Peter what does the death certificate give as his cause of death? The only reason I can think of for him being in the Workhouse for so long is that he had some kind of long term health problem or disability which is why I looked in the newspapers to see if I could find a report of an accident that might have incapacitated him. I think I mentioned the rootsweb chat stream (google: henry hicks grocer oxford and the header is Workhouse death and burial) where someone was enquiring about his burial place - this also refers to his wife returning to Wales with the children. Micah the author of the original query also does not know why he spent so long in the Workhouse. Do you have Ancestry access? There are a couple family trees on there with the same story about his wife and children. She 'married' bigamously James BRIMBLE in 1868. Both have attached a photo Henry & Eliza and one has an extract apparently from his probate record dated March 1894 -this just says to Eliza £235 (about £20,000 in today's money according to one web site). Wendy -----Original Message----- From: D Taylor Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 3:16 PM To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford Wendy, Many thanks for that. I do have access to on line British Library 19th century newspaper through my Lancashire Library membership and have found and copied the references you have given me. Regarding Henry Hicks,I have a copy of his death certificate and he died in the workhouse in 1893 having been an inmate for the last 30 odd years of his life. The mystery being the reason for his downfall which as yet I have been unable to resolve. Peter On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 12:58 PM, Wendy King <wendyking37@hotmail.com> wrote: > > Peter does your local library give you access on line to the British > Library 19th Century Newspapers? > > Have had a browse through Jackson's Oxford Journal and cannot find an > obituary for Henry Hicks but did find couple of items for Alfred and > Thomas > Joy: > > text as in article: > > Notice is hereby given that the partnership heretofore existing between us > the undersigned Thomas Joy and Alfred Joy' of the City of Oxford, carrying > on the business or trade of tailors and robe makers under the firm "Thomas > and Alfred Joy", was, as and from the 31 day of December last, dissolved > by > mutual consent dated first day of February 1853. Thomas Joy, Alfred Joy. > > extract from article: a notice in 1850 listed the latest local business's > subscriptions to fund Wash Houses and Public Baths in Oxford - Thomas and > Alfred Joy contributed £1 1s. > > > Wendy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Cowley > Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 12:17 PM > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford > > There is still of course one Hicks wholesale greengrocery business in > Oxford. (Unless my memory is playing tricks, I think there were two retail > shops until about 20 years ago.) > > Cheers, > > Bob Cowley > --------------- > > On Sep 16 2012, D Taylor wrote: > >>I wonder if some one can shed some light onto a mystery concerning two >>branches of my family living in Oxford between the 1851 and 1861 >>census returns? >> >>The first is a Henry Hicks whose father, Paul Hicks a grocer in >>Oxford, died in 1839 leaving his business to him. >>This is reflected in the 1841 and 1851 census returns. >>The 1861 census has him in the workhouse where he spent the rest of >>his life until his death in1893. >> >>The second concerns Henry Hicks' cousin, Thomas Joy,whose father >>William Joy (Henry Hicks' uncle) died in 1847. >>William Joy was a tailor and son Thomas,together with his brother >>Alfred,took over the family business. >>This is reflected in the 1851 census. >>The 1861 census has Thomas,no longer a tailor,living in London. >>The 1871 census has him as a temporary clerk at a Post Office in London. >>No sign of Alfred >> >>Is it just a coincidence that these two businesses failed or did >>something happen in Oxford during this period to cause a down turn in >>the economy? >>The effects of the Crimea War perhaps? >> >>Peter Taylor >>Glossop >>Derbyshire >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >> >> See www.ofhs.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from >> the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with >> the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of >> the message > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. See www.ofhs.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Morning Wendy, I made a mistake on Henry Hicks' death certificate it was 1894 not 1893. The certificate gives his date and place of death as 15th Jan 1894 at Oxford Workhouse,Cowley Road His age was 78 and cause of death "Natural Decay" It would seem that he didn't have a health problem,just the opposite in fact to reach such a ripe old age despite spending some 30 odd years in the workhouse. I'm aware of his wife going to Wales as one of his sons who went with his mother,William Henry Hicks was my great grandfather with one of William Henry's daughters,Louisa Mary,my maternal grand mother. I'm also aware of his inheritance and thought this could have been the reason for his down fall,an unwise investment or an addiction to drink. Unfortunately I've been unable to find out when he entered the work house,only that it was some time between the 1851 and 1861 census returns. Regards Peter On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 9:02 PM, Wendy King <wendyking37@hotmail.com> wrote: > Peter > > what does the death certificate give as his cause of death? The only reason > I can think of for him being in the Workhouse for so long is that he had > some kind of