Hi there, I am new to this list. My kinship to the original 13 would be that I descend from the Hallman's. I believe that many of the family members that married into the Hallman family were descended from the Original 13. Maybe you all can help me fill in a few blanks. My earliest Hallman was Anthony Hallman (Antonius Heilmann): Descendants of Anthony/Antonius Hallman/Heilmann 1 Anthony/Antonius Hallman/Heilmann b: 1671 in Klein Neidersheim, Palatinate, Germany (Or Switzerland) d: July 16, 1759 in Skippack Township, Montgomery County, Pennsylvania . +Maria Salome b: Bet. 1672 - 1673 in Klein Neidersheim, Palatinate, Germany (Or Switzerland) d: September 26, 1745 in Skippack Township, Montgomery County, Pennsylvania m: Abt. 1690 ........ 2 Johannes (John) Hallman b: October 16, 1710 in Klein Neidsheim, Germany d: August 01, 1778 ........... +Anna Maria Croessman b: Abt. 1706 d: September 02, 1784 m: 1736 Father: Johann George Croesmann Would someone have any information about these, or possibly some of the folks whose families married into each other's? Also, would anyone be able to tell me about the area in the Palatinate? Some of the names that I am researching are: Custer/Kastor/Koster Krey Croessman/Kreseman/Cressman Op den Graeff In den Hoeffen (De Haven) Heizer/Heiser Penn Thanks, Linda Kyle

In a message dated 2/22/2003 4:32:25 PM Pacific Standard Time, hswain@ix.netcom.com writes: > <<According to the website you mentioned earlier, it appears William moved > to > Towamencin Township..........>> Hi all, Below is a portion of a line I am researching at the moment . The information below was supplied to me after contacting The Swedish Historical society. It appears that I have a Tennis (female) that marries into the yocum line. I was given the name Barbara Tennis, but so far have come up short on finding her. Have not been working on this long. I was looking at the surname in Towamencin as this is where the Yocums are found at and the ones in my line are buried in the Tennis family Cemetery. Since the subject is being discussed , figured it was a good time to ask if anyone may have an idea of where this Barbara Tennis hailed from. According to a very reliable Yocum resarcher my line of descent from Peter Jochimsson and his son Peter Petersson Yocum is as follows: Swan Yocum, born at Aronameck in Kingsessing. Philadelphia County, in 1685, married Joanna Collins 7 Feb. 1710, died 10 August 1758 at Aronameck, Kingsessing. Two sons, including James Yocum, born c. 1715 at Aronameck in Kingsessing, married Barbara Tennis c. 1740, died in Towamensing Township, Montgomery County, Pa., c. 1758. Six sons, including William Yocum, born 11 August 1747 in Towamensing Township, Montgomery County, Pa., married Margaret Wilson by 1776, died 11 Dec. 1813, Lower Salford Township, buried at Tennis Family cemetery, Allentown Road, Towamensing Township. Five children, including Jonathan Yocum, born 30 November 1779, Lower Salford Township, Montgomery County, Pa., married Mary Kulp by 1804, died 13 May 1859 in Upper Providence Township, Montgomery County, Pa. Buried with wife at St Luke's Cemetery, Trappe, Pa. Seven children, including Isaac Yocum, born 19 Dec. 1804, Montgomery County, married Lydia Stover by 1842, lived in Towamensing Township at time of 1850 census, died 27 February 1884, buried in Rockhill Mennonite Church Cemetery. Had three sons (Isaac, John, Joseph) and one daughter, Sarah (who married Emanuel Zearfoss). Thanks for any help Kassie Oregon

Hi Dixie, From: <MissDixieB@aol.com> Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 7:28 PM > To the TUNIS,etc. List: > > I have been trying to connect my William TUNIS to his heritage for a very > long time. I have him in a Survey Book in Sevier County, TN in 1824 and on > the 1830 Census of Sevier County, between the ages of 40 / 50. He is married > to Lucy (SURIN) TUNIS and they have four females and three males on this > census. I have been able to run a line on daughter, Sarah (b 1795): my Gr. > Gr. Grandmother, who married Joel SCOTT. Also, I have some information on > another daughter, Mary Surin (TUNIS), who married Amos OWENSBY. > > In November of 1846, Lucy TUNIS was at Court in Sevier County, TN trying to > claim her dowry, as her husband, William TUNIS, had died. > > I have checked this list many times to see if there would be a clue as to who > the parents of my William (b 1780 / 1790) might be. I do not even know for > sure where he was born. So, he missed by 4 years being in the 1850 census which would (hopefully) have shown the state of his birth. But how about Lucy? Did you find her in the 1850 census? Could her origin be a clue? Even if they married in TN, their families could have migrated together. Or how about their children in the 1880 census? There, they were supposed to say the state where their parents were born. Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com

