stephen davie wrote: > Other species grown on the Rousay plantation are: > > ash (don't know which variety) > bird cherry > beech (another variety challenge) > common alder > downy birch > elderberry > gray alder > hazel > mixed willow > rowan > sea buckhorn > swedish whitebeam > sycamore > wych elm Wych elm sounds like a pretty poor bet: "Wych Elm (Ulmus Glabra) Scots Elm. Irish Leamhan. Description: Large deciduous tree. Susceptible to Dutch Elm disease and accordingly not planted any more." http://www.british-trees.com/guide/wychelm.htm Maybe the assumption is that the elm bark beetle (that spreads Dutch elm disease) will get blown off course before it reaches Orkney, though? I can't see beech doing all that well either, but I'm no expert. Norman Tulloch

Nice thing about these projects and the diversity of the species is that they will prove out in time what works and what doesn't. What we are finding in this country is that global warming has a significant impact on the future of forestry here, and the various species have varied responses and reactions to what mother nature has been handing out this last five or ten years. The increased biodiversity that evolves on the land beneath the trees in the Rousay project is further fascinating. Bluebell, cyclamen, wood anemone...and the daffodils and grape hyacinth amongst the fledgling tree plantation all are a joy in the photos. I bought the book on this Rousay undertaking from the Orcadian bookstore online, and it seems like a worthwhile project indeed. There will be adjustments to be made, but it is evident by the photos that the environment they are encouraging is somewhat unique at this point in Orkney albeit perhaps what once was common. The involvement of the younger generation is an encouraging sign as we look ahead. Seems like Orkney's history is not restricted to people and events related thereto, but also to environmental evolution in much part at the hands on man and his crops and beasts. The wych elm in the book are nine years old as of the publication and thus 13 or so years old now. They seem healthy in the photo, but who knows at this point. They certainly wern't breaking any growth records, to emphasize your point Norman, but they appear healthy.Ffunny dome shaped thing. It would be interesting to see this book rewritten in another ten years, with updated photos and reports. As in all things....time will tell the story. Cheers...stephen 2007, at 6:11 PM, Norman Tulloch wrote: > stephen davie wrote: > > >> Other species grown on the Rousay plantation are: >> >> ash (don't know which variety) >> bird cherry >> beech (another variety challenge) >> common alder >> downy birch >> elderberry >> gray alder >> hazel >> mixed willow >> rowan >> sea buckhorn >> swedish whitebeam >> sycamore >> wych elm > > Wych elm sounds like a pretty poor bet: > > "Wych Elm (Ulmus Glabra) > > Scots Elm. Irish Leamhan. > > Description: Large deciduous tree. Susceptible to Dutch Elm disease > and > accordingly not planted any more." > http://www.british-trees.com/guide/wychelm.htm > > Maybe the assumption is that the elm bark beetle (that spreads > Dutch elm > disease) will get blown off course before it reaches Orkney, though? > > I can't see beech doing all that well either, but I'm no expert. > > Norman Tulloch > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

The ash variety that Stephen was questioning would most likely be European Ash (Fraxinus excelsior) which grows over most of Northern Europe. It has usually 11 or 13 leaflets on its leaves as opposed to the Brown/Black or basket ash ( Fraxinus Negra) found in the swamps, and White or Common Ash ( Fraxinus Americana) found in the uplands in Stephen's neck of the woods, and that have 7-11 (but usually 7) and 5-9 leaflets on their leaves respectively. The European ash will grow to about 60-64N, so about as far north as the Trondheim (sp) Fjord in Norway, for instance, but I have never seen European or any other wild ash above about 57.5 N in Scotland (Ullapool/Inverness/Aberdeen). That's not to say it is not there, just that I haven't run across it, and I spend a lot of time tramping in the woods across that part of Scotland looking for it. Black ash is at this moment struggling with the emerald ash borer which is wiping out vast swatches of this 'basket' tree between Minnesota and Western New York State and from Ontario to western Quebec. I have been part of a group of indigenous basket weavers (from both sides of the US/Canadian border) and black ash orchardists collecting black ash seeds in non-infected areas (they only seed about every seven years so the trees are very slow to replace themselves) and searching to see if they can be crossed in any form and with any luck with European ash if the black ash is wiped out completely within the next 15-20 years in the Northern Boreal Forest. European ash makes nice furniture and sleigh runners, but is not so great for weaving (the layers don't lift very easily or uniformly when pounded for basket wefts and weavers). Black ash grows in swamps so is not exactly easy to market commercially in the way European ash can be harvested. Anyway, I would beg to guess that the Orcadian ash trees are likely to be European Ash also as the narrow-leafed ash (Fraxinus angustifolia) grows mainly in southern Europe around the Mediterranian Sea, southwest Asia, and northern Africa and doesn't do well in colder wetter areas. With Kind Regards, Nan On 10/09/2007, Norman Tulloch <[email protected]> wrote: > stephen davie wrote: > > > > Other species grown on the Rousay plantation are: > > > > ash (don't know which variety) > > bird cherry > > beech (another variety challenge) > > common alder > > downy birch > > elderberry > > gray alder > > hazel > > mixed willow > > rowan > > sea buckhorn > > swedish whitebeam > > sycamore > > wych elm > > Wych elm sounds like a pretty poor bet: > > "Wych Elm (Ulmus Glabra) > > Scots Elm. Irish Leamhan. > > Description: Large deciduous tree. Susceptible to Dutch Elm disease and > accordingly not planted any more." > http://www.british-trees.com/guide/wychelm.htm > > Maybe the assumption is that the elm bark beetle (that spreads Dutch elm > disease) will get blown off course before it reaches Orkney, though? > > I can't see beech doing all that well either, but I'm no expert. > > Norman Tulloch > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Nan Fowler 19/11 Bristo Place Edinburgh EH1 1EZ 'If I can't dance I don't want to be in your revolution'