long term health problem or disability which is why I looked in > the newspapers to see if I could find a report of an accident that might > have incapacitated him. > > I think I mentioned the rootsweb chat stream (google: henry hicks grocer > oxford and the header is Workhouse death and burial) where someone was > enquiring about his burial place - this also refers to his wife returning > to Wales with the children. Micah the author of the original query also does > not know why he spent so long in the Workhouse. > > Do you have Ancestry access? There are a couple family trees on there with > the same story about his wife and children. She 'married' bigamously James > BRIMBLE in 1868. Both have attached a photo Henry & Eliza and one has an > extract apparently from his probate record dated March 1894 -this just says > to Eliza £235 (about £20,000 in today's money according to one web site). > > Wendy > > -----Original Message----- > From: D Taylor > Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 3:16 PM > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford > > Wendy, > Many thanks for that. > I do have access to on line British Library 19th century newspaper > through my Lancashire Library membership and have found and copied the > references you have given me. > Regarding Henry Hicks,I have a copy of his death certificate and he > died in the workhouse in 1893 having been an inmate for the last 30 > odd years of his life. > The mystery being the reason for his downfall which as yet I have been > unable to resolve. > Peter > > On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 12:58 PM, Wendy King <wendyking37@hotmail.com> > wrote: >> >> Peter does your local library give you access on line to the British >> Library 19th Century Newspapers? >> >> Have had a browse through Jackson's Oxford Journal and cannot find an >> obituary for Henry Hicks but did find couple of items for Alfred and >> Thomas >> Joy: >> >> text as in article: >> >> Notice is hereby given that the partnership heretofore existing between us >> the undersigned Thomas Joy and Alfred Joy' of the City of Oxford, carrying >> on the business or trade of tailors and robe makers under the firm "Thomas >> and Alfred Joy", was, as and from the 31 day of December last, dissolved >> by >> mutual consent dated first day of February 1853. Thomas Joy, Alfred Joy. >> >> extract from article: a notice in 1850 listed the latest local business's >> subscriptions to fund Wash Houses and Public Baths in Oxford - Thomas and >> Alfred Joy contributed £1 1s. >> >> >> Wendy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bob Cowley >> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 12:17 PM >> To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford >> >> There is still of course one Hicks wholesale greengrocery business in >> Oxford. (Unless my memory is playing tricks, I think there were two retail >> shops until about 20 years ago.) >> >> Cheers, >> >> Bob Cowley >> --------------- >> >> On Sep 16 2012, D Taylor wrote: >> >>>I wonder if some one can shed some light onto a mystery concerning two >>>branches of my family living in Oxford between the 1851 and 1861 >>>census returns? >>> >>>The first is a Henry Hicks whose father, Paul Hicks a grocer in >>>Oxford, died in 1839 leaving his business to him. >>>This is reflected in the 1841 and 1851 census returns. >>>The 1861 census has him in the workhouse where he spent the rest of >>>his life until his death in1893. >>> >>>The second concerns Henry Hicks' cousin, Thomas Joy,whose father >>>William Joy (Henry Hicks' uncle) died in 1847. >>>William Joy was a tailor and son Thomas,together with his brother >>>Alfred,took over the family business. >>>This is reflected in the 1851 census. >>>The 1861 census has Thomas,no longer a tailor,living in London. >>>The 1871 census has him as a temporary clerk at a Post Office in London. >>>No sign of Alfred >>> >>>Is it just a coincidence that these two businesses failed or did >>>something happen in Oxford during this period to cause a down turn in >>>the economy? >>>The effects of the Crimea War perhaps? >>> >>>Peter Taylor >>>Glossop >>>Derbyshire >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>>OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >>> >>> See www.ofhs.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from >>> the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with >>> the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of >>> the message >> >> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >> >> See www.ofhs.org.uk >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >> >> See www.ofhs.org.uk >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Peter Afraid you hit the same stumbling block with the Workhouse as I did when looking for my great grandfather's sisters - no record of admissions etc. exist for this period or indeed for much of the century. Had found the initials of all those I knew about plus an extra child. Wendy Archer was able to help me identify her birth but the search dead ended there until I literally tripped across on someone else's tree on Ancestry. I hope that at some point you get as lucky as I did. best wishes Wendy -----Original Message----- From: D Taylor Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2012 11:08 AM To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford Morning Wendy, I made a mistake on Henry Hicks' death certificate it was 1894 not 1893. The certificate gives his date and place of death as 15th Jan 1894 at Oxford Workhouse,Cowley Road His age was 78 and cause of death "Natural Decay" It would seem that he didn't have a health problem,just the opposite in fact to reach such a ripe old age despite spending some 30 odd years in the