Hi Dawn, back in the early 1960s when I was going trough my first divorce the sdolicvtortold me at srtatford court I would need to wait a period of 7 years unless I could prove my then wife had commited adultry she later admited this so I got my fist of two divorces but living in ther london area ment I had to attend the admimiratly court that wasthen in the old bailey and I wasv very surprised at the people mainly old ladies that were wandering around reading the singes on the court doors saying wehat cases were bing defended and propted to go listen to all thedetails of contested cases rather than sit through a boring non contested case I phoned the ex afterthe case to give her the good news and we celebrated the divorce by me taking her out for a drink and on to a meal. the second wasone of these quickie divorces in norwich crown court in the 1970s period. the third is still going strong but being 74 now I think this will be my last we bhave 6 children all of them are maried now . thanks pete From: Dawn Webb <dawnwebb@optusnet.com.au> To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, 15 August 2011, 23:30 Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE AND GARDNER - KEDONAUGH Well, after 7 years of not hearing anything, you could have the person presumed dead so you were free to marry again. It happened quite a lot when one spouse was eg in Australia and the other in England. And I am sure too that the odd letter that might have come in that 7 years could be easily "lost" or "forgotten" if it helped to bring the seven years period to completion earlier. I think today when a person is missing - eg went fishing, car and clothes found but no body, rough sea,.. it takes seven years for the family to be able to claim them dead - and so get access to eg superannuation and insurance - and probably the will. Not a good place to be, waiting those seven years! Dawn (Melbourne Australia) -----Original Message----- From: oxfordshire-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:oxfordshire-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of lynne scaife Sent: Tuesday, 16 August 2011 2:46 AM To: oxfordshire list Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE AND GARDNER - KEDONAUGH Hi Wendy Nice to hear from you. So much happened yesterday, I hardly know where to begin, but my brick wall is knocked down! Firstly, when I checked the post, the birth certificate had arrived for my great grandmother, Eliza GARDNER. No father's name mentioned, as expected, but it says her maiden name was FLETCHER. The GARDNER's I found on the 1841 were the wrong family. I made a basic error and presumed too much. I have, however, now found the correct family and here they are: H0 107/889/14, Deddington, Philcock Street: GARDNER, Mary, 30, Y GARDNER, Elizabeth, 7, Y GARDNER, Sarah, 4, Y FLETCHER, James, 1, Y GARDNER, Mary, 9, Y and right next door: FLETCHER, William, 71, Cooper, Y BETTS, Elizabeth, 60, Y FLETCHER, Elizabeth 69, Y FLETCHER, Jane, 24, Y. Elizabeth aged 7 died 10 years later, and I think must have been their first child. It looks as though Sarah is another sibling, but I can't find her birth. James Fletcher is the son of Jane Fletcher, and I don't know who the Mary aged 9 is, since it's the bottom of the list, perhaps it's a visitor/other family member. Mary FLETCHER was c. in Chipping Norton 11 06 1810. (Mary not Mary Ann according to the IGI.) I have considered the Adderbury marriage in 1830, Robert Gardner to Mary Fletcher, but I'd like to check the Chipping Norton PR's to see if there is a marriage there. So if anyone has the Chippy PR's and wouldn't mind having a look, I'd be very grateful. Howard, I've wondered all along if Mary did actually marry a GARDNER, but if she didn't, why did she and thomas WILKINS wait so long to wed. I don't suppose she would have been informed of his death, but wonder in a transportation case, whether you could remarry after a certain time lapse if no contact was received? Judy in London very kindly found the transporation details for Richard GARDNER, he was in fact transported for 7 years in 1839 to NSW and died in Sydney General Hospital the year after. He was transported for a most curious case of perjury. Many thanks Lynne ---------------------------------------- > From: wendyking37@hotmail.com > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2011 21:44:33 +0100 > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE AND GARDNER - KEDONAUGH > > Howard & Lynne > > Mary Ann KEDONAUGH intrigued by this name so put just the last name into > family search and came up with NO hits and their phonetic suggestions were > all Germanic or Scandinavian. Similar search on ancestry again no hits - it > produced Keating variations and Keutenius (in London marriages) and the > wonderfully named 'Money Kathnasses' (her husband was a German born violin > maker). > > suspect the celebrant misheard or had his own phonetic spelling of some > other name. > > Only possibility I can come up with is Kennedy > > Wendy > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Howard