Anne Slater wrote: > For auld lang syne > > Anne in SE Pennsylvania There will be twelve of us (7 English, 5 Swedish) sitting down to supper today. We will have haggis, tatties & neeps but it won't be a very traditional Burns Supper because there's nobody brave enough to try a Scottish accent - I may just try the Selkirk Grace <g> -- Bruce Fletcher Stronsay, Orkney UK <http://claremont.island-blogging.co.uk> "Never ask a man if he is from Yorkshire. If he is he will surely tell you. If he's not, why embarrass him?"

For auld lang syne Anne in SE Pennsylvania

We have had lots of sun in January! ------Original Message------ From: KJEMEM@aol.com Sender: orcadia-bounces@rootsweb.com To: orcadia@rootsweb.com ReplyTo: orcadia@rootsweb.com Subject: [ORCADIA] MAESHOWE Sent: 24 Jan 2009 15:18 If anybody's out there, if you look quickly there's sun shining in Maeshowe---which implies there's sun shining in Orkney! Miracles do happen!! Karen _Maeshowe Winter Solstice Sunset_ (http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/) _http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/_ (http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/) **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device

Missed it, I'm afraid, Karen. Oddly enough, though, at about the time when the setting sun would have been shining into Maeshowe, I was looking at a non-Orcadian stone circle just down the road from me and trying to work out why on earth it had been constructed. http://www.stonepages.com/ancient_scotland/sites/torhouse.htm Norman T.

If anybody's out there, if you look quickly there's sun shining in Maeshowe---which implies there's sun shining in Orkney! Miracles do happen!! Karen _Maeshowe Winter Solstice Sunset_ (http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/) _http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/_ (http://www.maeshowe.co.uk/) **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62)

2009/1/15 Norman Tulloch <norman@nwtulloch.vispa.com> > Interesting, Andrei. I looked at the Brinnoven site a few weeks ago and > saw no news of "The Orkney Norn", so it's good to see that (possibly, > maybe, perhaps) the publication of the book is coming closer. > > Still, when Brinnoven says that the book will be available in March, I > note that it doesn't say *which* March! :) > Well, if March' 2010 or 2011 is meant, then I would consider this to be black humour by Brinnoven... just like their background colour :D Andrei > > Norman T. > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > Orcadia Group Photo Album > http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Interesting, Andrei. I looked at the Brinnoven site a few weeks ago and saw no news of "The Orkney Norn", so it's good to see that (possibly, maybe, perhaps) the publication of the book is coming closer. Still, when Brinnoven says that the book will be available in March, I note that it doesn't say *which* March! :) Norman T.

Hello everyone! Brinnoven has finally announced the date (well, the month) of the release of the new edition of Orkney Norn: January 2009 The new edition of The Orkney Norn will be available in March. As noted earlier, it features an introduction by Dr Robert McColl Millar of Aberdeen University. Dr Millar is well-known for his work as a historical linguist. His book Northern and Insular Scots was published by Edinburgh University Press in 2007. All of our Orkney books are available for purchase from our Amazon.co.ukstore. In addition to our own publications, our Amazon.co.uk store stocks an eclectic selection of Scottish-interest titles (and a few other books besides!) http://www.brinnoven.co.uk/ All the best! Andrei

Just realized I sent the original to Royce instead of group. The light is just about gone, but it was pretty. ____________________________________ Some really good light at Maeshowe. About half hour to sun set. Look quickly before the clouds are back. Happy New Year all. Karen ____________________________________ New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making _headlines_ (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000026) . **************New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making headlines. (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000026)

Back on the air this morning. -- Kind regards Mike Clouston

Margaret Bainton wrote: > Does anyone know when Radio Orkney will resume its regular broadcasting? > > Peggy (USA) Monday 5 Jan 2009 according to <http://www.orkneycommunities.co.uk/radioOrkneySchedule.asp> -- Bruce Fletcher Stronsay, Orkney UK <http://claremont.island-blogging.co.uk>

Margaret Bainton wrote: > Does anyone know when Radio Orkney will resume its regular broadcasting? > > Peggy (USA) > Monday 5th, hopefully. -- Mike Clouston

