with a thank you for all the help.  I resolved to send no more queries to this list.  I only write now to let you know why this list sees so little activity.  True, this is probably the most highly organized list to which I have subscribed and sometimes has helpful information, but it is also the least friendly. > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

As a list admin myself of several lists I can tell you that Sandra is one of the most knowledgeable, organized, and helpful list owners around. She runs this list like it is supposed to be run. Sandra is absolutely wonderful as both a genealogist and list admin. I have learned a lot about being a list admin and genealogy from her over the years on this list. Sandra is the person who drummed into my head, over and over - look for variants in surname spelling -think out of the box - and it worked. I jumped 100+ years back as soon as my brain connected the dots to the original surname (mis)spelling of my ancestors. All thanks to Sandra. I haven't been online much due to being the filling in the sandwich generation but I had noticed that the PAOldC list was slow - I thought everyone was too busy to post much. Thank you Tim for the wake up post - I for one needed it. When Sandra told you to Google - that was GREAT advice. Google is such a valuable underused genealogical tool by most family genealogists. Many people do find great online books, files, records that pertain to the genealogy you are searching for. One has to try different search parameters and try alternate spellings for their surnames, try using locations and names etc... The search engines caches are constantly changing as new records go online so using any search engine should be repeated again and again, monthly, weekly, daily - whatever one has time for because I guarantee you will find new info all the time. As a bonus some old info may fit into your genealogical puzzle that you were unaware of the last time you found that info. Again, Google or any other search engine for that fact are much to under utilized by new and experienced genealogists. You would probably be upset if you joined one of my surname/state lists because I require my posters to not only thank our list members who have spent time researching the poster's genealogical requests or offered help, but posters are required to sign their posts with either initials or given names. This helps keep all the inquiries going to the correct poster and the poster being made aware of who took time to help them. Anyone who doesn't like the way my lists are run may leave at any time. I have over 1600+ people on my largest state list and more joining every day because of how helpful, congenial, and content the list members are. Never any fire fights. >From your statement it is evident you haven't been on some of the other PA lists. There are several very unfriendly PA lists out there that hopefully you will not have the misfortune to join. I miss you Sandra, so feel better and take good care of yourself! I will be looking forward to posts from you in the Jan 2010. Warmest Regards, Carina Who has many, many, relatives living in early 1700 PA ----- Original Message ----- From: ruby riley<mailto:[email protected]> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 1:18 PM Subject: [PaOldC] lack of activity I am new to this list. I posted a query and was told basically to google it. Then I got a personal e-mail from Sandra chastising me for not replying with a thank you for all the help. I resolved to send no more queries to this list. I only write now to let you know why this list sees so little activity. True, this is probably the most highly organized list to which I have subscribed and sometimes has helpful information, but it is also the least friendly. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Ruby: List admin's set the rules and subscribers have the choice of complying or leaving the list. Way too often we see people go far out of their own way to help a member who has posted a query only to get no thanks or "oh, I already knew that'. Sandra has chosen as part of her 'rules & regs' to request that people treat others on the list with some respect especially if they take their own time to answer queries. I don't think she's asking too much and again, anytime someone doesn't like the way a list is run they can unsub and read the list postings on the threaded archives. Kathi Jones-Hudson, National Coordinator Tombstone Transcription Project http://www.usgwtombstones.org/

I too am new but have not found that to be the case for me. They have been very helpful and showed concern that you found what you were looking for, especially Sanda. Kit ----- Original Message ----- From: "ruby riley" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 1:18 PM Subject: [PaOldC] lack of activity I am new to this list. I posted a query and was told basically to google it. Then I got a personal e-mail from Sandra chastising me for not replying with a thank you for all the help. I resolved to send no more queries to this list. I only write now to let you know why this list sees so little activity. True, this is probably the most highly organized list to which I have subscribed and sometimes has helpful information, but it is also the least friendly. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.716 / Virus Database: 270.14.108/2566 - Release Date: 12/15/09 02:52:00

And when you consider she has had health problems, I think we worry more. Eliz On Tue, Dec 15, 2009 at 8:05 AM, Tim Robinson <[email protected]> wrote: > Thanks Sheila......... > > My thoughts exactly, and my fingers are crossed.... > > Tim R. > ***** > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "sheila penner" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 6:59 AM > Subject: [PaOldC] MIA List Administrator > > > I am a neophyte in genealogical research (only 6 years), so I have really missed > Sandra's editorial comments and historical helps. She just has a knack for > cleaning up the ragged edges and offering logical explanations to suggest where > to look and to assist in forming circumstantial conclusions. I was able to get > my DAR membership based on "compelling circumstantial evidence" so I have a > great appreciation for the talent and experience of an administrator with > Sandra's integrity. I hope whomever is responsible for Sandra's retreat will > make amends soon. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