To the TUNIS,etc. List: I have been trying to connect my William TUNIS to his heritage for a very long time. I have him in a Survey Book in Sevier County, TN in 1824 and on the 1830 Census of Sevier County, between the ages of 40 / 50. He is married to Lucy (SURIN) TUNIS and they have four females and three males on this census. I have been able to run a line on daughter, Sarah (b 1795): my Gr. Gr. Grandmother, who married Joel SCOTT. Also, I have some information on another daughter, Mary Surin (TUNIS), who married Amos OWENSBY. In November of 1846, Lucy TUNIS was at Court in Sevier County, TN trying to claim her dowry, as her husband, William TUNIS, had died. I have checked this list many times to see if there would be a clue as to who the parents of my William (b 1780 / 1790) might be. I do not even know for sure where he was born. Thank any and all who may have any clues to my search. I read the list every day there is a post, and I am glad to see all the help that comes through with information. I will gladly send what I have to anyone that needs what I do have. Thanks again: Dixie (SCOTT)

of course you likely know that Tunes and Klincken are the same families...Erik Conard

Hi Dave, From: "Dave Tennis" <bondoutdt@yahoo.com> Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 8:50 PM > Hi everyone, > > As I stated earlier I am new to the genealogy thing, and am asking for suggestions. One of the original 13, Abraham Tunes had a son named William who married Magdalena Levering. I have read the Levering family genealogy book and found 4 sons, Anthony, John, Abraham, and Samuel. I have tracked several generations of Samuel's line but cannot find anything about the other 3 sons. Does anyone have any suggestions of where to look? I am not afraid to ask questions or for help as it sounds like most of you have been doing this for quite some time and would like to learn the proper way of checking records. > > I also am not sure that Abraham Tunes only had William, he may have had more than one son but I don't know for sure. From your earlier message, I have the feeling you have a tentative line of descent from Abraham Tunes. It would help, I think, if you could post the first several generations that you are trying to verify. In general, it is best to work back from the known present toward the past. Otherwise, if you start at the distant past and try to go forward, you don't know which line to follow, so face an ever expanding number of families to search at each generation. However, if you have a tentative line from some secondary source, it may be reasonable to try to check it out and verify it. The birth dates of the children of Abraham Tunes are shown in the Records of the Abington Monthly Meeting of the Society of Friends. (I just happen to have a copy of that page.) It shows another son, "Tunes". Since Tunes (or Teunis) is the short form of Antheunis, he may also have been known as Anthony. There may be other information on the family in these records, including the marriage of the children. You can get a microfilm of them from your local Family History Center operated by the Latter Day Saints. See: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/FHLC/frameset_fhlc.asp The film for the early Abington records is #0383428 According to the website you mentioned earlier, it appears William moved to Towamencin Township. This is near to Gwynedd, so maybe his family is in the Gwynedd Monthly Meeting. That is film #0383439 The records there begin in 1714. Both films have indexes, as I recall. Another resource you may find useful is: Genealogical Records: Pennsylvania Wills, 1682-1834 This is available as CDROM published by Family Tree Maker as #209. This has very brief, terse abstracts of the wills. If you find a will that appears relevant from the abstract, you will also see the county, the will book (this may be a letter) , the page number, and the date proved. With that information, you can get a copy of the complete will on microfilm from the LDS. You will want to search for last names of Tunes, Tunis, Tennis, and Teunis -- at least. The basic article detailing the European origin of the 13 families is: "The Ancestry of the Thirteen Krefeld Emigrants of 1683" by Wilhelm Niepoth, translated by John Brockie Lukens in Pennsylvania Genealogical Magazine vol XXXI no 3 (1980) pp 191-207. And reprinted in Genealogies of Pennsylvania Families vol III pp 495-512. In addition to "How to" info on the LDS site, see: http://www.cyndislist.com/ You happen to live near one of the largest and best genealogical libraries in the country: The Allen County Public Library in Fort Wayne. If your ancestors were still Quakers when they moved to Indiana and Iowa, you should ask questions about them on the QUAKER-ROOTS list. There are several people there that are very knowledgeable about researching Quakers in those states. This is probably a lot to dump on you at one time, but I wanted to get it down while it was on my mind. Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com

here is the Merion Meeting file in usgw archives. there are several other Tunis entries as well... ONE caution. there may be errors.... this researcher has the Kunders/Streypers marriage listed so not sure how valid other entries are. More current ones apt to be better..... http://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb/pa/montgomery/church/merion05.txt There are other files for this series...... 05 the most recent. just change the last number to get the other files 01-04.