In fact it is complex. Studies of cores from lochsn bogs etc allow a survey pollen, insects, etc back to the ice Age. Isotopic analyses and lots more can be done if funds allow. Archaeologists used to use ritual to explain what they could not devine from piles of stones. Now like politicians they may invoke climate change. Next they will be counting how many times Joe Nith picked his nose etc. I prefer to observe their workmanship and wonder what they thought. Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device -----Original Message----- From: SIMON TREASURE <tiny.treasure@btinternet.com> Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 14:22:43 To: <orcadia@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [ORCADIA] Maeshowe hi norman, your timeline is a bit wonky at the back end. Two phd students presented a paper on climate change in orkney in 2007 drawn from multiple cores taken from peat bogs across orkney and found climate deterioration from approx 2000 bc lasting to around 1200 bc i think. Also found evidence of human interaction with the biosphere back to 7500 bc which is obvious when you allow for the original mesolithic hunter gatherer settlers. They were not primitive, just few enough of them not to need permament dwelling and thus farming lifestyles. They would have herded beasts which to my memory was proved by the peat cores. regards, Simon ________________________________ From: Norman Tulloch <norman@nwtulloch.vispa.com> To: orcadia@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, 2 January, 2009 10:02:18 AM Subject: Re: [ORCADIA] Maeshowe Charles Tait wrote: > No I doubt that the sunsets could have been any better than we have > now, including today and several others this season. It all depends > on highs and lows, temperature and wind. The weather was just as > oceanic then! > > In fact it is usuallly quite nice weather in > december/January/February. i have taken some of my "best" shots > during these months. I think the climate was changing in the Neolithic period, though I readily admit it's not something I know much about. However, here are one or two pointers. First, a timeline (which may or may not be accurate): BC 100 BC Broch of Gurness 214 BC Great Wall of China being built 600 BC Brochs begin to appear 700 BC Iron Age dwellings c. 2500 BC Skara Brae abandoned 2700 BC Building begins on the pyramids of Egypt 2750 BC The tomb of Maeshowe built 3000 BC The Ring of Brodgar built 3200 BC Oldest evidence of occupation at Skara Brae 3600 BC Oldest remains at the Knap of Howar 3800 BC- 1000 BC Climate cooling, peat bogs developing 3900 BC The first human settlers are present c. 10,000 BC Last of the Ice Age glaciers retreats http://www.visitorkney.com/culture_and_history.asp It would seem, then, that Maeshowe was built during a period when the climate was gradually deteriorating over a period of roughly 2800 years — obviously a very long time. A few extracts from a book called "People and Woods in Scotland: A History" by T.C. Smout: "On Orkney and Shetland the woodland was substantially lost in the Neolithic period, although it may not have disappeared, but it is unlikely that this was entirely due to human impacts. Woodland this far north was probably highly stressed, and even small impacts may have been enhanced by the already tenuous hold of trees on the landscape.., "...Around 5,000 years ago [i.e around 3,000 BC] the use of agriculture gradually became more discernible in the [Scottish] landscape. Sustained but not necessarily intensive grazing pressure probably achieved more work than the axe or fire in creating partly cleared landscapes. It is very unlikely that significant parts of the country were converted to permanently altered open ground by human impacts, however. It is more likely that climate change and soil deterioration were more significant agents, particularly in northern Scotland. Hence the catastrophic collapse in pine populations 4,000 years ago... opened up entire regions in Sutherland and Caithness which have remained virtually treeless since then. The conversion of mineral soils to nutrient-deficient acid blanket peat had occurred here and elsewhere from the beginning of the interglacial, but rapidly increasing precipitation waterlogged this natural sponge, forcing trees from its surface through cutting off air to roots... "...This extraordinary loss of trees occurred when parts of the Highlands were receiving influxes of settlers, in the early Bronze Age... The idea that this wave of colonisation might represent a large population expansion in some 'golden age' of climatic warmth has been replaced by the opposite notion. Climate-change history shows this period to have experienced the most severe deterioration of any in the last 5,000-6,000 years." It does seem to be reasonably well established, then, that during the Neolithic and the Bronze Age the climate slowly became cooler and wetter — hence maybe gradually cloudier skies and poorer sunsets? That last comment is just a speculation, though. Oddly enough, though, I came across this in a piece on Neolithic Somerset: ____________________________________________________________________________ Neolithic 4000-2000BC Lifestyle Changes During the 2000 years of the Neolithic period substantial changes occurred in the way people interacted with their environment... The lifestyle of humankind was not the only thing that saw change at this time. The preserved remains of beetles and other insects found within peat deposits tell us that the climate too was altering. Beetles have been found that live in a climate that was 2-4 degrees colder in the winter and 2-3 degrees warmer in the summer than our current climate. This different climate would have had consequences for where and when certain human activities could take place. http://www.somerset.gov.uk/somerset/cultureheritage/heritage/info/periodsummaries/neolithicsomerset/ ____________________________________________________________________________ Now admittedly that's about the south-west of England rather than the north of Scotland, but it's interesting just the same: warmer summers and colder winters than we have now. I wonder if there was something similar in Orkney? And *if* there were colder winters in the Neolithic period, does that also mean there were clearer skies and hence better sunsets? Who knows? Certainly not me! Norman T. _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks Mike. --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Mike Clouston <mcc11639@gmx.com> wrote: From: Mike Clouston <mcc11639@gmx.com> Subject: Re: [ORCADIA] Radio Orkney To: orcadia@rootsweb.com Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 11:20 PM Margaret Bainton wrote: > Does anyone know when Radio Orkney will resume its regular broadcasting? > > Peggy (USA) > Monday 5th, hopefully. -- Mike Clouston _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Does anyone know when Radio Orkney will resume its regular broadcasting?    Peggy (USA)