In brief... Sandra managed the list with a strong hands-on approach which is what is needed most days on one of these email lists. People can tend to stray too far off line very easily and we all need some advice(LOL) from above occaisionally. Sandra IS what a list admin should be. She knows the format and the subject and stays involved. Many list admins are there in name only or rarely step in until WAY too late to resolve an issue. That wasn't so brief, sorry. Alan T ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Robinson" <[email protected]> To: "sheila penner" <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 8:05 AM Subject: Re: [PaOldC] MIA List Administrator > Thanks Sheila......... > > My thoughts exactly, and my fingers are crossed.... > > Tim R. > ***** > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "sheila penner" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 6:59 AM > Subject: [PaOldC] MIA List Administrator > > > I am a neophyte in genealogical research (only 6 years), so I have really > missed > Sandra's editorial comments and historical helps. She just has a knack for > cleaning up the ragged edges and offering logical explanations to suggest > where > to look and to assist in forming circumstantial conclusions. I was able to > get > my DAR membership based on "compelling circumstantial evidence" so I have > a > great appreciation for the talent and experience of an administrator with > Sandra's integrity. I hope whomever is responsible for Sandra's retreat > will > make amends soon. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dotty, et al. After a couple of personal emails I visited the list and read the very kind posts from several of you. I became very upset by a posting from a list member, in September, accusing me of purposefully trying to make research more difficult for people....this was very different from how I always pictured myself, and it really got to me, for some reason...being a list adm. is pretty much a thankless job, and really a no win in this sort of situation - if you stick up for yourself you're called a bully, and if you don't, and no one else does either, you feel unsure of anything. So, I just quit reading the posts, and have only taken care of the administrative duties since then. Stress is something I can't afford to have in my life, and I remove what I can of it. Right now, I'm having problems with my ongoing cardiac condition, and I can't tell you how much your kind comments have lessened the sadness I felt concerning Old Chester....it's been like the loss of a dear friend that you grieve for.....it was part of my daily life for a lot of years and greatly missed. Health permitting, perhaps I'll return after the first of the year.....but, regardless, I appreciate knowing that I have been a positive, helpful element in at least some of your lives. Have a safe and healthy Holiday. S. > So that's what happened. Sandra has always been helpful to our list and I > have been on it before it was the Old Chester list. We need you to come > back Sandra. I too thought I had lost the list since nothing has > happened in > about 3 months. So, how do we get her to respond back and cheer up our > listers. > > Dottie

I emailed Sandra. She is still administering the list, but not reading the messages. She needs her life to be 'low stress' right now for personal reasons. Whoever has been critical of other peoples' voluntary help in the past should do us all a favor and remember that it is HELP (take it our leave it) and VOLUNTARY (take it or leave it). Disagreeing with other peoples' opinions is a right we all have, but let's be conscious of what's appropriate in this setting...... -Aimee Heinly > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

So that's what happened. Sandra has always been helpful to our list and I have been on it before it was the Old Chester list. We need you to come back Sandra. I too thought I had lost the list since nothing has happened in about 3 months. So, how do we get her to respond back and cheer up our listers. Dottie

I have been on and off the computer for 6 months. Just getting on long enough to check emails to keep from getting dropped because of bouncing mail. I thought I had gotten dropped from this list because of that, but here I find Sandra has been off. This is BAD. There are very few administers like her out there. This list has always been my favorite because of her. Yes, I have been on the receiving end of her chastisement. It was a constructive chastisement which I needed reminded of because the info should have been posted on the list not shared privately. That way it could go into the archives, and others researching same lines could have info. Anyway. I pray Sandra is alright and will be back soon. It is almost Christmas and Sandra you know how I look forward to your info about the holidays, days of old, or how ever you want to put it. Because of Sandra this list was what it was one of the best out there, now look at us.......That's right without her this list is nothing, dead.......... Oh I pray you are alright Sandra. Yvonne Bakersfield Ca

I am new to this list.  I posted a query and was told basically to google it.  Then I got a personal e-mail from Sandra chastising me for not replying with a thank you for all the help.  I resolved to send no more queries to this list.  I only write now to let you know why this list sees so little activity.  True, this is probably the most highly organized list to which I have subscribed and sometimes has helpful information, but it is also the least friendly.

Yea Sandra! Good to hear from you, sorry for your health problem, hope you improve to get back on the list after the first of the year. Missed you. Iris Masten Harris (Harlan descendent)