Dave Tennis wrote: >Hi everyone, > >As I stated earlier I am new to the genealogy thing, and am asking for suggestions. One of the original 13, Abraham Tunes had a son named William who married Magdalena Levering. I have read the Levering family genealogy book and found 4 sons, Anthony, John, Abraham, and Samuel. I have tracked several generations of Samuel's line but cannot find anything about the other 3 sons. Does anyone have any suggestions of where to look? > Which Levering book did you use?? Horatio Gates or John Levering's?? or another? good timing.... just found this which is new in the usgw archives and not linked. The Incompleted Burial Records of Merion (PA) Meeting Grave-yard by Margaret B. Harvey, A.M. 11, 13, 1755. Abraham Tunis, of Merion, son of Anthony; - and Hannah Humphreys, of the same township, dau. of Benjamin of Haverford, dec'd; at Merion Meeting House. Wit: Anthony, Mary and Joseph Tunis; Samuel, Joshua and Solomon Humphreys.

Let's all hear it for Erik. Hip, hip, hurrah!!!!!!!! Judy ----- Original Message ----- From: EConard1@aol.com To: ORIGINAL-13-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [ORIGINAL-13] Thones Kunders I have sent kindly Gene Stackhouse GEDCOM disks of my CONARD male lines + other families, not related Kunders-wise, who have used CONARD and varied spellings. Gene will eventually get them transcribed and they will repose in the Germantown Historical Society. If you know of any place who'd benefit from parts of the KUNDERS collection that Athlyn Luzier (now deceased) and I gathered over the past forty years, let me know. I have no objection to sharing and the only condition is that you DO NOT PEDDLE the data. The LDS and FTM have quite a scattered collection of Kunders data, mostly crap and erroneous, and they peddle it to newbies who think they have found a sugar titty. I have NEVER charged a dime and we spent thousands of dollars and hours getting this info...it is yours with no conditions despite the contrary ole image some of us have gotten....WHADDYA MEAN HAVE A NICE DAY? Regards, Erik Paul Conard, PhD, Life Member Elks, Shriners, Masons, Sertoma, TKE, flakes.....LOL ______________________________

Thank you very much Joe Patterson, The book I used was John Leverings book. I had noted the will you spoke about but since I am new to this I had a hard time getting the will terminalogy through my thick skull. I will read what you sent today to hopefully gain new clues. I know Samuel Tennis (son of William and Magdalena) was born 1716 so I assumed his brothers were around that era but cooudn't determine much about about the other boys. As I said I will read what other info you sent and may put it together.(hope I am smart enough, I know I am stubborn enough) Thanks so much for your help. Dave Tennis --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more

unfortunately most of those other links are from 1727 forward, much to late for inclusion on our site and replete with errors, too. Erik P Conard

Yes, and so far as I know, the Osbornes, Nicholas and Richard, were cousins. Keep postin' and you will eventually resolve it. Quakers, yes. Hang in there, partner, and write anytime. Erik P Conard

You missed Elin...anyhow, without having to go into linguistics or a lengthy explanation of language nuances, we use NOTES to try to explain our case. However, the rank and file genie, lamentably, is not inclined to so pursue such a thing as scholarship, preferring whiteout, the Xerox, and copying. So, we plod along and try to wanly smile. Cheers! Erik P Conard

It is easy to get a sour gizzard, friend, over what you have just communicated as well as what I have said. I know of no way other than endure it and go on. BUT...we don't have to like it! Regards, Erik P Conard

Hi everyone, As I stated earlier I am new to the genealogy thing, and am asking for suggestions. One of the original 13, Abraham Tunes had a son named William who married Magdalena Levering. I have read the Levering family genealogy book and found 4 sons, Anthony, John, Abraham, and Samuel. I have tracked several generations of Samuel's line but cannot find anything about the other 3 sons. Does anyone have any suggestions of where to look? I am not afraid to ask questions or for help as it sounds like most of you have been doing this for quite some time and would like to learn the proper way of checking records. I also am not sure that Abraham Tunes only had William, he may have had more than one son but I don't know for sure. Thanks in invance for anyone's help or guidence. Dave Tennis --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more

