Does anyone know the whereabouts of North Wald Firth - I am assuming that it is either Orkney or Shetland? Thanks Sarah

Reply sent off-Group -- Mike Clouston mike@clouston.co.uk http://www.clouston.co.uk/ http://web.ukonline.co.uk/pegwell/ -----Original Message----- From: Sarah Finlow-Bates [mailto:sunshinelady@ozemail.com.au] Sent: 12 November 1999 00:36 To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ORKNEY] Family Ties Thank you to Mike, Sigurd and Ron for the information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE clan. Mike, if you could remember roughly how old Captain John Hourie was or any other details, I would be most grateful. As I am discovering, the practice of naming children after fathers, uncles, brothers! leads to loads of duplication - John, James and William being my own nemesis! I believe that once I get to the Orkneys (next year in April/May I hope), there will be more than enough data to get my teeth into. Having said that I am already swimming in dates, places, misspelt names and lots of "skeletons in the closet" --- I love it!! Cheers Sarah

Thank you to Mike, Sigurd and Ron for the information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE clan. Mike, if you could remember roughly how old Captain John Hourie was or any other details, I would be most grateful. As I am discovering, the practice of naming children after fathers, uncles, brothers! leads to loads of duplication - John, James and William being my own nemesis! I believe that once I get to the Orkneys (next year in April/May I hope), there will be more than enough data to get my teeth into. Having said that I am already swimming in dates, places, misspelt names and lots of "skeletons in the closet" --- I love it!! Cheers Sarah

> Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone > had information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is > HOWRIE and I have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys > back to the 1650s - I haven't got anything like a family tree yet > though and as I am new to all this (and living in Australia) any > snippets of information would be most gratefully received. Howrie/Hourie is pronounced "Hoorie" and probably comes from the West Mainland parish of Evie, possible from the farm of Horry. However, there is/was also a farm called Horrie in inthe East Mainland parish of St Andrews, which is another possible origin for the name. There are still Houries in the islands but only three or four. Hello, When I lived in Shetland 1985-1991 my chemist/pharmacist was called Alan Hourie, who originally came from Stromness, Orkney, as I do. He has a sister called Ethel, but I cannot remember her married name. Their father was Captain John Hourie, who taught me how to recognise many of the planets and stars. Whether Alan, and his wife Greta, are still alive, I don't know, I certainly hope so - they were very kind to me - Greta made the finest tattie soup I have ever tasted! -- Mike Clouston mike@clouston.co.uk http://www.clouston.co.uk/ http://web.ukonline.co.uk/pegwell/

> Budge is a South Ronaldsay name but I think Kirkness is more of a Mainland > name. I don't remember seeing the name Kirkness in South Ronaldsay. But. > Heather, I am not at home right now and I don't have access to my records. Kirkness was a tunship in the West Mainland parish of Sandwick. -- Sigurd Towrie - Blackhall - Kirbister - Stromness - Orkney E-Mail: sigurd@orkneyjar.com Orkneyjar - The Heritage of Orkney: http://www.orkneyjar.com

> Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone > had information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is > HOWRIE and I have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys > back to the 1650s - I haven't got anything like a family tree yet > though and as I am new to all this (and living in Australia) any > snippets of information would be most gratefully received. Howrie/Hourie is pronounced "Hoorie" and probably comes from the West Mainland parish of Evie, possible from the farm of Horry. However, there is/was also a farm called Horrie in inthe East Mainland parish of St Andrews, which is another possible origin for the name. There are still Houries in the islands but only three or four. -- Sigurd Towrie - Blackhall - Kirbister - Stromness - Orkney E-Mail: sigurd@orkneyjar.com Orkneyjar - The Heritage of Orkney: http://www.orkneyjar.com