Fuller > Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:21 AM > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE AND GARDNER > > Hello Lynne, > > Others have offered help with SKUCE but this may help with GARD(I/E)NER. > > You say Mary Ann (surname unknown) was the mother of your > g-grandmother. You want to know who Mary Ann's parents were. > > >From the 1841 Census you deduce that her (first) marriage was to > Robert GARDNER in about 1825/26, but you can't find this marriage. > > When, as a widow, she married Thomas WILKINS in Deddington on 12 May > 1865, the register says only that her father's name is William, that > he is a cooper, but it gives no surname. > > According to her age in the 1851 and 1871 censuses, Mary Ann was born > in about 1802-5 in Chipping Norton. Eight Mary Ann's were baptised at > Chipping Norton in 1800 to 1807. Two of these had father = William: > - 1801 Apr 26 - Mary Ann, dau. William & Mary KEDONAUGH > - 1805 May 12 - Mary Ann, dau. William & Ann BUSSWELL > > Unfortunately, I can't find who Mary Ann KEDONAUGH married - if she > did. But Mary Ann BUSSWELL married Samuel ENDALL at Chipping Norton on > 18 Jul 1826. > > Pehaps Robert GARDNER and his Mary Ann didn't actually get married? > > No real progress, I'm afraid! > > Howard > > > On 10/08/2011 19:27, lynne scaife wrote: > > > > Dear List > > > > I have been absent from the list for a while, of late mainly due to PC > > problems. But I'm back! > > > > I am researching mainly SKUCE in Deddington and Charlbury, but many other > > names that married into the line. > > > > I have recently reserected a family skeleton - the curious case of Mary > > Ann and Robert GARDNER. > > Mary is the mother of my great grandmother Eliza SKUCE nee GARDNER. It's > > now most certain that the man Mary Ann married is not the father of my > > great grand mother, or any of the subsequent children, and that Robert, > > was actually transported for goodness knows what! > > > > Mary Ann was born about 1805 in Chipping Norton according to 1841 and 1851 > > and other census' of Deddington. > > > > She married 1. Robert GARDNER about 1825/26. I can not find this marriage > > from the IGI, as there are no marriages coverage. > > > > I've found them on the 1841 which shows: > > Chipping Norton, Churchill Road, H0107/879/3 > > > > Robert GARDNER, 45, Labourer, "Y" (in county) > > Mary GARDNER, 35, Y > > Ann GARDNER, 14, Y > > Robert GARDNER, 12, Y > > John GARDNER, 7, Y > > Jane GARDNER, 5, Y > > Thomas GARDNER, 3, Y > > > > And 1851 shows: > > Deddington, Philcock Street > > > > Mary GARDNER, 45, 1806, House servant, Chipping Norton > > Elizabeth GARDNER, 8, Deddington, (note this should be Eliza not > > Elizabeth, my great grandmother) > > George GARDNER, 6, Deddington > > Emma GARDNER, 4, Deddington > > Harriet GARDNER, 1, Deddington > > All living in the household of Thomas Wilkins who she later married in > > 1865! > > > >> From previous kind help, and copies of PRs and a couple of certificates, > >> I know that Robert GARDNER was transported around about 1839-41, and on > >> the PR for Eliza's birth, who was a twin with Eleanor, (Eleanor died 11 > >> weeks later), bapt. 24 02 1843 in Deddington, it states that Robert is > >> not the father of these children. It's more than likely that Thomas > >> WILKINS is the father of Eleanor and Eliza, and several subsequent > >> children all born before she married him in 1865. > > > > There are several discrepancies queries re. the above, but mainly: > > > > 1. The date of his transportation. Pam in NZ kindly helped back in 2005 > > with information that Robert GARDNER, convict no. 28130 departed > > Portsmouth 14 07 1841 (6 weeks after the 1841 census carried out on 16th > > June 1841), on the Lord Goderich bound for Tasmania. The main problem > > with this, is when Isabella GARDNER AKA Louisa was bapt. 12 06 1853, Mary > > Ann states on the registration that father was transported 1839. That's a > > 2 year discrepancy. > > > > I am in contact now with the Archives Office of Tasmania to see if I can > > get any further with his transportation. > > > > 2. I am desperate to know who Mary Ann's parents were. When she married > > Thomas WILKINS in 1865, register says her father's name is William, but > > infuriatingly, she does not give a surname, only that he is a "cooper" > > (prof.) > > > > If any one can offer me any advice, I'll gladly take it and be eternally > > grateful. > > > > Kindest regards > > Lynne Scaife > > Tenerife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > OFHS "Wills Library" : > > Can you submit any wills, please?http://wills.oxfordshirefhs.org.uk/ > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS "Wills Library" : > Can you submit any wills, please?http://wills.oxfordshirefhs.org.uk/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > OFHS "Wills Library" : > Can you submit any wills, please?http://wills.oxfordshirefhs.org.uk/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ OFHS "Wills Library" : Can you submit any wills, please? http://wills.oxfordshirefhs.org.uk/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 6380 (20110815) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ OFHS "Wills Library" : Can you submit any wills, please? http://wills.oxfordshirefhs.org.uk/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to OXFORDSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