Thanks Sheila......... My thoughts exactly, and my fingers are crossed.... Tim R. ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "sheila penner" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 6:59 AM Subject: [PaOldC] MIA List Administrator I am a neophyte in genealogical research (only 6 years), so I have really missed Sandra's editorial comments and historical helps. She just has a knack for cleaning up the ragged edges and offering logical explanations to suggest where to look and to assist in forming circumstantial conclusions. I was able to get my DAR membership based on "compelling circumstantial evidence" so I have a great appreciation for the talent and experience of an administrator with Sandra's integrity. I hope whomever is responsible for Sandra's retreat will make amends soon. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks Jamie....That needed to be said, and I appreciate your remarks. Tim R. ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: JAMIE To: Tim Robinson Cc: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 6:23 AM Subject: Re: [PaOldC] No action on List......Why???? Hi Tim... I've been wondering why this mailing list has been so quite and why there hasn't been any signs of Sandra for awhile on this mailing list....I was thinking maybe this flu that's been going around was the reason behind that, until you brought this up Tim....thanks for letting me know...I'm sorry to hear that someone has been so hard on Sandra over how she manages this mailing list and has hurt her feelings...Sandra doesn't deserve to be treated that way.....she has given so much of her time and effort over the years in helping out anyone who asks for help with their genealogy research and in making sure that the Old Chester, PA - ML is as good as it is.... Sandra is a role model to follow on how things should be done for anyone who would want to manage a genealogy mailing list...I've learned so much about my family tree, thanks to Sandra, as well as learning more about the lives of other folks from the same area.....I alway look forward to reading what she has to share with those of us on this mailing list...I really appreciate all she has done to make the Old Chester, PA - ML one of the top genealogy mailing lists out there......I hope it won't be too long before she comes back...I miss hearing from her on this mailing list.... ~ Jamie Riutcel From: Tim Robinson <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Mon, December 14, 2009 8:10:35 PM Subject: [PaOldC] No action on List......Why? ----- Original Message ----- List member's Pa-Old Chester, Here it is right near Christmas and this list has been like the dead zone for a few month's. And why????? No one has asked or wondered out loud on here as to where our List Administrator has disappeared to. A very helpful one at that! I know myself and have kept off the list by not wanting to accuse anyone of causing this action. But I think something needs to be said about it. Somebody, and you know who you are, gave her a "hard way to go" about how she was running the list. And from that "slap in the face" she decided to take herself off answering people's posts. So I hope that the person who thought they knew how OUR list was run and didn't approve of how Sandra performed her rightful duties as list administrator, can feel responsible for their actions. There was not another administrator on any of these mail lists that was as helpful and knowledgable as Sandra has been for us. I do miss her very much on here and I hope that at some point she will return the Old-Pa List back to a real good functioning genealogy forum as it once was. Thanks for listening............ Timothy L. Robinson Catonsville, Baltimore Maryland.

Come back, please, Sandra! We miss you! Merry Christmas! Bob Wilson Beaufort SC

I, too, am sorry to hear that Sandra has stepped away from the list administrator (volunteer) duties. She was the first to assist (and properly instruct) me in how to use the "list and its participants" to the best advantage.   Although I haven't been able to secure any confirming evidence about my ancestor Abraham Maxwell (of old West Chester circa 1800) and his daughter Esther, it was Sandra who kept my research hopes alive with periodical encouragement & educational suggestions.   Tom M. Whitelock Texas Society Sons of the American Revolution   m: Tim Robinson <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Mon, December 14, 2009 8:10:35 PM Subject: [PaOldC] No action on List......Why? ----- Original Message ----- List member's Pa-Old Chester, Here it is right near Christmas and this list has been like the dead zone for a few month's. And why????? No one has asked or wondered out loud on here as to where our List Administrator has disappeared to. A very helpful one at that! I know myself and have kept off the list by not wanting to accuse anyone of causing this action.  But I think something needs to be said about it. Somebody, and you know who you are, gave her a "hard way to go" about how she was running the list. And from that "slap in the face" she decided to take herself off answering people's posts. So I hope that the person who thought they knew how OUR list was run and didn't approve of how Sandra performed her rightful duties as list administrator, can feel responsible for their actions. There was not another administrator on any of these mail lists that was as helpful and knowledgable as Sandra has been for us. I do miss her very much on here and I hope that at some point she will return the Old-Pa List back to a real good functioning genealogy forum as it once was. Thanks for listening............ Timothy L. Robinson Catonsville, Baltimore Maryland. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Come back to us, Sandy!  

Is Sandra really out of action?   If so, do we know where she lives?   Sandra isn't the sort who'd be easily chased away, and I don't know if there is any evidence that that happened.   It might be good to give her a call.   Alot of leadership on these lists are far older than you'd thinnk.   I am writing from my hospital bed - my appendix blew a cork.   You just never know.   Yours Dora --- On Tue, 12/15/09, sheila penner <[email protected]> wrote: From: sheila penner <[email protected]> Subject: [PaOldC] MIA List Administrator To: [email protected] Date: Tuesday, December 15, 2009, 5:59 AM I am a neophyte in genealogical research (only 6 years), so I have really missed Sandra's editorial comments and historical helps.  She just has a knack for cleaning up the ragged edges and offering logical explanations to suggest where to look and to assist in forming circumstantial conclusions.  I was able to get my DAR membership based on "compelling circumstantial evidence" so I have a great appreciation for the talent and experience of an administrator with Sandra's integrity.  I hope whomever is responsible for Sandra's retreat will make amends soon.  ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am a neophyte in genealogical research (only 6 years), so I have really missed Sandra's editorial comments and historical helps.  She just has a knack for cleaning up the ragged edges and offering logical explanations to suggest where to look and to assist in forming circumstantial conclusions.  I was able to get my DAR membership based on "compelling circumstantial evidence" so I have a great appreciation for the talent and experience of an administrator with Sandra's integrity.  I hope whomever is responsible for Sandra's retreat will make amends soon.