Simon, I think it's these stories that you're referring to: http://www.orkneyjar.com/archaeology/paeleoecology.htm http://www.orkneyjar.com/archaeology/paeleoecology2007.htm I must admit that I'm not clear if there were two periods of prehistoric climate deterioration, one in the Neolithic that led to the disappearance of the Orkney woodlands (no doubt with human influence too) and then a further deterioration of climate in the Bronze Age, or if there was just one slowly continuing process of climate deterioration during the Neolithic and Bronze Age. However, it does seem to be widely accepted that climate deterioration did take place, and that suggests to me that the climate of Orkney at the time of the building of Maeshowe wasn't necessarily the same as it is now. Just how much has the climate changed? I haven't a clue, really! Norman T. SIMON TREASURE wrote: > hi norman, > > your timeline is a bit wonky at the back end. Two phd students > presented a paper on climate change in orkney in 2007 drawn from > multiple cores taken from peat bogs across orkney and found climate > deterioration from approx 2000 bc lasting to around 1200 bc i think. > > Also found evidence of human interaction with the biosphere back to > 7500 bc which is obvious when you allow for the original mesolithic > hunter gatherer settlers. They were not primitive, just few enough of > them not to need permament dwelling and thus farming lifestyles. They > would have herded beasts which to my memory was proved by the peat > cores. > > regards, > > Simon