The 7-year period comes from a section of an early bigamy act, and was intended to cover situations where one party had gone overseas and nothing further had been heard of him or her. Perhaps Mary Ann lied on the birth certificate about the date of transportation because she knew of the 7-year rule and wanted to shorten the waiting period. Here is the link for anyone else wishing to search for a convict sent to VDL. http://portal.archives.tas.gov.au/menu.aspx?search=11 HB > From: Dawn Webb <dawnwebb@optusnet.com.au> > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > Sent: Monday, 15 August 2011, 23:30 > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE > AND GARDNER - KEDONAUGH > > Well, after 7 years of not hearing anything, you could have > the person > presumed dead so you were free to marry again. It > happened quite a lot when > one spouse was eg in Australia and the other in England. > And I am sure too > that the odd letter that might have come in that 7 years > could be easily > "lost" or "forgotten" if it helped to bring the seven years > period to > completion earlier. > > I think today when a person is missing - eg went fishing, > car and clothes > found but no body, rough sea,.. it takes seven years for > the family to be > able to claim them dead - and so get access to eg > superannuation and > insurance - and probably the will. Not a good place to be, > waiting those > seven years! > > Dawn (Melbourne Australia) > > -----Original Message----- > From: oxfordshire-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:oxfordshire-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of lynne scaife > Sent: Tuesday, 16 August 2011 2:46 AM > To: oxfordshire list > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly SKUCE > AND GARDNER - > KEDONAUGH > > > Hi Wendy > > Nice to hear from you. > > So much happened yesterday, I hardly know where to begin, > but my brick wall > is knocked down! > > Firstly, when I checked the post, the birth certificate had > arrived for my > great grandmother, Eliza GARDNER. No father's name > mentioned, as expected, > but it says her maiden name was FLETCHER. > > The GARDNER's I found on the 1841 were the wrong family. > I made a basic > error and presumed too much. I have, however, now found > the correct family > and here they are: > > H0 107/889/14, Deddington, Philcock Street: > > GARDNER, Mary, 30, Y > GARDNER, Elizabeth, 7, Y > GARDNER, Sarah, 4, Y > FLETCHER, James, 1, Y > GARDNER, Mary, 9, Y > > and right next door: > > FLETCHER, William, 71, Cooper, Y > BETTS, Elizabeth, 60, Y > FLETCHER, Elizabeth 69, Y > FLETCHER, Jane, 24, Y. > > Elizabeth aged 7 died 10 years later, and I think must have > been their first > child. It looks as though Sarah is another sibling, but I > can't find her > birth. James Fletcher is the son of Jane Fletcher, and I > don't know who the > Mary aged 9 is, since it's the bottom of the list, perhaps > it's a > visitor/other family member. > > Mary FLETCHER was c. in Chipping Norton 11 06 1810. (Mary > not Mary Ann > according to the IGI.) I have considered the Adderbury > marriage in 1830, > Robert Gardner to Mary Fletcher, but I'd like to check the > Chipping Norton > PR's to see if there is a marriage there. So if anyone > has the Chippy PR's > and wouldn't mind having a look, I'd be very grateful. > Howard, I've > wondered all along if Mary did actually marry a GARDNER, > but if she didn't, > why did she and thomas WILKINS wait so long to wed. I > don't suppose she > would have been informed of his death, but wonder in a > transportation case, > whether you could remarry after a certain time lapse if no > contact was > received? > > Judy in London very kindly found the transporation details > for Richard > GARDNER, he was in fact transported for 7 years in 1839 to > NSW and died in > Sydney General Hospital the year after. He was > transported for a most > curious case of perjury. > > Many thanks > Lynne > > > > ---------------------------------------- > > From: wendyking37@hotmail.com > > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > > Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2011 21:44:33 +0100 > > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly > SKUCE AND GARDNER - > KEDONAUGH > > > > Howard & Lynne > > > > Mary Ann KEDONAUGH intrigued by this name so put just > the last name into > > family search and came up with NO hits and their > phonetic suggestions were > > all Germanic or Scandinavian. Similar search on > ancestry again no hits - > it > > produced Keating variations and Keutenius (in London > marriages) and the > > wonderfully named 'Money Kathnasses' (her husband was > a German born violin > > maker). > > > > suspect the celebrant misheard or had