I received this from a cousin...thought some of you may enjoy it or seeing it again! Click on the link below...the site is FULL of other links! <A HREF="http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pagermanpioneers/">Pennsylvania German Pioneers Passenger Lists Directory of Online Transcriptions Palatine German Immigrants to Philadelphia 1727-1808 http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~pagermanpioneers/</A>

In the early to mid 1700's several Osborne's (Richard and Nicholas) married Cunnards. I am trying to trace the Osborne line backwards and so far I've been able to find a Richard Osborne who just appeared near Hopewell, New Jersey in the late 1600's. Does anyone know where I can go to find out if he was a Quaker, my guess was that he was, several of his children and grandchildren married Quakers. I am at a blind alley. Thanks for any assistance Bill Daley

Eric, I agree with you with all my heart about sharing. But someone took my Berger history which I had shared and wrote it into his book on Barger, even the birthdates and birthplaces of new grandchildren! My name wasn't mentioned. When I wrote the author he said he had gotten it off the Internet and anything from there is free for the taking! Never saw my name he says. Cathy ----- Original Message ----- From: <EConard1@aol.com> To: <ORIGINAL-13-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 5:01 PM Subject: Re: [ORIGINAL-13] Thones Kunders > I have sent kindly Gene Stackhouse GEDCOM disks of my CONARD male lines + > other families, not related Kunders-wise, who have used CONARD and varied > spellings. Gene will eventually get them transcribed and they will repose in > the Germantown Historical Society. If you know of any place who'd benefit > from parts of > the KUNDERS collection that Athlyn Luzier (now deceased) and I gathered over > the past forty years, let me know. I have no objection to sharing and the > only condition > is that you DO NOT PEDDLE the data. The LDS and FTM have quite a scattered > collection of Kunders data, mostly crap and erroneous, and they peddle it to > newbies > who think they have found a sugar titty. > I have NEVER charged a dime and we spent thousands of dollars and hours > getting this info...it is yours with no conditions despite the contrary ole > image some of us have gotten....WHADDYA MEAN HAVE A NICE DAY? Regards, Erik > Paul Conard, > PhD, Life Member Elks, Shriners, Masons, Sertoma, TKE, flakes.....LOL > > > ==== ORIGINAL-13 Mailing List ==== > Please do not post just general Philadelphia information, but material > that is relevant to the 13 settling families of Germantown, PA, and > their descendant lines. Anything on these is A-OK. Thanks... > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >

I have sent kindly Gene Stackhouse GEDCOM disks of my CONARD male lines + other families, not related Kunders-wise, who have used CONARD and varied spellings. Gene will eventually get them transcribed and they will repose in the Germantown Historical Society. If you know of any place who'd benefit from parts of the KUNDERS collection that Athlyn Luzier (now deceased) and I gathered over the past forty years, let me know. I have no objection to sharing and the only condition is that you DO NOT PEDDLE the data. The LDS and FTM have quite a scattered collection of Kunders data, mostly crap and erroneous, and they peddle it to newbies who think they have found a sugar titty. I have NEVER charged a dime and we spent thousands of dollars and hours getting this info...it is yours with no conditions despite the contrary ole image some of us have gotten....WHADDYA MEAN HAVE A NICE DAY? Regards, Erik Paul Conard, PhD, Life Member Elks, Shriners, Masons, Sertoma, TKE, flakes.....LOL

One other thing...early CONRADs were not likely to be kin to Thones Kunders, as that surname evolved from many previous generations not even close to CONRAD in spelling. And Conrad is a common, sometimes regal, name in old Germany. So, do not even try to connect a CONRAD with old Thones if it is before, say 1711. The name today finds Kunders' descendants using CONARD, CUNARD, CONRAD, CONNARD, CUNNARD, CONERD, CUNERD & CONRADE...in that order of frequency. CUNERD and CONRADE have not been definitely nailed down as of the Kunders line, but it is likely. CONARD is still overwhelmingly CON'erd, but CUNARD is split CUN'erd and ka-NARD' And there are still folks who think we own the steam ship lines The Canadian CUNARDs have about daughtered out, the Baronetage is now extinct, and I have excellent records on most of them. Regards, grumpy Erik