workhouse. I'm aware of his wife going to Wales as one of his sons who went with his mother,William Henry Hicks was my great grandfather with one of William Henry's daughters,Louisa Mary,my maternal grand mother. I'm also aware of his inheritance and thought this could have been the reason for his down fall,an unwise investment or an addiction to drink. Unfortunately I've been unable to find out when he entered the work house,only that it was some time between the 1851 and 1861 census returns. Regards Peter On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 9:02 PM, Wendy King <wendyking37@hotmail.com> wrote: > Peter > > what does the death certificate give as his cause of death? The only > reason > I can think of for him being in the Workhouse for so long is that he had > some kind of long term health problem or disability which is why I looked > in > the newspapers to see if I could find a report of an accident that might > have incapacitated him. > > I think I mentioned the rootsweb chat stream (google: henry hicks grocer > oxford and the header is Workhouse death and burial) where someone was > enquiring about his burial place - this also refers to his wife returning > to Wales with the children. Micah the author of the original query also > does > not know why he spent so long in the Workhouse. > > Do you have Ancestry access? There are a couple family trees on there with > the same story about his wife and children. She 'married' bigamously James > BRIMBLE in 1868. Both have attached a photo Henry & Eliza and one has an > extract apparently from his probate record dated March 1894 -this just > says > to Eliza £235 (about £20,000 in today's money according to one web site). > > Wendy > > -----Original Message----- > From: D Taylor > Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 3:16 PM > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford > > Wendy, > Many thanks for that. > I do have access to on line British Library 19th century newspaper > through my Lancashire Library membership and have found and copied the > references you have given me. > Regarding Henry Hicks,I have a copy of his death certificate and he > died in the workhouse in 1893 having been an inmate for the last 30 > odd years of his life. > The mystery being the reason for his downfall which as yet I have been > unable to resolve. > Peter > > On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 12:58 PM, Wendy King <wendyking37@hotmail.com> > wrote: >> >> Peter does your local library give you access on line to the British >> Library 19th Century Newspapers? >> >> Have had a browse through Jackson's Oxford Journal and cannot find an >> obituary for Henry Hicks but did find couple of items for Alfred and >> Thomas >> Joy: >> >> text as in article: >> >> Notice is hereby given that the partnership heretofore existing between >> us >> the undersigned Thomas Joy and Alfred Joy' of the City of Oxford, >> carrying >> on the business or trade of tailors and robe makers under the firm >> "Thomas >> and Alfred Joy", was, as and from the 31 day of December last, dissolved >> by >> mutual consent dated first day of February 1853. Thomas Joy, Alfred Joy. >> >> extract from article: a notice in 1850 listed the latest local >> business's >> subscriptions to fund Wash Houses and Public Baths in Oxford - Thomas and >> Alfred Joy contributed £1 1s. >> >> >> Wendy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bob Cowley >> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 12:17 PM >> To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [OXF] Henry Hicks & Thomas Joy 1850s Oxford >> >> There is still of course one Hicks wholesale greengrocery business in >> Oxford. (Unless my memory is playing tricks, I think there were two >> retail >> shops until about 20 years ago.) >> >> Cheers, >> >> Bob Cowley >> --------------- >> >> On Sep 16 2012, D Taylor wrote: >> >>>I wonder if some one can shed some light onto a mystery concerning two >>>branches of my family living in Oxford between the 1851 and 1861 >>>census returns? >>> >>>The first is a Henry Hicks whose father, Paul Hicks a grocer in >>>Oxford, died in 1839 leaving his business to him. >>>This is reflected in the 1841 and 1851 census returns. >>>The 1861 census has him in the workhouse where he spent the rest of >>>his life until his death in1893. >>> >>>The second concerns Henry Hicks' cousin, Thomas Joy,whose father >>>William Joy (Henry Hicks' uncle) died in 1847. >>>William Joy was a tailor and son Thomas,together with his brother >>>Alfred,took over the family business. >>>This is reflected in the 1851 census. >>>The 1861 census has Thomas,no longer a tailor,living in London. >>>The 1871 census has him as a temporary clerk at a Post Office in London. >>>No sign of Alfred >>> >>>Is it just a coincidence that these two businesses failed or did >>>something happen in Oxford during this period to cause a down turn in >>>the economy? >>>The effects of the Crimea War perhaps? >>> >>>Peter Taylor >>>Glossop >>>Derbyshire >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>>OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >>> >>> See www.ofhs.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from >>> the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with >>> the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of >>> the message >> >> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >> >> See www.ofhs.org.uk >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. >> >> See www.ofhs.org.uk >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. > > See www.ofhs.org.uk > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ OFHS Open Day - 6 October at Woodstock. See www.ofhs.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message