Jackie - The sites noted in the old eMail still work ! Just tried them. One is for the Census data < http://globalgenealogy.com/gazfd29.htm >, the other is for Occupation listings < www.cpcug.org/user/jlacombe/terms.html > The site says the following (plus a LOT more) about the census dates - Meg Greenwood / Oklahoma This was midnight of first date to midnight second date. This applies to all the censuses. 1841-1891 Census: 1841 census was taken on June 6/7. PRO reference - HO 107 1851 census was taken on March 30/31. PRO reference - HO 107. 1861 census was taken on April 7/8. PRO reference - RG 9. 1871 census was taken on April 2/3. PRO reference - RG10. 1881 census was taken on April 3/4. PRO reference - RG 11. 1891: census was taken on April 5/6. PRO reference - RG 11. PRO = Public Record Office - where the data is held HO = Home Office RG = Record Group Information requested included: Number of the schedule Name of Street, place or road Household number Name - First and last name of each person in the house on midnight on the 30/31 March Relationship of all persons listed to the head of the household Marital Status (condition) - married, unmarried, widow, widower Age and Sex - was supposed to be listed as the exact age of the person at the time of the census. Many researchers will know that ages were not always reported accurately. Many people did not like the idea of such detailed information being collected to start with! Rank, Profession or Occupation. This information was supposed to be included for everyone and reveals a diverse range of occupations - many of which no longer exist today. Ever wondered what an ADVERTISEMENT CONVEYANCER was? - How about a sandwich board man! There is a great website for a List of Occupations at: www.cpcug.org/user/jlacombe/terms.html This list is a must for anyone trying to understand changing occupations and their labels over time. Where Born. Place of Birth Medical condition (blind, deaf, dumb, imbecile, etc.)

Thanks to both Dave and Meg for this info....just one more question: in 1881 was the date April 3 or 4? Jackie

I think this is what you are after 7th June 1841 31st March 1851 8th April 1861 3rd April 1871 4th April 1881 5th April 1891 Dave Eddington david.eddington@ns.sympatico.ca http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/david.eddington Jackie Middleton-Promo-2671 wrote: > > Hi! > > I was wondering if someone could supply me with the dates of the census for > each of the years > that it was taken (1841-1891). > > Thank you. > > Jackie

This is an excerpt from Meg Greenwood, hope it helps The census was taken for the whole of the UK on these dates: The dates the Census was taken: 1841 - June 7 1851- March 31 1861- April 8 1871 - April 3 1881- April 3 These dates may help in figuring dates of birth. This came from a member of the Lanarkshire list. There is also an informative site at the following address: http://globalgenealogy.com/gazfd29.htm This is unfortunately only an England and Wales site, but the information is still valuable. The Scottish counties are of course, not listed. There is a great deal of information about the availability of the upcoming 1901 census to be released about 2003. If someone knows of a Scots site for census info - please list it, it deserves to be passed on ! - Meg Greenwood - Oklahoma Hi! I was wondering if someone could supply me with the dates of the census for each of the years that it was taken (1841-1891). Thank you. Jackie

Hi! I was wondering if someone could supply me with the dates of the census for each of the years that it was taken (1841-1891). Thank you. Jackie

Jackie -- I saved this: >From: finn@ionet.net (Greenwood) >Reply-To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com >To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [ORKNEY-L] Census dates for the UK >Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 18:20:56 GMT > >The census was taken for the whole of the UK on these dates: > >The dates the Census was taken: >1841 - June 7 >1851- March 31 >1861- April 8 >1871 - April 3 >1881- April 3 > >These dates may help in figuring dates of birth. This came from a member >of the Lanarkshire list. > >There is also an informative site at the following address: > >http://globalgenealogy.com/gazfd29.htm > >This is unfortunately only an England and Wales site, but the information >is still valuable. The >Scottish counties are of course, not listed. There is a great deal of >information about the >availability of the upcoming 1901 census to be released about 2003. If >someone knows of a Scots >site for census info - please list it, it deserves to be passed on ! - >Meg Greenwood - Oklahoma > > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

Heather - After looking at those census records for awhile, I would not trust what the enumerator wrote as being the Legal Name of whomever they listed. There are plenty of Lizzies, Maggies and Nellies, and even one soul recorded as H R. Who knows what those letters stood for ? Betty, or Betisy, or Betsy, it was probably Elizabeth on the birth certificate. However, I would still keep 'Betisy' in my back pocket in case it showed up elswhere ! - Meg Greenwood / Oklahoma, USA

In the 1881 census my daughter in law's great grandparents Robert 32 and Jessie Budge 37 (nee Tait) are staying at Fletts, South Ronaldsay with Robert's parents John and Betsy Budge all born South Ronaldsay Kay

Wow - I'm sure these are my great grandparents that I have been looking for. Those are the names on my grandmother's birth certificate. I have never been able to find info on Betisy, probably because I've been looking for Betsy as on the birth certificate. Now I can research more into this. Heather -----Original Message----- From: Meg Greenwood <finn@ionet.net> To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 12:34 AM Subject: [ORKNEY] BUDGE surname >Alex - Just saw a post from you (I think) and have a reference to >BUDGE on the few sheets of 1891 Census I have copied. This has been >sent out before, if this is a duplicate, I do apologize. - Meg >Greenwood / Oklahoma. USA > >Living at Budge's Cottage - John BUDGE - head - married - 76 years old - >retired fisherman, born So. Ronaldshay. Also Betisy (spelled exactly >this way except the 'e' is not clear) BUDGE - wife - married - 61 years >old - born So. Ronaldshay. > >They lived right next to my HALCROWs in Orphir. > > > >

