Forgot the list again in my eagerness!!! Kind Regards June & Roy http://www.btinternet.com/~roy.cox/index.htm -----Original Message----- From: Roy [mailto:roy.cox@btinternet.com] Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 8:50 PM To: 'norman.lee1' Subject: RE: [OEL] What do I do with that extra "f" Good Evening on this snowy day in some parts - Sunny in others one hopes? Its almost as though someone were using some form of "Olde Abbreviation" in these olde documents isn't it? But methinks there to be a more sequential reason for the apparent use of two similar letters or even an 'sf' etc., What I mean is, the evolution of the English language, prior to the Conquest my Middle English Handbook tells me, that the alphabet used, consisted of 25 letters of which only 20 are the same as those in use today. These continued in use by the scribes after the Conquest until the end of the 14th century when there were 27 letters in use of which two were about to "Disappear". After the close of the 14th century a norm tended to be established. The greater part of this period, manuscripts were frequently copied by one or more scribes, speaking a different dialect from that of the text they were copying. I think the supposition here is apparent, which the book carries on to explore, but my 'ole fingers would not be able to copy! I would have liked to have been able to produce a copy of this olde alphabet but there is not a font to support it and although some letters are the same it would not look right, not to reproduce it in its entirety. One thing stands out though, there are hardly any duplications like 'ff' which questions "At about what period did this duplication make itself apparent"? I wholeheartedly agree with everything that has been said so far, and even more so to transcribe "AS IS" and not ones' interpretation which would lead to a different construction of the document's sense. Whilst writing I would like to thank everyone who "Had-a-go" at John Chew's Will and Inventory which I have now copied and from all your kind efforts and passed on to my elderly cousin in North Carolina. I have also been able link some genealogy with the will as a result. Kind Regards and keep warm or cool wherever! June & Roy http://www.btinternet.com/~roy.cox/index.htm -----Original Message----- From: norman.lee1 [mailto:norman.lee1@virgin.net] Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 4:42 PM To: OLD-ENGLISH-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [OEL] What do I do with that extra "f" Hello there Mary I have a feeling that someone will disagree with me but most people I know transcribe ff as F. ff was the way of writing a capital. A number of letters have different forms for their capitals and you can get used to these. s/S is one of them. In fact there are about three different forms of s. R/r is another that has different forms. Then there's b/B, sometimes d/D, e/E, and many of the other letters of the alphabet. I have a feeling that there's a web site that will help you with these different forms. It's worth getting something you can print out to have by you as you transcribe. You also have to come to terms with how to transcribe u and i. These two letters present different problems and there is more than one school of thought concerning their transcription. u and v are often presented in documents as appearing to be the same letter. Many people transcribe all of these as u, regardless of whether any of us would pronounce them as a u. For instance, I can't think of anyone who would pronounce an underground chamber as 'caue' and most people would call it a 'cave'. However, there is a school of thought that would not alter the word caue to cave. You have to take your pick on this one. Equally, at one time there was not such a letter as j/J. They were all written as i/I but I can't imagine anyone actually pronouncing enioy rather than enjoy. I do know that there is a course on-line for palaeography. Someone on the list may well give you the reference for that one but if not, then key it into Google and I am sure you will find a good one. Good luck with your efforts. Audrey ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mary Seal" <mseal@sympatico.ca> To: <OLD-ENGLISH-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 12:37 PM Subject: [OEL] What do I do with that extra "f" > I would like some advise please. For quite some time now I have been involved with transcribing parish registers and bishop's transcripts. The advise I was given in the beginning was to trascribe everything as is. (not the "s" which looks like "f" though. Consequently I have been writing Frances and February as they were originally written - ffrances and ffebruary. Now I am being told that I am putting in too many "f"s. > > So what do I do? Transcribe as it is written or leave off one of the "f"s? > > Regards..............Mary from Ottawa, Canada > > > ==== OLD-ENGLISH Mailing List ==== > Going away for a while? > Don't forget to UNSUBSCRIBE! > OLD-ENGLISH-L-request@rootsweb.com > > ==== OLD-ENGLISH Mailing List ==== OLD-ENGLISH Web Page http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/