his own phonetic > spelling of some > > other name. > > > > Only possibility I can come up with is Kennedy > > > > Wendy > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Howard Fuller > > Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:21 AM > > To: oxfordshire@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [OXF] Reintroducing my interests mainly > SKUCE AND GARDNER > > > > Hello Lynne, > > > > Others have offered help with SKUCE but this may help > with GARD(I/E)NER. > > > > You say Mary Ann (surname unknown) was the mother of > your > > g-grandmother. You want to know who Mary Ann's parents > were. > > > > >From the 1841 Census you deduce that her (first) > marriage was to > > Robert GARDNER in about 1825/26, but you can't find > this marriage. > > > > When, as a widow, she married Thomas WILKINS in > Deddington on 12 May > > 1865, the register says only that her father's name is > William, that > > he is a cooper, but it gives no surname. > > > > According to her age in the 1851 and 1871 censuses, > Mary Ann was born > > in about 1802-5 in Chipping Norton. Eight Mary Ann's > were baptised at > > Chipping Norton in 1800 to 1807. Two of these had > father = William: > > - 1801 Apr 26 - Mary Ann, dau. William & Mary > KEDONAUGH > > - 1805 May 12 - Mary Ann, dau. William & Ann > BUSSWELL > > > > Unfortunately, I can't find who Mary Ann KEDONAUGH > married - if she > > did. But Mary Ann BUSSWELL married Samuel ENDALL at > Chipping Norton on > > 18 Jul 1826. > > > > Pehaps Robert GARDNER and his Mary Ann didn't actually > get married? > > > > No real progress, I'm afraid! > > > > Howard > > > > > > On 10/08/2011 19:27, lynne scaife wrote: > > > > > > Dear List > > > > > > I have been absent from the list for a while, of > late mainly due to PC > > > problems. But I'm back! > > > > > > I am researching mainly SKUCE in Deddington and > Charlbury, but many > other > > > names that married into the line. > > > > > > I have recently reserected a family skeleton - > the curious case of Mary > > > Ann and Robert GARDNER. > > > Mary is the mother of my great grandmother Eliza > SKUCE nee GARDNER. It's > > > now most certain that the man Mary Ann married is > not the father of my > > > great grand mother, or any of the subsequent > children, and that Robert, > > > was actually transported for goodness knows > what! > > > > > > Mary Ann was born about 1805 in Chipping Norton > according to 1841 and > 1851 > > > and other census' of Deddington. > > > > > > She married 1. Robert GARDNER about 1825/26. I > can not find this > marriage > > > from the IGI, as there are no marriages > coverage. > > > > > > I've found them on the 1841 which shows: > > > Chipping Norton, Churchill Road, H0107/879/3 > > > > > > Robert GARDNER, 45, Labourer, "Y" (in county) > > > Mary GARDNER, 35, Y > > > Ann GARDNER, 14, Y > > > Robert GARDNER, 12, Y > > > John GARDNER, 7, Y > > > Jane GARDNER, 5, Y > > > Thomas GARDNER, 3, Y > > > > > > And 1851 shows: > > > Deddington, Philcock Street > > > > > > Mary GARDNER, 45, 1806, House servant, Chipping > Norton > > > Elizabeth GARDNER, 8, Deddington, (note this > should be Eliza not > > > Elizabeth, my great grandmother) > > > George GARDNER, 6, Deddington > > > Emma GARDNER, 4, Deddington > > > Harriet GARDNER, 1, Deddington > > > All living in the household of Thomas Wilkins who > she later married in > > > 1865! > > > > > >> From previous kind help, and copies of PRs > and a couple of > certificates, > > >> I know that Robert GARDNER was transported > around about 1839-41, and on > > >> the PR for Eliza's birth, who was a twin with > Eleanor, (Eleanor died 11 > > >> weeks later), bapt. 24 02 1843 in Deddington, > it states that Robert is > > >> not the father of these children. It's more > than likely that Thomas > > >> WILKINS is the father of Eleanor and Eliza, > and several subsequent > > >> children all born before she married him in > 1865. > > > > > > There are several discrepancies queries re. the > above, but mainly: > > > > > > 1. The date of his transportation. Pam in NZ > kindly helped back in 2005 > > > with information that Robert GARDNER, convict no. > 28130 departed > > > Portsmouth 14 07 1841 (6 weeks after the 1841 > census carried out on 16th > > > June 1841), on the Lord Goderich bound for > Tasmania. The main problem > > > with this, is when Isabella GARDNER AKA Louisa > was bapt. 12 06 1853, > Mary > > > Ann states on the registration that father was > transported 1839. That's > a > > > 2 year discrepancy. > > > > > > I am in contact now with the Archives Office of > Tasmania to see if I can > > > get any further with his transportation. > > > > > > 2. I am desperate to know who Mary Ann's parents > were. When she married > > > Thomas WILKINS in 1865, register says her > father's name is William, but > > > infuriatingly, she does not give a surname, only > that he is a "cooper" > > > (prof.) > > > > > > If any one can offer me any advice, I'll gladly > take it and be eternally > > > grateful. > > > > > > Kindest regards > > > Lynne Scaife > > > Tenerife > > > >