Alex - Just saw a post from you (I think) and have a reference to BUDGE on the few sheets of 1891 Census I have copied. This has been sent out before, if this is a duplicate, I do apologize. - Meg Greenwood / Oklahoma. USA Living at Budge's Cottage - John BUDGE - head - married - 76 years old - retired fisherman, born So. Ronaldshay. Also Betisy (spelled exactly this way except the 'e' is not clear) BUDGE - wife - married - 61 years old - born So. Ronaldshay. They lived right next to my HALCROWs in Orphir.

----- Original Message ----- From: "H Alex Cromarty" <hacgmc@telusplanet.net> To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 6:31 PM Subject: Re: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > Hi Sarah, > Yes my anscestry come from Orkney but we as yet haven't come across your > maiden name "Howrie", on any of my lines. That is not a South Ronaldsay > name as I am familiar with most of those names. > Any way good luck. > > Alex > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sarah Finlow-Bates" <sunshinelady@ozemail.com.au> > To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:12 PM > Subject: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > > > > Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone had > information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is HOWRIE and I > have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys back to the 1650s - I > haven't got anything like a family tree yet though and as I am new to all > this (and living in Australia) any snippets of information would be most > gratefully received. > > > > Thanks > > Sarah > > > > > >

Heather; Good to hear from you. We have Budges on our line from South Ronaldsay. Budge is a South Ronaldsay name but I think Kirkness is more of a Mainland name. I don't remember seeing the name Kirkness in South Ronaldsay. But. Heather, I am not at home right now and I don't have access to my records. I want to exchange notes after we get back home and that will be after the first of December. So if I don't get back to you be sure and drop me another email. Alex ----- Original Message ----- From: "Heather" <crafty@mb.sympatico.ca> To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 6:34 PM Subject: Re: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > Just wondering if you are familiar with Budge or Kirkness. My grandparents > are from Deerness and S. Ronaldsay. > Heather > -----Original Message----- > From: H Alex Cromarty <hacgmc@telusplanet.net> > To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> > Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 7:29 PM > Subject: Re: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > > > >Hi Sarah, > > Yes my anscestry come from Orkney but we as yet haven't come across > your > >maiden name "Howrie", on any of my lines. That is not a South Ronaldsay > >name as I am familiar with most of those names. > >Any way good luck. > > > >Alex > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Sarah Finlow-Bates" <sunshinelady@ozemail.com.au> > >To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:12 PM > >Subject: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > > > > > >> Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone had > >information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is HOWRIE and I > >have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys back to the 1650s - I > >haven't got anything like a family tree yet though and as I am new to all > >this (and living in Australia) any snippets of information would be most > >gratefully received. > >> > >> Thanks > >> Sarah > >> > >> > > > > > >

Just wondering if you are familiar with Budge or Kirkness. My grandparents are from Deerness and S. Ronaldsay. Heather -----Original Message----- From: H Alex Cromarty <hacgmc@telusplanet.net> To: ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 7:29 PM Subject: Re: [ORKNEY] Family Ties >Hi Sarah, > Yes my anscestry come from Orkney but we as yet haven't come across your >maiden name "Howrie", on any of my lines. That is not a South Ronaldsay >name as I am familiar with most of those names. >Any way good luck. > >Alex >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Sarah Finlow-Bates" <sunshinelady@ozemail.com.au> >To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:12 PM >Subject: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > > >> Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone had >information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is HOWRIE and I >have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys back to the 1650s - I >haven't got anything like a family tree yet though and as I am new to all >this (and living in Australia) any snippets of information would be most >gratefully received. >> >> Thanks >> Sarah >> >> > >

Hi Sarah, Yes my anscestry come from Orkney but we as yet haven't come across your maiden name "Howrie", on any of my lines. That is not a South Ronaldsay name as I am familiar with most of those names. Any way good luck. Alex ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Finlow-Bates" <sunshinelady@ozemail.com.au> To: <ORKNEY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:12 PM Subject: [ORKNEY] Family Ties > Hi, I have just been added to this list and wondered if anyone had information on the HOWRIE/HOURIE family? My maiden name is HOWRIE and I have been able to trace the family to the Orkneys back to the 1650s - I haven't got anything like a family tree yet though and as I am new to all this (and living in Australia) any snippets of information would be most gratefully received. > > Thanks > Sarah > >