Thanks Nan. The species of ash they planted is not well defined. An interesting quote in the book, which a talented ash weaver like yourself would appreciate perhaps: "As soon as multiplying man had filled the open grounds along the margin of the rivers, the lakes, and the sea, and sufficiently peopled the natural meadows and savannas of the interior, where such existed, he could find room for expansion and further growth only by the removal of a portion of the forest that hemmed him in. The destruction of the woods was man's first physical conquest, his first violation of the harmonies of inanimate nature." George Perkins Marsh 1864. On Sep 10, 2007, at 7:53 PM, Nan Fowler wrote: > The ash variety that Stephen was questioning would most likely be > European Ash (Fraxinus excelsior) which grows over most of Northern > Europe. It has usually 11 or 13 leaflets on its leaves as opposed to > the Brown/Black or basket ash ( Fraxinus Negra) found in the swamps, > and White or Common Ash ( Fraxinus Americana) found in the uplands in > Stephen's neck of the woods, and that have 7-11 (but usually 7) and > 5-9 leaflets on their leaves respectively. > > The European ash will grow to about 60-64N, so about as far north as > the Trondheim (sp) Fjord in Norway, for instance, but I have never > seen European or any other wild ash above about 57.5 N in Scotland > (Ullapool/Inverness/Aberdeen). That's not to say it is not there, > just that I haven't run across it, and I spend a lot of time tramping > in the woods across that part of Scotland looking for it. > Black ash is at this moment struggling with the emerald ash borer > which is wiping out vast swatches of this 'basket' tree between > Minnesota and Western New York State and from Ontario to western > Quebec. I have been part of a group of indigenous basket weavers > (from both sides of the US/Canadian border) and black ash orchardists > collecting black ash seeds in non-infected areas (they only seed about > every seven years so the trees are very slow to replace themselves) > and searching to see if they can be crossed in any form and with any > luck with European ash if the black ash is wiped out completely within > the next 15-20 years in the Northern Boreal Forest. > > European ash makes nice furniture and sleigh runners, but is not so > great for weaving (the layers don't lift very easily or uniformly when > pounded for basket wefts and weavers). Black ash grows in swamps so > is not exactly easy to market commercially in the way European ash can > be harvested. > > Anyway, I would beg to guess that the Orcadian ash trees are likely to > be European Ash also as the narrow-leafed ash (Fraxinus angustifolia) > grows mainly in southern Europe around the Mediterranian Sea, > southwest Asia, and northern Africa and doesn't do well in colder > wetter areas. > > With Kind Regards, > > Nan > > On 10/09/2007, Norman Tulloch <[email protected]> wrote: >> stephen davie wrote: >> >> >>> Other species grown on the Rousay plantation are: >>> >>> ash (don't know which variety) >>> bird cherry >>> beech (another variety challenge) >>> common alder >>> downy birch >>> elderberry >>> gray alder >>> hazel >>> mixed willow >>> rowan >>> sea buckhorn >>> swedish whitebeam >>> sycamore >>> wych elm >> >> Wych elm sounds like a pretty poor bet: >> >> "Wych Elm (Ulmus Glabra) >> >> Scots Elm. Irish Leamhan. >> >> Description: Large deciduous tree. Susceptible to Dutch Elm >> disease and >> accordingly not planted any more." >> http://www.british-trees.com/guide/wychelm.htm >> >> Maybe the assumption is that the elm bark beetle (that spreads >> Dutch elm >> disease) will get blown off course before it reaches Orkney, though? >> >> I can't see beech doing all that well either, but I'm no expert. >> >> Norman Tulloch >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA- >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > -- > Nan Fowler > 19/11 Bristo Place > Edinburgh EH1 1EZ > > 'If I can't dance I don't want to be in your revolution' > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message