hi norman, your timeline is a bit wonky at the back end. Two phd students presented a paper on climate change in orkney in 2007 drawn from multiple cores taken from peat bogs across orkney and found climate deterioration from approx 2000 bc lasting to around 1200 bc i think. Also found evidence of human interaction with the biosphere back to 7500 bc which is obvious when you allow for the original mesolithic hunter gatherer settlers. They were not primitive, just few enough of them not to need permament dwelling and thus farming lifestyles. They would have herded beasts which to my memory was proved by the peat cores. regards, Simon ________________________________ From: Norman Tulloch <norman@nwtulloch.vispa.com> To: orcadia@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, 2 January, 2009 10:02:18 AM Subject: Re: [ORCADIA] Maeshowe Charles Tait wrote: > No I doubt that the sunsets could have been any better than we have > now, including today and several others this season. It all depends > on highs and lows, temperature and wind. The weather was just as > oceanic then! > > In fact it is usuallly quite nice weather in > december/January/February. i have taken some of my "best" shots > during these months. I think the climate was changing in the Neolithic period, though I readily admit it's not something I know much about. However, here are one or two pointers. First, a timeline (which may or may not be accurate): BC 100 BC Broch of Gurness 214 BC Great Wall of China being built 600 BC Brochs begin to appear 700 BC Iron Age dwellings c. 2500 BC Skara Brae abandoned 2700 BC Building begins on the pyramids of Egypt 2750 BC The tomb of Maeshowe built 3000 BC The Ring of Brodgar built 3200 BC Oldest evidence of occupation at Skara Brae 3600 BC Oldest remains at the Knap of Howar 3800 BC- 1000 BC Climate cooling, peat bogs developing 3900 BC The first human settlers are present c. 10,000 BC Last of the Ice Age glaciers retreats http://www.visitorkney.com/culture_and_history.asp It would seem, then, that Maeshowe was built during a period when the climate was gradually deteriorating over a period of roughly 2800 years — obviously a very long time. A few extracts from a book called "People and Woods in Scotland: A History" by T.C. Smout: "On Orkney and Shetland the woodland was substantially lost in the Neolithic period, although it may not have disappeared, but it is unlikely that this was entirely due to human impacts. Woodland this far north was probably highly stressed, and even small impacts may have been enhanced by the already tenuous hold of trees on the landscape.., "...Around 5,000 years ago [i.e around 3,000 BC] the use of agriculture gradually became more discernible in the [Scottish] landscape. Sustained but not necessarily intensive grazing pressure probably achieved more work than the axe or fire in creating partly cleared landscapes. It is very unlikely that significant parts of the country were converted to permanently altered open ground by human impacts, however. It is more likely that climate change and soil deterioration were more significant agents, particularly in northern Scotland. Hence the catastrophic collapse in pine populations 4,000 years ago... opened up entire regions in Sutherland and Caithness which have remained virtually treeless since then. The conversion of mineral soils to nutrient-deficient acid blanket peat had occurred here and elsewhere from the beginning of the interglacial, but rapidly increasing precipitation waterlogged this natural sponge, forcing trees from its surface through cutting off air to roots... "...This extraordinary loss of trees occurred when parts of the Highlands were receiving influxes of settlers, in the early Bronze Age... The idea that this wave of colonisation might represent a large population expansion in some 'golden age' of climatic warmth has been replaced by the opposite notion. Climate-change history shows this period to have experienced the most severe deterioration of any in the last 5,000-6,000 years." It does seem to be reasonably well established, then, that during the Neolithic and the Bronze Age the climate slowly became cooler and wetter — hence maybe gradually cloudier skies and poorer sunsets? That last comment is just a speculation, though. Oddly enough, though, I came across this in a piece on Neolithic Somerset: ____________________________________________________________________________ Neolithic 4000-2000BC Lifestyle Changes During the 2000 years of the Neolithic period substantial changes occurred in the way people interacted with their environment... The lifestyle of humankind was not the only thing that saw change at this time. The preserved remains of beetles and other insects found within peat deposits tell us that the climate too was altering. Beetles have been found that live in a climate that was 2-4 degrees colder in the winter and 2-3 degrees warmer in the summer than our current climate. This different climate would have had consequences for where and when certain human activities could take place. http://www.somerset.gov.uk/somerset/cultureheritage/heritage/info/periodsummaries/neolithicsomerset/ ____________________________________________________________________________ Now admittedly that's about the south-west of England rather than the north of Scotland, but it's interesting just the same: warmer summers and colder winters than we have now. I wonder if there was something similar in Orkney? And *if* there were colder winters in the Neolithic period, does that also mean there were clearer skies and hence better sunsets? Who knows? Certainly not me! Norman T. _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I would suggest some restraint in blaming humans for deforestation, or any other noticeable environmental changes, before farming and animal husbandry became common and wide spread. In the case of Orkney it would be questionable until the advent of mechanized farming (horse and plow).Typically hunter gatherers have very low (almost none existent) ecological impacts. Same with fishier folk before they aggregate into large communities. Best guess, Orkney's trees were long gone way before humans were in any position to be a factor. R -----Original Message----- From: orcadia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:orcadia-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Norman Tulloch Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 11:32 AM To: orcadia@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ORCADIA] Maeshowe Simon, I think it's these stories that you're referring to: http://www.orkneyjar.com/archaeology/paeleoecology.htm http://www.orkneyjar.com/archaeology/paeleoecology2007.htm I must admit that I'm not clear if there were two periods of prehistoric climate deterioration, one in the Neolithic that led to the disappearance of the Orkney woodlands (no doubt with human influence too) and then a further deterioration of climate in the Bronze Age, or if there was just one slowly continuing process of climate deterioration during the Neolithic and Bronze Age. However, it does seem to be widely accepted that climate deterioration did take place, and that suggests to me that the climate of Orkney at the time of the building of Maeshowe wasn't necessarily the same as it is now. Just how much has the climate changed? I haven't a clue, really! Norman T. SIMON TREASURE wrote: > hi norman, > > your timeline is a bit wonky at the back end. Two phd students > presented a paper on climate change in orkney in 2007 drawn from > multiple cores taken from peat bogs across orkney and found climate > deterioration from approx 2000 bc lasting to around 1200 bc i think. > > Also found evidence of human interaction with the biosphere back to > 7500 bc which is obvious when you allow for the original mesolithic > hunter gatherer settlers. They were not primitive, just few enough of > them not to need permament dwelling and thus farming lifestyles. They > would have herded beasts which to my memory was proved by the peat > cores. > > regards, > > Simon _______________________________________ Orcadia Group Photo Album http://tinyurl.com/28bx9x ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ORCADIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello, while everyone is paying attention re Christmas delights (not sure about milk on toast... could be nearly as lovely as vegemite on toast ;-) ) Was wondering if there was anyone out there researching the Linklater family of Sandwick - Housegarth and area. A few of the descendants have 'found' each other via the net and are compiling a tree. Too many names to list here, but if there is anyone with a Linklater from the above area on their line, please contact me and we can sort out what we have. Glenda Aust husband from David b 1841/2 migrated around 1865

charles.tait@zetnet.co.uk wrote: > All from my guide book including errors! > You mean the timeline was from your guide book, Charles? I hadn't realised that. Looks like another promising day for Maeshowe, though again there seems to be a low bank of dark cloud over Hoy, so that could spoil things. Norman T.